God?

[eyephone]

You mean like the parable of talents, (story of stewardship of talent/money of the 3 servants and what they did with it when the master is away, MAXROI was praised and the one that buried in the dirt and got 0 ROI got punished)?
Basically be wise with money

Interesting example. I didn't think about this verse when I was asking the question, but I guess we can relate to this parable Jesus gave also.

I think the main theme Jesus wanted to teach of this verse you brought up is that the man who made 0 ROI had a wrong knowledge of the master, who really is Jesus Himself. The man who made 0 ROI speaks of Jesus as "a hard man, reaping where you did not sow, and gathering where you scattered no seed.." which are all wrong information about the master, Jesus. However, Jesus gave praise to others because of their faithfulness not because of the result they made with talents/money.

Being wise with money, like you said, is a right advice, but I'm not quite sure if that answers where I was going originally. I was asking the question if you should strive to become rich or if you should not care about that in your mind at all as a Christian. Or if you would like to bring up something in the middle between those two ideas, please share.

Max ROI is just a figure of speech. The best outcome for the situation. Would a fisherman make more money selling tuna or a sustainable fish?

I?m sure being a fisherman back in the day they made a profit or traded for goods that they didn?t have. (barter) It?s like almost a necessity of making money. (like survival)

Those fishermen who were Jesus' disciples gave up their profession and followed Jesus. That means they didn't really go back to their old job though Peter kind of almost did, but Jesus confirmed Peter to feed His people which means Jesus ordained Peter to preach the gospel, to be a fisher of men. So after Jesus ascended to Heaven, Peter didn't really work as a fisherman anymore but became a preacher along with the rest of the disciples/Apostles. How did they manage to have money? Well, people started selling their possessions and bringing money and goods to share in the church. That would be seen as collecting offerings now days. But to get real technical, that's nothing new because God did commend Israel in the OT to pay the Levites certain amount of money for them to minister God's works. So that in the same way is still kept on even to now.

Anyways, it seems like trading and trying to make profits for ourselves were not really what God's people should be after but they should seek to help the poor and strive to learn the Word of God as the main goal. THEN God would take care of the rest as He knows we need money, clothes, housings, etc. I'm not saying don't work and just to go church to learn gospel. I'm saying what our heart desires as the most important thing should not be making money or profits. But I'm curious, if you don't really put money before God, then why are we even looking at stock trying to make the most out of it? Why are we even investing our lifetime trying to be debt free or whatsoever? Why care so much for MAXROI? Many big companies or famous rich people show off their donation to help the poor, but I'm sure they are tax deducting big time off those donations for their own profits anyways. What seems good on the surface doesn't always mean it's the right thing especially with God. Of course, only God knows our heart so we ourselves can't really condemn anyone, but I'm trying to see what you guys are really after in this matter. Is God really before money for you? Do you read God's words and strive to know Him more before looking at the stock portfolio every day?

I want to start off by saying thanks for your post. I have to disagree with you. A person who makes an honest living is not committing sin.

Let?s be clear about helping out people. Who?s the one compassionate to help the homeless even if it?s not popular? (My self, belly, and maybe another person) It all comes down to the core principles. Some or a lot of people might not agree, but there?s nothing we can do. But at the end of the day, I can say I tried to help another fellow human being. Can they?

All I have to say regarding ROI. Don?t knock the person because they work hard, read, up to date with the news and trends. (What does the Bible day about jealousy? Actually there are many versus about jealousy. I rest my case.)

Living an honest life is great, but sin is a different category. Everyone is under sin. Proof? Everyone is drying as we get older. Death is the result of sin or a sinful life as that's what God promised sin would do to us from the book of Genesis. If anyone is not dying and living forever, only that person is not under sin. (hint. there is Someone like that already)

Your support for homeless people or the shelter in Irvine was one of very few. Belly probably was more enthusiastic because of his hatred toward GP in a political sense, but I'm not him so I can't fully speak for his motivation. As I mentioned earlier to king's reply, helping others is good as long as the motivation is good and pure before God. I could say I donated $5 billion to a homeless shelter or a church but still have a prideful heart wanting to show off and get all other benefits and praise from other people. Then that's not really a good faithful action in God's eyes but a lie and a deceitful corruption. But since only God knows one's heart, we can't really fully know yet of anyone's motivations or intentions. For example, no one knew Judas Iscariot would betray Jesus until the very moment he actually did. No one knew he was a fake believer though Jesus knew from the beginning.

