Shady Canyon

"No need to be flippant. I was just expressing my view which is what I thought this board was for."



That's an easy mistake to make.
 
[quote author="not a realtor" date=1252369374][quote author="Roo" date=1252277777][quote author="not a realtor" date=1252276284]I for the life of me cannot figure out why anyone would live in Shaday Canyon or Coto. If you're going to live in Socal, live by the beach. Otherwise you're just overpaying for an Arizona life. This is particularly true in Coto. Heck, Coto is probably closer to the 909 than the Ocean. Socal is expensive because of the ocean and beach lifestyle. Ladera, Coto, Mission Viejo, Shady, etc. I just don't get it. Mostly cookie cutter, tract, insta homes you can find anywhere. Irvine to some extent makes sense. Even though it's hot, sterile, and far from the beach at least it's close to work for many people.</blockquote>


I can't disagree any more.



Have you been to AZ? the weather is no wehre close to what it is in all the places you mentionned. It's been really hot the last couple of weeks, but that's about it. Go in AZ and it's been in the 100 since April.



SoCal is not ALL about the beach. Personally, I'm not a big beach fan, I like to see it, sometimes go take a walk in the sand, but I'm no surfer. However, I like the outdoors and there are thousands of things you can do all year long in SoCal.



If I'd buy in Newport Coast it would only be for the ocean view. Shady canyon is nicely located just as well as Newport Coast for me. About other areas like Coto, Mission, Ladera, Talega that you don't get, well think how much more land and sf you get there compared to Irvine. Also, keep in mind some poeple are retired or don't work in Irvine and these places are closer to their work.</blockquote>


socal really is all about the beach. it is the only reason socal enjoys higher property values than the most of the country. if you're not a beach person why live here? Maybe you have a job here but you could probably get one in another state and have a better quality of life due to cost of living. You mention newport coast but say it is because of the ocean view (ie the beach). shady canyon is in a pit full of dry shrubs. Yes you can get bigger lots/houses in ladera, etc. It's because people like living there less due to heat, distance from the ocean, etc. If you like the cookie cutter, car culture, insta cities filled with tract homes there is plenty of that around the country where you really can get a bigger lot and house. Whether you surf or not the draw for socal is for most the ocean and the property values for the most part bear that out. The further from the water generally the cheaper the community. maybe you are one of the exceptions. I maintain living in south inland oc in particular is really overpaying for a lifestyle available many other places for half the price.</blockquote>


I used to think the same thing, but I thought about it and realized that home prices in coto are already discounted for that same reason. And, on a nice summer day, it's only a 30 minute drive to the beach. I definitely prefer Dana Point, Laguna Niguel, and up to Newport Beach a lot more, but Coto is a nice alternative if you can't afford that size house in a city closer to the beach. To me coto is a nice austin, texas piece of suburbia placed a lot closer to the beach and less humid.
 
[quote author="not a realtor" date=1252276284]



No need to be flippant. I was just expressing my view which is what I thought this board was for.</blockquote>


Be careful with objective personal views... they don't make friends with the popular crowd.
 
[quote author="RoLar_USC" date=1252396588][quote author="not a realtor" date=1252276284]



No need to be flippant. I was just expressing my view which is what I thought this board was for.</blockquote>


Be careful with objective personal views... they don't make friends with the popular crowd.</blockquote>




Dude who ARE you? You're as petty and childish as an angst ridden teenage GIRL. The popular crowd? WTF is this? The 7th grade?
 
[quote author="GraceOMalley" date=1252396931][quote author="RoLar_USC" date=1252396588][quote author="not a realtor" date=1252276284]



No need to be flippant. I was just expressing my view which is what I thought this board was for.</blockquote>


Be careful with objective personal views... they don't make friends with the popular crowd.</blockquote>




Dude who ARE you? You're as petty and childish as an angst ridden teenage GIRL. The popular crowd? WTF is this? The 7th grade?</blockquote>


Haha, feels like it sometimes. I was just joking around! Relax dude... and don't make fun of girls. I couldn't think of a better way to put it, I was going to use "forum Nazis" but that might upset some people. Bad joke I guess... Why do you pick me out of the crowd anyways? Crowd being 3 people...



