How much does the Irvine Company hate this site?

NEW -> Contingent Buyer Assistance Program
The nature of the system is such that excess is rewarded. Most people aren't informed enough to realize that local pork is just as bad as remote pork. Bringing federal spending home creates jobs and buys votes. As long as we have a system that rewards stupidity, the system will create stupidity. You could change that by taxing Congressional districts in proportion to the amount of money that their representatives voted on spending.





Oh, and as long as we are talking about bringing home the bacon, this conversation wouldn't be complete without the mention of (former KKK member) Robert Byrd of West Virginia. If you ever go there, you will be astounded by the number of things named after him and funded by the rest of the United States.
 
<em>Trooper, you're trying to get me ranting tonight, aren't you?





</em>Anytime I can get under your skin, it's a good thing ! JK





I guess my city doesn't believe that SS will be solvent...so they don't participate. Of course, this means most members won't collect a SS check upon retirement, but our pension is pretty good. I'll collect both....but only b/c I work the side job....no, it's not my business, I am an employee.
 
<em>You could change that by taxing Congressional districts in proportion to the amount of money that their representatives voted on spending.</em>





That's something that DiFi has been b*tching about for awhile now. Not exactly that, but that CA gives more to the feds than it gets back. I believe that Missippi was #1 for awhile, getting about $1.25 of federal funds for each $1 its residents paid in. You think former Majority Leader Senator Trent Lott had anything to with that?








<em>If you ever go there, you will be astounded by the number of things named after him and funded by the rest of the United States.</em>





Do you know who has the most buildings named after him? I'll give you a hint: there's a lot of irony involved since this person was a small government crusader.
 
> I guess my city doesn't believe that SS will be solvent...so they don't participate.





I don't believe it will be solvent either, but I don't have the ability to opt out of the system.





But unless you are making over $97.5k on your side job, the impact will be indirect. Of course, if your employer has employees that make over $97.5k, it is possible that the hit they pay from increased taxes under an Obama administration would be spread throughout the company. Or if your employer buys goods or services from companies that are impacted, the resulting increase in prices could reduce your salary or eliminate your position.
 
>I believe that Missippi was #1 for awhile, getting about $1.25 of federal funds for each $1 its residents paid in. You think former Majority Leader Senator Trent Lott had anything to with that?





It's been a while since I have looked at the data, but New Mexico was always at the top of the list. And the reason is quite easy to understand. It's a poor state, but a lot of Federal money is spent on Los Alamos and White Sands Missile Range.





> Do you know who has the most buildings named after him?





Ronald Reagan. But that's a tribute to a great man. The buildings spread throughout the country weren't built simply because he spread pork everywhere like (former KKK member) Robert Byrd.
 
<em>>> I guess my city doesn't believe that SS will be solvent...so they don't participate.</em>





Actually, I think it's a federal vs. state kind of issue. None of the state and county employees even have the option of paying into social security. I can't recall what the details are, but I think it has to do with (let's all say it together now) a 10th Amendment issue.
 
jcaraway - you mean would i rather a ceo be honest or deluded? i would go with the first obviously :) unfortunately they're often the latter :(



todays news brings up an interesting example...



BEAR STEARNS DENIES LIQUIDITY RUMORS



NEW YORK ? New York ? March 10, 2008 ? The Bear Stearns Companies Inc. today denied market rumors regarding the firm's liquidity. The company stated that there is absolutely no truth to the rumors of liquidity problems that circulated today in the market.



Alan Schwartz, President and CEO of The Bear Stearns Companies Inc., said, "Bear Stearns' balance sheet, liquidity and capital remain strong."
 
Well, I think someone important wants them deluded, I think the board and investors (myself included) think that's the CEO's primary objective, to generate a positive image about the company. I hate to admit this, but if i were on a cnference call, and the CEO the first nay sayer on the market in their industry or was negative about their comapny, i'd be pissed if i were a shareholder.



In response to the Bear Stearns, a post from CR i'm sure that we've all read.



JPMorgan, NY Fed to Help Bear Stearns



From the WSJ: Bear Stearns to Get Backing From J.P. Morgan, N.Y. Fed



J.P. Morgan Chase & Co. and the Federal Reserve Bank of New York have agreed to provide, as necessary, secured funding to Bear Stearns Cos. for an initial period of up to 28 days.



J.P. Morgan is also "working closely with Bear Stearns on securing permanent financing or other alternatives for the company."



It was just last Monday that former Bear Stearns CEO "Ace" Greenberg responded on CNBC to the rumor that Bear faced a liquidity crisis:



"It's ridiculous, totally ridiculous."



