Freedom of speech? Not in Obama?s America...
- Thread starter WINEX_IHB
- Start date
acpme_IHB
New member
ok, the title of the thread alone lets me know the article is not worth reading.
also as a rule of thumb, anything prefaced with "the truth about XYZ..." is usually followed by a whole lot of crap. sort of like any time someone says, "i don't mean to be racist, but..." the next thing that comes out of their mouth is almost guaranteed to be racist.
also as a rule of thumb, anything prefaced with "the truth about XYZ..." is usually followed by a whole lot of crap. sort of like any time someone says, "i don't mean to be racist, but..." the next thing that comes out of their mouth is almost guaranteed to be racist.
bltserv_IHB
New member
Winex
If your going to post Conservative Propaganda.
At least get the link to work.
Here I will post a nice "Funny" for you to let you
know how much we care about your link.
<img src="http://www.bltserv.com/images/BlackOps.gif" alt="" />
If your going to post Conservative Propaganda.
At least get the link to work.
Here I will post a nice "Funny" for you to let you
know how much we care about your link.
<img src="http://www.bltserv.com/images/BlackOps.gif" alt="" />
For those who may think that there is nothing wrong with Obama trying to squash ads that mention his connection to terrorists, take a look at this. Not only is Obama trying to silence his critics, he is trying to have them thrown in jail. Is this the kind of "change" that America wants?
<a href="http://www.politico.com/blogs/bensmith/0808/Obama_camp_Prosecute_Simmons.html">Speak the truth about Obama, risk being thrown in jail</a>
Obama camp: Prosecute Simmons
Obama general counsel Bob Bauer today sent a second, sharper letter to the Justice Department, directly attacking the Dallas billionaire funding a harsh attack ad, Harold Simmons.
"We reiterate our request that the Department of Justice fulfill its commitment to take prompt action to investigate and to prosecute the American issues Project, and we further request that the Department of Justice investigate and prosecute Howard (sic) Simmons for a knowing and willful violation of the individual aggregate contribution limits," he wrote.
He called the group's activities "patently illegal."
Bauer made the case that Simmons' group fulfilling its a real nonprofit charter because it hasn't spent any money on anything other than attacking Obama.
The American Issues Project released a statement responding to the letter.
"Having failed in its attempts to get our legal, factual and fully-supported ad off the air, Barack Obama's campaign now wants to put our donors in prison for exercising their right to free speech," said Ed Martin, the group's president. "These over-the-top bullying tactics are reminiscent of the kind of censorship one would see in a Stalinist dictatorship, with the only difference being that those guys generally had to wait until they were in power to throw people who disagreed with them into jail."
The group said its ad would continue to air through the end of the Democratic National Convention. Simmons has spent almost $3 million to air the ad, which can be seen on the group's site.
A spokeswoman for the Justice Department, Laura Sweeney, had no comment on the second letter.
It's worth noting that this isn't the first time Bauer has called for criminal investigations and prosecutions into the donors to independent groups critical of Obama, including one supporting John Edwards and another supporting Hillary Rodham Clinton. His words did have the effect of scaring their donors and consultants, but haven't yet appeared to result in any prosecution.
Rick Hasen has some more thoughts on the law, suggesting that Simmons, at worst, will face fines after it's too late to matter.
<a href="http://www.politico.com/blogs/bensmith/0808/Obama_camp_Prosecute_Simmons.html">Speak the truth about Obama, risk being thrown in jail</a>
Obama camp: Prosecute Simmons
Obama general counsel Bob Bauer today sent a second, sharper letter to the Justice Department, directly attacking the Dallas billionaire funding a harsh attack ad, Harold Simmons.
"We reiterate our request that the Department of Justice fulfill its commitment to take prompt action to investigate and to prosecute the American issues Project, and we further request that the Department of Justice investigate and prosecute Howard (sic) Simmons for a knowing and willful violation of the individual aggregate contribution limits," he wrote.
He called the group's activities "patently illegal."
Bauer made the case that Simmons' group fulfilling its a real nonprofit charter because it hasn't spent any money on anything other than attacking Obama.
The American Issues Project released a statement responding to the letter.
