[IHB] Does the Irvine school system add value to local houses?

[IndieDev]

... but not in 2008.

Everybody here realizes that there are 8 ivy league schools right?  Brown University, Columbia University, Cornell University, Dartmouth College, Harvard University, Princeton University, the University of Pennsylvania, and Yale University.  Hard to imagine that not one UHS student got accepted in any given year.

My thought exactly.  I haven't seen IndieDev provide any evidence of this other than him saying it's a fact.  I went to ANHS and the school was terrible.  Out of my class of 650, we had about 15 go to UCLA and 10 to Cal and 1 Ivy League (Brown).  I just remember meeting a TON of people from Irvine HSs during college and when I look at the statistics, I can see why.  I'm pretty sure it's safe to say that Irvine HSs send a larger % of students to mid/top universities than surrounding area schools.  The real only argument is if it's worth the premium...

Look you can spin it anyway you want, and if that's what you need to help rationalize overpaying for a home in Irvine, more power to you.

But the simple fact is Uni High sends most of its students to fairly average to below average universities after graduation, and people are paying hundreds of thousands of dollar premiums to get into homes zoned to the "famous" Uni High.

What if TIC showed in their brochures that 70% of the students who attended this elite high school went to places like UCSD, UCI, Fullerton and CAL POLY?  I think that would be a sobering thought considering the premium you're paying.

How much does personal tutoring and prep classes cost? I'm pretty sure not $250,000 over the course of 4 years.

 

[The Motor Court Company]

I think I'm taking crazy pills.

So basically, you guys think a $1,000,000 home is worth it for a school that sends 70% of its graduating class to schools that are considered mid to lower tier universities.

The TIC marketing machine is strong. I love it.

I lived in Bay Area for several years; there is no TIC there but people pay top dollars to get into good school districts. I would say you don't need marketing to persuade the targeted audience because they actively seek out the best schools with the highest APIs already. TIC is in effect wasting money in advertising how great the Irvine schools are.

 

[so_scared]

I think I'm taking crazy pills.

So basically, you guys think a $1,000,000 home is worth it for a school that sends 70% of its graduating class to schools that are considered mid to lower tier universities.

The TIC marketing machine is strong. I love it.

I lived in Bay Area for several years; there is no TIC there but people pay top dollars to get into good school districts. I would say you don't need marketing to persuade the targeted audience because they actively seek out the best schools with the highest APIs already. TIC is in effect wasting money in advertising how great the Irvine schools are.

this is so true. what is even crazier is that prices go through the roof in Asia because the homes are close to the best private after school tutoring schools too. This is in a city with easy access to mass transit where kids can get to the academy by subway if they need too yet the homes close to the areas have enormous premiums.

 

[IndieDev]

I think I'm taking crazy pills.

So basically, you guys think a $1,000,000 home is worth it for a school that sends 70% of its graduating class to schools that are considered mid to lower tier universities.

The TIC marketing machine is strong. I love it.

I lived in Bay Area for several years; there is no TIC there but people pay top dollars to get into good school districts. I would say you don't need marketing to persuade the targeted audience because they actively seek out the best schools with the highest APIs already. TIC is in effect wasting money in advertising how great the Irvine schools are.

I think that's true to a certain extent, I know the prices in places like Cupertino, and Danville, etc.

I don't think TIC has wasted any money in advertising/promoting the image of this city as some paradise for safety, stellar schools, and families. Just read some of the quotes in this thread.

"Irvine makes you closer to your family"
"Irvine attracts higher wage (aka class) people who are able to pay more taxes therefore making a better city"

When the reality is, Irvine isn't much more safe or closer to centers of work than surrounding cities. And just as we've proven in this thread, Irvine's BEST most ELITE high school is really just a feeder school for UCSD, UC Irvine, CSU Fullerton, and CAL POLY.

I honestly think Donald Bren is a marketing genius, and I am learning a lot of lessons from his work.

 

[NoSoup4U]

man you really are that stupid...

Grade 9 627
Grade 10 677
Grade 11 622
Grade 12 588
Total          2,514

That makes it even worse.

If we use 588 as our baseline, then 399/588 = 68% of Uni High Students go to UCSD, UCI, Fullerton, or CAL POLY SLO after graduation. Damn, 70% of the students pretty much go to mid-tier or lower tier schools.

That's definitely not worth $1,000,000.

Are those the number of students who got accepted to those schools or who actually attended those schools?

It's always "reported acceptances", so it's not 100% accurate. Someone could say they got accepted to Harvard and end up going to community college because of money issues, etc.

But I think it's safe to say that Uni High isn't some magical feeder school for top tier universities, which was my point from the very beginning.

Would you pay $1,000,000 for a home knowing that your child had a 70% chance to go to UCI, UCSD, CSU Fullerton, or CAL POLY SLO?

