Sungevity

[JL-CG]

you pretty much answered the negatives yourself. the biggest things in my opinion are the following:
-Payback period is way too long (if purchased), its horrible if you lease it
- for most people solar is probably more of a headache (panels on your roof, maintenance, failure, etc) so there will be some impact on resale. potential assumption of lease/early termination fee

solar is a good idea, much like electric cars. the technology is not ready for primetime yet though. i think it will get there, but not now.

Thanks for clarifying, qwerty. I agree w/ you on payback period as to the purchase and the zero-down lease. I personally thought that the estimated 10-12 year payback period on the lease prepayment option (the $17K option) wasn't too unreasonable.

I completely agree as to your 2nd and 3rd point, and I think we're better off waiting until the technology improves and comes down in price.

 

[socal78]

If there was a way to make  Internet free... I would buy that.

Well, how much is a time machine going for these days? Set the dial to 1998. Log on to NetZero. Voila.

When you go back in time, page me on the beeper. Mr. SoCal created a program that resized their banner ads down to 0x0. Good free service with no annoying ad interruption... that is until he got busted and they denied us access.

 

[irvinehusky]

Since on average people move every 7 years(?) then it would be cumbersome.  Someone like me would never take over the lease since my electric bill is way under $100.  But from reading this blog, it seems my situation is not normal.    If someone already paid for the whole system, I would not mind taking it over.    But then, you would lose out as I would not pay additional for the previous owner's expenses, especially in a down market.

 

[OpenSky]

8)

 

[qwerty]

solar is a good idea, much like electric cars. the technology is not ready for primetime yet though. i think it will get there, but not now.

Over 100,000 Nissan Leafs have been sold. Tesla is killing it. Plug ins have popped up everywhere. You can lease a new Leaf for $199/month or buy a used one for under $16k - no rebate funny business.

If you broaden the field to plug in cars that have some type of internal combustion engine - there is a spectrum of cars at all price points from $20k to $120k that continues to broaden.

If that isn't prime time, I don't know what is.

i work for a company that dabbles in this industry, trust me when i say its not ready for primetime. in 2013 there were barely over 20K leafs sold compared to over 400K camrys, 366K accords, 320K altimas. the leaf gives you 80 miles per full charge if you are lucky, the volt gives you 35 if you are lucky. the batteries are extremely expensive, Tesla which gives you a reasonable driving range (200+ miles) costs upwards of what 60-70k? the charging infrastructure is not there for these cars to be practical at their current driving ranges. its a constant chicken or the egg argument, public fast chargers are extremely expensive and no builds them because there are not enough electric cars, there are not enough electric cars because the customer demand is not there because there is no charging infrastructure.  Plugins with internal combustion engines give you even less mileage than the leaf (prius plugin gets you what 10-15 miles on charge?). Cost wise, the car manufactures all lose money on electric vehicles, what are they going to do, make up the losses on volume

I hate to do this to you, but like i said

NOT READY FOR PRIMETIME!!!!!

 

[OpenSky]

8)

 

[qwerty]

i dont disagree that EVs have some benefits, the carpool sticker is nice, no oil changes is nice, not going to the gas station is nice. an EV can not be a primary vehicle for most households. you cant go to san diego, you can barely do a roundtrip to LA and you definitely wont be driving to Vegas. i drive just about 100 miles each day. had a coworker who had a leaf who had a 55 mile commute into the office where there is a charger, he got rid of it, he started getting concerned that he wouldnt make it into the office (AC turned on, etc). ok maybe your not lucky to get 80, but you wont get much more than that. you seam to integrate the benefits of the EV into the discussion of whether EVs are ready for widespread adoption and they are not ready. the range and infrastructure are not there. o

maybe we disagree on the definition of ready for primetime. yes there are people such as yourself who can do fine with a leaf, more power to you. but most familys have an SUV (or minivan if your IHO) to haul the kids/family around, then maybe they have a commuter car for the parent who drives to LA from OC for work, but for most families the EV doesnt work. i would never buy an electric car because for me its not practical.

EDIT - not to mention, even at a public charger an 80% charge takes 15-20 minutes, how is that practical?

 

[OpenSky]

:

 

[qwerty]

The sentiment about charging is real. It takes 15-20 minutes for an 80% charge. What exactly are u doing at the dealership other than to charge your car? Let's say the infrastructure existed and you drive to San Diego you have to wait 20 minutes minutes for your charge and u better hope there is no lone. Charging at home is obviously a different story.

