19,140 signatures to overturn Irvine?s decision on veterans cemetery location

[jmoney74]

Let's the fued continue to go on between looser, Larry Agran and the City Officials for along time. Because by then, nothing coming to fruition of the Cemetary. Irvine residents WINS.

Money saved....Sort of.

Say what you want about Larry Agran but he helped shaped Irvine despite his crookedness.  Irvine could have easily turned into any other Orange County suburban sh""twhole. Thankfully that was delayed by a couple of decades.

+1

This is a fact or very close to it .  People may not like him for his crankiness now and he did waste a bunch of $$ but you can?t change facts and history.  Irvine was very unique compared to other generic non coastal oc  development (atleast until now ) .

People complain about the Great Park but don't realize that it was a way for Irvine to fight off the building of an airport that the Newport people wanted.  It would have destroyed Irvine as we know it.

Defeating the airport was bad for Irvine's future. It would have transformed OC. Aside from the talent pool Why did Hock Tan move BRCM HQ to SJC? Guess what's 5 miles away....San Jose Int'l airport! The anti-airport faction will regret their actions as time goes by.

Many people love living in Irvine. Those same people probably would not be happy living in San Jose.

 

[Irvinecommuter]

Let's the fued continue to go on between looser, Larry Agran and the City Officials for along time. Because by then, nothing coming to fruition of the Cemetary. Irvine residents WINS.

Money saved....Sort of.

Say what you want about Larry Agran but he helped shaped Irvine despite his crookedness.  Irvine could have easily turned into any other Orange County suburban sh""twhole. Thankfully that was delayed by a couple of decades.

+1

This is a fact or very close to it .  People may not like him for his crankiness now and he did waste a bunch of $$ but you can?t change facts and history.  Irvine was very unique compared to other generic non coastal oc  development (atleast until now ) .

People complain about the Great Park but don't realize that it was a way for Irvine to fight off the building of an airport that the Newport people wanted.  It would have destroyed Irvine as we know it.

Defeating the airport was bad for Irvine's future. It would have transformed OC. Aside from the talent pool Why did Hock Tan move BRCM HQ to SJC? Guess what's 5 miles away....San Jose Int'l airport! The anti-airport faction will regret their actions as time goes by.

That's insane...SJ is nothing like Irvine...SJC is a weird mix of commercial, residential, and industrial units.  Irvine is pretty much 80% residential. 

Broadcom did not "move" its HQ to SJC because of the airport.  It is because they moved all the R&D and manufacturing to Asia and Broadcom is merging with Brocade who is already based in SJC. 

Also...Broadcom will be legally based out of Delaware.  Is that cuz of the airport there?

 

[OCtoSV]

Let's the fued continue to go on between looser, Larry Agran and the City Officials for along time. Because by then, nothing coming to fruition of the Cemetary. Irvine residents WINS.

Money saved....Sort of.

Say what you want about Larry Agran but he helped shaped Irvine despite his crookedness.  Irvine could have easily turned into any other Orange County suburban sh""twhole. Thankfully that was delayed by a couple of decades.

+1

This is a fact or very close to it .  People may not like him for his crankiness now and he did waste a bunch of $$ but you can?t change facts and history.  Irvine was very unique compared to other generic non coastal oc  development (atleast until now ) .

People complain about the Great Park but don't realize that it was a way for Irvine to fight off the building of an airport that the Newport people wanted.  It would have destroyed Irvine as we know it.

Defeating the airport was bad for Irvine's future. It would have transformed OC. Aside from the talent pool Why did Hock Tan move BRCM HQ to SJC? Guess what's 5 miles away....San Jose Int'l airport! The anti-airport faction will regret their actions as time goes by.

Many people love living in Irvine. Those same people probably would not be happy living in San Jose.

Generally professionals gravitate to where they can make the most money. I loved living in South OC (including my days in Irvine) but moved when I realized living in SoCal is career limiting in high tech. I was against the airport when I lived there too, but in retrospect I realized this was a golden opportunity to transform OC into a major business hub that is gone forever.

