Is 1800 sq ft too small for a 4br?

[CogNeuroSci]

Valid points. I am wondering whether this is recent. Because there are a bunch of plan 3s and 4s butted up against the setback that the seller already sold in previous phases. People are living there too. I wonder what their reaction is and whether there is a plan forward...

Yeah, it's such a nice community with amazing homes and floor plans. There better be a plan going forward, and it better not cost residents any money or involve a lawsuit.

Have you asked Robin and Tammy from the sales office?

 

[Icarus1204]

Valid points. I am wondering whether this is recent. Because there are a bunch of plan 3s and 4s butted up against the setback that the seller already sold in previous phases. People are living there too. I wonder what their reaction is and whether there is a plan forward...

Yeah, it's such a nice community with amazing homes and floor plans. There better be a plan going forward, and it better not cost residents any money or involve a lawsuit.

Have you asked Robin and Tammy from the sales office?

I did. She said this was the first time she was hearing about it. Her guess is that it is the temporary electric poles making that noise but she's going to ask a couple folks including her site manager about it and let me know.

 

[freedomcm]

What charges make up the $15k in closing costs?

They estimated $8,000-$10,000 on top of closing cost which was quoted around $15k. Even the disclosures didn't outline the impound amount because "it was too soon" since we aren't closing until end of November. It's all very odd.

 

[usctrojancpa]

What charges make up the $15k in closing costs?

They estimated $8,000-$10,000 on top of closing cost which was quoted around $15k. Even the disclosures didn't outline the impound amount because "it was too soon" since we aren't closing until end of November. It's all very odd.

A good estimate for buyer closing costs is about 1% of the purchase price, whether it's new or resale (prorations, impounds, and lender fees/credits can change that percentage). Biggest closing costs for new home purchases are escrow fees, owners title insurance policy, county transfer tax, homeowners insurance policy, and HOA fees.

 

[freedomcm]

still don't quite get the need for title insurance for a new house on a new lot....

 

[Kings]

still don't quite get the need for title insurance for a new house on a new lot....

many times it's the lender that will require this to cover their ass

 

[yes2]

Lender Title insurance is mandatory, owner title insurance is optional.

 

[CogNeuroSci]

I?ve been in a lot of homes and anyone can make all the arguments for efficient layouts, floorplans, etc, all they want, but for Me 2000 SQFT and under feels way to ?cozy? to be anything other than a temporary starter home.

Here's another way to look at it, Kris. When I was in HS, we thought we were going to have a nuclear war with the USSR and then Russian tennis players were coming to America and becoming "Americanized" and welcomed. Another example is homes used to have a separate living room and family room, but now new homes are "space efficient" with one great room, even homes at 3000 sq ft. The social fabric changes and the collective conscious adjusts.

People from other cities come into Irvine and fall in love but complain (at least initially) that for each price point, the homes are small, on small lots, and too close to each other. In Irvine, for $500,000-$700,000, you can probably get only 2-3 bdr or 2 bdr + tech room (1/2 loft). These people might then go elsewhere, like Ontario Ranch, and buy a 3000 sq ft, 5-bdr, new construction home for around $600,000! But they'd rather be in Irvine.

If only there was a way to be in Irvine and stay under $900,000 but get 4 bdr or 3bdr + loft. And when (and where) you least expect it, along comes such a way--California Pacific Homes! Talise Plans 1 and 2 both come with a little over 1800 sq ft with 4 decent size rooms at less than $900K, Montara has a Plan 3 with 4 bdr or 3 + full size loft at $880K, and Celeste has a Plan 4X with 4 bdr + full size loft at less than $850K. All in a little over 1800 sq ft. If you're not averse to 3-story homes, Celeste has the best one that I've seen since 2015: a Plan 1 at 1792 sq ft with 3 bdr [very very large master bdr (15' X 16'6") with shower AND tub and large 2ndary bdr on 3rd floor] and a really ideal kitchen (with balcony) and spacious great room on the 2nd floor for $759K. Brisa and its twin, Carissa, have a 1590 sq ft 3-story plan for $700K that has an unusually spacious feel in the 2nd floor great room and dining area (because it's 21 ft long) independent of the kitchen/kitchen island area!

So it's like a new neural pathway or bridge has been established that didn't exist before that provides never-before-seen ACCESS. And this isn't just psycho-babble; the phenomenology is real and can be quantified (eg, 4 bdr for under $900K). Now, a lot of people like me can gain access to Irvine. Whether you're young, not so young, with children, or planning to have children is not the point. The point is we now have the numbers (eg, number of rooms) that provide the option to stay in Irvine in these homes for the long-term, if we choose to.

