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[Geotpf_IHB]

"Now is NOT a good time to buy a home in Orange County".

Or Riverside or San Diego either.

Orange County, now is not the time to buy. Riverside County, now is the time. Prices in Riverside (on the low end) aren't going to go down much from what they are now. When rent on a 1 bedroom apartment with no covered parking or patio is more than the monthly mortgage payment (minus taxes, insurance, and repairs) of a 1,800 sq ft, 4 bed/2 bath house with a 8,700 sq ft yard and a three car garage (as in my particular circumstance), it's time to buy. A few miles to the east, newer (less than five years old), large (3,000+ sq ft) houses in San Jacinto are selling below construction costs. Prices can't drop much lower than this, IMHO, as every single person with good credit and a steady job who currently lives in an apartment buys a house. I would hate to own an apartment building in Riverside right now, although maybe the people who lost their homes will be moving in.

In fact, if the original poster isn't working (and therefore won't be affected by the major negative of Riverside County-long commutes to most jobs), and wants a large house in a temperate climate for low cost, large sections of Riverside County are worth looking into. Of course, so would other states, including those with lower taxes than California.

 

[ABC123_IHB]

San Jacinto? That's pretty far out there, away from the world. Not quite like Irvine (but that's why I like it there - or I should say did before the over-development). Is it a place where you would want to raise your children?

 

[freedomCM_IHB]

Prices can't drop much lower than this, IMHO, as every single person with good credit and a steady job who currently lives in an apartment buys a house.

wrong. they can, and will go lower.

job situation is only going to get worse, particularly in the IE. you are going to see redefaults soon enough.

and a true lack of qualified buyers.

 

[ipoplaya_IHB]

I have a small advantage in that Mr. Foreclosure himself is usually in my living room telling me all about upcoming REOs in my desired neighborhoods, but the information Graphrix gets is all public.

After having seen CrackerCakes on the b-ball court, I think his new handle should be Spider Monkey...

 

[irvine_home_owner_IHB]

Prices can't drop much lower than this, IMHO, as every single person with good credit and a steady job who currently lives in an apartment buys a house.

wrong. they can, and will go lower.

job situation is only going to get worse, particularly in the IE. you are going to see redefaults soon enough.

and a true lack of qualified buyers.

Agreed... not every renter can qualify to buy a house.

And the downward spiral in prices of RE will hit the rental market soon too. IE can't bottom out until the rest of SoCal does... and considering how slow some places in Irvine are dropping... that's gonna be a while.

P.S. If the hubby is okay with bi-coastal living... you should be fine... I think sometimes my better half wishes I was living in another state.

 

[gypsyuma_IHB]

Well, just got back to Boston from my vacation SLASH Home Buying versus Renting exploration trip to OC. I was able to quickly eliminate Ladera Ranch from consideration, as I just could not overcome the wires thing - maybe it doesn't bother some, but it did me. I also decided against Mission Viejo and RSM. I didn't like the lack of access to either the 5 or 405, and I also didn't like the whole huge, double story formal LR/DR combo thingy. It reminded me too much of my mom's house. I have had those before, and they are just major dust collectors in my family.

So then I became enthralled with the new construction in Portola Springs - I love me a new construction! Well, the infactuation wore off after I crunched the numbers and saw how much goes to taxes, Mella Roos and HOA. I explored Northwood and decided I hated the gate thing and thought the quality of construction of what I saw was sub-par. I explored Woodbury, and actually put an offer on a Short Sale of a former model home (because I thought the price was good), that had never been lived in, which of course I did not get. The agent was very slimey, and kept telling me it "looks good", but of course it was not "good". I saw a home in Northwood Pointe I think, which I also did not like. And some others I don't recall.

I couldn't get over the feeding frenzy! I was looking in the $650 - 750k range, and it was literally like vultures circling over a fresh kill!