A friend who works for a major Wall St bank once complained to me about having to fly in to LAX then take a town car 2 hrs south to a meeting in Irvine due to lack of nonstop flights into SNA. The airport would have transformed the economy into more of a corporate job market as opposed to the mid market base of jobs that currently exist in OC.

 

[OCtoSV]

Let's the fued continue to go on between looser, Larry Agran and the City Officials for along time. Because by then, nothing coming to fruition of the Cemetary. Irvine residents WINS.

Money saved....Sort of.

Say what you want about Larry Agran but he helped shaped Irvine despite his crookedness.  Irvine could have easily turned into any other Orange County suburban sh""twhole. Thankfully that was delayed by a couple of decades.

+1

This is a fact or very close to it .  People may not like him for his crankiness now and he did waste a bunch of $$ but you can?t change facts and history.  Irvine was very unique compared to other generic non coastal oc  development (atleast until now ) .

People complain about the Great Park but don't realize that it was a way for Irvine to fight off the building of an airport that the Newport people wanted.  It would have destroyed Irvine as we know it.

Defeating the airport was bad for Irvine's future. It would have transformed OC. Aside from the talent pool Why did Hock Tan move BRCM HQ to SJC? Guess what's 5 miles away....San Jose Int'l airport! The anti-airport faction will regret their actions as time goes by.

That's insane...SJ is nothing like Irvine...SJC is a weird mix of commercial, residential, and industrial units.  Irvine is pretty much 80% residential. 

Broadcom did not "move" its HQ to SJC because of the airport.  It is because they moved all the R&D and manufacturing to Asia and Broadcom is merging with Brocade who is already based in SJC. 

Also...Broadcom will be legally based out of Delaware.  Is that cuz of the airport there?

You're right - SJC is a city of 1M people with a per capita income close to $100K/yr - very different than Irvine.

When Avago bought BRCM they canned 700 Irvine workers, stopped the new HQ construction, and moved the HQ to SJC. I would imagine this was largely due to proximity to major customers + the SJC talent pool, but having an international airport is a HUGE factor. I can go to Japan, PRC, Germany, UK, many others nonstop from SJC - no need to schlep up to SFO. Everyone here is underestimating the economic impact the airport could have had and overstating the impact to quality of life.

Due to tax law most major US corporations are based in Delaware, but not their leadership teams and product operations.

 

[Irvinecommuter]

Let's the fued continue to go on between looser, Larry Agran and the City Officials for along time. Because by then, nothing coming to fruition of the Cemetary. Irvine residents WINS.

Money saved....Sort of.

Say what you want about Larry Agran but he helped shaped Irvine despite his crookedness.  Irvine could have easily turned into any other Orange County suburban sh""twhole. Thankfully that was delayed by a couple of decades.

+1

This is a fact or very close to it .  People may not like him for his crankiness now and he did waste a bunch of $$ but you can?t change facts and history.  Irvine was very unique compared to other generic non coastal oc  development (atleast until now ) .

People complain about the Great Park but don't realize that it was a way for Irvine to fight off the building of an airport that the Newport people wanted.  It would have destroyed Irvine as we know it.

Defeating the airport was bad for Irvine's future. It would have transformed OC. Aside from the talent pool Why did Hock Tan move BRCM HQ to SJC? Guess what's 5 miles away....San Jose Int'l airport! The anti-airport faction will regret their actions as time goes by.

Many people love living in Irvine. Those same people probably would not be happy living in San Jose.

Generally professionals gravitate to where they can make the most money. I loved living in South OC (including my days in Irvine) but moved when I realized living in SoCal is career limiting in high tech. I was against the airport when I lived there too, but in retrospect I realized this was a golden opportunity to transform OC into a major business hub that is gone forever.

A friend who works for a major Wall St bank once complained to me about having to fly in to LAX then take a town car 2 hrs south to a meeting in Irvine due to lack of nonstop flights into SNA. The airport would have transformed the economy into more of a corporate job market as opposed to the mid market base of jobs that currently exist in OC.