You roll into Irvine and you get hit in the face (cognitive dissonance) and it takes some time to sort your schemas out (looks like it's going to have to be Ontario Ranch or Chino Hills). Along comes Cal Pac Homes and you get hit with cognitive dissonance again. But this time, although it's positive, it's a bit tricky for your brain to sort out. Certain pillars of conventional thought might not seem so clear and definitive anymore. Such as what is the sq ft cut-off point that decides whether a home is a starter home or a permanent home. Like I mentioned before, Samsung (Cal Pac) didn't care what Steve Jobs had said (that the 3.5" screen of the iPhone 1/2/3 was perfect and no one would ever want anything larger) and simply went ahead and purposely reworked the (psychological) matrix by simultaneously flooding the market in 2012 with phones of all kinds of screen sizes. Samsung redefined the verbal label of "perfect screen size" and Cal Pac appears to be redefining the label of "starter home" or, to be more precise, "Irvine starter home." Irvine home buyers need to be more flexible in their thinking. And now we have more options to allow for this, which can only be a good thing.

 

[Dr. CA Real Estate]

Yes the smaller more bedroom homes give people access to Irvine at a lower price point.... They still feel small

 

[BlackkFever]

Here's another way to look at it, Kris. When I was in HS, we thought we were going to have a nuclear war with the USSR and then Russian tennis players were coming to America and becoming "Americanized" and welcomed. Another example is homes used to have a separate living room and family room, but now new homes are "space efficient" with one great room, even homes at 3000 sq ft. The social fabric changes and the collective conscious adjusts.

People from other cities come into Irvine and fall in love but complain (at least initially) that for each price point, the homes are small, on small lots, and too close to each other. In Irvine, for $500,000-$700,000, you can probably get only 2-3 bdr or 2 bdr + tech room (1/2 loft). These people might then go elsewhere, like Ontario Ranch, and buy a 3000 sq ft, 5-bdr, new construction home for around $600,000! But they'd rather be in Irvine.

If only there was a way to be in Irvine and stay under $900,000 but get 4 bdr or 3bdr + loft. And when (and where) you least expect it, along comes such a way--California Pacific Homes! Talise Plans 1 and 2 both come with a little over 1800 sq ft with 4 decent size rooms at less than $900K, Montara has a Plan 3 with 4 bdr or 3 + full size loft at $880K, and Celeste has a Plan 4X with 4 bdr + full size loft at less than $850K. All in a little over 1800 sq ft. If you're not averse to 3-story homes, Celeste has the best one that I've seen since 2015: a Plan 1 at 1792 sq ft with 3 bdr [very very large master bdr (15' X 16'6") with shower AND tub and large 2ndary bdr on 3rd floor] and a really ideal kitchen (with balcony) and spacious great room on the 2nd floor for $759K. Brisa and its twin, Carissa, have a 1590 sq ft 3-story plan for $700K that has an unusually spacious feel in the 2nd floor great room and dining area (because it's 21 ft long) independent of the kitchen/kitchen island area!

So it's like a new neural pathway or bridge has been established that didn't exist before that provides never-before-seen ACCESS. And this isn't just psycho-babble; the phenomenology is real and can be quantified (eg, 4 bdr for under $900K). Now, a lot of people like me can gain access to Irvine. Whether you're young, not so young, with children, or planning to have children is not the point. The point is we now have the numbers (eg, number of rooms) that provide the option to stay in Irvine in these homes for the long-term, if we choose to.

You roll into Irvine and you get hit in the face (cognitive dissonance) and it takes some time to sort your schemas out (looks like it's going to have to be Ontario Ranch or Chino Hills). Along comes Cal Pac Homes and you get hit with cognitive dissonance again. But this time, although it's positive, it's a bit tricky for your brain to sort out. Certain pillars of conventional thought might not seem so clear and definitive anymore. Such as what is the sq ft cut-off point that decides whether a home is a starter home or a permanent home. Like I mentioned before, Samsung (Cal Pac) didn't care what Steve Jobs had said (that the 3.5" screen of the iPhone 1/2/3 was perfect and no one would ever want anything larger) and simply went ahead and purposely reworked the (psychological) matrix by simultaneously flooding the market in 2012 with phones of all kinds of screen sizes. Samsung redefined the verbal label of "perfect screen size" and Cal Pac appears to be redefining the label of "starter home" or, to be more precise, "Irvine starter home." Irvine home buyers need to be more flexible in their thinking. And now we have more options to allow for this, which can only be a good thing.

But why live in Irvine when you can commute from Chino Hills?

Such a relaxing drive on a country toll road through rustic scenery that every true southern Californian should love.

