Alta Vista and Bella Vista at Orchard Hills

BruinDoc said:
dragon007 said:
stephen said:
dragon007 said:
Wanted to get everyone's opinion on a dilemma my cousin has come across.  She is deciding between the Amelia Plan 1 versus waiting for the Bellino at Bella Vista.  The Amelia is fully upgraded with landscaping done or she can get a Bellino starting for nearly the same price but will have to put in another 400-500K for upgrades and landscaping.  The issue with Bella Vista is have only some idea of what it will look like based on looking at Hidden Canyon.  Also have no idea of the site it will be located and if it even will be affordable by the time the phase she wants is released.  With the Amelia, she will also have saved up extra money to purchase an investment property.  Which is the better investment and which would you do in her shoes...Amelia fully upgraded and ready to move in plus an investment property of 500K or Bella Vista in the hills with a larger lot and can customize a little.
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Is the Bellino on the radar due to casita? It's probably my least favorite floorplan in the Vistas...
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Not entirely. We looked at the Altura model, or what is made of it and didn't like how the spiral staircase ends over the entry way. In the Cielo, don't care much for the dual staircase off to the side with the courtyard in front which seems wasted space to me and more landscaping needs to be done after looking at the similar model in Hidden Canyon. Also has no great room and living room awkwardly situated with a dual kitchen countertop which she didn't find useful. My cousin actually liked the Amelia 2 with the casita due to the central courtyard. The Tacara looks amazing but will fall out of the price range unless get it bare bones which defeats the purpose of having a house as this one.
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Amelia. Fantastic builder with unparalleled customer service IMHO. Plus an investment property for the future.
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Zippohunter said:
dragon007 said:
stephen said:
dragon007 said:
Wanted to get everyone's opinion on a dilemma my cousin has come across.  She is deciding between the Amelia Plan 1 versus waiting for the Bellino at Bella Vista.  The Amelia is fully upgraded with landscaping done or she can get a Bellino starting for nearly the same price but will have to put in another 400-500K for upgrades and landscaping.  The issue with Bella Vista is have only some idea of what it will look like based on looking at Hidden Canyon.  Also have no idea of the site it will be located and if it even will be affordable by the time the phase she wants is released.  With the Amelia, she will also have saved up extra money to purchase an investment property.  Which is the better investment and which would you do in her shoes...Amelia fully upgraded and ready to move in plus an investment property of 500K or Bella Vista in the hills with a larger lot and can customize a little.
Click to expand...

Is the Bellino on the radar due to casita? It's probably my least favorite floorplan in the Vistas...
Click to expand...

Not entirely. We looked at the Altura model, or what is made of it and didn't like how the spiral staircase ends over the entry way. In the Cielo, don't care much for the dual staircase off to the side with the courtyard in front which seems wasted space to me and more landscaping needs to be done after looking at the similar model in Hidden Canyon. Also has no great room and living room awkwardly situated with a dual kitchen countertop which she didn't find useful. My cousin actually liked the Amelia 2 with the casita due to the central courtyard. The Tacara looks amazing but will fall out of the price range unless get it bare bones which defeats the purpose of having a house as this one.
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Plenty of items that I don't like about Amelia in general and the plan 2 especially but that's me.  I personally like Cielo a lot.  It is all personal preference.  So if your cousin really likes Amelia plan 2 then its a no brainer.  Especially since it is cheaper and she gets extra money for investment to boot.  Just make sure other things are considered:  Feel of the neighborhood, lot, privacy, etc.  As for future appreciation between Bella Vista and Amelia...no one has a crystal ball but it is mho that Bella Vista is the better investment.  But you are right you will spend more money on Bella Vista on upgrades in the house and lots are generally much larger then Amelia so lots of landscaping costs.
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She actually has decide on Plan 1 but like the courtyard of plan 2 which Bella Vista Bellini looks like may have.  Thank for the input.  Will let her know
 
Rtlguru said:
I personally wouldn't touch the Amelia's.

I hate how such large homes are packed in like sardines. I also hate how dark the model homes were due to having homes right up against you on every side.

However, if your cousin really loves that particular floor plan and she's not too concerned about value short term, getting it at a steep discount probably isn't a bad idea.

I too think the Toll homes will be much better investments in the long term, which is why I'm looking there and passing on both Trevi and Amelia.
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Thank you...make some very good points that have been taken into consideration as well.  The other thought was to purchase the Amelia and sell in two years and hopefully Bella Vista homes will still be available and move into those.  Hopefully the increase in price of Bella Vista by then will be offset by an appreciation of the Amelia, but hard to predict.
 
dragon007 said:
Rtlguru said:
I personally wouldn't touch the Amelia's.

I hate how such large homes are packed in like sardines. I also hate how dark the model homes were due to having homes right up against you on every side.

However, if your cousin really loves that particular floor plan and she's not too concerned about value short term, getting it at a steep discount probably isn't a bad idea.

I too think the Toll homes will be much better investments in the long term, which is why I'm looking there and passing on both Trevi and Amelia.
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Thank you...make some very good points that have been taken into consideration as well.  The other thought was to purchase the Amelia and sell in two years and hopefully Bella Vista homes will still be available and move into those.  Hopefully the increase in price of Bella Vista by then will be offset by an appreciation of the Amelia, but hard to predict.
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Hard to predict but I would not buy Amelia if Bella Vista is your preference.  I believe the Vistas will make it very difficult for Trevi and Amelia.  So if new Trevi and Amelia home sales are suffering because of the Vistas, resales will be even worse unless you give it away.
 
