jbenko_IHB
New member
Cool! I was starting to get bored! I welcome all violent market moves!
Stock Market Day-Trading Discussion Thread
- Thread starter usctrojanman29_IHB
- Start date
NEW -> Contingent Buyer Assistance Program
OK, have u been patient??? I'm all tapped out in gold miners right now, but if I had some left over I'd park it in DXO for a couple days now..... $2 looks good
Thanks for the reply. I thought I could margin at will too. It was weird. I did end up calling B of A, and he said it was because I had used up my buying power for the day, and that it would reset tomorrow. Was it some sort of regulation T violation? I still don't "get it" though because I wasn't holding on to anything. Yeah I am definitely maintaining a balance over 25k, and for sure I am not going beyond what I have in cash in my account and am not dipping into margin. I guess what I mean is, when I purchase my stock/ETF, I click the "margin" button, but I won't buy more than I have in cash. I was under the impression that in order to "day trade", I should check the "margin" button.
What I like about B of A is you get 30 free trades a month, but I'm not happy with it because of these "rejection" messages. Any other recommendations on brokerage accounts? Etrade looks inviting because it offers mobility on Blackberry.
Ahh my Trojan friend. Now you know what I meant with that longer post earlier. It is very hard to make money this way unless you know something others don't. What you are experimenting with, I've done over and over in my earlier years of trading. Mucho dineros lost. Now to make money, buy the stock and sell the calls and watch the premium evaporate after earnings. If the stock goes down, you're protected by the calls you sold. If the stock goes up, you still get something out of it. Only way you can lose, is if the stock collapses and even then your losses are somewhat absorbed vs. just holding the stock outright. It's all good
I'm the one with the .25 ask price btw trying to break even with transaction costs.
BV,
I use scottrade right now and every time I sell I need to wait 3 days for funds to settle. RLY annoying! Slows me down. Whats that time frame for TD?
I have no issues with TD Ameritrade. I don't know if you are talking about funds settling when making a deposit or everyday transactions. If you deposit with TD Ameritrade, then buying equities is instant. If you are wanting to use it to buy options, then you have to wait 5 days until funds settle.
If you are talking about everday trading, then I have't noticed any issue regarding delay in funds settling. As soon as I sell something, I can use the funds again.
Scottrade sucks. Well it doesn't if you want to build a long term portfolio buying here and there. But if you want a reliable brokerage that favors day-traders than look to something like TD Ameritrade. I'm trying to see if Optionhouse is an option. I moved over 10K just to play around with the platform and the reliability of trades before I move over my trillions.
I get hammered by TD's fee structure, especially when buying and selling 100+ option contracts. It hurts...bad.
With Optionhouse, its a flat fee of 10 bucks whether I buy 1 option contract or 1,000! They also have a 15 dollar flat fee for multiple trades such as buying the stock, selling calls at X strike price and buying calls at another strike price. I often take part in positions like that and can be costly. With Optionhouse its only 15 bucks flat fee up to 4 legs. Stocks trades are only 3 bucks.
Too good to be true, but so far I like it and getting used to it. Time will tell.
But if you want to day-trade, get away from Scottrade! 3 dollars difference in fee's isn't worth it unless you're a chronic trader.
usctrojanman29_IHB
New member
Ditto that....I still kept a few SPY and JPM puts through the weekend. Also sold a few calls on TXT and TER.BlackVault CM said:
jbenko_IHB
New member
Cool. Yeah patience pays off. Which JP Morgan puts did you buy? Same ones I mentioned on my blog?
Thats what I'm holding, March 25 strike puts. JP Morgan is down 1.40 pre-market. Should be fun
I still have a small position that I started building in NVDIA and XOM, those will suffer. But JP Morgan will more than enough pay for it.
It feels kinda wrong to hope that market opens sharply lower, but feels so good at the same time too.
Thats what I'm holding, March 25 strike puts. JP Morgan is down 1.40 pre-market. Should be fun
I still have a small position that I started building in NVDIA and XOM, those will suffer. But JP Morgan will more than enough pay for it.