 

[OCtoSV]

Like with any product creating more levels of segmentation expands the total available market. You couldn't pay me to live in one of those 3 story plans though.

 

[CogNeuroSci]

But why live in Irvine when you can commute from Chino Hills?

Such a relaxing drive on a country toll road through rustic scenery that every true southern Californian should love.

So funny you? After the self-congratulations, you and your comment helps the OP and members how?

 

[CogNeuroSci]

Like with any product creating more levels of segmentation expands the total available market. You couldn't pay me to live in one of those 3 story plans though.

I agree on both counts. For us, at our age, we wouldn't want 3-stories. Younger couples maybe would like the pros vs cons. No courtyard, but you get a large master bdr w/ bathroom tub.

 

[Irvine2020]

I?ve been communicating with Erica Dose at Loan Depot for my Cal Pacific home. She?s been great, very responsive and knowledgeable. They recently started doing rate locks but we are still looking around for rates.

I agree Erica dose has been great!

 

[usctrojancpa]

Like with any product creating more levels of segmentation expands the total available market. You couldn't pay me to live in one of those 3 story plans though.

+1 I would advise would-be buyers away from 3-level homes unless the 3rd level has a bonus room/loft. You want to have the kitchen/living on the ground level when you enter the home.

 

[CogNeuroSci]

Like with any product creating more levels of segmentation expands the total available market. You couldn't pay me to live in one of those 3 story plans though.

+1 I would advise would-be buyers away from 3-level homes unless the 3rd level has a bonus room/loft. You want to have the kitchen/living on the ground level when you enter the home.

I hear what you're saying, Martin. You didn't say why, but I'll assume it has to do with (1) resale and (2) inconvenience climbing up to the primary living areas.

I will admit that 5 years ago, while looking at KB Homes Willow in PS6, which is the location from hell that is sandwiched in a narrow, vertical line between Pavilion Park and the 133 toll fwy, I wondered why anyone would ever buy one of those. Willow consists of 4 attached condo plans, all have 2-car tandem garages, none have 1st floor bedroom, and the largest 2 plans are 4 stories (1st floor garage, 2nd floor nothing but access floor, living areas 3rd and 4th floors). It took them a while, but they eventually sold out. It couldn't have been an ideal purchase for any of those buyers.

Every new home buyer has valid reasons to feel good about their purchase, and it was up to me to find out what they might be. So I decided to change my premise and assume some of those buyers didn't second-guess themselves and don't regret their purchase to this day. If only I could run into one of those buyers.

I ran into one of those buyers 3.5 years ago. She's the daughter of my friend, who owns an Irvine mortgage brokerage! Her mom and dad own 8 houses. They live in the big one in Quail Hill and the others are rented out. They have a mortgage on each house. The daughter graduated from college and got a tech job back home in Irvine. Shortly after, she bought a unit in Willow with 20% down payment and immediately rented it out. Her parents would not let her make a stupid purchase, even if I couldn't understand it at the time. I recently learned her Willow condo has risen $100,000 in value and her tenant's rent covers the monthly mortgage, HOA, and property tax.

My wife and I recently thought about buying the Celeste plan 1, which is 3 stories, and that's only because it has a 1st floor room that we could rent out. Ideally, we wouldn't want the tenant to live on the same floor as our other bedrooms. Both we and the tenant would have more privacy. It would be about $90,000 less than the house we ended up buying and we could collect about $800-1000/mo on rent.

 

[CogNeuroSci]

Yes the smaller more bedroom homes give people access to Irvine at a lower price point.... They still feel small

You didn't just say "feel small" the first time; you said "2000 SQFT and under feels way to ?cozy? to be anything other than a temporary starter home."

First, they don't feel small to me. Second, I would safely say many people who are not you bought those homes to be permanent or long-term homes.

 

[usctrojancpa]

Like with any product creating more levels of segmentation expands the total available market. You couldn't pay me to live in one of those 3 story plans though.

+1 I would advise would-be buyers away from 3-level homes unless the 3rd level has a bonus room/loft. You want to have the kitchen/living on the ground level when you enter the home.

I hear what you're saying, Martin. You didn't say why, but I'll assume it has to do with (1) resale and (2) inconvenience climbing up to the primary living areas.

I will admit that 5 years ago, while looking at KB Homes Willow in PS6, which is the location from hell that is sandwiched in a narrow, vertical line between Pavilion Park and the 133 toll fwy, I wondered why anyone would ever buy one of those. Willow consists of 4 attached condo plans, all have 2-car tandem garages, none have 1st floor bedroom, and the largest 2 plans are 4 stories (1st floor garage, 2nd floor nothing but access floor, living areas 3rd and 4th floors). It took them a while, but they eventually sold out. It couldn't have been an ideal purchase for any of those buyers.