Do people really believe that you can't get into those schools coming from Aliso Niguel High School, Beckman, or any other high school with a 800+ API?

So explain to me what the premium means for Uni High zoned houses? It's marketing, just as I've been saying ALL along.

Where are the stats that show where these kids actually attended?  These numbers are only acceptances.  It's only smart to apply to some safety schools.

It looks like about 10% of the seniors get accepted to Cal.  Not bad if you ask me.

 

[irvinehomeowner]

I wish somebody on this board would just grow a sack and say what "good schools" is really code word for.  Everyone knows it, especially TIC.  Look at the faces on the glossy marketing materials.  Nobody here is paying that $250k premium for the "education" --- at least I hope nobody believes they are getting that value from any California public school. The premium is for the exclusivity of that Irvine bubble....being sheltered from all those people out there.  No need to apologize --- it is what it is.

It's a combination... good schools are part of the equation.

If Irvine schools were bad... would people buy here? If Irvine were crime-ridden, located in the boonies, didn't have good job centers, did not have ethnic dining/shopping... would prices be as high?

And these "bubbles" exist everywhere... even where you live. I'm sure you have bit of a premium over some surrounding cities in your area. If schools aren't that important, why not live in a bad district and just get the largest home possible for $180k?

For that matter... why does Indie still live in Irvine? He doesn't believe in the school system, he hates the prices and there is no 180 view... he says he has the money to do so, doesn't even need to sell his Irvine home... so why is he still here? He doesn't even like 85 Degrees that much. Weird.

 

[The Motor Court Company]

I think I'm taking crazy pills.

So basically, you guys think a $1,000,000 home is worth it for a school that sends 70% of its graduating class to schools that are considered mid to lower tier universities.

The TIC marketing machine is strong. I love it.

I wish somebody on this board would just grow a sack and say what "good schools" is really code word for.  Everyone knows it, especially TIC.  Look at the faces on the glossy marketing materials.  Nobody here is paying that $250k premium for the "education" --- at least I hope nobody believes they are getting that value from any California public school. The premium is for the exclusivity of that Irvine bubble....being sheltered from all those people out there.  No need to apologize --- it is what it is.

Good schools for the targeted buyers comprise mainly two things
1. high API scores (900+ for high school)
2. mostly Caucasians and Asians with very few blacks and Latinos (that's why some people rather choose Irvine HS or Woodbridge HS over Beckman)

Moreover, 2 actually fits well with the perception of being safe.

 

[IndieDev]

I think I'm taking crazy pills.

So basically, you guys think a $1,000,000 home is worth it for a school that sends 70% of its graduating class to schools that are considered mid to lower tier universities.

The TIC marketing machine is strong. I love it.

I wish somebody on this board would just grow a sack and say what "good schools" is really code word for.  Everyone knows it, especially TIC.  Look at the faces on the glossy marketing materials.  Nobody here is paying that $250k premium for the "education" --- at least I hope nobody believes they are getting that value from any California public school. The premium is for the exclusivity of that Irvine bubble....being sheltered from all those people out there.  No need to apologize --- it is what it is.

I'm not touching that subject, but if I did, it would be another day, and another thread (and I completely agree btw). I'm just having too much fun right now exposing Uni High in front of the bubble believers for what it really is; a super high rated high school that people overpay for their homes for, which is in reality a feeder school for some fairly average to below average universities.

 

[IndieDev]

man you really are that stupid...

Grade 9 627
Grade 10 677
Grade 11 622
Grade 12 588
Total          2,514

That makes it even worse.

If we use 588 as our baseline, then 399/588 = 68% of Uni High Students go to UCSD, UCI, Fullerton, or CAL POLY SLO after graduation. Damn, 70% of the students pretty much go to mid-tier or lower tier schools.

That's definitely not worth $1,000,000.

Are those the number of students who got accepted to those schools or who actually attended those schools?

It's always "reported acceptances", so it's not 100% accurate. Someone could say they got accepted to Harvard and end up going to community college because of money issues, etc.

But I think it's safe to say that Uni High isn't some magical feeder school for top tier universities, which was my point from the very beginning.

Would you pay $1,000,000 for a home knowing that your child had a 70% chance to go to UCI, UCSD, CSU Fullerton, or CAL POLY SLO?

Do people really believe that you can't get into those schools coming from Aliso Niguel High School, Beckman, or any other high school with a 800+ API?

So explain to me what the premium means for Uni High zoned houses? It's marketing, just as I've been saying ALL along.

Where are the stats that show where these kids actually attended?  These numbers are only acceptances.  It's only smart to apply to some safety schools.

It looks like about 10% of the seniors get accepted to Cal.  Not bad if you ask me.

It's not bad, and let me be clear, I'm NOT calling Uni High a "bad" high school. It's a great "public school", and deservedly so. In fact, I'd venture to say they may even send an above average amount to some good schools.