I was just offering Not a Realtor some advice, before he gets voted off the island.
 
[quote author="RoLar_USC" date=1252399037][quote author="GraceOMalley" date=1252396931][quote author="RoLar_USC" date=1252396588][quote author="not a realtor" date=1252276284]



No need to be flippant. I was just expressing my view which is what I thought this board was for.</blockquote>


Be careful with objective personal views... they don't make friends with the popular crowd.</blockquote>




Dude who ARE you? You're as petty and childish as an angst ridden teenage GIRL. The popular crowd? WTF is this? The 7th grade?</blockquote>


Haha, feels like it sometimes. I was just joking around! Relax dude... and don't make fun of girls. I couldn't think of a better way to put it, I was going to use "forum Nazis" but that might upset some people. Bad joke I guess... Why do you pick me out of the crowd anyways? Crowd being 3 people...



I was just offering Not a Realtor some advice, before he gets voted off the island.</blockquote>




No one is getting voted off the island, and since I am a person of the female persuasion I will make fun of us all I want to.



There are no "forum nazis". The people you keep arguing with have been at this far longer and more intensely than you, or I, and honestly they have proved to one another the value and validity of their statements, facts and sources. To be clear? They know their stuff.



Its is not an easy group to be friends with because at times they are analytical to the point of being annoying. That being said, their methodical approach means that they rarely make mistakes in their analysis.



Having met most of them in person, I can tell you that they are generally pretty kind, and well meaning. And a really good, solid source of information. If you have your facts down, can articulate them clearly and back them up, chances are they will quit picking on you. But piss in their wheaties and they will piss back in yours.



Im not "picking you out of a crowd" but I am getting really annoyed with the one upsmanship of both this thread and the "4 weeks and all hell breaks loose" thread, not just from you but from all participating. I mean come on.... just get the ruler out and measure already. The over abundance of testosterone is stinking up the place.

:roll:
 
I have only posted on this thread once before, though I check in on it almost dally as I look for a new home in OC. It has been a very valuable source for information about properties and values in Shady Canyon: I?m always sorry to see a page taken up with foolish commentary. That said, I will weigh in on the value of Shady versus the beach. I have lived in Laguna Beach for MANY years now, in a lovely updated 1940?s home with a terrific ocean view and great privacy. With two growing tweens I find that as my husband and I look for a much-needed larger home the options are always a compromise: In Crystal Cove, your ocean view includes PCH, the parking lot & loading docks for Trader Joes, The Gap, etc.?and you can count on seeing several neighbors from your master bed & bath windows. In Laguna, Emerald Bay offers some very large, new homes with views: share the gate, share the ?public? pool, put up with the interminable speed bumps & the guard gate with no ?fast lane? for residents, and you will get a lot that extends a few feet in each direction from your walls. Because it slopes down to the sea, views are plentiful in Laguna?more so than Newport or CdM?but lots and homes tend to be smaller because of the age of many properties. At some point, probably anywhere near any coast, the trade is proximity to the ocean and the view that comes with that, versus a more spacious home, more property, and more private amenities?like your own pool, gate, or grass lawn. As prices in Shady Canyon have been dropping to where they probably should always have been, its advantages in terms of large house, large lot have become more attractive. It should cost LESS to live there than at the beach, for obvious reasons, but it still has something to offer?something hard to find next to the ocean. Bottom line: unlimited resources bring unlimited choices?.for the rest of us there is compromise!! And still, when my kids are grown, I will be back at the beach, not in Irvine. Family decisions are a compromise, too!
 
[quote author="Zulu" date=1230167103]A couple of the homes in Canyon Creek are in the low 4's, which they should be as this is the busiest street in Shady. Too dense and too much traffic.