Every new home buyer has valid reasons to feel good about their purchase, and it was up to me to find out what they might be. So I decided to change my premise and assume some of those buyers didn't second-guess themselves and don't regret their purchase to this day. If only I could run into one of those buyers.

I ran into one of those buyers 3.5 years ago. She's the daughter of my friend, who owns an Irvine mortgage brokerage! Her mom and dad own 8 houses. They live in the big one in Quail Hill and the others are rented out. They have a mortgage on each house. The daughter graduated from college and got a tech job back home in Irvine. Shortly after, she bought a unit in Willow with 20% down payment and immediately rented it out. Her parents would not let her make a stupid purchase, even if I couldn't understand it at the time. I recently learned her Willow condo has risen $100,000 in value and her tenant's rent covers the monthly mortgage, HOA, and property tax.

My wife and I recently thought about buying the Celeste plan 1, which is 3 stories, and that's only because it has a 1st floor room that we could rent out. Ideally, we wouldn't want the tenant to live on the same floor as our other bedrooms. Both we and the tenant would have more privacy. It would be about $90,000 less than the house we ended up buying and we could collect about $800-1000/mo on rent.

Main reasons are those 3-level homes decrease the future buyer pool as well as the renter pool and that results in lower future appreciation compared to their 2-level counterparts. It's mainly the inconvenience of all the stairs (e.g. you forget your car keys in the 3rd level master when you are in the garage), not having multiple bedrooms on one floor, more cramped living areas (tall and skinny layout), and less efficient use of SF space as stair area does count as square footage. The big draw of buyers to these 3+ level condos is the attractive price point (much lower price per SF) than 2-level condos. So a buyer that is on a limited budget that wants to live in Irvine will be drawn to those cheaper condos.

I actually sold one of those Willow condos a few years ago (as well as a few other 3 level condos) so I heard all of the negative feedback from buyers. The seller of that condo did regret buying the condo because they knew that if they bought a 2-level condo it would have appreciated more but that's all they could afford at that time. Even though that Willow condo appreciated because the entire Irvine market appreciated, I'm positive that a similar sized 2-level condo appreciated more because the buyer pool is much larger for 2-level condos. As I tell my clients, if a home sells at a lower price when they buy it because of various negative aspects, including being 3+ levels, when they buy it'll less for a lower price when they sell it. A great example of that is Celeste, the only available unsold lots are the 3-level Plan 2 condos. One of my jobs as an agent for my clients is to help them to purchase a home that will have good resale value/appreciation in the future.

 

[CogNeuroSci]

Valid points. I am wondering whether this is recent. Because there are a bunch of plan 3s and 4s butted up against the setback that the seller already sold in previous phases. People are living there too. I wonder what their reaction is and whether there is a plan forward...

Yeah, it's such a nice community with amazing homes and floor plans. There better be a plan going forward, and it better not cost residents any money or involve a lawsuit.

Have you asked Robin and Tammy from the sales office?

I did. She said this was the first time she was hearing about it. Her guess is that it is the temporary electric poles making that noise but she's going to ask a couple folks including her site manager about it and let me know.

Good news! I went to Talise last night at just before 1AM--and the noise was gone! Completely gone. No noise at all and just peaceful quiet.

Maybe whatever makes the noise turns on at 8PM and shuts off at 12AM (or at least before 1 AM), I don't know. I'll test again between 12AM and 1AM.

But right now, I'll just assume the noise is probably gone for good. Talise is back to being awesome again!

 

[Mety]

Valid points. I am wondering whether this is recent. Because there are a bunch of plan 3s and 4s butted up against the setback that the seller already sold in previous phases. People are living there too. I wonder what their reaction is and whether there is a plan forward...

Yeah, it's such a nice community with amazing homes and floor plans. There better be a plan going forward, and it better not cost residents any money or involve a lawsuit.

Have you asked Robin and Tammy from the sales office?

I did. She said this was the first time she was hearing about it. Her guess is that it is the temporary electric poles making that noise but she's going to ask a couple folks including her site manager about it and let me know.

Good news! I went to Talise last night at just before 1AM--and the noise was gone! Completely gone. No noise at all and just peaceful quiet.

Maybe whatever makes the noise turns on at 8PM and shuts off at 12AM (or at least before 1 AM), I don't know. I'll test again between 12AM and 1AM.

But right now, I'll just assume the noise is probably gone for good. Talise is back to being awesome again!

So if I roam around 1AM in that area, I'll know who YF is?