 

[OpenSky]

 

[qwerty]

The sentiment about charging is real. It takes 15-20 minutes for an 80% charge. What exactly are u doing at the dealership other than to charge your car? Let's say the infrastructure existed and you drive to San Diego you have to wait 20 minutes minutes for your charge and u better hope there is no lone. Charging at home is obviously a different story.

I don't ever drive my commuter to San Diego.

The occasional imperative isn't a reason to do/not do something. I'd otherwise have a stakebed truck and a large van.

Which proves the point they are not ready for prime time. If u can't take a particular car to San Diego cause I may not get back or even get there, not ready for prime time

 

[OpenSky]

8)

 

[qwerty]

The sentiment about charging is real. It takes 15-20 minutes for an 80% charge. What exactly are u doing at the dealership other than to charge your car? Let's say the infrastructure existed and you drive to San Diego you have to wait 20 minutes minutes for your charge and u better hope there is no lone. Charging at home is obviously a different story.

I don't ever drive my commuter to San Diego.

The occasional imperative isn't a reason to do/not do something. I'd otherwise have a stakebed truck and a large van.

Which proves the point they are not ready for prime time.

like saying two wheel drive cars and motorcycles aren't ready for prime time...

dude - i dont even know what to say. the leaf sold 20K cars last year. in 2013, 15.6 million cars were sold in the US. if the numbers dont spell out they are not ready for primetime i dont know what does.

 

[OpenSky]

8)

 

[qwerty]

The sentiment about charging is real. It takes 15-20 minutes for an 80% charge. What exactly are u doing at the dealership other than to charge your car? Let's say the infrastructure existed and you drive to San Diego you have to wait 20 minutes minutes for your charge and u better hope there is no lone. Charging at home is obviously a different story.

I don't ever drive my commuter to San Diego.

The occasional imperative isn't a reason to do/not do something. I'd otherwise have a stakebed truck and a large van.

Which proves the point they are not ready for prime time.

like saying two wheel drive cars and motorcycles aren't ready for prime time...

dude - i dont even know what to say. the leaf sold 20K cars last year. in 2013, 15.6 million cars were sold in the US. if the numbers dont spell out they are not ready for primetime i dont know what does.

Adoption isn't a proxy for readiness. Else any good idea at the early stages "isn't ready for prime time."

Fact is, a Leaf or Volt would work for 75% of US households as a commuter car.

things get adopted when they are ready for widespread use.  a good idea is not ready for primetime in its early stages, thus "early stage" - just like that young canadian girl who invented a flashlight that you hold and your body heat turns it on, the problem is that its like 24 lumens vs several hundred for your average commercial flashlight. that is an excellent idea, but not ready for primetime. i cant talk about this anymore. now i know how bones feels talking to irvine commuter.

 

[OpenSky]

 

[qwerty]

things get adopted when they are ready for widespread use. a good idea is not ready for primetime in its early stages, thus "early stage"

Things are often quite ready for widespread use but simply don't get adopted for years due to openness and awareness. Facebook, Netflix, texting and frozen yogurt are good examples. They didn't substantively change for YEARS until the general public finally adopted them. Critical mass takes time.

ok how bout this, things get adopted by the general public when they are practical. i know, you think they are practical, most people would disagree, thus 20K leafs out of 15.6M cars. 

i just asked my wife without any previous mention of this discussion - "do you think electric cars are ready for primetime?" she said, no - i cant even get to san diego in one.  yes, there are charging stations on the way there, but no one wants to go around looking for a parking stall in some corner of a mall looking for the damn charger and they sure as hell dont want to wait 20 minutes for their charge. what if you needed a charge and the one charger at the mall is being used by some who is taking their sweet time eating lunch at the mall restaurant? not practical man.

 

[socal78]

i cant talk about this anymore. now i know how bones feels talking to irvine commuter.

Are you getting the ladies of TI mixed up again? I think you mean me & Irvine Commuter (unless Bones shared the same sentiment as me and I wasn't aware of it. Possible.)

 

[qwerty]

i cant talk about this anymore. now i know how bones feels talking to irvine commuter.

Are you getting the ladies of TI mixed up again? I think you mean me & Irvine Commuter (unless Bones shared the same sentiment as me and I wasn't aware of it. Possible.)

both of you share the same sentiment.  i think she mentioned it last though so that was in my head

 

[socal78]

i cant talk about this anymore. now i know how bones feels talking to irvine commuter.

Are you getting the ladies of TI mixed up again? I think you mean me & Irvine Commuter (unless Bones shared the same sentiment as me and I wasn't aware of it. Possible.)

both of you share the same sentiment.  i think she mentioned it last though so that was in my head

Oh! Interesting.