What do you guys think after today's vote?

[/quote]

The cemetery is going to create formaldehyde and heavy metal leaching contamination in the soil. It is no better than TCE as formaldehyde is a human carcinogen. 

[/quote]

No.

Most of the cemetery will be columbarium  -  above ground niches for urns of ashes. Designed for high density, to accommodate demand for next 100 years. It is expected to be among the busiest Veteran Cemeteries in the nation. Right there next to your new high school. 

Check the report/plans available from the city website.  Do your homework.
 

The cemetery is going to create formaldehyde and heavy metal leaching contamination in the soil. It is no better than TCE as formaldehyde is a human carcinogen. 

[/quote]

No.

Most of the cemetery will be columbarium  -  above ground niches for urns of ashes. Designed for high density, to accommodate demand for next 100 years. It is expected to be among the busiest Veteran Cemeteries in the nation. Right there next to your new high school. 

Check the report/plans available from the city website.  Do your homework.
[/quote]

Actually it says least busy.
 
http://www.latimes.com/socal/daily-pilot/news/tn-wknd-voc-veterans-cemetery-20170407-story.html 

" ...  For decades, no elected officials tried to get a local cemetery for Orange County veterans .... "         
 
YellowFever said:
Our Gang said:
No.

Most of the cemetery will be columbarium  -  above ground niches for urns of ashes. Designed for high density, to accommodate demand for next 100 years. It is expected to be among the busiest Veteran Cemeteries in the nation. Right there next to your new high school. 

Check the report/plans available from the city website.  Do your homework.
Click to expand...

So are you telling me that there will be ZERO dead and decaying bodies or ashes buried beneath the ground there then?  Will there still be tombstones?  Just curious.
Click to expand...

I did not say that. Read the report, see the plans. Do your homework
 
[youtube]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UqWwsUhrFBw[/youtube]
 
YellowFever said:
Ok. You're confusing the shit out of me.    WTF?!?!?!?

I ain't got time to read the report. Just copy and paste parts of the report! For cryin' out loud.
Click to expand...

Just the facts, a condensed version for the lazy:

Department of General Services  Southern California Veterans Cemetery Concept Plan

P a g e | 1

1. EXECUTIVE SUMMARY
The proposed cemetery site is at the former Marine Corps Air Station (MCAS) El Toro in Irvine, California. The former MCAS El Toro is currently being redeveloped as the Orange County Great Park (OCGP), and the State of California, Department of General Services (DGS) is developing this Concept Plan for the acquisition and redevelopment of approximately 125 acres of the Great Park for the proposed Southern California Veterans Cemetery (SCVC). 

The purpose of this Concept Plan is to illustrate development of the SCVC over a 100-year build-out timeframe. The Concept Plan outlines a process and strategy for the implementation of the entire cemetery including utility constraints, architectural and design concepts, environmental issues, a signage plan, grading and geotechnical considerations, landscaping needs, phasing and associated cost estimates.

Design of the Cemetery
The overall intent of the proposed design is to create a monument to the service and sacrifice of California State Veterans. Part of this goal is accomplished through the inclusion of features that will make a lasting and memorable impression on visitors to the cemetery.
At full build-out the cemetery will supply 211,125 gravesites with 60,066 in-ground crypts, 645 oversize in-ground crypts, 55,614 in-ground cremains, and 94,800 columbarium niches, enough to serve the anticipate needs of veterans for the next 100 years. The burials will be accommodated by approximately 70 percent cremation and 30 percent precast in ground burials.

Adjacent Area Land Uses
Adjacent land uses include the OCGP, a new Irvine Unified School District High School, and residential, retail, and commercial uses. The cemetery site is bounded by Cadence Boulevard to the northwest, Pusan Street to the north, Irvine Boulevard to the east, a habitat restoration area  to the south and southeast, and a golf course to the west.