The home at 57 Boulder View has just started construction. At $4.995m for 7,000 sf, this seller seems more realistic. The home was designed by high-end architect Fleetwood Joiner and will be very nice looking. The seller is building 2 properties - this Santa Barbara style home in Shady and a Tuscan on 2 acres in the Los Ranchos Estates section of Coto de Caza. They are also looking to trade either of their properties for a completed property in Shady, although the seller says most Shady Canyon realtors are "pooh-poohing the idea of a trade." Seems they should explore all avenues, but few realtors really want to go outside the box and actually try to put a deal together.



55 Boulder View is being sold because the seller wasn't able to sell their home in Laguna Niguel. It was in escrow, but then the buyer jumped ship and bought 95 Canyon Creek.



59 Boulder View has been on the market since 2007. Hmmm...think it could be the price? I think the market has spoken. HELLO!!!!



31 Watercress - heard they had a full price offer but the sellers turned it down because it required them to carry back the paper.</blockquote>


are you sure about your info?
 
Sandydee - some of what I wrote I heard from RE agents in Shady, some from owners themselves, and the rest was just commentary. I am only sure of one thing and that is what I hear - whether it is correct or not is anyones guess. That being said, if I were you, I wouldn't believe anything I read in this or any other blog. Blogs are nothing more than hearsay, rumor, speculation, probably a few lies mixed in from unscrupulous types. So take everything with a grain of salt. There is probably a big disclaimer somewhere in the fine print on this blog.



Sanctuary -it's hard to find real meat in the info in this blog. But there is some and every now and then someone comes up with good info. I check it regularly because I'm interested in Shady as a place to live. I lived near the beach for 10 years - in Newport and Corona Del Mar. Love the close restaurants, bars, etc but not a great place to raise kids in my opinion. I like Shady for a whole lot of reasons - big lots, beautiful homes, quiet, uncrowded, close to everything. What is not to like? Sure I'd like to have an ocean view, but not at the expense of what I'd give up (not to mention what I'd pay). For me, the California coast is not a particularly great view anyway. Coast of France - definitely. Howe Sound up near Squamish in B.C. - absolutely. Long Island, Bahamas - now THAT is waterfront ;0.
 
You certainly are consistent. :coolgrin:



[quote author="not a realtor" date=1252276284]I for the life of me cannot figure out why anyone would live in Shaday Canyon or Coto. If you're going to live in Socal, live by the beach. Otherwise you're just overpaying for an Arizona life. This is particularly true in Coto. Heck, Coto is probably closer to the 909 than the Ocean. Socal is expensive because of the ocean and beach lifestyle. Ladera, Coto, Mission Viejo, Shady, etc. I just don't get it. <strong>Mostly cookie cutter, tract, insta homes you can find anywhere. Irvine to some extent makes sense. Even though it's hot, sterile, and far from the beach at least it's close to work for many people.</strong></blockquote>


[quote author="not a realtor" date=1252369374]

socal really is all about the beach. it is the only reason socal enjoys higher property values than the most of the country. if you're not a beach person why live here? Maybe you have a job here but you could probably get one in another state and have a better quality of life due to cost of living. You mention newport coast but say it is because of the ocean view (ie the beach). shady canyon is in a pit full of dry shrubs. Yes you can get bigger lots/houses in ladera, etc. It's because people like living there less due to heat, distance from the ocean, etc. If you like the <strong>cookie cutter,</strong> car culture, insta cities filled with tract homes there is plenty of that around the country where you really can get a bigger lot and house. Whether you surf or not the draw for socal is for most the ocean and the property values for the most part bear that out. The further from the water generally the cheaper the community. maybe you are one of the exceptions. <strong> I maintain living in south inland oc in particular is really overpaying for a lifestyle available many other places for half the price.[/</strong>quote]





[quote author="not a realtor" date=1247872961]Why do people even consider lofts in OC? Lofts make sense in vibrant, more urban locations that are walkable and have some unique culture.