LOL...Irvine is one of the biggest tech growth centers outside of Silicon Valley and has high growth multiple areas.
https://www.builtinla.com/2017/03/03/irvine-tech-capital-orange-county
http://www.ocregister.com/2017/07/23/southern-california-tech-grows-even-in-silicon-valleys-shadow/
http://www.ocregister.com/2017/09/1...oming-job-growth-over-5-things-that-hint-yes/
http://www.ocweekly.com/news/irvine...-city-to-find-a-new-job-and-be-active-6879132

Wall Street will always be in LA or NYC because that is where all the corporate/banking HQs are.  That is not the job growth Irvine is looking for. 

 

[Irvinecommuter]

Let's the fued continue to go on between looser, Larry Agran and the City Officials for along time. Because by then, nothing coming to fruition of the Cemetary. Irvine residents WINS.

Money saved....Sort of.

Say what you want about Larry Agran but he helped shaped Irvine despite his crookedness.  Irvine could have easily turned into any other Orange County suburban sh""twhole. Thankfully that was delayed by a couple of decades.

+1

This is a fact or very close to it .  People may not like him for his crankiness now and he did waste a bunch of $$ but you can?t change facts and history.  Irvine was very unique compared to other generic non coastal oc  development (atleast until now ) .

People complain about the Great Park but don't realize that it was a way for Irvine to fight off the building of an airport that the Newport people wanted.  It would have destroyed Irvine as we know it.

Defeating the airport was bad for Irvine's future. It would have transformed OC. Aside from the talent pool Why did Hock Tan move BRCM HQ to SJC? Guess what's 5 miles away....San Jose Int'l airport! The anti-airport faction will regret their actions as time goes by.

That's insane...SJ is nothing like Irvine...SJC is a weird mix of commercial, residential, and industrial units.  Irvine is pretty much 80% residential. 

Broadcom did not "move" its HQ to SJC because of the airport.  It is because they moved all the R&D and manufacturing to Asia and Broadcom is merging with Brocade who is already based in SJC. 

Also...Broadcom will be legally based out of Delaware.  Is that cuz of the airport there?

You're right - SJC is a city of 1M people with a per capita income close to $100K/yr - very different than Irvine.

When Avago bought BRCM they canned 700 Irvine workers, stopped the new HQ construction, and moved the HQ to SJC. I would imagine this was largely due to proximity to major customers + the SJC talent pool, but having an international airport is a HUGE factor. I can go to Japan, PRC, Germany, UK, many others nonstop from SJC - no need to schlep up to SFO. Everyone here is underestimating the economic impact the airport could have had and overstating the impact to quality of life.

Due to tax law most major US corporations are based in Delaware, but not their leadership teams and product operations.

So

1)  you just made up the reason about why Broadcomm went to SJC...has nothing to do with the airport
2) yes you can but with this age of online meetings air travel is not nearly as important.
3)  SJC has tried to make international flights a thing for a long time.  It's just not a huge deal.  Silicon Valley is Silicon Valley not because of SJC.  SJC is not exactly a hub of wall street transactions.

 

[Hugo Township]

Generally professionals gravitate to where they can make the most money. I loved living in South OC (including my days in Irvine) but moved when I realized living in SoCal is career limiting in high tech. I was against the airport when I lived there too, but in retrospect I realized this was a golden opportunity to transform OC into a major business hub that is gone forever.

A friend who works for a major Wall St bank once complained to me about having to fly in to LAX then take a town car 2 hrs south to a meeting in Irvine due to lack of nonstop flights into SNA. The airport would have transformed the economy into more of a corporate job market as opposed to the mid market base of jobs that currently exist in OC.

I totally agree that El Toro International Airport would have been an incredible economic benefit. I travel extensively for business and drive up to LAX way too much (have flown 75,000 miles this year). Connecting in PHX, ORD, and DFW sucks. Budgeting 2 hours of driving because you're never sure about traffic up there sucks.

Having said that, there is an SNA-EWR flight on UA you can take nonstop. Of course, one has to be willing to fly UA but that's another argument.

 

[newPParker]

Generally professionals gravitate to where they can make the most money. I loved living in South OC (including my days in Irvine) but moved when I realized living in SoCal is career limiting in high tech. I was against the airport when I lived there too, but in retrospect I realized this was a golden opportunity to transform OC into a major business hub that is gone forever.