Burial Options
The cemetery has a combination of burial facilities to meet the desires of all Veterans. The proposed 211,125 burials will be accommodated by approximately 70 percent cremation and 30percent precast in ground burials. At full build-out, the cemetery will supply 211,125 gravesites with 60,066 in-ground crypts, 645 oversize in-ground, 55,614 in-ground cremains, and 94,800 columbarium niches, enough to serve the anticipate needs of veterans for the next 100 years. Phase 1 includes the necessary buildings and 5,000 gravesites- 1,750 in-ground cremains and 3,250 columbarium niches.
For cremated remains, burial will be in freestanding double columbarium wall niches or inground cremains burials. Walls are arranged in courts of three to eight walls for a total of 2,000 to 12,400 niches in a single court. The architectural style of the walls are to match the California Tuscan building style.
Of the 60,711 crypt burials planned for the cemetery, 95 percent will be 3 foot by 8 foot plots, with the remaining 5 percent as over-sized 5 foot by 10 foot plots. Full casket burials will utilize pre-placed double depth vaults. The burial areas are divided into 32 crypt fields. The sections are separated by vegetated edges and slopes. Since the site has reclaimed water available the site can use turf or decomposed granite (a local crushed rock). The site is relatively flat and therefore accommodating slopes less than 2 percent can be achieved with minimal grading. Edges along\ the street would be planted with a colorful significant vegetated edge.
In addition to burial sites, the plan incorporates a memorial wall for those who do not desire burial on site but want to be memorialized as a veteran. The wall consists of 40 plaques in five rows mounted on a stucco wall with a cast stone cap flanked by stucco columns.

5.8 Hazards and Hazardous Materials
In discussions with the City of Irvine staff, when the site is transferred to the State, the State will  be responsible for the environmental remediation if contaminated soil is discovered during excavation There are two areas identified on the project site that have various institutional controls. As a result, future development of these areas may be somewhat restricted, depending on the proposed uses and activities. Some of these restrictions may be lifted as remediation actions are deemed complete. Attachment 1 describes these areas in more detail and a summary is presented below:
FOST 7 area contains contaminated ground water and is located on and around the air control tower building 372 and the FAA facility. It is assumed that surface improvements are and will be allowed; therefore, there are only roadway and columbarium niches proposed. Additionally, the development of these areas are proposed to be completed in Phases 7 and 10.
FOST 8 area has significant instructional controls/restrictions. This is area is located at the eastern portion of the site adjacent to the Navy property. It is assumed that no development will be allowed. Additionally, there is a buffer area of restrictions that is anticipated to be removed in the future and development should be allowed to occur. Burials within this area will not be developed until Phase 10 of construction.

9. PRELIMINARY HAZARDOUS MATERIALS SITE ASSESSMENT
An assessment of the hazardous materials found on site and a contaminated soil evaluation has been conducted by Avocet Environmental, Inc. The full report is found in Attachment 2
?Summary Environmental Evaluation.? The report concludes that MCAS El Toro is a very
complex, albeit mature, site with numerous documented impacts and very probably other impacts that won?t come to light until near-surface soil is disturbed during redevelopment. The proposed SCVC is located near the center of MCAS El Toro and very likely also encompasses multiple areas of impacted soil. As previously noted, this summary evaluation is based on the relevant FOST documents, which provide generally limited information. As such, Avocet adopted a conservative approach in identifying PECs and DRAs but makes no warranty regarding the completeness of the information presented in the FOST documents.
Demolition, redevelopment grading, foundation excavation, utility installation, and excavation for in-ground cremains and crypts will all involve soil disturbance, during which impacted soil could be encountered. In broad terms, contaminated soil encountered during demolition, redevelopment grading, foundation excavation, and utility installation could be addressed ?up  front? prior to the SCVC becoming operational. Excavation for in-ground cremains and crypts, however, likely would be a recurring activity that could go on for decades. In Avocet?s opinion, it would be impractical to address contaminated soil disturbed by in-ground cremains and crypt excavation on a case-by-case basis. The alternative would be to over-excavate and recompact the entire SCVC to a depth of, say, 8 to 10 feet below ground surface prior to it becoming operational and address contaminated soil, as/if encountered, at that time. Of course, there are significant cost considerations with such an approach.
A comprehensive soil survey should be conducted during the design of Phase 1 to identify any additional contaminated soil not previously encountered. If impacted soil is encountered, additional assessment may be required by overseeing regulatory agencies to determine if it is related to a known release or a previously undocumented release. The estimate does not include the cost to abate contaminated soil if discovered as a result of the soil survey, nor does the estimate include the cost for involvement of overseeing regulatory agencies. Based on the findings of the survey, a robust soil management plan should be developed to ensure that contaminated soil encountered at any stage of the SCVE development is characterized, profiled, and managed appropriately.
 