But I also want to know the truth, and the truth is, Uni High isn't a high school that automatically means you're destined for some high tier  university, or sends some high percentage of kids to elite colleges. 70% of the acceptances are from some fairly mediocre schools. I think if people knew this, or TIC advertised this fact, people might not blow an extra $250,000+ to live in a home zoned to this school.

 

[LAtoOC]

I wish somebody on this board would just grow a sack and say what "good schools" is really code word for.  Everyone knows it, especially TIC.  Look at the faces on the glossy marketing materials.  Nobody here is paying that $250k premium for the "education" --- at least I hope nobody believes they are getting that value from any California public school. The premium is for the exclusivity of that Irvine bubble....being sheltered from all those people out there.  No need to apologize --- it is what it is.

Tosh's first comedy special had an excellent bit on this. [youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NbrTeoDl0f4[/youtube]

 

[Irvinecommuter]

I think I'm taking crazy pills.

So basically, you guys think a $1,000,000 home is worth it for a school that sends 70% of its graduating class to schools that are considered mid to lower tier universities.

The TIC marketing machine is strong. I love it.

I wish somebody on this board would just grow a sack and say what "good schools" is really code word for.  Everyone knows it, especially TIC.  Look at the faces on the glossy marketing materials.  Nobody here is paying that $250k premium for the "education" --- at least I hope nobody believes they are getting that value from any California public school. The premium is for the exclusivity of that Irvine bubble....being sheltered from all those people out there.  No need to apologize --- it is what it is.

I'm not touching that subject, but if I did, it would be another day, and another thread (and I completely agree btw). I'm just having too much fun right now exposing Uni High in front of the bubble believers for what it really is; a super high rated high school that people overpay for their homes for, which is in reality a feeder school for some fairly average to below average universities.

I'm pretty sure that you have not proven you theory regarding Uni.  You may believe that it's a fluke but I think the stats and the rankings show the opposite.  Additionally, you make it sound like people come to Irvine solely for the schools.  Schools are just one part of the equation, just like the weather, the low crime rate, the parks, convenience/proximity to work, etc...all those are factors. 

 

[NoSoup4U]

....being sheltered from all those people out there.

Aren't a lot of South County cities segregated too?

 

[kalbi]

I wish somebody on this board would just grow a sack and say what "good schools" is really code word for.  Everyone knows it, especially TIC.  Look at the faces on the glossy marketing materials.  Nobody here is paying that $250k premium for the "education" --- at least I hope nobody believes they are getting that value from any California public school. The premium is for the exclusivity of that Irvine bubble....being sheltered from all those people out there.  No need to apologize --- it is what it is.

Good schools for the targeted buyers comprise mainly two things
1. high API scores (900+ for high school)
2. mostly Caucasians and Asians with very few blacks and Latinos (that's why some people rather choose Irvine HS or Woodbridge HS over Beckman)

Moreover, 2 actually fits well with the perception of being safe.

Winner, winner, chicken dinner.  I can't tell you how many times I heard that during the six years we lived in Irvine.  And oh, how distressed many zoned to Beckman were over the students from old Tustin bussed there.  I don't know why that is such a taboo subject, people need to be honest.

And yeah, IHO -- of course where I live carries a premium over the surrounding valley.  It's a gated hillside community...we wouldn't have moved here if we did not want some exclusivity.  Do you think we didn't notice that the demographics of Porter Ranch are almost identical to Irvine?  Do you think we didn't notice the 940 API score those demographics drive in the elem API?  Do you think we didn't notice that Granada Hills HS won the National Academic Decathalon?  Of course we noticed all those things.  But I sure as hell am not crediting Los Angeles Unified School District for that.  It's the student population, not the school that drives those things.

That's what my point is...stop this stupid argument that the "school" is better.  The pool of students in that school comes from a different socioeconomic background --- That drives the results of the school.  Not the other way around.  No California public school is worth $250k.  People are paying for something else, and labeling it "good schools".

I'm going to go out on a limb and say that the socialeconomic background of those that attend Corona Del Mar High most likely exceeds that of Uni students.  Why does Uni consistently outperforms CDM in terms of test scores then?

 

[Irvinecommuter]

That's what my point is...stop this stupid argument that the "school" is better.  The pool of students in that school comes from a different socioeconomic background --- That drives the results of the school.  Not the other way around.  No California public school is worth $250k.  People are paying for something else, and labeling it "good schools".

That's a little unfair.  While I think some people look for "segregation", it is also a product of socioeconomics in this country.  White and Asians are at a higher socioeconomic level than Latinos or Blacks.  People with money (regardless of race) look to live in the nice neighborhoods (ala Irvine).  There is a tendency for minority races to pool together (regardless of income) due to availability of minority services/food/culture. 