It feels kinda wrong to hope that market opens sharply lower, but feels so good at the same time too.
usctrojanman29_IHB
New member
25 Feb Puts bought @ $1.26 (just 10 of them). Also have 10 Feb 85 SPY puts bought @ $2.74. Morgan just broke $23 in pre-market....this could be an ugly day for financials (I'm still pissed I bought back my 500 shares of COF that I short sold @ $19.66...oh well, there's always another trade on the horizon. Blue Fire mentioned picking up some GS April puts...what are your thoughts (the stock seems overbought)?BlackVault CM said:
upperlowerclass_IHB
New member
PANDA said:
OK, have u been patient??? I'm all tapped out in gold miners right now, but if I had some left over I'd park it in DXO for a couple days now..... $2 looks good
upperlowerclass_IHB
New member
Heh I scrapped the bottom of the MM account barrel and tossed it in DXO@2... its gambling time
jbenko_IHB
New member
Yeah he PMd me about it. I'm not touching GS puts personally. If you time it right you can make money, but GS is solid compared to other financials. Why pick one of the best when you can pick the worst.
With GS if I'm right on my timing, I can make money. If I'm wrong I'm screwed. With JP Morgan, BAC etc. I can be right and make money and be wrong and make money. There are better fights to fight than GS. But I"m not saying the opportunity isn't there, you just have to be perfect.
With GS if I'm right on my timing, I can make money. If I'm wrong I'm screwed. With JP Morgan, BAC etc. I can be right and make money and be wrong and make money. There are better fights to fight than GS. But I"m not saying the opportunity isn't there, you just have to be perfect.
toady9_IHB
New member
Can I ask a noob day trading question?
I have a margin account w/ B of A. Well I was buying and selling stock ABC today, each time making a little profit and then selling. I was doing this in "margin" but never technically dipping into "margin". Then after I sold that I was trying to buy stock XYZ and it got "rejected". I then proceded to buy ABC again, and I was able to do that and then sell it later.
Then after hours, I tried to pick up XYZ again, it got rejected. I tried buying it in cash instead of margin and it still got rejected. Then I tried to pick up DXO and it got rejected.
Was it because I exceeded the daily total buying power? I thought as long as you sell what your holding and your total account value is above a certain amount, you can keep buying and selling stocks?
On another note, Panda, are you on the Yahoo DXO board? There's a kung fu panda there.'
*Edit: does it have to with DXO being a 2 dollar ETF? Thus is it possible that buying a cheap ETF or stock would take up twice the buying power that another stock would?
I have a margin account w/ B of A. Well I was buying and selling stock ABC today, each time making a little profit and then selling. I was doing this in "margin" but never technically dipping into "margin". Then after I sold that I was trying to buy stock XYZ and it got "rejected". I then proceded to buy ABC again, and I was able to do that and then sell it later.
Then after hours, I tried to pick up XYZ again, it got rejected. I tried buying it in cash instead of margin and it still got rejected. Then I tried to pick up DXO and it got rejected.
Was it because I exceeded the daily total buying power? I thought as long as you sell what your holding and your total account value is above a certain amount, you can keep buying and selling stocks?
On another note, Panda, are you on the Yahoo DXO board? There's a kung fu panda there.'
*Edit: does it have to with DXO being a 2 dollar ETF? Thus is it possible that buying a cheap ETF or stock would take up twice the buying power that another stock would?
jbenko_IHB
New member
I'm not sure how B of A has their trading setup or their restrictions/rules. I would probably know whats going on if I saw it. You should be able to use margin at will, no matter how often you buy and sell. I use 2x and even 4x margin often and was able to buy and sell at will. Only time I can think of it being an issue is if you're buying and selling option contracts. Then it usually needs a bit for the funds to settle. Also, not sure how much money you trade with, but if you have 25K or less, I think there is a restriction on how many trades you can make in X amount of time. I believe its 5 trades over 5 days, and then you get flagged as a day trader. You will be required to bring your balance to 25K and then you can day trade all you want.
I'm just throwing out ideas. You're best bet is to contact BofA and ask them honestly.
FYI: Try not to listen to message boards. You will get probably the worst opinions there that can at times influence your own decisions. Stand strong, do your own research, form a strategy, buy the stock and always wear a condom for protection...err use option contracts I mean.
Honestly though, If you're newer to investing and don't have that much experience, you shouldn't use margin. Only use margin when you have proven over and over that you can successfuly make money trading stocks. Do this first before you start using other peoples money (margin). I can't imagine using margin either if you don't use option contracts to hedge your position. Because margin calls are brutal and nasty.
I know someone personally who shorted yahoo near its peak back in the 99-00 crash. He knew it was going to fall apart, he placed all his money on the line, used margin too. Stock went higher, and he got a margin call and couldn't supply additional capital to meet the margin call. So he was forced to liquidate. Then yahoo crashed from hundreds of dollars a share to teens.
Difference in his life? Lost his home and got a divorce vs. being a multi-millionare. But that example is extreme
I'm just throwing out ideas. You're best bet is to contact BofA and ask them honestly.