Our Gang said:
YellowFever said:
Ok. You're confusing the shit out of me.    WTF?!?!?!?

I ain't got time to read the report. Just copy and paste parts of the report! For cryin' out loud.
Click to expand...

Just the facts, a condensed version for the lazy:

Department of General Services  Southern California Veterans Cemetery Concept Plan

P a g e | 1

1. EXECUTIVE SUMMARY
The proposed cemetery site is at the former Marine Corps Air Station (MCAS) El Toro in Irvine, California. The former MCAS El Toro is currently being redeveloped as the Orange County Great Park (OCGP), and the State of California, Department of General Services (DGS) is developing this Concept Plan for the acquisition and redevelopment of approximately 125 acres of the Great Park for the proposed Southern California Veterans Cemetery (SCVC). 

The purpose of this Concept Plan is to illustrate development of the SCVC over a 100-year build-out timeframe. The Concept Plan outlines a process and strategy for the implementation of the entire cemetery including utility constraints, architectural and design concepts, environmental issues, a signage plan, grading and geotechnical considerations, landscaping needs, phasing and associated cost estimates.

Design of the Cemetery
The overall intent of the proposed design is to create a monument to the service and sacrifice of California State Veterans. Part of this goal is accomplished through the inclusion of features that will make a lasting and memorable impression on visitors to the cemetery.
At full build-out the cemetery will supply 211,125 gravesites with 60,066 in-ground crypts, 645 oversize in-ground crypts, 55,614 in-ground cremains, and 94,800 columbarium niches, enough to serve the anticipate needs of veterans for the next 100 years. The burials will be accommodated by approximately 70 percent cremation and 30 percent precast in ground burials.

Adjacent Area Land Uses
Adjacent land uses include the OCGP, a new Irvine Unified School District High School, and residential, retail, and commercial uses. The cemetery site is bounded by Cadence Boulevard to the northwest, Pusan Street to the north, Irvine Boulevard to the east, a habitat restoration area  to the south and southeast, and a golf course to the west.

Burial Options
The cemetery has a combination of burial facilities to meet the desires of all Veterans. The proposed 211,125 burials will be accommodated by approximately 70 percent cremation and 30percent precast in ground burials. At full build-out, the cemetery will supply 211,125 gravesites with 60,066 in-ground crypts, 645 oversize in-ground, 55,614 in-ground cremains, and 94,800 columbarium niches, enough to serve the anticipate needs of veterans for the next 100 years. Phase 1 includes the necessary buildings and 5,000 gravesites- 1,750 in-ground cremains and 3,250 columbarium niches.
For cremated remains, burial will be in freestanding double columbarium wall niches or inground cremains burials. Walls are arranged in courts of three to eight walls for a total of 2,000 to 12,400 niches in a single court. The architectural style of the walls are to match the California Tuscan building style.
Of the 60,711 crypt burials planned for the cemetery, 95 percent will be 3 foot by 8 foot plots, with the remaining 5 percent as over-sized 5 foot by 10 foot plots. Full casket burials will utilize pre-placed double depth vaults. The burial areas are divided into 32 crypt fields. The sections are separated by vegetated edges and slopes. Since the site has reclaimed water available the site can use turf or decomposed granite (a local crushed rock). The site is relatively flat and therefore accommodating slopes less than 2 percent can be achieved with minimal grading. Edges along\ the street would be planted with a colorful significant vegetated edge.
In addition to burial sites, the plan incorporates a memorial wall for those who do not desire burial on site but want to be memorialized as a veteran. The wall consists of 40 plaques in five rows mounted on a stucco wall with a cast stone cap flanked by stucco columns.