Zippohunter said:
dragon007 said:
Rtlguru said:
I personally wouldn't touch the Amelia's.

I hate how such large homes are packed in like sardines. I also hate how dark the model homes were due to having homes right up against you on every side.

However, if your cousin really loves that particular floor plan and she's not too concerned about value short term, getting it at a steep discount probably isn't a bad idea.

I too think the Toll homes will be much better investments in the long term, which is why I'm looking there and passing on both Trevi and Amelia.
Click to expand...

Thank you...make some very good points that have been taken into consideration as well.  The other thought was to purchase the Amelia and sell in two years and hopefully Bella Vista homes will still be available and move into those.  Hopefully the increase in price of Bella Vista by then will be offset by an appreciation of the Amelia, but hard to predict.
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Hard to predict but I would not buy Amelia if Bella Vista is your preference.  I believe the Vistas will make it very difficult for Trevi and Amelia.  So if new Trevi and Amelia home sales are suffering because of the Vistas, resales will be even worse unless you give it away.
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In the early phases, the Bella Vistas are near the water basin and possibly less desirable location.  Is there any concern of being so near water with increase risks of mosquitos and other critters to anyone?
 
dragon007 said:
Zippohunter said:
dragon007 said:
Rtlguru said:
I personally wouldn't touch the Amelia's.

I hate how such large homes are packed in like sardines. I also hate how dark the model homes were due to having homes right up against you on every side.

However, if your cousin really loves that particular floor plan and she's not too concerned about value short term, getting it at a steep discount probably isn't a bad idea.

I too think the Toll homes will be much better investments in the long term, which is why I'm looking there and passing on both Trevi and Amelia.
Click to expand...

Thank you...make some very good points that have been taken into consideration as well.  The other thought was to purchase the Amelia and sell in two years and hopefully Bella Vista homes will still be available and move into those.  Hopefully the increase in price of Bella Vista by then will be offset by an appreciation of the Amelia, but hard to predict.
Click to expand...

Hard to predict but I would not buy Amelia if Bella Vista is your preference.  I believe the Vistas will make it very difficult for Trevi and Amelia.  So if new Trevi and Amelia home sales are suffering because of the Vistas, resales will be even worse unless you give it away.
Click to expand...

In the early phases, the Bella Vistas are near the water basin and possibly less desirable location.  Is there any concern of being so near water with increase risks of mosquitos and other critters to anyone?
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mosquitos will hang out near the water so I do not think they will be an issue.  My mom lives next to the water basin in Pavilion Park and no issues there.  There are ducks as well but they never bothered my Mom either.  ;)
On the positive it will be a good separator from the smaller homes that will be built below the water basin.
 
I mentioned it in the other thread, but my opinion is that Toll is one of the best builders out there.  Really good customer service (easy to work with as a realtor), great reputation, and good quality homes.  They have sold homes without models in Baker Ranch, Hidden Canyon, and now Orchard Hills for the past few years.  Name me another builder that's been able to do that.  I'd love to buy that single story 4-car garage home at Alta Vista but I have an expensive car habits to feed and I'd like to eat more than just cup of noodles. haha
 
Want to get an estimate how much you think it would cost to upgrade the Vistas on average, without going all out like the models, that is classy but not tacky.
 
No structural upgrades (i.e sliders, decks, prep kitchens, free standing tubs etc), you are probably looking at $225K or so.

With some structural upgrades $300K+.
 
The structural upgrades are pretty darn expensive. A friend has a reservation at Bella and showed me his upgrade list. This is off the top of my head so may be off a little.

Conservatory is 85k
Sitting area add to master bedroom is around 45k

Toll is definitely charging a premium for upgrades.
 
dragon007 said:
Want to get an estimate how much you think it would cost to upgrade the Vistas on average, without going all out like the models, that is classy but not tacky.
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~$200K, however "classy vs tacky" will depend highly on decor as well.
 
Rtlguru said:
The structural upgrades are pretty darn expensive. A friend has a reservation at Bella and showed me his upgrade list. This is off the top of my head so may be off a little.

Conservatory is 85k
Sitting area add to master bedroom is around 45k

Toll is definitely charging a premium for upgrades.
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But remember that those add to SF so he'll actually get a return on those additions.
 
You called? Got tired of all of these Toll employees taking over all the threads. I disagree with Tolls reputation. If you talk to many of the buyer at Tolls other developments you will here that many homeowners are unhappy with Toll and their customer service. Once you sign on the dotted the line its all downhill. Walk around Hidden Canyon and ask the homeowners what their experience has been before you buy. Im sure you will think twice. I would also think twice about any home builder flying around in a helicopter. Give me a break. What a ridiculous sales tactic to sell homes in Tustin. Also, some of the sales people in the Vistas are from HC. Thats why they are still all over these blogs. Same tactics as the HC link.

OC-Broker said:
Where is orange_curtain?
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Rtlguru said:
The structural upgrades are pretty darn expensive. A friend has a reservation at Bella and showed me his upgrade list. This is off the top of my head so may be off a little.

Conservatory is 85k
Sitting area add to master bedroom is around 45k

Toll is definitely charging a premium for upgrades.
Click to expand...

Pretty pricey for structural stuff compared to some builders.  Ive also heard suspect things about tolls reputation from more than one dissatisfied buyer.
 
you may see buyers in the vistas act similarly to the buyers in HC and complete most upgrades (outside of structural ) after closing. Not that these buyers want to save on costs- they actually want things that are more customized than what toll offers, and frankly want to avoid the shoddy craftsmanship that comes with any tract home.
 
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