Making ROI is fine. Being smart with God's given talent and money is a good way to present good stewardship. But if we think we must make more ROI and money to expand God's Kingdom, then that's where I'm having a question since God never commanded in The Holy Bible for us to get rich in order to do His work. God rather tells us to trust in Him more than worldly riches and He will do take care of our needs.

I'm not sure who was being jealous, but again this is the heart issue where we can't fully know of others.

@Mety - How many times have you used ROI on TI? (besides this thread) I rest my case.

 

[Mety]

@Panda,

I didn't know you were making these posters. Great job! Keep designing these. I'm sure your designs are being used for God's glory somehow.

 

[Mety]

You mean like the parable of talents, (story of stewardship of talent/money of the 3 servants and what they did with it when the master is away, MAXROI was praised and the one that buried in the dirt and got 0 ROI got punished)?
Basically be wise with money

Interesting example. I didn't think about this verse when I was asking the question, but I guess we can relate to this parable Jesus gave also.

I think the main theme Jesus wanted to teach of this verse you brought up is that the man who made 0 ROI had a wrong knowledge of the master, who really is Jesus Himself. The man who made 0 ROI speaks of Jesus as "a hard man, reaping where you did not sow, and gathering where you scattered no seed.." which are all wrong information about the master, Jesus. However, Jesus gave praise to others because of their faithfulness not because of the result they made with talents/money.

Being wise with money, like you said, is a right advice, but I'm not quite sure if that answers where I was going originally. I was asking the question if you should strive to become rich or if you should not care about that in your mind at all as a Christian. Or if you would like to bring up something in the middle between those two ideas, please share.

Max ROI is just a figure of speech. The best outcome for the situation. Would a fisherman make more money selling tuna or a sustainable fish?

I?m sure being a fisherman back in the day they made a profit or traded for goods that they didn?t have. (barter) It?s like almost a necessity of making money. (like survival)

Those fishermen who were Jesus' disciples gave up their profession and followed Jesus. That means they didn't really go back to their old job though Peter kind of almost did, but Jesus confirmed Peter to feed His people which means Jesus ordained Peter to preach the gospel, to be a fisher of men. So after Jesus ascended to Heaven, Peter didn't really work as a fisherman anymore but became a preacher along with the rest of the disciples/Apostles. How did they manage to have money? Well, people started selling their possessions and bringing money and goods to share in the church. That would be seen as collecting offerings now days. But to get real technical, that's nothing new because God did commend Israel in the OT to pay the Levites certain amount of money for them to minister God's works. So that in the same way is still kept on even to now.

Anyways, it seems like trading and trying to make profits for ourselves were not really what God's people should be after but they should seek to help the poor and strive to learn the Word of God as the main goal. THEN God would take care of the rest as He knows we need money, clothes, housings, etc. I'm not saying don't work and just to go church to learn gospel. I'm saying what our heart desires as the most important thing should not be making money or profits. But I'm curious, if you don't really put money before God, then why are we even looking at stock trying to make the most out of it? Why are we even investing our lifetime trying to be debt free or whatsoever? Why care so much for MAXROI? Many big companies or famous rich people show off their donation to help the poor, but I'm sure they are tax deducting big time off those donations for their own profits anyways. What seems good on the surface doesn't always mean it's the right thing especially with God. Of course, only God knows our heart so we ourselves can't really condemn anyone, but I'm trying to see what you guys are really after in this matter. Is God really before money for you? Do you read God's words and strive to know Him more before looking at the stock portfolio every day?

I want to start off by saying thanks for your post. I have to disagree with you. A person who makes an honest living is not committing sin.

Let?s be clear about helping out people. Who?s the one compassionate to help the homeless even if it?s not popular? (My self, belly, and maybe another person) It all comes down to the core principles. Some or a lot of people might not agree, but there?s nothing we can do. But at the end of the day, I can say I tried to help another fellow human being. Can they?

