ICE or EV?

[morekaos]

They never really caught on. And without government welfare, there's not enough demand.

Electric vehicle sales are plummeting. Will they soon become too niche?​

Demand for electric vehicles in the U.S. has cratered since last September, when the $7,500 federal tax credit for EVs expired. The financial losses have forced automakers to write off billions of dollars in investment -- factories, battery technology and new models -- as consumers ignored higher-priced EVs for hybrids.

So what does that mean for consumers? Are electric vehicles now a niche form of transportation?

Wakefield argued there would have been "a long and steady growth" path for EVs if the current government had supported the industry, though he acknowledged that the market had been propped up by incentives and mandates.

"We're in a K economy and 65% of EV models are over $60,000," she said. "Consumers are still worried about the price. Not many models are affordable..."

Electric vehicle sales are plummeting. Will they soon become too niche?

Nearly 96% of electric vehicle owners say they would consider purchasing or leasing another one in the future, according to one study.

abcnews.com

 

[Liar Loan]

This is why Tesla's have not caught on.

How America’s Oil and Gas Dominance Has Weakened Iran​

Even at current prices, it’s still cheaper to fuel a gas-guzzler than to charge an electric vehicle. In any case, prices are lower than they were during most of the Biden presidency. Thank increased oil production in the U.S. and the rest of the Americas. While prices may rise further, they are unlikely to remain elevated for any significant duration.

https://www.wsj.com/opinion/how-americas-oil-and-gas-dominance-has-weakened-iran-022d8e84?st=ocNn3v

 

[morekaos]

By the way Scout is going to be another disaster…said it over and over…VW makes very bad financial decisions…this is another…

VW IS IN BIG FINANCIAL TROUBLE! SHOULD IT SELL SCOUT MOTORS?

German automaker Volkswagen is in a terrible financial spot that has it considering drastic action on less or non-profitable areas of the company, which could include its investment in EV startup Scout Motors.

Gunnar Kilian, a VW board member, warns that the company’s goal to cut about $11.6 million will need to be achieved through measures other than just workforce reduction. “We need to finally be brave and honest enough to throw things overboard that are being duplicated within the company or are simply ballast we don’t need for good results,” Kilian said.

VW is in Big Financial Trouble! Should It Sell Scout Motors?

Hard lessons to learn but VW never seems to…EV adoption is going great, don’t you think?…Just never caught on, huh?…

Volkswagen Loses Half Their Profit, Now Plan to Cut 50,000 Jobs Over Next Four Years​

When you overlay the big picture of their expensive “green energy” costs, the EU find themselves in an unescapable downward spiral. Quite literally, all commonsense seems to have been lost in their green energy chase.
By focusing on energy targets, specifically by trying to force production of European electric vehicles that are not favored by European car purchasers, the EU is shrinking their economy to the benefit of Beijing exploitation.

https://theconservativetreehouse.co...-plan-to-cut-50000-jobs-over-next-four-years/

 

[morekaos]

…And Honda bites the bullet and confesses the error of their ways (at shareholder expense)…and what do you know…Toyota is again vindicated for not stepping in the EV bear trap and losing a leg

Honda Just Lost Billions on EVs It Can't Sell​

Japanese automaker Honda just cancelled the production of three planned made-in-the-U.S.A. electric cars, including the 0-Series SUV, the 0-Series Saloon, and the Acura RSX — and the company says it will write off massive losses as a result.
Still, better than building EVs nobody wants to buy. The company said the EVs had to go to avoid future losses, complaining about the “current business environment where the demand for EVs is declining significantly.”

Honda says total write-downs could total $15.8 billion.

Then there's fussy old Toyota, which remained largely focused on hybrids and fuel-efficient ICE vehicles. That company seems to be doing just fine.

Honda Just Lost Billions on EVs It Can't Sell

Honda cancels U.S. EV production, faces $15.8B losses amid declining demand and market challenges.

pjmedia.com

 

[irvinehomeowner]

Except that Toyota is now in the EV space and moving forward.