I refuse to use an agent, so I was doing all this on my own. Why jack up the price of a home, when I have a cell phone, a laptop, and a GPS system??? I got so sick of the agents using their ploys to try and become my agent...., and also trying to explain to each agent why I do not use an agent after I refused their services. GEEZ!!! One agent had the nerve to insist I NEED to use an agent because of all the "new forms". I told her I am a lawyer and I LOVE forms, even the fine print! lol

Anyway, I ended up back in my old neighborhood where I rented in 2003 - 2004 - Turtle Rock. I can't help it - I just love it. It is someplace I feel at home. It just feels like a good fit. So I looked at several homes there. They were all overpriced in my opinion. I did find one I absolutely loved - but the asking price was something like $362/sf. Whereas the recent comps all sold below $300/sf. But it was absolutely perfect for me.

If I was not using my noggin, I might have bought it. But then, after crunching the numbers again, and using the ol' brain muscle, the facts just speak for themselves. I could buy that place or spend literally HALF to rent an apartment again where I used to live in Turtle Rock. And I get to keep my huge savings account as an added bonus! I loved that apartment by the way, and I still get to live in Turtle Rock.

So that is my decision - rent where I used to live and keep an eye on the Turtle Rock market. Maybe someday I will be able to justify buying - but right now I just cannot.

A couple questions for all you know-it-alls out there (I mean that as a compliment):

1. Is it true that the high school in Turtle Rock is the best in the country? One of the agents told me that.

2. What do you see in your crystal ball for the Turtle Rock market specifically?

TIA!!!

 

[awgee_IHB]

Well, just got back to Boston from my vacation SLASH Home Buying versus Renting exploration trip to OC. I was able to quickly eliminate Ladera Ranch from consideration, as I just could not overcome the wires thing - maybe it doesn't bother some, but it did me. I also decided against Mission Viejo and RSM. I didn't like the lack of access to either the 5 or 405, and I also didn't like the whole huge, double story formal LR/DR combo thingy. It reminded me too much of my mom's house. I have had those before, and they are just major dust collectors in my family.

So then I became enthralled with the new construction in Portola Springs - I love me a new construction! Well, the infactuation wore off after I crunched the numbers and saw how much goes to taxes, Mella Roos and HOA. I explored Northwood and decided I hated the gate thing and thought the quality of construction of what I saw was sub-par. I explored Woodbury, and actually put an offer on a Short Sale of a former model home (because I thought the price was good), that had never been lived in, which of course I did not get. The agent was very slimey, and kept telling me it "looks good", but of course it was not "good". I saw a home in Northwood Pointe I think, which I also did not like. And some others I don't recall.

I couldn't get over the feeding frenzy! I was looking in the $650 - 750k range, and it was literally like vultures circling over a fresh kill!

I refuse to use an agent, so I was doing all this on my own. Why jack up the price of a home, when I have a cell phone, a laptop, and a GPS system??? I got so sick of the agents using their ploys to try and become my agent...., and also trying to explain to each agent why I do not use an agent after I refused their services. GEEZ!!! One agent had the nerve to insist I NEED to use an agent because of all the "new forms". I told her I am a lawyer and I LOVE forms, even the fine print! lol

Anyway, I ended up back in my old neighborhood where I rented in 2003 - 2004 - Turtle Rock. I can't help it - I just love it. It is someplace I feel at home. It just feels like a good fit. So I looked at several homes there. They were all overpriced in my opinion. I did find one I absolutely loved - but the asking price was something like $362/sf. Whereas the recent comps all sold below $300/sf. But it was absolutely perfect for me.

If I was not using my noggin, I might have bought it. But then, after crunching the numbers again, and using the ol' brain muscle, the facts just speak for themselves. I could buy that place or spend literally HALF to rent an apartment again where I used to live in Turtle Rock. And I get to keep my huge savings account as an added bonus! I loved that apartment by the way, and I still get to live in Turtle Rock.

So that is my decision - rent where I used to live and keep an eye on the Turtle Rock market. Maybe someday I will be able to justify buying - but right now I just cannot.

A couple questions for all you know-it-alls out there (I mean that as a compliment):

1. Is it true that the high school in Turtle Rock is the best in the country? One of the agents told me that.

2. What do you see in your crystal ball for the Turtle Rock market specifically?

TIA!!!

University High is a great high school, but extremely competitive. I have no idea how to tell if a high school is the best in the country. How does the agent measure that?

In six months, prices in TR will start falling hard.

In RSM, quick access to the freeway system is the 241 toll road. I (heart) the 241.