<strong>OC (especially irvine and aliso) are the most sterile, car culture, cookie cutter suburban places. </strong> Just because you thow up a few tall buildings doesn't mean you have a real city. And they don't even do it right. with all the setbacks and space between business parks it could never be walkable. I don't know, it just doesn't seem right to live in a loft when the entertainment is a chain restaurant in a vanilla shopping center.</blockquote>


[quote author="not a realtor" date=1242733770]<strong>If there is a more bland place than Irvine I don't know it.</strong> no part of inland oc especially south oc will ever be "beverly hills" because there is nothing unique about it. <strong>boring stucco boxes </strong>that all look alike and equally as important boring shopping centers that all look alike and are filled witth chain stores. you need some culture and variety to appreciate like a beverly hills</blockquote>


[quote author="not a realtor" date=1242363765]the best places to live are along the coast or north. <strong>the south inland communities are just too cookie cutter, sterile, and soul crushing</strong>. Yes they are new. But most are poorly constructed as most tract developments are thrown up quickly. After all they are spec homes. also, they are so car cultured. nothing to walk too. <strong>just cookie cutter shopping centers. </strong> and even though they are middle class areas there is so much pressure to appear rich. not a great environment for raising children. Finally, the south inland areas like ladera, mv, laguna niguel are just too far from job centers. either you're lucky enough to find one of the few jobs in aliso or you're commuting. even irvine is a tough commute from these places in traffic. best bet is coastal or the north communities.</blockquote>


[quote author="not a realtor" date=1240698910]there is nothing walkable in the south inland oc cities like laguna niguel. <strong>those cities are all very cookie cutter (and sterile to some). lBasically tract homes and cookie cutter shopping malls you drive to.</strong>

aguna like all beach towns is walkable.



as far as schools go, a lot of folks get hung up on api scores and such but really as long as the school isn't terrible your child's success has more to do his parents than anything else.



Sounds like even though you don't like the surf culture so much a beach town would be right for you. I would look at laguna or even up north in Belmont Shore (Long Beach) or one of the southbay cities. You will find the artsy, etc vibe there.</blockquote>


[quote author="not a realtor" date=1240376940][quote author="butterflymama" date=1240376312]I know it's impossible to predict these things, but I am going to throw it out there anyways. Obviously the Ladera Ranch housing market has taken some real hits and is one of the worst performing (if not THE worst performing) market in the OC. My question is this: Will it continue to go down? How much? When do you think we see bottom? Again, I know we don't have crystal balls and I certainly know I'm asking hard-to-answer questions. I am interested in hearing the discussion though.



Thanks!</blockquote>


an area that is far inland from the beach, very far south from job centers, <strong>is very sterile/cookie cutter</strong>, and buyers with not a lot of equity. Yeah, I think it's going to continue going down.</blockquote>


[quote author="not a realtor" date=1236319831]I find it weird that people would characterize anything in Irvine (or all of south inland orange county for that matter) as charming. Irvine offers safe, reasonably affordable (compared to coastal towns anyway), neighborhoods with good schools. But to call any of it charming is a stretch. <strong>It's very beige, cookie cutter, and manufactured</strong>.</blockquote>
 
[quote author="Zulu" date=1253017197]Sandydee - some of what I wrote I heard from RE agents in Shady, some from owners themselves, and the rest was just commentary. I am only sure of one thing and that is what I hear - whether it is correct or not is anyones guess. That being said, if I were you, I wouldn't believe anything I read in this or any other blog. Blogs are nothing more than hearsay, rumor, speculation, probably a few lies mixed in from unscrupulous types. So take everything with a grain of salt. There is probably a big disclaimer somewhere in the fine print on this blog.



Sanctuary -it's hard to find real meat in the info in this blog. But there is some and every now and then someone comes up with good info. I check it regularly because I'm interested in Shady as a place to live. I lived near the beach for 10 years - in Newport and Corona Del Mar. Love the close restaurants, bars, etc but not a great place to raise kids in my opinion. I like Shady for a whole lot of reasons - big lots, beautiful homes, quiet, uncrowded, close to everything. What is not to like? Sure I'd like to have an ocean view, but not at the expense of what I'd give up (not to mention what I'd pay). For me, the California coast is not a particularly great view anyway. Coast of France - definitely. Howe Sound up near Squamish in B.C. - absolutely. Long Island, Bahamas - now THAT is waterfront ;0.</blockquote>
Are you gonna be heading out to the foreclosure auctions looking to pick up the few Shady homes that are going on the auction block?
 
