Great Park Development

Tyler Durden said:
this coming from the guy who is sure affordable housing won't happen.

Hilarious.
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What? Did I say that?
Tyler Durden said:
maybe back in China, you can simply bribe your way into getting what you want.
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I've never been there and see no reason to go there in the near future.

Tyler Durden said:
  It doesn't happen like that here - since the dollars 5P has influenced the city with greatly exceed any amount you can throw at them to listen to you.
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Are you talking about 5P bribing the city council?

Tyler Durden said:
It probably bothers you that you can't compete with the big boys here (e.g., corporations) - which have resources any individual don't have. 
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The election season is coming.
 
Tyler Durden said:
common sense will tell you that any city is going to vote with the outcome that results in the greatest increase in revenue.
More homes = larger revenue base for irvine.
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Which I do not disagree with.


Tyler Durden said:
Plus, we know Irvine wasted the $200M originally intended to build the park.  The city can put their ineptitude behind them if they mask it by getting any type of park built.
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Again, I agree. However, I want them (all of them) take responsibility and clearly admit this fact. Is it too much to ask for?

Tyler Durden said:
If the area stays a barren wasteland (the city isn't going to fund it), it only draws more attention to their past stupidity and risks the county taking over the park as they have threatened to do in the past.
The only way a park gets built is if private enterprise builds it.  And you are suggesting to entrust the stewardship of that awarding that contract decision to a gang of idiots who have how much experience in contracts, vendor management, construction or finance?
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The new park design will be a bargain. Of course, we won't get another Central Park. However, wasting money on a huge USELESS sports arena is merely a solution.
My only point is that 5P should come up with much better park concept, if they want to have their business for 5K+ houses. Instead, they are trying to push through a cheap useless design. City Council has enough power to negotiate it. Well, instead of doing that, three out of five council members blindly agree with anything 5P throws to them


Tyler Durden said:
Meanwhile, other county residents who have neither a park nor any future ability to have a park built are waiting while Irvine cannot tie its own shoe laces trying to figure this out.
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They can go to any regional or city park in the area for free (parking fees may apply), can't they?
 
Seriously?  Next time you want to go to the beach or the mountains, or an amusement park, keep that in mind since you live with none of those in the city.
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Do you have a personal issue going to Disneyland in Anaheim? Or going to Crystal Cove?
 
im going to take my dogs and have them shit all over the great park paid for by my neighboring irvinites. i may or may not pick up the poo.
 
adventurous said:
The new park design will be a bargain. Of course, we won't get another Central Park. However, wasting money on a huge USELESS sports arena is merely a solution.
My only point is that 5P should come up with much better park concept, if they want to have their business for 5K+ houses. Instead, they are trying to push through a cheap useless design. City Council has enough power to negotiate it. Well, instead of doing that, three out of five council members blindly agree with anything 5P throws to them
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"USELESS" to who, maybe you.  But a large number of ORANGE COUNTY (which includes Irvine) families participate in youth sports and having a large sports complex will help foster a positive environment for participation at the ORANGE COUNTY Great Park.

Benefits of Youth Sports
The evidence supporting sports participation for young people is overwhelming?It has the power to combat everything from racism to low self-image, to the high-school drop-out rate.? (Sue Castle, Executive Producer of PBS Sports: Get in the Game)

Physical Benefits
Children who play sports develop general physical fitness in a way that?s fun, and they establish lifelong habits for good health. This is particularly important at a time when obesity in the United States has reached epidemic proportions. The incidence of obesity has increased by more than 50% among America?s children and teens since 1976. It continues to grow at a staggering rate. The 2009 National Survey of Children?s Health showed that non-athletes are 60% more likely to be overweight than athletes.
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I'll cast my vote for the council members who endorse this project.  Anything is better than that barren wasteland right now.  Again, I think this is a done deal already.  Shea and Choi are already yeses.  Lalloway, Agran, and Krom wanted the documents vetted through legal.  90% was already vetted, so once legal gives the thumbs up, this project will go through.  There is nobody else out there willing to take on this project and it's already been stalled for too long.  In fact, I think I'll call the representatives right now to endorse this project and get it moving.
 
OCgasman said:
"USELESS" to who, maybe you.  But a large number of ORANGE COUNTY (which includes Irvine) families participate in youth sports and having a large sports complex will help foster a positive environment for participation at the ORANGE COUNTY Great Park.
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You still didn't answer my question. How many fields are you short on? 68+? Another golf course? 25 tennis courts that is almost the size of Wimbledon?
OCgasman said:
I'll cast my vote for the council members who endorse this project.
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yep. Another private golf club is what we need in Irvine. It's a way better than a family park, isn't it?
 
So we know what 5 Points plans to do but what is the in-place plan?

Instead of 4600 homes what does the GP get? Industrial buildings?

I think the other side is under represented in this issue.

While I understand the desire for finishing the GP, I really think there is a short sightedness going on here because people may not understand the kind of impact 4600 additional homes is going to have on the area.

