The Future of Urban development

I

idrnkurmlkshk_IHB

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I've always wondered why America was so damn sprawling?

And now we are going to pay for it.



With high inflation in oil, food..everything., I' hoping to see more developments follow Europe. We should end the stupid zoning rules. People will need to work out of their homes, live closer to markets, and most of all live in smaller, self sufficient communities.



I look forward to the end of suburbia.



Dell Webb, Lennar and all the big developers should stop whining about the housing market and get moving on the future.

Time is running out!
 
<em>"Commuting several hundred miles per week with gas at $3.50 stings a bit".

</em>

My how things have changed.....now it's just a downright slap in the face !
 
No, we need BUS SERVICE.



For rail to work, you have to have efficient ubiquitous BUS SERVICE.



For mass transit to work, you need to walk out of your home or office and at max a 10-15 minute walk to get to the transit locations. The reality is it needs to be closer to 5-10 minutes because at 15 minutes it's a half hour of walking which combined with the mass transit commute, turns even trivial commutes into massive time burners.
 
No, we need TELEPORTATION.



Instant travel from point to point. Since Obama is on a spending spree he should allocate some funds to research this technology.
 
Bus service is important, both as a singular mode of transit and as a vital component of a rail network , but to concentrate efforts completely on bus service isn't going to have any effect to lessen our dependence on cars. The only way public transit is going to work is if it's faster, or at least equal to the time it takes to travel in cars. That means rail. Rail also has less of a social class stigma than bus transit. It's sad, but true. Just look how transit works and is perceived in Los Angeles.
 
[quote author="asianinvasian" date=1235873921]No, we need TELEPORTATION.



Instant travel from point to point. Since Obama is on a spending spree he should allocate some funds to research this technology.</blockquote>
But you would still need to get ready for work... which is a time-waster itself.



It's all about TELE-commuting... no Obama cash needed... just a phone, internet and possibly a virtual terminal or collaboration tool.
 
[quote author="ABC123" date=1236064268]I'm all for trains and mass transit, but how are you supposed to shop at Costco if you don't have an SUV?</blockquote>


Costco demographic is not in urban cities. City dwellers have limited storage and small household. Dean and Deluca, Joe the neighborhood butcher, and Soup Nazi are the retailers that are familiar with the city formula.
 
[quote author="savvy" date=1236039165]Bus service is important, both as a singular mode of transit and as a vital component of a rail network , but to concentrate efforts completely on bus service isn't going to have any effect to lessen our dependence on cars. The only way public transit is going to work is if it's faster, or at least equal to the time it takes to travel in cars. That means rail. Rail also has less of a social class stigma than bus transit. It's sad, but true. Just look how transit works and is perceived in Los Angeles.</blockquote>


You haven't ridden the blue and green lines have you?



Local rail is pointless in OC. The sprawl makes it pointless. We don't have enough density to make rail pragmatic from a ridership standpoint that makes it cost effective to run.



Frankly, if you live in Irvine and work in Irvine, you shouldn't drive. If you aren't taking your bike now, you aren't going to take rail either.



The only way rail is going to be faster than driving is when driving gridlocks and rail is run down the middle of Jamboree, Culver, Jeffrey with a North/South connector up Barranca. And to be truely effective, you need to extend that out to CM, HB, South County and Fullerton, Brea.



Or maybe you just want to look up how much LA Metro loses. http://www.metro.net/about_us/finance/images/cafr_2008.pdf
 
Public transportation will only work when it is a financial burden to park your car at home, shopping, and work.
 
[quote author="bkshopr" date=1236081797]Public transportation will only work when it is a financial burden to park your car at home, shopping, and work.</blockquote>
Sad but true.
 
If given the option, I would take the train from Irvine to UCLA (or anywhere on the westside) rather than driving the nightmare 405. I've tried taking the train to downtown and then the bus, but once was enough. Not only did it take too long, but there were too many crazy, smelly homeless people sharing the ride. If I have to go to downtown San Diego, I take the train even though driving is quicker and cheaper.
 
[quote author="bkshopr" date=1236080516][quote author="ABC123" date=1236064268]I'm all for trains and mass transit, but how are you supposed to shop at Costco if you don't have an SUV?</blockquote>


Costco demographic is not in urban cities. City dwellers have limited storage and small household. Dean and Deluca, Joe the neighborhood butcher, and Soup Nazi are the retailers that are familiar with the city formula.</blockquote>


Very true, I didn't realize that aspect of urban living until we went to Europe in 2007 and our tour guide who lived in London said he couldn't believe the size of the fridges in the U.S. (just regular ordinary fridges, not the supersize Viking ones). He said London dwellers have fridges the size of mini-fridges, so they shop every day for what they make for lunch or dinner that day.
 
The last few posts point out the differenes in how people view what "public transportation" is.



Local transportation similar to Europe or more dense cities is near impossible in Irvine or other suburban cities because the need for it is just not there.



Regional transportation is cost and time/convenience dependent because the quality of local transportation is dependent on destination.



Yet... our automakers need more money. Imagine if we didn't need cars.
 
[quote author="irvine_home_owner" date=1236135272]The last few posts point out the differenes in how people view what "public transportation" is.



Local transportation similar to Europe or more dense cities is near impossible in Irvine or other suburban cities because the need for it is just not there.



Regional transportation is cost and time/convenience dependent because the quality of local transportation is dependent on destination.



Yet... our automakers need more money. Imagine if we didn't need cars.</blockquote>


Every major car brand has their car design headquarter in Irvine.
 
[quote author="bkshopr" date=1236139657][quote author="irvine_home_owner" date=1236135272]The last few posts point out the differenes in how people view what "public transportation" is.



Local transportation similar to Europe or more dense cities is near impossible in Irvine or other suburban cities because the need for it is just not there.



Regional transportation is cost and time/convenience dependent because the quality of local transportation is dependent on destination.



Yet... our automakers need more money. Imagine if we didn't need cars.</blockquote>


Every major car brand has their car design headquarter in Irvine.</blockquote>


So thats why all the cars from the major car manufacturers are beginning to look like each other
 
[quote author="No_Such_Reality" date=1236081153]

The only way rail is going to be faster than driving is when driving gridlocks and rail is run down the middle of Jamboree, Culver, Jeffrey with a North/South connector up Barranca. And to be truely effective, you need to extend that out to CM, HB, South County and Fullerton, Brea.



</blockquote>




amazingly, this is what used to exist! Streetcars on all the major blvds. Red Line, anyone?



(since replaced by buses, I guess).
 
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