 

[Mcdonna1980_IHB]

I refuse to use an agent, so I was doing all this on my own. Why jack up the price of a home, when I have a cell phone, a laptop, and a GPS system???

Gypsyuma, I recommend you read through this thread where we discussed the pros and cons of using a buyer's agent.

If you go into the transaction without an agent, you are not going to save money because the seller's agent will keep the full 6% commission.

 

[freedomCM_IHB]

Uni high is very good, but iirc not in the top 50 in the US

but may be in the top 200

Did you look at newport coast/beach?

 

[awgee_IHB]

I refuse to use an agent, so I was doing all this on my own. Why jack up the price of a home, when I have a cell phone, a laptop, and a GPS system???

Gypsyuma, I recommend you read through this thread where we discussed the pros and cons of using a buyer's agent.

If you go into the transaction without an agent, you are not going to save money because the seller's agent will keep the full 6% commission.

I disagree 1000%. No one in my family has used a buyer's agent in the last twenty years. We make our offers with the decreased commission in mind. So far, not one transaction has included a full commission.

 

[SoCal78_IHB]

I refuse to use an agent, so I was doing all this on my own. Why jack up the price of a home, when I have a cell phone, a laptop, and a GPS system???

Gypsyuma, I recommend you read through this thread where we discussed the pros and cons of using a buyer's agent.

If you go into the transaction without an agent, you are not going to save money because the seller's agent will keep the full 6% commission.

I disagree 1000%. No one in my family has used a buyer's agent in the last twenty years. We make our offers with the decreased commission in mind. So far, not one transaction has included a full commission.

I think if you go about it unrepresented, you will be met with resistance. Gypsy - I hope you had a nice trip. Your story does not surprise me at all. When I had my house on the market, my agent and I refused to let anyone in to see the home who was not with an agent. This was also for safety purposes, so that we could be sure they were there for legitimate reasons (except for open house). When it came down to it, she was very much against dealing with an unrepresented party and if anyone came who was not with a buyer's agent, she would refer them to an agent (somebody other than herself. The point was not to become a dual agent.) She felt strongly that they usually do not know the rules and regs like they think they do and did not want that hassle. So whether it's right or wrong, that is just what happens. As a seller, I only wanted to have a smooth transaction so this was all fine by me. Now maybe as things evolve in this market, there will become a new normal. If you are an experienced buyer like awgee then perhaps it could be different. But all I'm saying is from my experience, it may be a challenge. Good luck & I'm glad you decided to rent for now.

 

[Mcdonna1980_IHB]

I refuse to use an agent, so I was doing all this on my own. Why jack up the price of a home, when I have a cell phone, a laptop, and a GPS system???

Gypsyuma, I recommend you read through this thread where we discussed the pros and cons of using a buyer's agent.

If you go into the transaction without an agent, you are not going to save money because the seller's agent will keep the full 6% commission.

I disagree 1000%. No one in my family has used a buyer's agent in the last twenty years. We make our offers with the decreased commission in mind. So far, not one transaction has included a full commission.

Well, from my understanding of the thread discussion I linked. In order to avoid the seller's agent getting less than 6% rate, you would have to amend the contract between the seller and seller's agent. I'm not sure how to do this. If this is not correct, then how do decrease the rate to say 3% for the seller's agent?

In one of your previous posts, you suggested offering 3% less on the purchase price in order to compensate for the lack of a buyer's agent. However, if you do that then the seller's agent will still get 6% of the amount offered. How does this put you in a better position to get an accepted offer from the seller? IMO, getting a buyer's agent that will kick you back a portion of the commission would be the cheapest route for both the seller and buyer.

 

[usctrojanman29_IHB]

I refuse to use an agent, so I was doing all this on my own. Why jack up the price of a home, when I have a cell phone, a laptop, and a GPS system???

Gypsyuma, I recommend you read through this thread where we discussed the pros and cons of using a buyer's agent.

If you go into the transaction without an agent, you are not going to save money because the seller's agent will keep the full 6% commission.

I disagree 1000%. No one in my family has used a buyer's agent in the last twenty years. We make our offers with the decreased commission in mind. So far, not one transaction has included a full commission.