No, I'm committed to finishing our home under construction.



Foreclosure, no foreclosure...price is part of the equation but not the end-all. Some builders put more into their homes than others. What is sad is that they don't often get a higher price than a poorly built, flashier home. I think the best deal is to find a really well built home where the builder has put a lot of time and thought into every part of the home and if you can buy it at or less than replacement cost then you are getting a better deal than just buying a foreclosure property because it is cheap. You'll only be upset about buying a nice home the day you write the check, but you'll be upset with a dog every day that you own it no matter what you pay.



Some houses that are available, or sold, that I like:



72 Golden Eagle. Wow.http://smsold304.smsold.com/clients/04001/docs/100_72GoldenEagle.pdfI saw a basketball hoop by the garage so assume that either it sold, or the sellers gave up and move in to it. Not 100% my taste, but I'd love to live there if only for the view, the beautiful floors, windows, kitchen island....etc.



93 & 95 Canyon Creek - I heard both of these were built for owners, in any case neither is on the same level as a spec home. 93 is still available as far as I know. 95 sold a few months ago.



"Casa California" - don't know the address but it's on Canyon Creek and is this years' Philharmonic house. I think it opens in October and you can see it for $30 a pop. They spent a ton on their flooring and fireplaces - beautiful products from www.pstone.com and www.xsurfaces.com Not my style of home but except for the kitchen I like it.



57 Boulder View - when I see a builder using copper on the roof, copper vents, french limestone flooring samples lying around the house, miles of audio prewire and Fleetwood Joiner as the architect, I know it's going to be a quality product. The owner is planning to move in if it doesn't sell before completion, but for now it is still on the market. I think it is supposed to be completed by Feb 2010.



53 Boulder View - was on the market but didn't sell as far as I know. I think the owners moved in. Beautiful, quality materials throughout.



Home at top of Needlegrass being built by RDM. Right out of Provence. I love that home. My gosh it's beautiful. The owner/designer/builders have done their homework and it shows. I don't think its on the market but if it were and I could afford it....And by the way it does have an ocean view, sort of....



Any home built by Glass Construction IF you like the style. They are all quality in my opinion.



Foreclosure properties, for the most part, really aren't on my radar UNLESS they meet a lot of more important criteria. Flipping homes isn't really an option anymore - if you buy a home you'd better like it because your chances of reselling it are slim unless you sell it at a loss.





PS bargain of the week - 67 Canyon Creek - at $3.795m. If you could buy it at $3.2-3.5 that is basically foreclosure pricing without having to deal with an auction or the banks. I'm not sure what the problem is as to why the owners didn't bother to put the last bit of rock on the side of the house, or finish the landscaping, but I'm sure it probably has to do with MONEY. So some lucky buyer is going to get a nice custom home at less than the price of a tract home in Turtle Ridge.
 
[quote author="Zulu" date=1253191062]PS bargain of the week - 67 Canyon Creek - at $3.795m. If you could buy it at $3.2-3.5 that is basically foreclosure pricing without having to deal with an auction or the banks. I'm not sure what the problem is as to why the owners didn't bother to put the last bit of rock on the side of the house, or finish the landscaping, but I'm sure it probably has to do with MONEY. So some lucky buyer is going to get a nice custom home at less than the price of a tract home in Turtle Ridge.</blockquote>


They owe $3.4mil on it. So ya, probably $$, but probably won't get it below that unless the bank takes it. Its owned by an LLC set up just for that house.
 
[quote author="Zulu" date=1253191062]No, I'm committed to finishing our home under construction.



Foreclosure, no foreclosure...price is part of the equation but not the end-all. Some builders put more into their homes than others. What is sad is that they don't often get a higher price than a poorly built, flashier home. I think the best deal is to find a really well built home where the builder has put a lot of time and thought into every part of the home and if you can buy it at or less than replacement cost then you are getting a better deal than just buying a foreclosure property because it is cheap. You'll only be upset about buying a nice home the day you write the check, but you'll be upset with a dog every day that you own it no matter what you pay.