"Having failed in its attempts to get our legal, factual and fully-supported ad off the air, Barack Obama's campaign now wants to put our donors in prison for exercising their right to free speech," said Ed Martin, the group's president. "These over-the-top bullying tactics are reminiscent of the kind of censorship one would see in a Stalinist dictatorship, with the only difference being that those guys generally had to wait until they were in power to throw people who disagreed with them into jail."
The group said its ad would continue to air through the end of the Democratic National Convention. Simmons has spent almost $3 million to air the ad, which can be seen on the group's site.
A spokeswoman for the Justice Department, Laura Sweeney, had no comment on the second letter.
It's worth noting that this isn't the first time Bauer has called for criminal investigations and prosecutions into the donors to independent groups critical of Obama, including one supporting John Edwards and another supporting Hillary Rodham Clinton. His words did have the effect of scaring their donors and consultants, but haven't yet appeared to result in any prosecution.
Rick Hasen has some more thoughts on the law, suggesting that Simmons, at worst, will face fines after it's too late to matter.
FairEconomist_IHB
New member
I'm sorry you have a problem with campaign contribution limits but the Supreme Court has ruled them constitutional. I'm quite content with campaign contribution limitations because otherwise you risk monopoly power over media being used to take over politically (think Berlusconi, Thaksin, or Putin). It can happen here. Campaign contribution limits allow ordinary people to be heard over the din billionaires can generate by their vast contributions and that's a very good thing.
Nice try at spinning the truth, but it's about as factual as your claims in the Iraq thread.
This is a blatant attempt to ignore the First Amendment whenever that free speech says something bad about Obama. He actually managed to get the documents from the Annenberg Challenge suppressed until yesterday in an attempt to prevent people from finding out about the depth of his connections to <a href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bill_Ayers#Radical_history">William Ayers</a>.
Obama is showing that he will do anything to prevent the truth from getting out.
This much is obvious.
But there is a larger issue. If Obama is elected President, will he appoint an Attorney General who will carry out politically-motivated prosecutions like the one he is now demanding? I suppose we can't know for sure, but why wouldn't he? If he demands criminal prosecution of free speech that opposes his political interests when he's a candidate, why wouldn't he order it as President?
This is a blatant attempt to ignore the First Amendment whenever that free speech says something bad about Obama. He actually managed to get the documents from the Annenberg Challenge suppressed until yesterday in an attempt to prevent people from finding out about the depth of his connections to <a href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bill_Ayers#Radical_history">William Ayers</a>.
Obama is showing that he will do anything to prevent the truth from getting out.
This much is obvious.
But there is a larger issue. If Obama is elected President, will he appoint an Attorney General who will carry out politically-motivated prosecutions like the one he is now demanding? I suppose we can't know for sure, but why wouldn't he? If he demands criminal prosecution of free speech that opposes his political interests when he's a candidate, why wouldn't he order it as President?
FairEconomist_IHB
New member
Obama has made it clear that he opposes end-runs around campaign finance laws on *both* sides. He has essentially shut down 527s on the *Democratic* side by telling contributors not to contribute to them, and they have almost had to shut down as a result. It's basically unprecedented for any politician to act to prevent smears of his *opponent* but he's done it, backing up his traditional, principled, and effective support of good governance in general.
OTOH, McCain has no problem with Bush's outrageous politicization of the Justice Department, so there's every reason to expect a McCain administration to continue politically motivated hirings for civil service position and selective prosecution of political opponents. If you want a fair Justice Department, vote Obama.
OTOH, McCain has no problem with Bush's outrageous politicization of the Justice Department, so there's every reason to expect a McCain administration to continue politically motivated hirings for civil service position and selective prosecution of political opponents. If you want a fair Justice Department, vote Obama.
Nude_IHB
New member
[quote author="FairEconomist" date=1219869042]...McCain has no problem with Bush's outrageous politicization of the Justice Department...</blockquote>
Got a link proving your claim as fact? Something like a speech by McCain expressing this opinion?
One more question: Are you as outraged at the amount of money George Soros has dumped into 527's since 2003 as you are about Simmons or is the "din billionaires can generate" acceptable when it benefits your candidate?
Got a link proving your claim as fact? Something like a speech by McCain expressing this opinion?