Well, from my understanding of the thread discussion I linked. In order to avoid the seller's agent getting less than 6% rate, you would have to amend the contract between the seller and seller's agent. I'm not sure how to do this. If this is not correct, then how do decrease the rate to say 3% for the seller's agent?

In one of your previous posts, you suggested offering 3% less on the purchase price in order to compensate for the lack of a buyer's agent. However, if you do that then the seller's agent will still get 6% of the amount offered. How does this put you in a better position to get an accepted offer from the seller? IMO, getting a buyer's agent that will kick you back a portion of the commission would be the cheapest route for both the seller and buyer.

Exactly correct, the listing contract spells out the commission and is between the SELLER and LISTING BROKER (it's the listing broker that owns the listing and not the agent). Notice how the buyer's agent/broker and the buyers are not parties to the listing contract. People may think that if they don't use a buyer's agent they can throw out a 3% lower lower offer because they think they are saving the seller the 3% buy-side commission. The reality is that the seller will still have to pay the listing agent the full 6% on a 3% lower sales price. The only way to decrease the seller's listing agent commission to 3% if no buyer's agent was involved would be to amend the original listing contract (you have a better chance of seeing mortgage rates go to 0% before this happens). Don't you think if it was as simple as Awgee makes it seem that there would be lot of buyers who wouldn't use buyers agents and ask for a 3% lower sales price and force the listing agents to only take a 3% commission (1/2) with success? Trust me, realtors/NAR won't allow that to happen because it would take money out of their pockets. IMHO...the path of least resistance is to find a buyer's agent who is open to contributing a portion of their commission back to the buyers' escrow (especially if those buyers are sophisticated and reduce the workload on the buyers' agent).

 

[usctrojanman29_IHB]

I refuse to use an agent, so I was doing all this on my own. Why jack up the price of a home, when I have a cell phone, a laptop, and a GPS system???

Gypsyuma, I recommend you read through this thread where we discussed the pros and cons of using a buyer's agent.

If you go into the transaction without an agent, you are not going to save money because the seller's agent will keep the full 6% commission.

I disagree 1000%. No one in my family has used a buyer's agent in the last twenty years. We make our offers with the decreased commission in mind. So far, not one transaction has included a full commission.

What do you mean that not one transaction has included a full commission? So in your offers you are requiring that the seller and listing agent amend their listing contract to lower the commission to 3% if the buyer isn't using an agent? The buyer's Final HUD-1 Closing Statement will not show you the total commission paid to the broker/agent (that's private information) so I'm not sure how you would know whether the seller paid a 3% or 6% commission to the listing agent/broker.

 

[usctrojanman29_IHB]

Well, just got back to Boston from my vacation SLASH Home Buying versus Renting exploration trip to OC. I was able to quickly eliminate Ladera Ranch from consideration, as I just could not overcome the wires thing - maybe it doesn't bother some, but it did me. I also decided against Mission Viejo and RSM. I didn't like the lack of access to either the 5 or 405, and I also didn't like the whole huge, double story formal LR/DR combo thingy. It reminded me too much of my mom's house. I have had those before, and they are just major dust collectors in my family.

So then I became enthralled with the new construction in Portola Springs - I love me a new construction! Well, the infactuation wore off after I crunched the numbers and saw how much goes to taxes, Mella Roos and HOA. I explored Northwood and decided I hated the gate thing and thought the quality of construction of what I saw was sub-par. I explored Woodbury, and actually put an offer on a Short Sale of a former model home (because I thought the price was good), that had never been lived in, which of course I did not get. The agent was very slimey, and kept telling me it "looks good", but of course it was not "good". I saw a home in Northwood Pointe I think, which I also did not like. And some others I don't recall.

I couldn't get over the feeding frenzy! I was looking in the $650 - 750k range, and it was literally like vultures circling over a fresh kill!