FYI: Try not to listen to message boards. You will get probably the worst opinions there that can at times influence your own decisions. Stand strong, do your own research, form a strategy, buy the stock and always wear a condom for protection...err use option contracts I mean.
Honestly though, If you're newer to investing and don't have that much experience, you shouldn't use margin. Only use margin when you have proven over and over that you can successfuly make money trading stocks. Do this first before you start using other peoples money (margin). I can't imagine using margin either if you don't use option contracts to hedge your position. Because margin calls are brutal and nasty.
I know someone personally who shorted yahoo near its peak back in the 99-00 crash. He knew it was going to fall apart, he placed all his money on the line, used margin too. Stock went higher, and he got a margin call and couldn't supply additional capital to meet the margin call. So he was forced to liquidate. Then yahoo crashed from hundreds of dollars a share to teens.
Difference in his life? Lost his home and got a divorce vs. being a multi-millionare. But that example is extreme
toady9_IHB
New member
BlackVault CM said:
Thanks for the reply. I thought I could margin at will too. It was weird. I did end up calling B of A, and he said it was because I had used up my buying power for the day, and that it would reset tomorrow. Was it some sort of regulation T violation? I still don't "get it" though because I wasn't holding on to anything. Yeah I am definitely maintaining a balance over 25k, and for sure I am not going beyond what I have in cash in my account and am not dipping into margin. I guess what I mean is, when I purchase my stock/ETF, I click the "margin" button, but I won't buy more than I have in cash. I was under the impression that in order to "day trade", I should check the "margin" button.
What I like about B of A is you get 30 free trades a month, but I'm not happy with it because of these "rejection" messages. Any other recommendations on brokerage accounts? Etrade looks inviting because it offers mobility on Blackberry.
jbenko_IHB
New member
I've used TD Ameritrade since I got my first tooth. I haven't had an issues ever. I've been researching some other brokers, but haven't pulled the trigger. I thought about going to option house but their site froze on me twice while I was trying to place a fake trade. I can't deal with that. So I'm thinking to stay with TD Ameritrade.
Margin buttons? hmm...I've never seen that. I don't have that option with TD. I simply have Cash Balance, Margin Balance, Available Funds for Trading, Stock Buying Power and Option Buying Power. So if I have 1M in trading funds then assuming I haven't used margin yet it will say either 2M or 4M purchasing power. This will depend on whether or not you're enabled for 2x or 4x margin trading. 2x you can hold forever (as long as you meet margin requirements) and 4x you can only hold throughout the day, no overnight positions. Their tools are pretty nice too, like strategy desk and advanced analyzer, live streaming news is a must too! Become an APEX client and you'll get other perks too.
Margin buttons? hmm...I've never seen that. I don't have that option with TD. I simply have Cash Balance, Margin Balance, Available Funds for Trading, Stock Buying Power and Option Buying Power. So if I have 1M in trading funds then assuming I haven't used margin yet it will say either 2M or 4M purchasing power. This will depend on whether or not you're enabled for 2x or 4x margin trading. 2x you can hold forever (as long as you meet margin requirements) and 4x you can only hold throughout the day, no overnight positions. Their tools are pretty nice too, like strategy desk and advanced analyzer, live streaming news is a must too! Become an APEX client and you'll get other perks too.
toady9_IHB
New member
^does what the B of A guy said sound normal? That I used up my buying power for the day? (I wasn't holding any stocks or anything, I had just sold everything).
Oh, about the "margin button", I meant I can choose to purchase in margin or in cash, and click on either one.
Thanks again.
Oh, about the "margin button", I meant I can choose to purchase in margin or in cash, and click on either one.
Thanks again.
usctrojanman29_IHB
New member
Guys take a look at MYL Feb $12.50 Calls. I have been tracking it all day since they report earnings after the bell today. About a half hour ago, I saw a HUGE buy of 2,000+ Feb. $12.50 Call options bought on the ASK price (bid was $.10 and ask was $.15). The $12.50 Feb Call volume is HUGE. I picked up 20 Feb $12.50 calls for a small play.
Update - stock keeps dropping but some other buyers picked up 500+ $12.50 Feb Calls on the ASK (bid $.15 with ask of $.20). Now the Options are trading at a bid of $.20 and ask of $.25.