All I have to say regarding ROI. Don?t knock the person because they work hard, read, up to date with the news and trends. (What does the Bible day about jealousy? Actually there are many versus about jealousy. I rest my case.)

Living an honest life is great, but sin is a different category. Everyone is under sin. Proof? Everyone is drying as we get older. Death is the result of sin or a sinful life as that's what God promised sin would do to us from the book of Genesis. If anyone is not dying and living forever, only that person is not under sin. (hint. there is Someone like that already)

Your support for homeless people or the shelter in Irvine was one of very few. Belly probably was more enthusiastic because of his hatred toward GP in a political sense, but I'm not him so I can't fully speak for his motivation. As I mentioned earlier to king's reply, helping others is good as long as the motivation is good and pure before God. I could say I donated $5 billion to a homeless shelter or a church but still have a prideful heart wanting to show off and get all other benefits and praise from other people. Then that's not really a good faithful action in God's eyes but a lie and a deceitful corruption. But since only God knows one's heart, we can't really fully know yet of anyone's motivations or intentions. For example, no one knew Judas Iscariot would betray Jesus until the very moment he actually did. No one knew he was a fake believer though Jesus knew from the beginning.

Making ROI is fine. Being smart with God's given talent and money is a good way to present good stewardship. But if we think we must make more ROI and money to expand God's Kingdom, then that's where I'm having a question since God never commanded in The Holy Bible for us to get rich in order to do His work. God rather tells us to trust in Him more than worldly riches and He will do take care of our needs.

I'm not sure who was being jealous, but again this is the heart issue where we can't fully know of others.

@Mety - How many times have you used ROI on TI? (besides this thread) I rest my case.

How many times have I used ROI? I'll tell you. I've used the word MAXROI here probably more than 100 times. Now, am I always making MAXROI? No. Am I always thinking and making decisions based on MAXROI? No. I write those facts for whoever wants those information. Delano is one example. I don't personally live or own there.

Now, am I benefitting MAXROI in terms of God's purpose? Yes, because He does not define success on money or fame of this world. Even if I've made half ROI than others in terms of RE or any money, that's still fine because even though I might be planning and making decisions myself, God is the one who completes and makes those things happen. That means even if I were to be eligible and buy the most MAXROI home, if God's plan is NOT there for me, then that will NOT happen no matter what.

We still need to do our best to do everything including making money, but if I think of money all the time, how I would benefit more and more each moment, that is surely having money as my god. I don't want that to happen to any of us especially if you call yourself a Christian.

Why do you want your kids to go to good colleges? Why are you investing in Irvine? Why are you not buying in Santa Ana? Why afraid of TUSD? There is nothing wrong with having these thoughts and plans, but if the final outcome you want out of it is money, then money is probably your god.

 

[Mety]

So I guess not that many people really cared about this matter or doesn't want to get involved in such discussion since only a handful of people responded.
Are you guys really all about making more money? More MAXROI brings more happiness for you?

 

[Kings]

they say money doesn't buy happiness, but it sure helps

 

[Happiness]

they say money doesn't buy happiness, but it sure helps

Prostitution: You can't buy love but you can rent it.

 

[Kings]

if we are all god's children, then isn't god rewarding those that provide him with maxroi in carrying on his faith?

 

[Irvinecommuter]

if we are all god's children, then isn't god rewarding those that provide him with maxroi in carrying on his faith?

Nope because wealth is not a measurement of faith.

 

[irvinehomeowner]

they say money doesn't buy happiness, but it sure helps

Prostitution: You can't buy love but you can rent it.

It's not love if it's rented.

 

[Mety]

if we are all god's children, then isn't god rewarding those that provide him with maxroi in carrying on his faith?

Nope because wealth is not a measurement of faith.

I think Kings is asking are we not supposed to work hard to bring MAXROI on God's given money. That is correct in a sense. But making MAXROI of money itself is not really something God seeks for. God wants us to use money to love and help others rather than making money for our own benefits. The talents example (Matthew 25) also shows that those who made double the talents were working hard for the master, not for themselves. The master just ended up giving it all to them as a result. We might say we'll help others once we make MAXROI, but that's not true because ones who really wants to love and help others will do so with or without ROI made.

