Obama leaves door open to health benefits tax

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trrenter_IHB

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<a href="http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/31521872/ns/politics-capitol_hill/">Link to Article</a>



This steams me. During his campaign Obama slammed McCain on this idea and he said he was completely opposed to this.



<strong>Quote from President Obama's website during the election.</strong>

<blockquote>McCain's Stance on Health Care

John McCain?s health plan would tax health benefits for the first time ever ? imposing a trillion tax increase on working families and leaving millions without heath care.

</blockquote>


<strong>Ad run by the Obama Campaign</strong>

<blockquote>"On health care, John McCain promises a tax credit," an announcer says in one of Obama's new ads, over images of families examining their bills. "But here's what he won't tell you: McCain would make you pay taxes on your health benefits, taxing your health care for the first time ever, raising costs for employers who offer health care so your coverage could be reduced or dropped completely. You won't find one word about it on his website."

</blockquote>


<strong>Quote from the Article in the link</strong>

<blockquote>?I don?t want to prejudge what they?re doing,? the president said, referring to proposals in the Senate to tax workers who get expensive insurance policies.</blockquote>


<strong>President Obama doesn't want to prejudge what Congress is doing? Does he mean re pre judge because he already judged it to be a bad idea during the campaign.</strong>
 
<a href="http://krugman.blogs.nytimes.com/2009/06/23/the-president-is-making-sense/">http://krugman.blogs.nytimes.com/2009/06/23/the-president-is-making-sense/</a>



<blockquote>Ezra Klein and Matthew Yglesias both catch President Obama making sense on the public option:



QUESTION: Wouldn?t that drive private insurance out of business?



OBAMA: Why would it drive private insurance out of business? <em><strong>If private insurers say that the marketplace provides the best quality health care</strong>; if they tell us that they?re offering a good deal, then why is it that <strong>the government</strong>, which they say can?t run anything, suddenly <strong>is going to drive them out of business? <span style="font-size: 16px;">That?s not logical</span></strong>.</em>



</blockquote>


I miss the days of 43 where everything was so simple with the mention of "terrorism" or "nuclear bomb" or "with us or against us". This guy wants us to use logic.



<img src="http://talentedapps.files.wordpress.com/2009/01/kijinnmaru-inconceivable.jpg" alt="" />
 
If Government were a private company, it would be called predatory pricing.



The government doesn't need to make a profit, even worse, they can and willfully run at sustained losses and simply take more money to fill in the gaps.
 
How is that different from the cherry picking and price gouging they are doing right now?



(My SO is uninsurable outside of COBRA at any price because the CEPAP machine she uses qualifies as a preexisting condition)
 
I didn't say the companies were angels, just the disingeniousness of Obama's statements.



I've work at an insurance company, IMHO, they give the government a run for the money on inefficiency.
 
[quote author="No_Such_Reality" date=1245931383]I didn't say the companies were angels, just the disingeniousness of Obama's statements.



I've work at an insurance company, IMHO, they give the government a run for the money on inefficiency.</blockquote>


I didn't say they were. Insurance company is only profitable by denying the maximum ammount of services and charging the maximium amount of profits. The other side of the same coin you were pointing out with El Government.
 
The HUGE corporations that have turned our health care into big business for profit in this country serve nobody but themselves. The doctors spend more time dealing with these bloodsucking pigs than with patients. They are about to go the way of the dinasour. If you own any of these big health care stocks. I would be selling them. Making huge profits by getting in between patients and their Doctors should be criminal and outlawed. Then there is Big Pharma. Where do you think they get all the money for those damn commercials we see all the time ? By charging us $ 100.00 for a prescription that cost them $ 2.00 and we could purchase for $ 7.00 in Mexico or Canada.



The rest of the Modern world has Nationalized Health care. Can someone name another major country on this earth that does NOT have nationalized health care ?

China is the only one that comes to mind.



Don't forget in Iraq and Afghanistan its free. We pay for it.

<img src="http://www.bltserv.com/images/WORLDHEALTH2.png" alt="" />
 
We have argued before about nationalized health care and come to the conclusion that some think it is great others do not.



I actually work with a person that lives in Canada. From his opinion both systems have their merits. His biggest issue is the wait time to get to see a doctor he likens the care to a HMO with below par service.



That is not the point.



The point here is that Congress is floating through the idea of taxing healthcare benefits for the first time in history.



This was a huge point of differentiation between Obama and McCain and Obama clearly stated.....<blockquote>?On health care, John McCain promises a tax credit,? an announcer says in one of Obama?s new ads, over images of families examining their bills. ?But here?s what he won?t tell you: <strong>McCain would make you pay taxes on your health benefits, taxing your health care for the first time ever, raising costs for employers who offer health care so your coverage could be reduced or dropped completely</strong>. You won?t find one word about it on his website.? </blockquote>


The quote is from Obama's campaign he told us that if the goverment taxed our health insurance like McCain wanted there may be huge negatives. Now McCain was at least going to give a $2500 tax credit to offset this the loss of a tax deduction.



Obama made it clear he would not support this type of action so to me the correct response is <strong>"During my Campagin McCain proposed this as a healtcare solution I said it was a bad idea then and it is still a bad idea. If this makes it through Congress it will be vetoed."</strong>



Anything short of that is a promise broken. He did promise us Change though so he can always fall back on that.
 
I'd add that some countries in the above chart have subsidized health insurance, but is not seen as "universal health care".



For example, in Philippines they have Phil-Health, starting at 100 php ($2 USD) per month for coverage:

http://www.philhealth.gov.ph/members/employed/contri_tbl.htm

http://www.philhealth.gov.ph/members/individually_paying/bmember.htm

http://www.philhealth.gov.ph/members/overseas_workers/bmember.htm



Those in the highest salary bracket pay 350 php (~$6.50 USD) per month for individual coverage.



Those in lowest salary bracket pay 50 php ($1 USD) per month, and self-employed pay 100 php ($2 USD) per month. A maid in Manila makes about $100 USD per month, so her personal health insurance cost is approx. 2% of her pre-tax monthly income.



It's cheap enough that anyone with a job there could realistically afford the basic health insurance. However, note that "basic health insurance" is not the same as "full coverage" with dental, vision, etc.



China is aiming to have something similar, they're spending 850 billion RMB over the next 3 years to provide basic health insurance coverage to >90% of the population by 2011.
 
Not only do I think it is ridiculous to have a FOR-PROFIT business be the ones who make the decisions on what care we get - businesses that actually employ doctors and nurses to find ways to NOT pay for our healthcare. I also think it is completely ridiculous to strap American businesses with the duty and responsibility of providing a social service that can mean the difference between life and death - the businesses are our EMPLOYER, not our Momma. People move, they get fired, they get laid off, they are self-employed, they are unable to work for various reasons...... yet the only place we are allowed access to GROUP healthcare coverage is thru an employer. Not to mention the fact that American businesses can no longer compete in the global market, with all the other companies not required to provide this expensive service to their employees, which gives all the American businesses a no-brainer excuse to merely ship all the American jobs overseas. I could go on and on about how nuts this is - why is it the rest of the western world gets it - except us. We are too busy calling each other socialist and communist, and trying to figure out anway possible for not having our liberty breached by having to pay taxes. Well, look where that has gotten us - we are collectively running this country into the ground.



As for Obama and his presto-change-o, well this is only one issue he seems to have switched teams on. So much for the "YES WE CAN". It should be his motto - "I THOUGHT WE COULD".
 
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