Update - stock keeps dropping but some other buyers picked up 500+ $12.50 Feb Calls on the ASK (bid $.15 with ask of $.20). Now the Options are trading at a bid of $.20 and ask of $.25.
usctrojanman29_IHB
New member
Sold the calls @ $.05 near the open (should have held because I could have sold at $.20), oh well...lesson learn. I also bought back the 500 DE shorts that I was short around 7am.usctrojanman29 said:
usctrojanman29_IHB
New member
usctrojanman29 said:
jbenko_IHB
New member
usctrojanman29 said:
Ahh my Trojan friend. Now you know what I meant with that longer post earlier. It is very hard to make money this way unless you know something others don't. What you are experimenting with, I've done over and over in my earlier years of trading. Mucho dineros lost. Now to make money, buy the stock and sell the calls and watch the premium evaporate after earnings. If the stock goes down, you're protected by the calls you sold. If the stock goes up, you still get something out of it. Only way you can lose, is if the stock collapses and even then your losses are somewhat absorbed vs. just holding the stock outright. It's all good
I'm the one with the .25 ask price btw
trying to break even with transaction costs.jbenko_IHB
New member
I squeezed by at .25. I even left a mark on the "last sale price
BTW USC, if you want to place bets like this (I often do with little amounts) do it on stocks whos premium is very low.
Let me give you an example. Yesterday Cisco closed at 15.04 and 15 strike option contracts closed at 15 cents. This means there is a 11 cent premium between the two.
If Cisco closes at 15.15 today, you would have already broke even. In the case of MYL the cost was .15-.20 cents a contract when the stock was trading at 11.50 a share, but the strike is at 12.50. The stock has to move a huge amount in a day, in a bad market in order for you to still have a loss. I mean your break even is at 12.65-12.70. Thats like 10-11% move in stock price. I'm not saying it can't happen, because it does. But your odds are against you.
In Ciscos example, if the stock moved 20-30 cents to the upside you make 50-100% return. 20-30 cent moves is common with Cisco.
So when using leverage like options, check out the daily volatility of the stock for your potential and then see if the premium is worth the volatility.
Anyway, let me know where you want to go eat. I'll pay for lunch this time since I did break even after all.
BTW USC, if you want to place bets like this (I often do with little amounts) do it on stocks whos premium is very low.
Let me give you an example. Yesterday Cisco closed at 15.04 and 15 strike option contracts closed at 15 cents. This means there is a 11 cent premium between the two.
If Cisco closes at 15.15 today, you would have already broke even. In the case of MYL the cost was .15-.20 cents a contract when the stock was trading at 11.50 a share, but the strike is at 12.50. The stock has to move a huge amount in a day, in a bad market in order for you to still have a loss. I mean your break even is at 12.65-12.70. Thats like 10-11% move in stock price. I'm not saying it can't happen, because it does. But your odds are against you.
In Ciscos example, if the stock moved 20-30 cents to the upside you make 50-100% return. 20-30 cent moves is common with Cisco.
So when using leverage like options, check out the daily volatility of the stock for your potential and then see if the premium is worth the volatility.
Anyway, let me know where you want to go eat. I'll pay for lunch this time since I did break even after all.
upperlowerclass_IHB
New member
BlackVault CM said:
BV,
I use scottrade right now and every time I sell I need to wait 3 days for funds to settle. RLY annoying! Slows me down. Whats that time frame for TD?
jbenko_IHB
New member
upperlowerclass said:
I have no issues with TD Ameritrade. I don't know if you are talking about funds settling when making a deposit or everyday transactions. If you deposit with TD Ameritrade, then buying equities is instant. If you are wanting to use it to buy options, then you have to wait 5 days until funds settle.
If you are talking about everday trading, then I have't noticed any issue regarding delay in funds settling. As soon as I sell something, I can use the funds again.
Scottrade sucks. Well it doesn't if you want to build a long term portfolio buying here and there. But if you want a reliable brokerage that favors day-traders than look to something like TD Ameritrade. I'm trying to see if Optionhouse is an option. I moved over 10K just to play around with the platform and the reliability of trades before I move over my trillions.
I get hammered by TD's fee structure, especially when buying and selling 100+ option contracts. It hurts...bad.
With Optionhouse, its a flat fee of 10 bucks whether I buy 1 option contract or 1,000! They also have a 15 dollar flat fee for multiple trades such as buying the stock, selling calls at X strike price and buying calls at another strike price. I often take part in positions like that and can be costly. With Optionhouse its only 15 bucks flat fee up to 4 legs. Stocks trades are only 3 bucks.
Too good to be true, but so far I like it and getting used to it. Time will tell.
But if you want to day-trade, get away from Scottrade! 3 dollars difference in fee's isn't worth it unless you're a chronic trader.