 

[NoSoup4U]

...White and Asians are at a higher socioeconomic level than Latinos or Blacks...

Persians are considered Asian btw.  There is a pretty big Persian population in Irvine.

 

[IndieDev]

I think I'm taking crazy pills.

So basically, you guys think a $1,000,000 home is worth it for a school that sends 70% of its graduating class to schools that are considered mid to lower tier universities.

The TIC marketing machine is strong. I love it.

I wish somebody on this board would just grow a sack and say what "good schools" is really code word for.  Everyone knows it, especially TIC.  Look at the faces on the glossy marketing materials.  Nobody here is paying that $250k premium for the "education" --- at least I hope nobody believes they are getting that value from any California public school. The premium is for the exclusivity of that Irvine bubble....being sheltered from all those people out there.  No need to apologize --- it is what it is.

I'm not touching that subject, but if I did, it would be another day, and another thread (and I completely agree btw). I'm just having too much fun right now exposing Uni High in front of the bubble believers for what it really is; a super high rated high school that people overpay for their homes for, which is in reality a feeder school for some fairly average to below average universities.

I'm pretty sure that you have not proven you theory regarding Uni.  You may believe that it's a fluke but I think the stats and the rankings show the opposite.  Additionally, you make it sound like people come to Irvine solely for the schools.  Schools are just one part of the equation, just like the weather, the low crime rate, the parks, convenience/proximity to work, etc...all those are factors.

I didn't have to prove anything, the stats are there to see for yourself. You think you need to go to Uni High to get into CSU Fullerton or UCI?

As for weather, safety, parks, and proximity to work, are you saying those are all things exclusive to Irvine therefore justifying the premium of price? Because that's a lot of bull.

 

[25inirvine]

That's a little unfair.  While I think some people look for "segregation", it is also a product of socioeconomics in this country.  White and Asians are at a higher socioeconomic level than Latinos or Blacks.  People with money (regardless of race) look to live in the nice neighborhoods (ala Irvine).  There is a tendency for minority races to pool together (regardless of income) due to availability of minority services/food/culture.

Well, you actually said the same thing I did --- but in a nicer way.  But really --- if all that is so unfair, why do so many people in Irvine thumb their nose at Beckman HS?  Within the racial subgroups, Beckman Asians and Beckman Whites actually have higher API scores than their Northwood counterparts across Culver.  So what's the problem with Beckman?

they don't want to go to school with mike tyson's kid?

 

[IndieDev]

I wish somebody on this board would just grow a sack and say what "good schools" is really code word for.  Everyone knows it, especially TIC.  Look at the faces on the glossy marketing materials.  Nobody here is paying that $250k premium for the "education" --- at least I hope nobody believes they are getting that value from any California public school. The premium is for the exclusivity of that Irvine bubble....being sheltered from all those people out there.  No need to apologize --- it is what it is.

Good schools for the targeted buyers comprise mainly two things
1. high API scores (900+ for high school)
2. mostly Caucasians and Asians with very few blacks and Latinos (that's why some people rather choose Irvine HS or Woodbridge HS over Beckman)

Moreover, 2 actually fits well with the perception of being safe.

Winner, winner, chicken dinner.  I can't tell you how many times I heard that during the six years we lived in Irvine.  And oh, how distressed many zoned to Beckman were over the students from old Tustin bussed there.  I don't know why that is such a taboo subject, people need to be honest.

And yeah, IHO -- of course where I live carries a premium over the surrounding valley.  It's a gated hillside community...we wouldn't have moved here if we did not want some exclusivity.  Do you think we didn't notice that the demographics of Porter Ranch are almost identical to Irvine?  Do you think we didn't notice the 940 API score those demographics drive in the elem API?  Do you think we didn't notice that Granada Hills HS won the National Academic Decathalon?  Of course we noticed all those things.  But I sure as hell am not crediting Los Angeles Unified School District for that.  It's the student population, not the school that drives those things.

That's what my point is...stop this stupid argument that the "school" is better.  The pool of students in that school comes from a different socioeconomic background --- That drives the results of the school.  Not the other way around.  No California public school is worth $250k.  People are paying for something else, and labeling it "good schools".

Shit son. I think Pat Star is my second favorite poster on this board now (maybe tied with USCTrojan).

 

[IndieDev]

I think the sales people selling those $1m+ Laguna Altura homes zoned for Uni may disagree with you.  If it was all TIC marketing, then shouldn't those be sold out by now?

That's two completely unrelated issues, it's not an issue of schools vs value, it's an issue of affordability vs desire.

The ability to afford a $1m+ home in today's economic climate is probably a lot less than the DESIRE to finance a $1m+ home. That still won't stop TIC from trying to lure the suckers in.

 

[IndieDev]

You made my signature. I can honestly say, there are probably 4 posters here who truthfully talk about Irvine, welcome to the club.