5.8 Hazards and Hazardous Materials
In discussions with the City of Irvine staff, when the site is transferred to the State, the State will  be responsible for the environmental remediation if contaminated soil is discovered during excavation There are two areas identified on the project site that have various institutional controls. As a result, future development of these areas may be somewhat restricted, depending on the proposed uses and activities. Some of these restrictions may be lifted as remediation actions are deemed complete. Attachment 1 describes these areas in more detail and a summary is presented below:
FOST 7 area contains contaminated ground water and is located on and around the air control tower building 372 and the FAA facility. It is assumed that surface improvements are and will be allowed; therefore, there are only roadway and columbarium niches proposed. Additionally, the development of these areas are proposed to be completed in Phases 7 and 10.
FOST 8 area has significant instructional controls/restrictions. This is area is located at the eastern portion of the site adjacent to the Navy property. It is assumed that no development will be allowed. Additionally, there is a buffer area of restrictions that is anticipated to be removed in the future and development should be allowed to occur. Burials within this area will not be developed until Phase 10 of construction.

9. PRELIMINARY HAZARDOUS MATERIALS SITE ASSESSMENT
An assessment of the hazardous materials found on site and a contaminated soil evaluation has been conducted by Avocet Environmental, Inc. The full report is found in Attachment 2
?Summary Environmental Evaluation.? The report concludes that MCAS El Toro is a very
complex, albeit mature, site with numerous documented impacts and very probably other impacts that won?t come to light until near-surface soil is disturbed during redevelopment. The proposed SCVC is located near the center of MCAS El Toro and very likely also encompasses multiple areas of impacted soil. As previously noted, this summary evaluation is based on the relevant FOST documents, which provide generally limited information. As such, Avocet adopted a conservative approach in identifying PECs and DRAs but makes no warranty regarding the completeness of the information presented in the FOST documents.
Demolition, redevelopment grading, foundation excavation, utility installation, and excavation for in-ground cremains and crypts will all involve soil disturbance, during which impacted soil could be encountered. In broad terms, contaminated soil encountered during demolition, redevelopment grading, foundation excavation, and utility installation could be addressed ?up  front? prior to the SCVC becoming operational. Excavation for in-ground cremains and crypts, however, likely would be a recurring activity that could go on for decades. In Avocet?s opinion, it would be impractical to address contaminated soil disturbed by in-ground cremains and crypt excavation on a case-by-case basis. The alternative would be to over-excavate and recompact the entire SCVC to a depth of, say, 8 to 10 feet below ground surface prior to it becoming operational and address contaminated soil, as/if encountered, at that time. Of course, there are significant cost considerations with such an approach.
A comprehensive soil survey should be conducted during the design of Phase 1 to identify any additional contaminated soil not previously encountered. If impacted soil is encountered, additional assessment may be required by overseeing regulatory agencies to determine if it is related to a known release or a previously undocumented release. The estimate does not include the cost to abate contaminated soil if discovered as a result of the soil survey, nor does the estimate include the cost for involvement of overseeing regulatory agencies. Based on the findings of the survey, a robust soil management plan should be developed to ensure that contaminated soil encountered at any stage of the SCVE development is characterized, profiled, and managed appropriately.
Click to expand...

211,125?  Damn, that's a lot of ghosts.

Wonder why you have to remediate the soil?  They're all dead anyway.  When you're embalmed in formaldehyde, I'd doubt you'd care that the soil you're buried in is toxic.
 
YellowFever said:
I said it could leach formaldehyde and metal if they bury dead and decaying bodies within caskets.
Click to expand...

YellowFever, we use concrete grave liners in this country. Even if they bury caskets, it won't get crushed from the weight of the soil or come into contact with the ground below. I think you're pretty safe from formaldehyde and metal-leaching concerns as far as that goes.
 
SoCal said:
YellowFever said:
I said it could leach formaldehyde and metal if they bury dead and decaying bodies within caskets.
Click to expand...

YellowFever, we use concrete grave liners in this country. Even if they bury caskets, it won't get crushed from the weight of the soil or come into contact with the ground below. I think you're pretty safe from formaldehyde and metal-leaching concerns as far as that goes.
Click to expand...

ah but you're not seeing those graphics he pasted. there's cracks in those concretes. nevermind how it can happen but it MIGHT happen so better get ready for the bio hazard suits when you live in Irvine.
 
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