The Highlander later this year will be an EV (and not over $100k). The revamped BZ is selling well. There are 5 models planned by 2027:

5 New Toyota & Lexus EVs we expect at U.S. dealers by 2027

As per our research, we can now identify five new Toyota and Lexus electric vehicles (EVs) planned for U.S. dealerships by 2027.

topelectricsuv.com

And this doesn't count the 2 Subaru clones of the Toyota EVs.

Nice disinformation attempt.

As for Honda... trying to figure out where these massive losses are because the 2 EVs they have (Prologue and Acura ZDX) are on GM platforms. Speculation is their Sony Afeela project is where this might be coming from but many of these automakers are using EVs as a scapegoat for fuzzy accounting.

And unlike morekaos, I can admit bad news:

While Hyundai/Kia is doing better than most with their EVs, they have discontinued the Ioniq 6 in the US... and have put other Kia EVx models on hold.

Everyone is waiting for US gov changes (which I agree with morekaos that EV adoption should not rely on subsidies) but recent gas price hikes is making people think about EVs again.

 

[irvinehomeowner]

Also, BMW is still designing and improving their EV lineup:

https://www.bmwusa.com/more-bmw/neue-klasse.html

Their Neue Klasse series (as a throwback to their New Class project in the 1960s) is all EV and will define the new design style of BMWs (they even mention their mistake in going with those overside kidney grills):

BMW's New Design Language Is Its Biggest Reset in 20 Years — Here's What It Actually Means

BMW's Neue Klasse design is the brand's biggest visual reset in 20 years. Here's what changed on the iX3, i3, and beyond — and what it means for every BMW going forward.

www.bmwblog.com

 

[morekaos]

Except that Toyota is now in the EV space and moving forward.

Everyone is waiting for US gov changes (which I agree with morekaos that EV adoption should not rely on subsidies) but recent gas price hikes is making people think about EVs again.

Face it…Toyota was smart and only now is tip toeing onto the EV Market as they step over the bodies of their foolish competition.. as for gas prices…you live in a bubble of our own making. (CA) National prices are still only in the mid $3.00 range and will soon fall…no one is running out and buying an EV because of that…They just never seemed to have caught on without massive government largesse and dumb, virtue signaling CEO’s…

 

[sgip]

The headline, and the "reasons" are BS. The RSX for example was cancelled about a year ago, not just in the last few weeks. The real reason Honda has pulled the ripcord is that outside of our protected American economy, these cars cannot compete against the Chinese EV's in price and quality.

None the less, it's another nail in the "development" curve of EV's being universally produced by all manufacturers.

Honda Cancels All Three U.S.-Built EVs as It Expects to Lose up to $15.8 Billion

The development and sale of the Honda 0-Series SUV, 0-Series Saloon, and the Acura RSX are being canceled, with Honda calling out tariffs and U.S. policy.

www.caranddriver.com

 

[irvinehomeowner]

It’s not the segment that is failing, it’s the execution.

Put it in smart phone terms. Remember Nokia and Motorola? They had innovative designs and features but they were missing out on what actual users wanted. As much as physical keyboards seemed like a need, Apple showed everyone touch screen was the king. And then Samsung showed Apple that big screens were better. So it’s not that EVs is not what people want, people always want better tech (which none of you ICE people have proved otherwise), it’s the other things like fast charging, public charging and range. All those are on the way. Remember when people felt that mobile phones had to last days/weeks on a charge? The paradigms shifts.

So while morekaos loves his mini victories, it’s not going to stop progress. EVs are the next evolution in transportation like cars over horses and smartphones ever landlines. The gravy? Less pollution and less dependence on fossil fuels. That’s the byproduct not the main motivation, smartphones did not come into dominance because of carbon footprint. It’s simply improved technology.