A friend who works for a major Wall St bank once complained to me about having to fly in to LAX then take a town car 2 hrs south to a meeting in Irvine due to lack of nonstop flights into SNA. The airport would have transformed the economy into more of a corporate job market as opposed to the mid market base of jobs that currently exist in OC.

I totally agree that El Toro International Airport would have been an incredible economic benefit. I travel extensively for business and drive up to LAX way too much (have flown 75,000 miles this year). Connecting in PHX, ORD, and DFW sucks. Budgeting 2 hours of driving because you're never sure about traffic up there sucks.

Having said that, there is an SNA-EWR flight on UA you can take nonstop. Of course, one has to be willing to fly UA but that's another argument.

It might make more sense for you to live close to LAX than rest of us to have an Airport next to our house.

 

[Hugo Township]

Generally professionals gravitate to where they can make the most money. I loved living in South OC (including my days in Irvine) but moved when I realized living in SoCal is career limiting in high tech. I was against the airport when I lived there too, but in retrospect I realized this was a golden opportunity to transform OC into a major business hub that is gone forever.

A friend who works for a major Wall St bank once complained to me about having to fly in to LAX then take a town car 2 hrs south to a meeting in Irvine due to lack of nonstop flights into SNA. The airport would have transformed the economy into more of a corporate job market as opposed to the mid market base of jobs that currently exist in OC.

I totally agree that El Toro International Airport would have been an incredible economic benefit. I travel extensively for business and drive up to LAX way too much (have flown 75,000 miles this year). Connecting in PHX, ORD, and DFW sucks. Budgeting 2 hours of driving because you're never sure about traffic up there sucks.

Having said that, there is an SNA-EWR flight on UA you can take nonstop. Of course, one has to be willing to fly UA but that's another argument.

It might make more sense for you to live close to LAX than rest of us to have an Airport next to our house.

ETIA would have been pretty far from my Irvine house. My understanding is that there wouldn't have been any houses next to ETIA if that was approved instead of OCGP. In what scenario would you have an airport next to your house?

 

[Irvinecommuter]

Generally professionals gravitate to where they can make the most money. I loved living in South OC (including my days in Irvine) but moved when I realized living in SoCal is career limiting in high tech. I was against the airport when I lived there too, but in retrospect I realized this was a golden opportunity to transform OC into a major business hub that is gone forever.

A friend who works for a major Wall St bank once complained to me about having to fly in to LAX then take a town car 2 hrs south to a meeting in Irvine due to lack of nonstop flights into SNA. The airport would have transformed the economy into more of a corporate job market as opposed to the mid market base of jobs that currently exist in OC.

I totally agree that El Toro International Airport would have been an incredible economic benefit. I travel extensively for business and drive up to LAX way too much (have flown 75,000 miles this year). Connecting in PHX, ORD, and DFW sucks. Budgeting 2 hours of driving because you're never sure about traffic up there sucks.

Having said that, there is an SNA-EWR flight on UA you can take nonstop. Of course, one has to be willing to fly UA but that's another argument.

It might make more sense for you to live close to LAX than rest of us to have an Airport next to our house.

ETIA would have been pretty far from my Irvine house. My understanding is that there wouldn't have been any houses next to ETIA if that was approved instead of OCGP. In what scenario would you have an airport next to your house?

Depends on where your Irvine house is but there are plenty of people living on Jeffrey/Irvine before the plan went down to defeat in 2002. 

Let's not forget about flight path and traffic congestion:
http://www.ocregister.com/2017/09/0...ncreased-noise-from-new-airline-flight-paths/

 

[Irvinecommuter]

Generally professionals gravitate to where they can make the most money. I loved living in South OC (including my days in Irvine) but moved when I realized living in SoCal is career limiting in high tech. I was against the airport when I lived there too, but in retrospect I realized this was a golden opportunity to transform OC into a major business hub that is gone forever.