I refuse to use an agent, so I was doing all this on my own. Why jack up the price of a home, when I have a cell phone, a laptop, and a GPS system??? I got so sick of the agents using their ploys to try and become my agent...., and also trying to explain to each agent why I do not use an agent after I refused their services. GEEZ!!! One agent had the nerve to insist I NEED to use an agent because of all the "new forms". I told her I am a lawyer and I LOVE forms, even the fine print! lol

Anyway, I ended up back in my old neighborhood where I rented in 2003 - 2004 - Turtle Rock. I can't help it - I just love it. It is someplace I feel at home. It just feels like a good fit. So I looked at several homes there. They were all overpriced in my opinion. I did find one I absolutely loved - but the asking price was something like $362/sf. Whereas the recent comps all sold below $300/sf. But it was absolutely perfect for me.

If I was not using my noggin, I might have bought it. But then, after crunching the numbers again, and using the ol' brain muscle, the facts just speak for themselves. I could buy that place or spend literally HALF to rent an apartment again where I used to live in Turtle Rock. And I get to keep my huge savings account as an added bonus! I loved that apartment by the way, and I still get to live in Turtle Rock.

So that is my decision - rent where I used to live and keep an eye on the Turtle Rock market. Maybe someday I will be able to justify buying - but right now I just cannot.

A couple questions for all you know-it-alls out there (I mean that as a compliment):

1. Is it true that the high school in Turtle Rock is the best in the country? One of the agents told me that.

2. What do you see in your crystal ball for the Turtle Rock market specifically?

TIA!!!

Great decision to rent, especially in Irvine where prices have a long way to go down. Just remember, not all agents are created equally and a good agent is worth their weight in gold. It's all about picking the right agent for you. I think in 2-4 years you'll see TR prices probably off about 20-30% from today's levels (my best guess).

 

[Mcdonna1980_IHB]

Thanks, SC. When I read awgee's comment, I was kind of like WTF because I thought he was in agreement with us that you can't lower the commission rate. I don't know, maybe we are misinterputing his post.

Edit: after writing this, it dawned on me that I could use the thank you button. Two years on this blog and I finally figure it out. Geez, I'm slow.

 

[usctrojanman29_IHB]

Thanks, SC. When I read awgee's comment, I was kind of like WTF because I thought he was in agreement with us that you can't lower the commission rate. I don't know, maybe we are misinterputing his post.

Edit: after writing this, it dawned on me that I could use the thank you button. Two years on this blog and I finally figure it out. Geez, I'm slow.

Haha, what a newb! lol j/k It also took me some time to realize what that "thank you" thing was all about. Btw, it looks like I might get an offer from that Brea bank that I'm doing consulting work for so I may be looking to make the move up to the Fullerton/Brea area when my lease expires in Nov.

But yeah, Awgee's main issue is with the conflict of interest that exists between real estate agents and the commissions resulting from real estate transactions (not to mention that the majority of realtors are uneducated, pushy, know-it-all idiots). And I completely understand and was one of the reasons why I became an agent so I can do my own transactions and help out my friends. Although it is true that many agents will allow the commissions dollars to cloud their judgment and try to push sellers and buyers along, obviously not all agents are like that.

 

[awgee_IHB]

I refuse to use an agent, so I was doing all this on my own. Why jack up the price of a home, when I have a cell phone, a laptop, and a GPS system???

Gypsyuma, I recommend you read through this thread where we discussed the pros and cons of using a buyer's agent.

If you go into the transaction without an agent, you are not going to save money because the seller's agent will keep the full 6% commission.

I disagree 1000%. No one in my family has used a buyer's agent in the last twenty years. We make our offers with the decreased commission in mind. So far, not one transaction has included a full commission.

Well, from my understanding of the thread discussion I linked. In order to avoid the seller's agent getting less than 6% rate, you would have to amend the contract between the seller and seller's agent. I'm not sure how to do this. If this is not correct, then how do decrease the rate to say 3% for the seller's agent?

In one of your previous posts, you suggested offering 3% less on the purchase price in order to compensate for the lack of a buyer's agent. However, if you do that then the seller's agent will still get 6% of the amount offered. How does this put you in a better position to get an accepted offer from the seller? IMO, getting a buyer's agent that will kick you back a portion of the commission would be the cheapest route for both the seller and buyer.

The seller's contract is between the seller and the agent, just as USC says. It is not appropriate for the buyer to try and negotiate the seller's contract.