Personally, I would rather have a football stadium built and have an NFL team called the Irvine Hoas. :)
 
adventurous said:
OCgasman said:
"USELESS" to who, maybe you.  But a large number of ORANGE COUNTY (which includes Irvine) families participate in youth sports and having a large sports complex will help foster a positive environment for participation at the ORANGE COUNTY Great Park.
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You still didn't answer my question. How many fields are you short on? 68+? Another golf course? 25 tennis courts that is almost the size of Wimbledon?
OCgasman said:
I'll cast my vote for the council members who endorse this project.
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yep. Another private golf club is what we need in Irvine. It's a way better than a family park, isn't it?
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Well let's see, there's about 3.1 million ppl living in Orange County right now.  You're right, there should be way more fields and courts built to accommodate the needs of the growing population. 

Some ppl don't want "just" a park with grass, benches, BBQ grills and walking trails.  Those are all nice, and I want them too, but there will be plenty of that there.  The only thing I'm really disappointed in seeing go is the winding canyon, that woulda been beautiful.  But, let's be pragmatic.  Orange County Great Park will no longer ever rival Central Park or Balboa Park because the funding is no longer there.  There's a lot worse than a sports complex, like having nothing at all.
 
irvinehomeowner said:
So we know what 5 Points plans to do but what is the in-place plan?

Instead of 4600 homes what does the GP get? Industrial buildings?

I think the other side is under represented in this issue.

While I understand the desire for finishing the GP, I really think there is a short sightedness going on here because people may not understand the kind of impact 4600 additional homes is going to have on the area.

Personally, I would rather have a football stadium built and have an NFL team called the Irvine Hoas. :)
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Eventually, the deal will be a mix of extra residential development, extra sport facilities ('cause it's cheap) and scaled down community park (more expensive part). 5P is trying to make the entire project as cheap as possible, while some city council members have obviously forgotten whose interests they have to protect
 
OCgasman said:
Well let's see, there's about 3.1 million ppl living in Orange County right now.  You're right, there should be way more fields and courts built to accommodate the needs of the growing population. 

Some ppl don't want "just" a park with grass, benches, BBQ grills and walking trails.  Those are all nice, and I want them too, but there will be plenty of that there.  The only thing I'm really disappointed in seeing go is the winding canyon, that woulda been beautiful.  But, let's be pragmatic.  Orange County Great Park will no longer ever rival Central Park or Balboa Park because the funding is no longer there.  There's a lot worse than a sports complex, like having nothing at all.
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I agree with you that it could turn worse. However, the large commercialized sports stadium doesn't look good enough. Like I mentioned in the post just above, the ultimate deal is a mix of sports facilities, community park and extra residential units. I am ok with that. However, the way 5P wants to cut down the GP design now is totally inappropriate. They have to come up with a better deal, which will benefit the locals better. The city council has to represent the residents, while Choi and Shea are obviously accommodating 5P.
 
adventurous said:
OCgasman said:
Well let's see, there's about 3.1 million ppl living in Orange County right now.  You're right, there should be way more fields and courts built to accommodate the needs of the growing population. 

Some ppl don't want "just" a park with grass, benches, BBQ grills and walking trails.  Those are all nice, and I want them too, but there will be plenty of that there.  The only thing I'm really disappointed in seeing go is the winding canyon, that woulda been beautiful.  But, let's be pragmatic.  Orange County Great Park will no longer ever rival Central Park or Balboa Park because the funding is no longer there.  There's a lot worse than a sports complex, like having nothing at all.
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I agree with you that it could turn worse. However, the large commercialized sports stadium doesn't look good enough. Like I mentioned in the post just above, the ultimate deal is a mix of sports facilities, community park and extra residential units. I am ok with that. However, the way 5P wants to cut down the GP design now is totally inappropriate. They have to come up with a better deal, which will benefit the locals better. The city council has to represent the residents, while Choi and Shea are obviously accommodating 5P.
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I wish you luck in getting the council to change their minds.  Btw, this is the first cogent, well written post in response to my argument that was devoid of defensive tone and personal posturing.  Well done.  <Not trying to be sarcastic.>. I'm on your side now.
 
Nah... It's just you have finally admitted, that 68+ sports fields and the private golf course is a bit too much and need to be blended with the community park too.  ;D
It's quite difficult to influence the city council, since they don't listen to residents. However, I do my best to give them my opinion on the matter. If enough people speak up, they will think twice before casting their votes
 
irvinehomeowner said:
So we know what 5 Points plans to do but what is the in-place plan?

Instead of 4600 homes what does the GP get? Industrial buildings?
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So the question is, would you rather have a swath of industrial or residential?  It seems to me having residential is better for the people already living in Irvine.  In that case the council should approve the rezoning regardless of the park. 



 
adventurous,

There is no funding to build the Great Park that was once envisioned. You should blame Larry Agran for pocketing 200 million and Governor Brown for dissolving the re-development agency. Would you care to share where is the money going to come from to build your version of the park?

The city may lose Broadcom to Tustin if Great Park is not being developed in time when their lease is up with The Irvine Company; do you really want to risk losing one of the city's biggest employer?
 
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