Wealth or anything is really something God has to allow for you to have. You might work hard, diligently, and honestly which could result in much wealth for you, but God is the one who makes that (or anything as a matter of fact) happen for you whether you are His children or not. That's why He is the almighty, all knowing, all controlling God. Otherwise, what makes Him God, right?

Remember, the wealth is not always a positive blessing God allows. It could also be for His purpose to smash you down hard from the top. Egypt, Babylon, Persian, Greek, and Roman Empire are all examples for that purpose throughout the Bible. The U.S. is currently the wealthy powerful nation in this world which God allowed also. The only way we don't end up like the rest of all the powerful nations is repentance. And the true repentance will lead us to help the poor and needy in the Name of Jesus, the true love.

 

[Irvinecommuter]

if we are all god's children, then isn't god rewarding those that provide him with maxroi in carrying on his faith?

Nope because wealth is not a measurement of faith.

I think Kings is asking are we not supposed to work hard to bring MAXROI on God's given money. That is correct in a sense. But making MAXROI of money itself is not really something God seeks for. God wants us to use money to love and help others rather than making money for our own benefits. The talents example (Matthew 25) also shows that those who made double the talents were working hard for the master, not for themselves. The master just ended up giving it all to them as a result. We might say we'll help others once we make MAXROI, but that's not true because ones who really wants to love and help others will do so with or without ROI made.

Wealth or anything is really something God has to allow for you to have. You might work hard, diligently, and honestly which could result in much wealth for you, but God is the one who makes that (or anything as a matter of fact) happen for you whether you are His children or not. That's why He is the almighty, all knowing, all controlling God. Otherwise, what makes Him God, right?

Remember, the wealth is not always a positive blessing God allows. It could also be for His purpose to smash you down hard from the top. Egypt, Babylon, Persian, Greek, and Roman Empire are all examples for that purpose throughout the Bible. The U.S. is currently the wealthy powerful nation in this world which God allowed also. The only way we don't end up like the rest of all the powerful nations is repentance. And the true repentance will lead us to help the poor and needy in the Name of Jesus, the true love.

Right, like most of our current society, worth generally viewed in lockstep with wealth/money.  This is not a Biblical concept.  Wealth is means to an end...not the end itself.  If you use your wealth to help the Kingdom of God, great.  But rather than spending time "maximizing" your ROI, you volunteer or help your church, that is arguably better. 

There is also a fundamental myth (at least for Christians) that you work to maximize your net worth/income.  Monetary wealth is something that God provides...doesn't mean you should be lazy or not work hard but that monetary reward should not be the measurement of faith or your connection with God.  In fact, God says that the richer your are...the more difficult it is for you to have a connection with God. 

Rather, as servants of God we commend ourselves in every way: in great endurance; in troubles, hardships and distresses; 5in beatings, imprisonments and riots; in hard work, sleepless nights and hunger; 6in purity, understanding, patience and kindness; in the Holy Spirit and in sincere love; 7in truthful speech and in the power of God; with weapons of righteousness in the right hand and in the left; 8through glory and dishonor, bad report and good report; genuine, yet regarded as impostors; 9known, yet regarded as unknown; dying, and yet we live on; beaten, and yet not killed; 10sorrowful, yet always rejoicing; poor, yet making many rich; having nothing, and yet possessing everything.

2 Cor. 6:4-9.

Anyone who has been stealing must steal no longer, but must work, doing something useful with their own hands, that they may have something to share with those in need.

Eph. 4:28.  Note the purpose for working is to share with those in need.

 

[irvinehomeowner]

So that's why I'm a 99%er.

 

[Mety]

So that's why I'm a 99%er.

Define 99%er.

 

[eyephone]

Belly found God?

 

[irvinehomeowner]

So that's why I'm a 99%er.

Define 99%er.

Someone who is not a 1%er.

 

[Mety]

So that's why I'm a 99%er.

Define 99%er.

Someone who is not a 1%er.

I know you are kind of joking, but if you live and own a home in Irvine, you are for sure not a 99%er.