And we make our offers low enough with the knowledge that the agent will lower their commission. I have not been privy to the actual contract. I only know what the seller or seller's agent told us. Maybe they were lying? It seems important to the seller's agent to let us know that we are getting such a deal because they are halving "their" commission.

And YES, it is that simple. It is a lot simpler than having a buyer's agent who actually represents their own interest, (commission), and not the buyer's interest. Our family has found that real estate transactions go much smoother with one less agent involved.

And you must remember that the seller's agent is NOT a dual agent with a non-represented buyer. The seller's agent legally represents the seller and has a contract only with the seller.

To those who think that a buyer's agent represents the buyer's interest in a real estate transaction, Good Luck. IMO, it is a fallacy propagated by the real estate industry using a scare tactic that the transaction is too complicated for you to understand and you need the help of an expert. The escrow company takes care of most of the issues after the offer contract. The papers the buyer has to sign are standard. Very few re agents are expert in anything, especially real estate. The most successful agents are expert in sales.

We use listing agents because they are experts at marketing, (sales). And only about 5% of the listing agents out there are any good at marketing.

 

[Mcdonna1980_IHB]

Thanks, SC. When I read awgee's comment, I was kind of like WTF because I thought he was in agreement with us that you can't lower the commission rate. I don't know, maybe we are misinterputing his post.

Edit: after writing this, it dawned on me that I could use the thank you button. Two years on this blog and I finally figure it out. Geez, I'm slow.

Haha, what a newb! lol j/k It also took me some time to realize what that "thank you" thing was all about. Btw, it looks like I might get an offer from that Brea bank that I'm doing consulting work for so I may be looking to make the move up to the Fullerton/Brea area when my lease expires in Nov.

But yeah, Awgee's main issue is with the conflict of interest that exists between real estate agents and the commissions resulting from real estate transactions (not to mention that the majority of realtor are uneducated, pushy, know-it-all idiots). And I completely understand and was one of the reasons why I became an agent so I can do my own transactions and help out my friends. Although it is true that many agents will allow the commissions dollars to cloud their judgment and try to push sellers and buyers along, obviously not all agents are like that.

Hey, old timer, don't laugh me! You drive me nuts when you don't use the link function. ha ha

I'll cross my fingers for you. I hope you get it the job.

We could end up in uncharted territory, though. What to do when your own realtor outbids you on a property? ah

 

[usctrojanman29_IHB]

Thanks, SC. When I read awgee's comment, I was kind of like WTF because I thought he was in agreement with us that you can't lower the commission rate. I don't know, maybe we are misinterputing his post.

Edit: after writing this, it dawned on me that I could use the thank you button. Two years on this blog and I finally figure it out. Geez, I'm slow.

Haha, what a newb! lol j/k It also took me some time to realize what that "thank you" thing was all about. Btw, it looks like I might get an offer from that Brea bank that I'm doing consulting work for so I may be looking to make the move up to the Fullerton/Brea area when my lease expires in Nov.

But yeah, Awgee's main issue is with the conflict of interest that exists between real estate agents and the commissions resulting from real estate transactions (not to mention that the majority of realtor are uneducated, pushy, know-it-all idiots). And I completely understand and was one of the reasons why I became an agent so I can do my own transactions and help out my friends. Although it is true that many agents will allow the commissions dollars to cloud their judgment and try to push sellers and buyers along, obviously not all agents are like that.

Hey, old timer, don't laugh me! You drive me nuts when you don't use the link function. ha ha

I'll cross my fingers for you. I hope you get it the job.

We could end up in uncharted territory, though. What to do when your own realtor outbids you on a property? ah

Respect your elders! haha You know, I recently learned how to use the link function after many, many months...takes time for an older timer to catch onto the tricks on here.

It's still talk at this point but I've heard directly from the VP that I would be reporting to that they like me and my work quality and are interested in bringing me on-board as a full-time employee. Only little wrinkle is that they would have to pay the consulting firm that placed me a placement fee if they do hire me (but I've heard that is negotiable especially since the bank brought on 5 more consultants last week). I like the VP and her staff plus it seems like a laidback place to work at and I could make a positive difference there (they don't have many experienced staff at the moment). So we'll see what happens.

That would be an interesting predicament to deal with, that's for sure. Talk about having INSIDER INFORMATION. haha