A friend who works for a major Wall St bank once complained to me about having to fly in to LAX then take a town car 2 hrs south to a meeting in Irvine due to lack of nonstop flights into SNA. The airport would have transformed the economy into more of a corporate job market as opposed to the mid market base of jobs that currently exist in OC.

I totally agree that El Toro International Airport would have been an incredible economic benefit. I travel extensively for business and drive up to LAX way too much (have flown 75,000 miles this year). Connecting in PHX, ORD, and DFW sucks. Budgeting 2 hours of driving because you're never sure about traffic up there sucks.

Having said that, there is an SNA-EWR flight on UA you can take nonstop. Of course, one has to be willing to fly UA but that's another argument.

Then you should buy a house in Torrance or South Bay.  Having an airport in Irvine would complete destroy what Irvine is now.

 

[OCtoSV]

Let's the fued continue to go on between looser, Larry Agran and the City Officials for along time. Because by then, nothing coming to fruition of the Cemetary. Irvine residents WINS.

Money saved....Sort of.

Say what you want about Larry Agran but he helped shaped Irvine despite his crookedness.  Irvine could have easily turned into any other Orange County suburban sh""twhole. Thankfully that was delayed by a couple of decades.

+1

This is a fact or very close to it .  People may not like him for his crankiness now and he did waste a bunch of $$ but you can?t change facts and history.  Irvine was very unique compared to other generic non coastal oc  development (atleast until now ) .

People complain about the Great Park but don't realize that it was a way for Irvine to fight off the building of an airport that the Newport people wanted.  It would have destroyed Irvine as we know it.

Defeating the airport was bad for Irvine's future. It would have transformed OC. Aside from the talent pool Why did Hock Tan move BRCM HQ to SJC? Guess what's 5 miles away....San Jose Int'l airport! The anti-airport faction will regret their actions as time goes by.

That's insane...SJ is nothing like Irvine...SJC is a weird mix of commercial, residential, and industrial units.  Irvine is pretty much 80% residential. 

Broadcom did not "move" its HQ to SJC because of the airport.  It is because they moved all the R&D and manufacturing to Asia and Broadcom is merging with Brocade who is already based in SJC. 

Also...Broadcom will be legally based out of Delaware.  Is that cuz of the airport there?

You're right - SJC is a city of 1M people with a per capita income close to $100K/yr - very different than Irvine.

When Avago bought BRCM they canned 700 Irvine workers, stopped the new HQ construction, and moved the HQ to SJC. I would imagine this was largely due to proximity to major customers + the SJC talent pool, but having an international airport is a HUGE factor. I can go to Japan, PRC, Germany, UK, many others nonstop from SJC - no need to schlep up to SFO. Everyone here is underestimating the economic impact the airport could have had and overstating the impact to quality of life.

Due to tax law most major US corporations are based in Delaware, but not their leadership teams and product operations.

So

1)  you just made up the reason about why Broadcomm went to SJC...has nothing to do with the airport
2) yes you can but with this age of online meetings air travel is not nearly as important.
3)  SJC has tried to make international flights a thing for a long time.  It's just not a huge deal.  Silicon Valley is Silicon Valley not because of SJC.  SJC is not exactly a hub of wall street transactions.

I don't think you know what you're talking about. SJC metro inclusive of the Peninsula represents probably the largest pool of deals for Wall St. Have you been paying attention to the semiconductor deals happening right now, or Cisco's software acquisitions???

SJC int'l flights are so popular they sell at a huge premium to SFO departures.

The ETIA could have driven Irvine prices up to SV levels even with all of the inventory there - who doesn't want to live in South OC if they can make the same money as NYC/Boston/Bay Area?

 

[Irvinecommuter]

@OCtoSV

That's not "wall street"...that's venture capital.  SFO is right next to the Peninsula.  Driving up the 101 from SJC is not all that fun.

If they do sell at a premium it is because there are fewer flights.    I have not seen any evidence that SJC is more expensive than SFO.

No, it could not have.  I lived in the Bay Area for 20 years, SV demographics are very different than Irvine.  SV is unique.  People have tried recreate SV elsewhere but SV is still the original.  The airport is not why SV is SV.

By your logic, people in Newport Beach should love SNA. 