Not so ridiculous. The rumors were true.
 
OK, getting back on track here.



I'll tell you why TIC is concerned about this blog and it has everything to do with reputation management. I work in Internet marketing and more specifically, SEO or search engine optimization and reputation management is a hot topic right now and companies are scrambling on how to deal with issues such as social media and how transparent they should be as a corporation given the current climate as well as the uprise in user generated content that is filling the search engine indices because the content is all very relevant to what end users are searching for. Corporations haven't reacted fast enough to social media and many haven't tapped into the resources offered up by sites like Facebook, Reddit, Digg and mass communications tools such as forums, blogs and even micro-blogging sites such as Twitter. When communication can spread like wildfire about a company's brand instantaneously in the digital world, the repercussions can be even more damaging than if a competitor took out a prime time commercial to issue disparaging remarks about them - especially if a topic goes viral - just ask any company that has been caught up in scandal and how fast bad news spread versus several years ago.



Several posts on this topic indicated that many home purchasing decisions have been delayed because of the information detailed on this blog and even if less than half of that is true, the repercussions are devastating because of the effect of word of mouth marketing. How many of you have indicated that this is a common water cooler topic and have introduced others to this blog? I'm especially guilty of that as well and have spoken to several people who have actually brought up this blog before I did and I'm an avid reader. But there's more...



Here's the real reason (hold your breath):



In August of 2007 this blog actually surpassed The Irvine Company's primary website (www.irvinecompany.com) in total number of unique views and visitor counts:



http://siteanalytics.compete.com/irvinehousingblog.com+irvinecompany.com/?metric=uv



Even more telling is the amount of user engagement between the two sites:



http://siteanalytics.compete.com/irvinehousingblog.com+irvinecompany.com/?metric=uv



User are spending an unusually large amount of time on IHB in relation to TIC and are devouring information. In this information age of instantaneous data, these charts show why the Irvine Company is very concerned. At the current rate of trajectory and the falloff of traffic for the TIC site by the end of the year, this blog will be even more of a powerhouse than it already is.



Interesting sidenote - the interactive agency that designed the Irvine Company's website tried to hire me to help them get more traffic from Google and Yahoo about 5 years ago but when I told them that they would need a complete overhaul of the website, ditch a majority of the graphics and flash animation (search engines cant index pictures very well), add more content such as a corporate blog or a forum etc...they didn't want to hear it. Anyway, they opted not to hire me (or didn't like my prices).



;)
 
<p>Reputation management? There is such a thing? The whole thing sounds both dull and dishonest.</p>

<p>I always tell people, that if someone tells you they are a good Christian (or Jew or Aetheist or whatever) you should run not walk away from them. If you try to arrange your reputation, doesn't that mean you don't deserve that reputation and are trying to maintain an undeserved pretence?</p>

<p>If the Irvine Company actually posted stuff that was somewhat critical, or actually used the comments to improve things, well, that might be helpful</p>

<p>My guess is that most with that company are yes-persons, and nobody wants to hear anything negative. Much less be allowed to satirize itself. Now, if the site did that, it would get lots of traffic.</p>

<p>The thing is you guys LIKE Irvine, so the Irvine Company must have done some good stuff to entice you there.</p>

<p>So what are they all worried about?</p>
 
Good comments Liz, I agree if someone was appointed by TIC and posted info, it would be make this a much more informative and interesting forum, however, this would also legitimize this open, unregulated discusion. I'm sure TIC fears the lack of control.



Equity, you really haven't told us why TIC is concerned about this blog, and your graphs only show that TIC traffic remains flat while IHB's grew. IHB's growth is perfectly logical as the popularity of the site has grown in relation to the increased press and references as the economy declines. Furthermore, so called declines on TIC's website coincide with anticipated seasonal lulls, your span of data is WAY to short to make even a guess.



Jesus, as a good judeo/christian patriotic, flag wearing american, i hate to beat a dead horse here, but TIC isn't concerned about this site because this site deals with the for sale housing market and TIC's core business model is commercial RE, which, as we have seen, is buffered much more than for sale to economic shifts. Sure, many many negative things about TIC have been said on the forums (i.e. the irvine company still uses asbestos and lead paint in their construction, and the irvine company made me sterile), but these comments are dilluted by the sheer volume and discredited by the ranting and haranguing nature of the posters (guilty!). This website isn't focused on disparging TIc, blog posts by IR are focused on resale housing, even a first time reader would recognize that.