One more question: Are you as outraged at the amount of money George Soros has dumped into 527's since 2003 as you are about Simmons or is the "din billionaires can generate" acceptable when it benefits your candidate?
EvaLSeraphim_IHB
New member
Actually, Obama has asked the 527s to sit this one out, <a href="http://tpmelectioncentral.talkingpointsmemo.com/2008/06/yet_another_demaligned_outside.php">including one to which Soros gave money.</a> McCain has not done so for the Swift Boat group.
bltserv_IHB
New member
Hey Winex.
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/rick-hasen/is-the-american-issues-pr_b_121512.html
So the old swiftboat ideas ride again. American Issues Project.
If you read something other than your spoon fed propaganda.
You would find Ayers and Obama both were on a neighborhood
association together in Chicago.
"For a time, Mr. Obama was on the board with Mr. Ayers, though he no longer has a formal association with the group. At the debate, he described Mr. Ayers as "a guy who lives in my neighborhood," but "not somebody who I exchange ideas from on a regular basis." Mr. Obama said he was being unjustly linked to "somebody who engaged in detestable acts 40 years ago, when Obama was 8 years old."
You need to work a little harder.
Maybe put on your white costume and hood. Then take some pictures with you holding a noose.
Post those. I think you would get more respect from some of us here.
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/rick-hasen/is-the-american-issues-pr_b_121512.html
So the old swiftboat ideas ride again. American Issues Project.
If you read something other than your spoon fed propaganda.
You would find Ayers and Obama both were on a neighborhood
association together in Chicago.
"For a time, Mr. Obama was on the board with Mr. Ayers, though he no longer has a formal association with the group. At the debate, he described Mr. Ayers as "a guy who lives in my neighborhood," but "not somebody who I exchange ideas from on a regular basis." Mr. Obama said he was being unjustly linked to "somebody who engaged in detestable acts 40 years ago, when Obama was 8 years old."
You need to work a little harder.
Maybe put on your white costume and hood. Then take some pictures with you holding a noose.
Post those. I think you would get more respect from some of us here.
BMP 309_IHB
New member
[quote author="WINEX" date=1219814282]<a href="http://www.breitbart.com/article.php?id=D92PL7400&show_article=1">The truth must remain unspoken</a>
Link fixed.</blockquote>
Winex, you are a head of the ball game...This will be brought up more and get more attention in the upcoming weeks/months.
Link fixed.</blockquote>
Winex, you are a head of the ball game...This will be brought up more and get more attention in the upcoming weeks/months.
acpme_IHB
New member
that story is really a stretch. two people who happen to live in the same community, happen to be in the same community organizations. shocker. somehow that ties them together socially, politically, and ideologically? prominent people tend to know other prominent people from all sorts of circles. this is as much nonsense as the attempt to tie the bush's to the bin ladens or drudging up some 20 yr old picture of rumsfeld shaking hands with saddam. all irrelevant.
God forbid kevin bacon ever does something heinous or none of us will ever be able to run for office.
God forbid kevin bacon ever does something heinous or none of us will ever be able to run for office.
Nude_IHB
New member
[quote author="EvaLSeraphim" date=1219875100]Actually, Obama has asked the 527s to sit this one out, <a href="http://tpmelectioncentral.talkingpointsmemo.com/2008/06/yet_another_demaligned_outside.php">including one to which Soros gave money.</a> McCain has not done so for the Swift Boat group.</blockquote>
Great, but what does that have to do with either of the questions I asked?
Great, but what does that have to do with either of the questions I asked?
[quote author="bltserv" date=1219880200]Hey Winex.
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/rick-hasen/is-the-american-issues-pr_b_121512.html
So the old swiftboat ideas ride again. American Issues Project.
If you read something other than your spoon fed propaganda.
You would find Ayers and Obama both were on a neighborhood
association together in Chicago.
"For a time, Mr. Obama was on the board with Mr. Ayers, though he no longer has a formal association with the group. At the debate, he described Mr. Ayers as "a guy who lives in my neighborhood," but "not somebody who I exchange ideas from on a regular basis." Mr. Obama said he was being unjustly linked to "somebody who engaged in detestable acts 40 years ago, when Obama was 8 years old."
