OHR...Worth it or not?

There will always be premium products, but are ALL premium products worth it, nope.  Some premium products sell well and appreciate, but not all are equal and this home at that price isn't worth it.  You had always touted slow GP sales due to high price & MR, no doubt its a combination of both and if price went low enough people bought it regardless of MR at the 1mil+ price point, not the crappy stucco boxes they have now.  Slow sales at Vivo with lower MR, means its more price dependent, not selling well means it's overpriced.

You always talk about ROI and appreciation, will this plan 1 Vivo appreciate to 1.3mil in 2 years to make some money if the op needs out?  Will a bank appraise this home at 1.3-1.4mil to take out a 200-300k HELOC to buy another phase 1 home? 

Burn That Belly said:
Here's my argument to akkord.

Let's be honest with ourselves and I'm going to use analogies because you know I love them. Orchard Hills Reserve, Hidden Canyon, etc. are all considered TIC's top-tier premium products by dollar per sqft.

Just like a BMW M6 or an E63 AMG. Now, do you honestly think for one second BMW or Mercedes cares for selling as much AMG or M6's as they can compared to a 3-series or C300? No. It is a top-tier premium product for the most finest and most privileged individuals. IrvineCo. has many products to sell and this is just one of their AMG / \\\M products.

With that being said, nobody wants riff-raffs as their neighbors in a top-tier premium neigborhood. Keeping prices high ensures a sophisticated class and prestige and that's what OH Reserves is about.

Do you think Hermes bags have any more "value" to it if 1/3 of high school girls were carrying it?  No. They're priced at $30 grand a piece for a reason.
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You never answered my question.  And I believe most of the BP > 1 mil products sold out, Parasol and Cadence are those stucco boxes I'm referring to and those things suck, no argument there. 

You always talk about ROI and appreciation, will this plan 1 Vivo appreciate to 1.3mil in 2 years to make some money if the op needs out?  Will a bank appraise this home at 1.3-1.4mil to take out a 200-300k HELOC to buy another phase 1 home? 

Burn That Belly said:
akkord said:
There will always be premium products, but are ALL premium products worth it, nope.  Some premium products sell well and appreciate, but not all are equal and this home at that price isn't worth it.  You had always touted slow GP sales due to high price & MR, no doubt its a combination of both and if price went low enough people bought it regardless of MR at the 1mil+ price point, not the crappy stucco boxes they have now.  Slow sales at Vivo with lower MR, means its more price dependent, not selling well means it's overpriced.

You always talk about ROI and appreciation, will this plan 1 Vivo appreciate to 1.3mil in 2 years to make some money if the op needs out?  Will a bank appraise this home at 1.3-1.4mil to take out a 200-300k HELOC to buy another phase 1 home? 

Burn That Belly said:
Here's my argument to akkord.

Let's be honest with ourselves and I'm going to use analogies because you know I love them. Orchard Hills Reserve, Hidden Canyon, etc. are all considered TIC's top-tier premium products by dollar per sqft.

Just like a BMW M6 or an E63 AMG. Now, do you honestly think for one second BMW or Mercedes cares for selling as much AMG or M6's as they can compared to a 3-series or C300? No. It is a top-tier premium product for the most finest and most privileged individuals. IrvineCo. has many products to sell and this is just one of their AMG / \\\M products.

With that being said, nobody wants riff-raffs as their neighbors in a top-tier premium neigborhood. Keeping prices high ensures a sophisticated class and prestige and that's what OH Reserves is about.

Do you think Hermes bags have any more "value" to it if 1/3 of high school girls were carrying it?  No. They're priced at $30 grand a piece for a reason.
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Actually GP's problem is not the selling price at all. It's the MR, location, and the political drama going on with it. Haven't you been reading?
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You're right, I don't reach everything on TI...let me rephrase the question, do you think there will be a ROI for this specific location in 2 years?  This board is started on speculation, bears vs bulls in the housing market, so to ask about appreciation is a thing here.  There's a whole thread on stocks if you want to use an analogy. 

Burn That Belly said:
akkord said:
You never answered my question.  And I believe most of the BP > 1 mil products sold out, Parasol and Cadence are those stucco boxes I'm referring to and those things suck, no argument there. 

You always talk about ROI and appreciation, will this plan 1 Vivo appreciate to 1.3mil in 2 years to make some money if the op needs out?  Will a bank appraise this home at 1.3-1.4mil to take out a 200-300k HELOC to buy another phase 1 home? 

Burn That Belly said:
akkord said:
There will always be premium products, but are ALL premium products worth it, nope.  Some premium products sell well and appreciate, but not all are equal and this home at that price isn't worth it.  You had always touted slow GP sales due to high price & MR, no doubt its a combination of both and if price went low enough people bought it regardless of MR at the 1mil+ price point, not the crappy stucco boxes they have now.  Slow sales at Vivo with lower MR, means its more price dependent, not selling well means it's overpriced.

You always talk about ROI and appreciation, will this plan 1 Vivo appreciate to 1.3mil in 2 years to make some money if the op needs out?  Will a bank appraise this home at 1.3-1.4mil to take out a 200-300k HELOC to buy another phase 1 home? 

Burn That Belly said:
Here's my argument to akkord.

Let's be honest with ourselves and I'm going to use analogies because you know I love them. Orchard Hills Reserve, Hidden Canyon, etc. are all considered TIC's top-tier premium products by dollar per sqft.

Just like a BMW M6 or an E63 AMG. Now, do you honestly think for one second BMW or Mercedes cares for selling as much AMG or M6's as they can compared to a 3-series or C300? No. It is a top-tier premium product for the most finest and most privileged individuals. IrvineCo. has many products to sell and this is just one of their AMG / \\\M products.

