The Investigation

So Senate and now House investigations are closed with no finding of "Collusion" (not even a real charge).  That pretty much just leaves Mueller.  What happens when his closes with similar findings and a few low level scalps?

GOP-led House panel officially clears Trump in Russia probe

?While the committee found no evidence that the Trump campaign colluded, coordinated, or conspired with the Russian government, the investigation did find poor judgment and ill-considered actions by the Trump and Clinton campaigns,? the House Intelligence Committee wrote.

https://apnews.com/8b95a7cf7bcb4585b00c038be2257ba4/GOP-led-House-panel-officially-clears-Trump-in-Russia-probe
 
morekaos said:
So Senate and now House investigations are closed with no finding of "Collusion" (not even a real charge).  That pretty much just leaves Mueller.  What happens when his closes with similar findings and a few low level scalps?

GOP-led House panel officially clears Trump in Russia probe

?While the committee found no evidence that the Trump campaign colluded, coordinated, or conspired with the Russian government, the investigation did find poor judgment and ill-considered actions by the Trump and Clinton campaigns,? the House Intelligence Committee wrote.

https://apnews.com/8b95a7cf7bcb4585b00c038be2257ba4/GOP-led-House-panel-officially-clears-Trump-in-Russia-probe
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won't happen until december  ;)
 
Declassified Congressional Report: James Clapper Lied About Dossier Leaks To CNN
A newly declassified report on Russian interference in the 2016 U.S. elections reveals that former intelligence chief James Clapper lied to Congress about information he shared with CNN on the infamous Steele dossier.
Buried within a newly declassified congressional report on Russian meddling in the 2016 U.S. elections is a shocking revelation: former Director of National Intelligence (DNI) James Clapper not only leaked information about the infamous Steele dossier and high-level government briefings about it to CNN, he also may have lied to Congress about the matter.

In one of the findings within the 253-page report, the House intelligence committee wrote that Clapper leaked details of a dossier briefing given to then-President-elect Donald Trump to CNN?s Jake Tapper, lied to Congress about the leak, and was rewarded with a CNN contract a few months later.

?Clapper flatly denied ?discussing[ing] the dossier [compiled by Steele] or any other intelligence related to Russia hacking of the 2016 election with journalists,'? the committee found.

When asked directly whether he had ever discussed the dossier with any journalists, Clapper replied that he had not, according to a transcript of the proceedings:

MR. ROONEY: Did you discuss the dossier or any other intelligence related to Russia hacking of the 2016 election with journalists?

MR. CLAPPER: No.

The former DNI later changed his story after he was confronted specifically about his communications with Jake Tapper of CNN.

?Clapper subsequently acknowledged discussing the ?dossier with CNN journalist Jake Tapper,? and admitted that he might have spoken with other journalists about the same topic,? the report continued. ?Clapper?s discussion with Tapper took place in early January 2017, around the time IC leaders briefed President Obama and President-elect Trump, on ?the Christopher Steele information,? a two-page summary of which was ?enclosed in? the highly-classified version of the ICA,? or intelligence community assessment.

The briefing of Trump by U.S. intelligence chiefs was held on January 6. CNN published its story on the briefing, based on anonymous leaks from ?two national security officials,? on January 10. BuzzFeed published the full dossier, which was jointly funded by the Hillary Clinton campaign and the Democratic National Committee, minutes after the CNN story was published.

The revelation that Clapper was responsible for leaking details of both the dossier and briefings to two presidents on the matter is significant, because former Federal Bureau of Investigation (FBI) director James Comey wrote in one of four memos that he leaked that the briefing of Trump on salacious and unverified allegations from the dossier was necessary because ?CNN had them and were looking for a news hook.?

The congressional report on Russian interference noted that it was this very briefing of Trump that multiple media organizations used as an excuse to publish the unverified dossier.
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http://thefederalist.com/2018/04/27/house-intel-report-james-clapper-lied-dossier-leaks-cnn/

Notice the circular justifications used by our "public servants" in the intelligence community.

1. Director of National Intelligence James Clapper briefs CNN anchor Jake Tapper on the 'pee' dossier prior to President-elect Trump ever being briefed.