You need to work a little harder.
Maybe put on your white costume and hood. Then take some pictures with you holding a noose.
Post those. I think you would get more respect from some of us here.</blockquote>
BLTSERV, your stupidity would be quite amusing if your delusions weren't so dangerous. (Before anyone cries about the tone of this post, please see the KKK inferences about me in the post I am responding to)
You talk about spoon fed propaganda, yet you site a link to Huffingtonpost in defense of your simplistic delusions.
Though I haven't wasted the effort or bandwidth necessary to read the tripe you linked to, I feel relatively confident that you are so obtuse that you fail to realize what is happening around you.
Both Obama and Ayers worked together on the Annenberg Challenge from 1995 through 2002.
Ayers held fund raisers for Obama in his own home in 1995 when Obama launched his political career.
This isn't just "a guy who lives in my neighborhood, but not somebody who I exchange ideas with on a regular basis" William Ayers was the leader of the Weather Underground. He was involved in the bombing of the New York City police headquarters in 1970, the US Capitol Building in 1971, and the Pentagon in 1972.
After 9/11/2001 (after working side by side with Obama for over 6 years) Ayers was quoted by the New York Times as saying "I don't regret setting bombs. I feel we didn't do enough."
No one is claiming that Obama was a member of the Weather Underground when he was a child. (But it should be noted that Obama was 11 when the Weather Underground bombed the Pentagon, not 8. So it's obvious that Obama can't even be honest here) But he was working side by side with Ayers when Ayers said that he didn't regret setting bombs and didn't go far enough. Regardless of Obama's lack of personal involvement of the terrorist activities his friend William Ayers engaged in, any objective person can not help but to question Obama's judgement. If Osama bin Laden approached me 15 years from now and offered to help me raise funds for a run at elective office, I'd deck the son of a bitch. The idea of accepting the offer and working among side him for 7 years even after he makes wistful statements about wishing that he was a more competent terrorist in the aftermath of the most deadly terrorist act in history on my own country's soil is incomprehensible.
This would be bad enough in isolation, but in the immediate aftermath of 9/11, it's even more despicable.
Beyond the simple fact that you are a friggin' idiot, I'm puzzled why you brought up the KKK when I mentioned that Obama is friends with domestic terrorists. You do realize that Ayers is white, don't you? (I have to ask, because, well, you are pretty stupid) Were you confused about Ayers race based on Obama's associations with black militant radicals?
Of course this all sad situation is made worse when Obama shows that even the First Amendment can't stand in the way of his lust for power.
So, given that Ayers isn't simply a "guy from Obama's neighborhood", one can only conclude that Obama is either incredibly obtuse and shouldn't be put in a position of power, or that there are serious character issues that he is trying to hide.
Given his supposed surprise about the racists beliefs of Reverend Jeremiah Wright after spending 20 years in his church, I believe the problem is that there are character issues that he is trying to obscure.
But whether my beliefs are on the mark or not, this is not a person who should be in a position of power. Obama is a very dangerous man.
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/rick-hasen/is-the-american-issues-pr_b_121512.html
So the old swiftboat ideas ride again. American Issues Project.
If you read something other than your spoon fed propaganda.
You would find Ayers and Obama both were on a neighborhood
association together in Chicago.
"For a time, Mr. Obama was on the board with Mr. Ayers, though he no longer has a formal association with the group. At the debate, he described Mr. Ayers as "a guy who lives in my neighborhood," but "not somebody who I exchange ideas from on a regular basis." Mr. Obama said he was being unjustly linked to "somebody who engaged in detestable acts 40 years ago, when Obama was 8 years old."
You need to work a little harder.
Maybe put on your white costume and hood. Then take some pictures with you holding a noose.
Post those. I think you would get more respect from some of us here.</blockquote>
BLTSERV, your stupidity would be quite amusing if your delusions weren't so dangerous. (Before anyone cries about the tone of this post, please see the KKK inferences about me in the post I am responding to)
You talk about spoon fed propaganda, yet you site a link to Huffingtonpost in defense of your simplistic delusions.
Though I haven't wasted the effort or bandwidth necessary to read the tripe you linked to, I feel relatively confident that you are so obtuse that you fail to realize what is happening around you.