With that being said, nobody wants riff-raffs as their neighbors in a top-tier premium neigborhood. Keeping prices high ensures a sophisticated class and prestige and that's what OH Reserves is about.

Do you think Hermes bags have any more "value" to it if 1/3 of high school girls were carrying it?  No. They're priced at $30 grand a piece for a reason.
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Actually GP's problem is not the selling price at all. It's the MR, location, and the political drama going on with it. Haven't you been reading?
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I don't have to answer your question because you ain't my mother. This thread asks if OHR is worth it or not. I say it is. That's the end of it.

It is quite asinine to ask anyone to predict the future. I have never promised people that buying __here__ would result in __x__ amount of appreciation and buying __there__ would result in __y__ amount of appreciation in the future. I only state appreciation after it has occurred.  Rather I have said before, always bet on "Location". But you haven't been reading well to get that.

(Damn, I'm starting to sound like Starman)


Now go put up your home for sale. The cemetery is coming.
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I've been lurking for a while and looking to move to Irvine as well. Does anybody know how much the HOA and MR for Vivo?
 
Thanks for the info!

Slightly off topic, but is the main difference of the Groves vs Reserve the school districts, aside from the different builders?



Burn That Belly said:
pcx said:
I've been lurking for a while and looking to move to Irvine as well. Does anybody know how much the HOA and MR for Vivo?
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Welcome.

Approximate HOA Dues: $299 for Reserve at Orchard Hills Community Association
Base Property Tax: 1.05% of sales price
AD Tax: $1,600 per year
CFD Tax: $1,700 per year
Other Taxes: $171 per year
Overall Effective Tax Rate: Approximately 1.4%


As you can see, it is far, far, far lower than Great Park.
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GP's effective tax rate is 1.8%?  Versus 1.4%, the delta on a million dollar home is $4000 a year or 333/month? Assuming the buyer's tax situation doesn't allow for property tax deduction.  To me 4k/year is a lot but maybe to some all cash FCB buyer, it's pocket change.
 
akkord said:
I assume it's one of the cheaper homes in OHR, why is it selling so slow per the op if the pool and view is so amazing.  If selling slow now, it normally means it'll sell slow during resale.  Personally, 1.1-1.15mil for a 3 bed once upgrades/landscaping are done is a no go for me...how much are you going to recoup if you try and sell in 2 years, is it going to go for 1.3mil in 2 years if you want to upsize from a 3 to a 4 bed?  I haven't checked elevations/site plan, but I assume no driveway either and motorcourt detached?
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Basically, everyone (who cares about ROI) is buying Vivo hoping to catch that Laguna Altura lightning in a bottle.  The entry level LA homes are very similar to this Vivo plan.  I think those started at what, high 600s/low 700s?  And those 3 bedroom 2.5 bath homes go for $1.0-$1.1M now.  Both gated, both zoned to good schools, but locations and "timing" are a bit different.
 
Didn't somebody do the math already for the 2%?  Compound calculator says $9k mello at 2% over 10 years reaches just under $11k?  I guess if you plan on living there forever it's going to suck but quite a few people move before the 10 year mark. I don't think that kind of increase is going to break the bank.

I thought somebody said SG and OH Groves has 2% increase like GP, Altair?  Dunno about Non grove side.
 
Maserson said:
Didn't somebody do the math already for the 2%?  Compound calculator says $9k mello at 2% over 10 years reaches just under $11k?  I guess if you plan on living there forever it's going to suck but quite a few people move before the 10 year mark. I don't think that kind of increase is going to break the bank.

I thought somebody said SG and OH Groves has 2% increase like GP, Altair?  Dunno about Non grove side.
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The 2% thing gets brought up a lot, but no, it really doesn't break the bank or affect your ability to keep your house.  It's the whole dollar amount that does.  And the psychological effect of having your MR be high $9k one year, then $10k the next.
 
The smallest homes in the Groves are about the size of the largest homes in the Reserves.

There are no condos (detached or otherwise) in the Groves.

Many of the Groves homes have extra room options,  like formal dining and library/den in addition to the Great Room/open kitchen, downstairs in law suite with kitchenette, dedicated home office (in addition to downstairs bedroom), third car garage, etc. More customizable. Higher price point.


pcx said:
Thanks for the info!

Slightly off topic, but is the main difference of the Groves vs Reserve the school districts, aside from the different builders?



Burn That Belly said:
pcx said:
I've been lurking for a while and looking to move to Irvine as well. Does anybody know how much the HOA and MR for Vivo?
Click to expand...

Welcome.

Approximate HOA Dues: $299 for Reserve at Orchard Hills Community Association
Base Property Tax: 1.05% of sales price
AD Tax: $1,600 per year
CFD Tax: $1,700 per year
Other Taxes: $171 per year
Overall Effective Tax Rate: Approximately 1.4%


As you can see, it is far, far, far lower than Great Park.
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If I had to pick a place in Irvine that will be the most resilient to price drops and have the best overall long term appreciation, I'd probably agree with BtB.  OHR is a beautiful neighborhood, the views are great, it's near a great shopping center, and not as far from the freeway as people think.

I just happen to really dislike the Vivo floorpans, and that's the only thing comfortably in my price range.  I also don't think there's much appreciation to be made in the short term *anywhere* in Irvine for places above 1mil.  There just aren't enough people who can afford those prices to get the quick pop that the smaller places are currently experiencing.
 
I think if you're buying for appreciation, that's the wrong reason to buy and if everyone is buying for appreciation, that's the wrong time to buy. You buy a nice place to live for a long time that's a good area for the kids with good schools. Nobody (figuratively speaking) in 2010 or 11 expected RE appreciation or stock market appreciation for that matter, and the increase took most everyone by surprise.
 
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