McMansions

A

autox_IHB

New member
Not trolling,

but what's with all the negativity toward large tract homes? I don't get it.

Living in Houston (soon to move back to socal), homes out here are large and cheap. Its not uncommon to buy a new home in a good neighborhood for $50/sf. KB homes had some houses that were 3500sf for 160k. Lots typically are about 3-4x the size of houses, but its not uncommon to have acreage homes out here. It would seem logical that if someone could afford a larger home, wouldn't they want to live in a larger home? There's seems to be so much snickering and sneering at people that want to live in a house bigger than 3000sf. In Texas, those would be starter homes.



I got used to living in a modest (by Texas standard) 3700sf house and planning to move back to Socal in about 6 months. There's no way I can afford anything that's even comparable in Irvine. I'm trying to mentally prepare for the downsizing. Don't a family of 4 feel claustrophobic in a 1500sf home?



As an aside, I grew up in the Valley (sf) and lived in small apartments, and it didn't bother me because I didn't know better. But having lived in a larger house, it think it would be very difficult to downsize.
 
I think it would be hard to downsize from a 3700 to a 1500 too.



The negativity you see towards tract homes (not necessarily the "large" part) is the aesthetic design. We have a bunch of art snobs here who think that if the outside of a house isn't the ultimate example of classic art... it's not worth living in.



Okay... that last sentence was inflammatory and more meant as graph-bait but external beauty *is* a big deal to many posters on the IHB. For me... just give me a 3-car wide garage and make sure it's not some pastel color and I'll be okay.
 
Allow me to use a metaphor since IHO expressed his other seldom used artistic side of his brain to express his eloquent idea. He actually has great taste for plaster miterless art frame (Irvine master planning, landscape, school system, and community infrastructure but the impeccable gilded moulding is framing some poster art from Aaron Brother that he bought the second one for one cent.
 
[quote author="irvine_home_owner" date=1247555968]Maybe I should have said bk/graph bait.



Where have you been Master Yoda?</blockquote>


I was sent to study George Orwells 1984.
 
[quote author="bkshopr" date=1247567250][quote author="irvine_home_owner" date=1247555968]Maybe I should have said bk/graph bait.



Where have you been Master Yoda?</blockquote>


I was sent to study George Orwells 1984.</blockquote>


Oooh... TIC re-education camp?
 
[quote author="bkshopr" date=1247567250][quote author="irvine_home_owner" date=1247555968]Maybe I should have said bk/graph bait.



Where have you been Master Yoda?</blockquote>


I was sent to study George Orwells 1984.</blockquote>


Classic book. I thought under Bush that it might come true
 
[quote author="EvaLSeraphim" date=1247568598][quote author="bkshopr" date=1247567250][quote author="irvine_home_owner" date=1247555968]Maybe I should have said bk/graph bait.



Where have you been Master Yoda?</blockquote>


I was sent to study George Orwells 1984.</blockquote>


Oooh... TIC re-education camp?</blockquote>


Eva is back. Viva snark!
 
[quote author="no_vaseline" date=1247570887][quote author="EvaLSeraphim" date=1247568598][quote author="bkshopr" date=1247567250][quote author="irvine_home_owner" date=1247555968]Maybe I should have said bk/graph bait.



Where have you been Master Yoda?</blockquote>


I was sent to study George Orwells 1984.</blockquote>


Oooh... TIC re-education camp?</blockquote>


Eva is back. Viva snark!</blockquote>


What are the guiding slogans?



Mortgage Debt is Wealth

Conformity is Expression

CC&Rs; are Freedom
 
[quote author="No_Such_Reality" date=1247572524][quote author="no_vaseline" date=1247570887][quote author="EvaLSeraphim" date=1247568598][quote author="bkshopr" date=1247567250][quote author="irvine_home_owner" date=1247555968]Maybe I should have said bk/graph bait.



Where have you been Master Yoda?</blockquote>


I was sent to study George Orwells 1984.</blockquote>


Oooh... TIC re-education camp?</blockquote>


Eva is back. Viva snark!</blockquote>


What are the guiding slogans?



Mortgage Debt is Wealth

Conformity is Expression

CC&Rs; are Freedom</blockquote>
3CWG is beautiful
 
[quote author="bkshopr" date=1247577885][quote author="No_Such_Reality" date=1247572524][quote author="no_vaseline" date=1247570887][quote author="EvaLSeraphim" date=1247568598][quote author="bkshopr" date=1247567250][quote author="irvine_home_owner" date=1247555968]Maybe I should have said bk/graph bait.



Where have you been Master Yoda?</blockquote>


I was sent to study George Orwells 1984.</blockquote>


Oooh... TIC re-education camp?</blockquote>


Eva is back. Viva snark!</blockquote>


What are the guiding slogans?



Mortgage Debt is Wealth

Conformity is Expression

CC&Rs; are Freedom</blockquote>
3CWG is beautiful</blockquote>
Icicle Gun is tech.
 
[quote author="autox" date=1247365960]Not trolling,

Its not uncommon to buy a new home in a good neighborhood for $50/sf. KB homes had some houses that were 3500sf for 160k. Lots typically are about 3-4x the size of houses, but its not uncommon to have acreage homes out here.</blockquote>


you hit the nail on the head right there. 3500 sf home on a half acre lot is fine. 3500 sf home on 4500 sf lot is what draws the most negativity.



as for square footage of homes in general, i grew up in larger homes and yet really have no desire for a home of that size myself. lifestyles and how families use their homes have changed. do american families still need a family room and living room? you don't invite friends to sit and conversate, you have them over to watch the big game. heck, some families don't even need dining rooms! and if you have an island in your kitchen, you probably do half your entertaining there.
 