Some houses that are available, or sold, that I like:



72 Golden Eagle. Wow.http://smsold304.smsold.com/clients/04001/docs/100_72GoldenEagle.pdfI saw a basketball hoop by the garage so assume that either it sold, or the sellers gave up and move in to it. Not 100% my taste, but I'd love to live there if only for the view, the beautiful floors, windows, kitchen island....etc.



93 & 95 Canyon Creek - I heard both of these were built for owners, in any case neither is on the same level as a spec home. 93 is still available as far as I know. 95 sold a few months ago.



"Casa California" - don't know the address but it's on Canyon Creek and is this years' Philharmonic house. I think it opens in October and you can see it for $30 a pop. They spent a ton on their flooring and fireplaces - beautiful products from www.pstone.com and www.xsurfaces.com Not my style of home but except for the kitchen I like it.



57 Boulder View - when I see a builder using copper on the roof, copper vents, french limestone flooring samples lying around the house, miles of audio prewire and Fleetwood Joiner as the architect, I know it's going to be a quality product. The owner is planning to move in if it doesn't sell before completion, but for now it is still on the market. I think it is supposed to be completed by Feb 2010.



53 Boulder View - was on the market but didn't sell as far as I know. I think the owners moved in. Beautiful, quality materials throughout.



Home at top of Needlegrass being built by RDM. Right out of Provence. I love that home. My gosh it's beautiful. The owner/designer/builders have done their homework and it shows. I don't think its on the market but if it were and I could afford it....And by the way it does have an ocean view, sort of....



Any home built by Glass Construction IF you like the style. They are all quality in my opinion.



Foreclosure properties, for the most part, really aren't on my radar UNLESS they meet a lot of more important criteria. Flipping homes isn't really an option anymore - if you buy a home you'd better like it because your chances of reselling it are slim unless you sell it at a loss.





PS bargain of the week - 67 Canyon Creek - at $3.795m. If you could buy it at $3.2-3.5 that is basically foreclosure pricing without having to deal with an auction or the banks. I'm not sure what the problem is as to why the owners didn't bother to put the last bit of rock on the side of the house, or finish the landscaping, but I'm sure it probably has to do with MONEY. So some lucky buyer is going to get a nice custom home at less than the price of a tract home in Turtle Ridge.</blockquote>
Thank you for your reply. Can you snap some pictures of your home when it completed and post them up for us to see? If money was no object I would love to buy a custom home and make it exactly the way I want it. Was it difficult in getting your plans approved with the HOA/CC&R requirements or are you free to pretty much build whatever you want? What would you say are the most frustrating aspects of building your home? One of my good clients during my commercial real estate lender days was a custom homebuilder/commercial real estate developer in Las Vegas. He built many gorgeous custom homes in Lake Las Vegas, Anthem, and Summerlin. I used to love going to his office to see the pictures of some of those masterpieces.
 
[quote author="sanctuary" date=1253193639]Didn't 67 Canyon Creek close this week?</blockquote>
It still shows as ACTIVE with a listing price of $3,795,000. Based upon Foreclosure Radar, a Notice of Default was filed on the property on 6/10/09 (there's total debt of $3,446,400).
 
More Shady Canyon smack down: 128 Canyon Creek reduced from $2,195,000 to $1,795,000, or - 18%, and 86 Canyon Creek fell out of escrow.
 
What were those lots initially selling for?



Do you know how big the <a href="http://www.redfin.com/CA/Irvine/55-Canyon-Crk-92603/home/5929745">55 Canyon Creek</a> lot is?
 
[quote author="ABC123" date=1253312741]What were those lots initially selling for?



Do you know how big the <a href="http://www.redfin.com/CA/Irvine/55-Canyon-Crk-92603/home/5929745">55 Canyon Creek</a> lot is?</blockquote>


if you look in the proprty tax info, the land value listed there is usually pretty close to what they paid for the lot.
 
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