2. James Comey uses the knowledge that CNN has been briefed as the excuse for why Trump needs to be briefed about the 'pee' dossier.

3. CNN uses the fact that Trump has been briefed as justification to break the dossier story to the public.  Effectively, briefing Trump made the "unverified and salacious" document newsworthy.

4. Buzzfeed uses the CNN story as cover and publishes the full "salacious and unverified" document to the public.

5. DNI Clapper personally profits by becoming a paid CNN commentator soon after.
 
eyephone said:
Here's what's happened when past presidents have been subpoenaed:
? Jefferson declined to comply but ultimately produced some material in the treason trial of his former vice president, Aaron Burr.

? Nixon resigned and the issue went away.

? The Clinton subpoena was withdrawn when he agreed to testify voluntarily.


Source:https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.nbcnews.com/news/amp/ncna870876
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Normally, if you or I refused to comply with a subpoena we would be at risk of jail time or fines.  Since the president can't be prosecuted, it would be incumbent upon the House to impeach Trump, and for the Senate to remove him from office with a 2/3 vote.  Does anybody really believe that is going to happen here?

The only leverage Mueller has against Trump is his children.  I wouldn't be surprised if he threatens to prosecute Ivanka, Jared, and Don Jr. in order to force Trump's cooperation.  That's the type of scum Mueller is based on other prosecutions he's been involved with.  The US government (you and I) have paid out over $100 million in damages to those that Mueller has had falsely imprisoned over the years.  The Whitey Bulger case, the 9/11 anthrax case, and the Scooter Libby case are all examples of Mueller imprisoning innocent people.

The problem with threatening Trump's children is they could simply be pardoned anyway, just as Scooter Libby was.  Mueller literally has no legal leverage against Trump.

The only thing Mueller can hope to do is present a case to the American public that Trump is dirty enough to warrant an impeachment hearing and removal from office.  The problem there is polling shows the public beginning to turn on Mueller.  People believe that if real crimes had occurred, they would have come to light by now, and they don't like that this investigation has dragged on for more than a year with no end in sight.

The initial rage from Democrats after losing the election is also starting to wear off.  People have moved on with their lives and the #resist movement is foundering.  Those that are still engaged politically have turned their hopes to the midterms for redemption and political payback.

In a strange way, Comey has helped with all this.  His book tour backfired big time, and now people are questioning why a special counsel was ever named in the first place.  Comey's sinking reputation is dragging Mueller's down with it.

Giuliani is smart to be playing the cards he is now.  He's an experienced prosecutor and senses blood in the water where Mueller is concerned.
 
Wait... wait... hold the phone for a moment... You're saying that there is a President of the United States who lied? WOW. Where's my fainting couch.

I know many are saying PERJURY!!! but are also hard pressed to show when POTUS was ever put under oath on this issue. Some are saying CAMPAIGN FINANCE RULES WERE BROKEN!!! but are equally hard pressed to raise the same volume level over Obama's campaign finance law breaking. (The WAPO downplays the story with a disingenuous headline... still I'm not surprised about this and don't care about this either)

https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/obama-campaign-to-pay-375000-fine-for-omitting-some-donors-names-in-2008/2013/01/04/78973402-56bb-11e2-8b9e-dd8773594efc_story.html?noredirect=on&utm_term=.6ac97d61a400

So what we have here is zip a dee do on collusion. We're chasing down a decade old possible affair (zzzzz) and a NDA that one party has decided not to abide by. That's what we've been spending money on. I hope it has all been worth it for some readers out there. The rest of us have moved on.

My .02c
 
Yes I am well aware that given the right leaning biases of the most prolific posters on the forum and also of the sponsor(s) , we need to  "move on" on from subjects that make them uncomfortable .... totally get it

Maybe we should re-label this forum "talk-right Irvine" :) 
 
Hi Soy: the stories keeps on changing. Don?t you find it amusing?
(Stormy, Comey firing, is Cohen a business partner or lawyer?)


Soylent Green Is People said:
Wait... wait... hold the phone for a moment... You're saying that there is a President of the United States who lied? WOW. Where's my fainting couch.