 

[eyephone]

So that's why I'm a 99%er.

Define 99%er.

Someone who is not a 1%er.

I know you are kind of joking, but if you live and own a home in Irvine, you are for sure not a 99%er.

Don?t mess with Mety 

 

[Kings]

if we are all god's children, then isn't god rewarding those that provide him with maxroi in carrying on his faith?

Nope because wealth is not a measurement of faith.

I think Kings is asking are we not supposed to work hard to bring MAXROI on God's given money. That is correct in a sense. But making MAXROI of money itself is not really something God seeks for. God wants us to use money to love and help others rather than making money for our own benefits. The talents example (Matthew 25) also shows that those who made double the talents were working hard for the master, not for themselves. The master just ended up giving it all to them as a result. We might say we'll help others once we make MAXROI, but that's not true because ones who really wants to love and help others will do so with or without ROI made.

Wealth or anything is really something God has to allow for you to have. You might work hard, diligently, and honestly which could result in much wealth for you, but God is the one who makes that (or anything as a matter of fact) happen for you whether you are His children or not. That's why He is the almighty, all knowing, all controlling God. Otherwise, what makes Him God, right?

Remember, the wealth is not always a positive blessing God allows. It could also be for His purpose to smash you down hard from the top. Egypt, Babylon, Persian, Greek, and Roman Empire are all examples for that purpose throughout the Bible. The U.S. is currently the wealthy powerful nation in this world which God allowed also. The only way we don't end up like the rest of all the powerful nations is repentance. And the true repentance will lead us to help the poor and needy in the Name of Jesus, the true love.

Right, like most of our current society, worth generally viewed in lockstep with wealth/money.  This is not a Biblical concept.  Wealth is means to an end...not the end itself.  If you use your wealth to help the Kingdom of God, great.  But rather than spending time "maximizing" your ROI, you volunteer or help your church, that is arguably better. 

There is also a fundamental myth (at least for Christians) that you work to maximize your net worth/income.  Monetary wealth is something that God provides...doesn't mean you should be lazy or not work hard but that monetary reward should not be the measurement of faith or your connection with God.  In fact, God says that the richer your are...the more difficult it is for you to have a connection with God. 

Rather, as servants of God we commend ourselves in every way: in great endurance; in troubles, hardships and distresses; 5in beatings, imprisonments and riots; in hard work, sleepless nights and hunger; 6in purity, understanding, patience and kindness; in the Holy Spirit and in sincere love; 7in truthful speech and in the power of God; with weapons of righteousness in the right hand and in the left; 8through glory and dishonor, bad report and good report; genuine, yet regarded as impostors; 9known, yet regarded as unknown; dying, and yet we live on; beaten, and yet not killed; 10sorrowful, yet always rejoicing; poor, yet making many rich; having nothing, and yet possessing everything.

2 Cor. 6:4-9.

Anyone who has been stealing must steal no longer, but must work, doing something useful with their own hands, that they may have something to share with those in need.

Eph. 4:28.  Note the purpose for working is to share with those in need.

nowhere did i say wealth.  when i said maxroi, i said it in metaphorical terms of preaching the good word of god and expanding the belief in him.

let me rephrase: if god has created us all, then the ones that provide him with the best return on investment in the form of maintaining and spreading his beliefs and receiving christ are rewarded with salvation.  is it not fair to say that god invests a piece of himself in all of us with the eventual transaction, for lack of a better word, that we will provide roi on his original personal capital?

 

[eyephone]

Are you an atheist?

 

[Mety]

Belly found God?

Seems like you are so firm that I'm YF/BTB. Believe however you want to believe. I gave plenty of answers and evidences that I'm not him. The choice is yours you make.

Which brings me want to say... God gives plenty of evidences that He exists. The skies, air, water, how things are so organized and in order. Some people say they believe in Physics. Okay, who do you think made physics? This is how you can answer when someone asks you how come God didn't give faith to everyone. Everyone is exposed to God's creation and grace. The choice of believing is something you need to participate. If God just makes you have faith then that makes us nothing different than robots, doesn't it? Although He is in full control of everything, He wants us to give our heart.