On a side and personnal attack note, the fact that you recommended that a real estate company start a corporate blog and forum would make me drop your proposal into the incinerator and question charging you for the paper i printed it on. RE companies aren't like google, apple or some hip design studio that's constanly cranking out new ideas and looking for some grass roots advertising, RE companies create more traffic, noise and light pollution, changes the beloved communities of old people, and in general participate in many earth destroying activities. The product hasn't changed in a hundred years, and all projects need to be approved in a public forum (at least in so cal) the last thing any RE company is going to do is allow activists another tool to voice their crazy opinions on a legitimized (aka developer run) forum.
 
Jc, I used to feel the same way about TIC not caring about this site. I thought of it as only a "symptom" or a "commentary" about what was going on. I think differently now though.





TIC has masterfully been able to build their brand, and this site has chipped away at this mystique. Remember the mayor of Irvine proclaiming that residential land would command 4.5 million dollars on the open market. . . would the same hold in Costa Mesa or Fountain Valley-- in areas just as close to the coast? I doubt they would be even in that range. And this is because of the excellent, top-down brand building of TIC. In exposing some of the strategy behind TIC, this site has created a very large scale forum (half a million hits plus per month) where TIC cannot ride as high as they previously were. Part of their hating will be a scapegoating move by dummy-underlings in the company, that much is true. Housing is bad in Irvine? Blame a website, some TIC noob will propose, and some guy up top will like the excuse because he's not too good on the computer and just as eager to find the cause of the problem.





I won't blame Zov if he sells out. Not at all-- just make sure they upgrade you to a Shady Villa or Ocean View Turtle Ridge. . .
 
I wouldn't blame zov or IR or anyone else that works so hard on this site for selling. I'd be bummed though. This site is a glowing example of what makes the Internet is great.
 
<p>SoulBrother, </p>

<p> I think along the lines you do. Blame a website for a negtative view instead of actually DOING something positive to actually HELP make this area as good as they hyped it up to be. It woulden't be hard, they hold all the cards.</p>

<p>What actually hurt them is there uncontrolled belief that everything would evaluate to stratosphereic levels. Come on guys even a startup company hedges thier bets. I bet they have a HUGE amount of VERY smart and well paid people working for them. Put them to work and cut the "yes men" controls.</p>

<p>Anyways enough of my rant...</p>

<p>-bix</p>
 
<p><em>TIC has masterfully been able to build their brand, and this site has chipped away at this mystique.</em> </p>

<p>I couldn't disagree more. The reality is this site is a temple to the desireability of Irvine. It's also a bully pulpit railing against greed, conspicious consumption, ignorant pride, and speculative financing that jeopardizes what has been built.</p>

<p> </p>
 
Some agreement, some disagreement, fair enough.





Bix, I think the "yes men" were the guys who might now be blaming the website. Really, was Bren the first one in the company who discovered this? Maybe he's one of those CEO's that has no computer and just gets reports from the underlings about the "rumors on the internets."





No Such, I certainly think this websites symbolizes the desirability of Irvine, and I think that it's got to hurt TIC, especially in terms of their new stuff and their high end product. I mean, when you go an look at model homes or just drive around a place like Quail Hill, everything is so well put together. When I really started checking out Irvine, I remember being just blown away by the product. When the "bully pulpit railing against greed, conspicious consumption, ignorant pride, and speculative financing" that just can't be good for these places. I'm saying this in terms of having numbers in front of me instead of just fine Tuscan homes. Mello Roos taxes, HOAs and the like (along with smaller lots) make it a tougher sell. So, "mystique" . . . in terms of peeling back the product on the objective end (rather than how well they've made a master planned community, which is pretty amazing) is really what I'm getting at.
 
ISB, land in Irvine, the Irvine business complex, did go for $4.5 mill an acre. Land in santa ana, see skyline towers, went for much more than $4.5m, same with the land the towers had been planned on in costa mesa. But more importantly, all of this land sold at this price did not belong to TIC. TIC sells lots, they never sell raw land because they are so talented at adding value to their land through entitlment.



Qui bono from the run up in land? For the most part not TIC, as i have mentioned before, residential lot sales is only a small part of their business compared to their commercial real estate holdings (apartments, retail, commercial, resort) furthermore, they own all the land outright, they have no carry costs and can hold indefinitely, which puts them in an incredibly different position than the suncals and other land developers.



Also clarify your position, do you really think that the mayor of irvine "declared" land values at $4.5 M as part of a TIC branding scheme? And now their solution, dictated by lower level assocaiates, is to scape goat blogs? Do you think that makes sense?



Also clairfy what peeling back on the objective end means. Fincial end?



No such, very eloquently put...I couldn't agree more
 
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