I know many are saying PERJURY!!! but are also hard pressed to show when POTUS was ever put under oath on this issue. Some are saying CAMPAIGN FINANCE RULES WERE BROKEN!!! but are equally hard pressed to raise the same volume level over Obama's campaign finance law breaking. (The WAPO downplays the story with a disingenuous headline... still I'm not surprised about this and don't care about this either)

https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/obama-campaign-to-pay-375000-fine-for-omitting-some-donors-names-in-2008/2013/01/04/78973402-56bb-11e2-8b9e-dd8773594efc_story.html?noredirect=on&utm_term=.6ac97d61a400

So what we have here is zip a dee do on collusion. We're chasing down a decade old possible affair (zzzzz) and a NDA that one party has decided not to abide by. That's what we've been spending money on. I hope it has all been worth it for some readers out there. The rest of us have moved on.

My .02c
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Liar Loan said:
fortune11 said:
Maybe we should re-label this forum "talk-right Irvine" :)
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I would stick to the Seinfeld clips if I were you.
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Cant post too many Seinfeld clips - then you will start claiming we are in a Seinfeld clip bubble ...  cant keep track of all your bubbles btw

 
eyephone said:
Hi Soy: the stories keeps on changing. Don?t you find it amusing?
(Stormy, Comey firing, is Cohen a business partner or lawyer?)


Soylent Green Is People said:
Wait... wait... hold the phone for a moment... You're saying that there is a President of the United States who lied? WOW. Where's my fainting couch.

I know many are saying PERJURY!!! but are also hard pressed to show when POTUS was ever put under oath on this issue. Some are saying CAMPAIGN FINANCE RULES WERE BROKEN!!! but are equally hard pressed to raise the same volume level over Obama's campaign finance law breaking. (The WAPO downplays the story with a disingenuous headline... still I'm not surprised about this and don't care about this either)

https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/obama-campaign-to-pay-375000-fine-for-omitting-some-donors-names-in-2008/2013/01/04/78973402-56bb-11e2-8b9e-dd8773594efc_story.html?noredirect=on&utm_term=.6ac97d61a400

So what we have here is zip a dee do on collusion. We're chasing down a decade old possible affair (zzzzz) and a NDA that one party has decided not to abide by. That's what we've been spending money on. I hope it has all been worth it for some readers out there. The rest of us have moved on.

My .02c
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Exactly

And I know I am committing heresy on this forum by challenging SGIP -- but if "most people" have moved on, why do they feel the need to keep responding to this thread ...
 
eyephone said:
Hi Soy: the stories keeps on changing. Don?t you find it amusing?
(Stormy, Comey firing, is Cohen a business partner or lawyer?)
Click to expand...

Trump is a lot like Bill Clinton in this regard.  I do find it amusing that Democrats are tied up in knots about it, yet seemed to have no problems with Clinton lying about it 20 years ago.
 
Liar Loan said:
eyephone said:
Hi Soy: the stories keeps on changing. Don?t you find it amusing?
(Stormy, Comey firing, is Cohen a business partner or lawyer?)
Click to expand...

Trump is a lot like Bill Clinton in this regard.  I do find it amusing that Democrats are tied up in knots about it, yet seemed to have no problem with Clinton lying about it 20 years ago.
Click to expand...

I?m not defending Billy Bob.  :)
 
Liar Loan said:
eyephone said:
Hi Soy: the stories keeps on changing. Don?t you find it amusing?
(Stormy, Comey firing, is Cohen a business partner or lawyer?)
Click to expand...

Trump is a lot like Bill Clinton in this regard.  I do find it amusing that Democrats are tied up in knots about it, yet seemed to have no problems with Clinton lying about it 20 years ago.
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The issue is not Democrats who care .  It is Trump himself

He cant stop tweeting about it or defending it

No one forced Giuliani to go on Hannity to generate the news cycle he did yesterday

It is all self inflicted damage - don't blame democrats or anyone else for it
 
fortune11 said:
No one forced Giuliani to go on Hannity to generate the news cycle he did yesterday
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Oh no?  You apparently don't know 10-dimensional chess when you see it.
 
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