 

[OCtoSV]

The Wall St banks advise on many of these deals, not to mention all the debt offerings being done by the big tech companies with money so cheap. They all have major offices in the Bay area.

SJC airport was like SNA when I moved here, but the business environment pushed the growth into an intl airport. ETIA was more of a field of dreams approach but nevertheless it seems very likely it would have generated business growth.

SV demographics are pretty close to Irvine. My kids high school is 50% white/50% Asian with 40+ NM scholars named this year. I see OC -> LA as similar to SJC/Peninsula -> East Bay, and Caltech/Harvey Mudd/Pomona College/USC/UCLA stacks up to Cal/Stanford. Bay area commerce is greatly facilitated by 3 int'l airports (OAK, SFO, SJC) within 50 mi of each other, and with 5x the population you'd think metro LA/OC would have benefited from a second int'l airport.  oh well.

With the high number of execs that likely have to do frequent coast to coast and intl travel that live in NB they would probably be thrilled if SNA was an intl airport.

 

[jmoney74]

Lol his threat has taken a turn. SJC. Lots of tech. Lots of jobs. Would never live there. 

Irvine. Just a better place to live and has some jobs.

 

[Hugo Township]

By your logic, people in Newport Beach should love SNA.

I used to live in Newport Beach. Went to high school directly under the SNA flight path. Rowed crew every day on the Back Bay. Flight noise doesn't bother me. Loved SNA and wish it had more flights.

Different people, different priorities...

 

[Irvinecommuter]

By your logic, people in Newport Beach should love SNA.

I used to live in Newport Beach. Went to high school directly under the SNA flight path. Rowed crew every day on the Back Bay. Flight noise doesn't bother me. Loved SNA and wish it had more flights.

Different people, different priorities...

They don't bother you but they bother plenty of people in NB that they want SNA out.

 

[Irvinecommuter]

The Wall St banks advise on many of these deals, not to mention all the debt offerings being done by the big tech companies with money so cheap. They all have major offices in the Bay area.

SJC airport was like SNA when I moved here, but the business environment pushed the growth into an intl airport. ETIA was more of a field of dreams approach but nevertheless it seems very likely it would have generated business growth.

SV demographics are pretty close to Irvine. My kids high school is 50% white/50% Asian with 40+ NM scholars named this year. I see OC -> LA as similar to SJC/Peninsula -> East Bay, and Caltech/Harvey Mudd/Pomona College/USC/UCLA stacks up to Cal/Stanford. Bay area commerce is greatly facilitated by 3 int'l airports (OAK, SFO, SJC) within 50 mi of each other, and with 5x the population you'd think metro LA/OC would have benefited from a second int'l airport.  oh well.

With the high number of execs that likely have to do frequent coast to coast and intl travel that live in NB they would probably be thrilled if SNA was an intl airport.

Venture capitalists are closer to tech mentality than Wall Street/Banker mentality.  They don't fly in and fly out to make a deal.  Wall Street and lawyers help but VCs are fundamentally different.  Of course they have offices in the BA...that has nothing to do with SJC.

SJ has tried to make SJC an international airport for years.  They tried it in the 1980s/1990s when they were selling direct flights to Japan from SJC...eventually they failed.  SFO is still the dominant international airport.  Peninsula is so much closer to SFO than it is SJC, especially factoring in traffic.

LA/OC is not being held back by a lack of airports.  LA/OC is fundamentally different from the BA culturally.  SV has a young/single demographics while OC is a family based demographics.  Irvine is attracting the tech people who settled down and want to buy a place in a good neighborhood with good schools.  It goes way beyond racial demographics.

Regardless...the original conversation was about an Irvine airport.  If that did exist, it would wreck the home value of Irvine and half of Southern OC.  You may think that it is worth it but that does not change the fact that Irvine would be fundamentally different than what it is now.

 

[Irvinecommuter]

double

 

[bones]

double

This forum definitely missed you IC!  Another SJC > SNA thing is there are direct flights to Hawaii.  I never understood why sna can?t support one flight a day to the islands. I heard there are some weight issues flying west in addition to not being able to fill seats.