<blockquote>We have a bunch of art snobs here who think that if the outside of a house isn?t the ultimate example of classic art? it?s not worth living in.</blockquote>


I think this misses the point. The purpose of design is to define space. The best homes have an eye pleasing exterior and a well designed floor plan. Many builders in Irvine (and elsewhere) try to reduce the home buying decision to just the number of square feet. I think there are a lot of people here who feel that is misguided.



There are a lot of reasons to dislike McMansions. The fact that they are generally pretty ugly is just one of them. Another person mentioned that in Irvine they are shoehorned onto tiny lots like obese people squeezed into spandex. Personally, I feel that McMansions represent some of the worst aspects of American culture, but other folk's personal views may vary.
 
[quote author="QH Renter" date=1247698520]<blockquote>We have a bunch of art snobs here who think that if the outside of a house isn?t the ultimate example of classic art? it?s not worth living in.</blockquote>
I think this misses the point. The purpose of design is to define space. The best homes have an eye pleasing exterior and a well designed floor plan. Many builders in Irvine (and elsewhere) try to reduce the home buying decision to just the number of square feet. I think there are a lot of people here who feel that is misguided.

</blockquote>
Well... it wasn't really meant as a serious statement... I was trying to wake up certain IHB regulars.



I agree with you... especially in regards to interior floorplan design. In trying to maximize internal space or cater to aesthetics, I feel the builders miss quite a few functional things that can easily be addressed within the confines of their parameters. I can't count the number of times I've walked into a new model home and wonder what drug the designer was taking when they put X in a Y position. Especially for bigger homes that have the space to be more flexible. For example, the huge Ciara homes in Columbus Grove that put the laundry room in the passageway from the garage to the house... 1) it's no longer 1980s... you can have a separate space for the laundry room and 2) put it upstairs where it's more convenient.

<blockquote>

There are a lot of reasons to dislike McMansions. The fact that they are generally pretty ugly is just one of them. Another person mentioned that in Irvine they are shoehorned onto tiny lots like obese people squeezed into spandex. Personally, I feel that McMansions represent some of the worst aspects of American culture, but other folk's personal views may vary.</blockquote>
In a perfect world, everyone would get the huge lot with the pretty exterior and the best floorplan... in Irvine, you can get that but you have to pay for it (Shady). If you want something that's affordable (well... not right now), you have to make sacrifices, whether it be smaller lot, ugly exterior, no dining room or (gasp!) no 3-car wide garage. In the end, it always boils down to the first 3 rules of real estate, otherwise move to the IE and you can get whatever you want for 1/4 the price.
 
[quote author="QH Renter" date=1247698520]Many builders in Irvine (and elsewhere) try to reduce the home buying decision to just the number of square feet. I think there are a lot of people here who feel that is misguided.</blockquote>


Strangely enough, I've noticed that the price per sq ft is what some (many?) buyers seem to focus on.



Developer/builder <del>greed</del> desire for profit is one thing.. but why do "we" enable them by continuing to purchase these compromised products? (ie 3500 sq ft homes on 4500 sq ft lot, zero lot homes, tri-level townhomes, etc)
 
[quote author="zovall" date=1247700485]but why do "we" enable them by continuing to purchase these compromised products?</blockquote>
Because... Soylent Green is people.



(props to our IHB poster with the same name)
 
cars, homes, consumer products, whatever... there's a high correlation between functionality and aesthetics. are there exceptions? of course... its possible that builders and their architects can come up with an amazingly smart and functional floorplan, and then decide to completely ignore the exterior. although more likely if they decided to cheap out/put little thought into the exteriors, the same effort was given throughout.



there's a reason why apple and bmw products are so widely mimicked in design, because smart designs usually mean better functionality.
 
I'd like to see more smaller and affordable homes for people. Lot size is not a big issue so long as there's nice community parks and amenities available. You'd also save on smaller appliances, electric, and heating bills.
 
[quote author="zovall" date=1247700485][quote author="QH Renter" date=1247698520]Many builders in Irvine (and elsewhere) try to reduce the home buying decision to just the number of square feet. I think there are a lot of people here who feel that is misguided.</blockquote>


Strangely enough, I've noticed that the price per sq ft is what some (many?) buyers seem to focus on.</blockquote>


PPSF is the embodiment of reducing a housing decision to square feet. It answers the question, "How can I get the most house for the least money?".



<blockquote>Developer/builder <del>greed</del> desire for profit is one thing.. but why do "we" enable them by continuing to purchase these compromised products? (ie 3500 sq ft homes on 4500 sq ft lot, zero lot homes, tri-level townhomes, etc)</blockquote>


Why do people buy based on marketing? Beats me. I think the housing bubble pretty definitively demonstrated that a vast majority of people will do things that are not in their best interests if they perceive that "everyone else is doing it".
 
[quote author="irvine_home_owner" date=1247699576]

In a perfect world, everyone would get the huge lot with the pretty exterior and the best floorplan... in Irvine, you can get that but you have to pay for it (Shady). If you want something that's affordable (well... not right now), you have to make sacrifices, whether it be smaller lot, ugly exterior, no dining room or (gasp!) no 3-car wide garage. In the end, it always boils down to the first 3 rules of real estate, otherwise move to the IE and you can get whatever you want for 1/4 the price.</blockquote>


Not everyone has the same tastes, but there are certain design principles that are true. I agree that compromises must be made, but I think that TIC's designs have robbed too much in aesthetics to create the larger floorplans (and beefy profits). There is no balance and as we've seen these homes do not age gracefully due to their poor design. The current crop of homes are even more out of whack and will be undesirable in 25 years. Caveat emptor.
 
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