Both Obama and Ayers worked together on the Annenberg Challenge from 1995 through 2002.
Ayers held fund raisers for Obama in his own home in 1995 when Obama launched his political career.
This isn't just "a guy who lives in my neighborhood, but not somebody who I exchange ideas with on a regular basis" William Ayers was the leader of the Weather Underground. He was involved in the bombing of the New York City police headquarters in 1970, the US Capitol Building in 1971, and the Pentagon in 1972.
After 9/11/2001 (after working side by side with Obama for over 6 years) Ayers was quoted by the New York Times as saying "I don't regret setting bombs. I feel we didn't do enough."
No one is claiming that Obama was a member of the Weather Underground when he was a child. (But it should be noted that Obama was 11 when the Weather Underground bombed the Pentagon, not 8. So it's obvious that Obama can't even be honest here) But he was working side by side with Ayers when Ayers said that he didn't regret setting bombs and didn't go far enough. Regardless of Obama's lack of personal involvement of the terrorist activities his friend William Ayers engaged in, any objective person can not help but to question Obama's judgement. If Osama bin Laden approached me 15 years from now and offered to help me raise funds for a run at elective office, I'd deck the son of a bitch. The idea of accepting the offer and working among side him for 7 years even after he makes wistful statements about wishing that he was a more competent terrorist in the aftermath of the most deadly terrorist act in history on my own country's soil is incomprehensible.
This would be bad enough in isolation, but in the immediate aftermath of 9/11, it's even more despicable.
Beyond the simple fact that you are a friggin' idiot, I'm puzzled why you brought up the KKK when I mentioned that Obama is friends with domestic terrorists. You do realize that Ayers is white, don't you? (I have to ask, because, well, you are pretty stupid) Were you confused about Ayers race based on Obama's associations with black militant radicals?
Of course this all sad situation is made worse when Obama shows that even the First Amendment can't stand in the way of his lust for power.
So, given that Ayers isn't simply a "guy from Obama's neighborhood", one can only conclude that Obama is either incredibly obtuse and shouldn't be put in a position of power, or that there are serious character issues that he is trying to hide.
Given his supposed surprise about the racists beliefs of Reverend Jeremiah Wright after spending 20 years in his church, I believe the problem is that there are character issues that he is trying to obscure.
But whether my beliefs are on the mark or not, this is not a person who should be in a position of power. Obama is a very dangerous man.
[quote author="BMP 309" date=1219883951][quote author="WINEX" date=1219814282]<a href="http://www.breitbart.com/article.php?id=D92PL7400&show_article=1">The truth must remain unspoken</a>
Link fixed.</blockquote>
Winex, you are a head of the ball game...This will be brought up more and get more attention in the upcoming weeks/months.</blockquote>
Thanks BMP309. I was going to wait to mention the Ayers connection, but given the attack on First Amendment rights and the threats of imprisonment for those who commit "thought crime", I felt it was necessary to bring this issue up now.
Link fixed.</blockquote>
Winex, you are a head of the ball game...This will be brought up more and get more attention in the upcoming weeks/months.</blockquote>
Thanks BMP309. I was going to wait to mention the Ayers connection, but given the attack on First Amendment rights and the threats of imprisonment for those who commit "thought crime", I felt it was necessary to bring this issue up now.
FairEconomist_IHB
New member
Obama's just asking the Justice department to enforce the law of the land, a law which has been confirmed *not* to violate First Amendment rights. Do you have a problem with the Justice Department enforcing constitutional laws?
green_cactus_IHB
New member
It's interesting how Michelle Malkin's "outrage" gets channeled here. How exactly is this infringing on the 1st Amendment. I please, don't just call me a janitor in your answer - make your point on why this is the case.
bltserv_IHB
New member
Winex
Lets check those facts of yours again.
http://blog.washingtonpost.com/fact-checker/2008/02/obamas_weatherman_connection.html
You are still getting spoon fed propaganda. The Ayers link is so weak you?re embarrassing
yourself and ruining any credibility you have.
"Obama was 8. No he was 11". Come on man. Lets work that Muslim school stuff or his drug
use. That at least is a first hand issue and not guilt by simple association.
Sure hope you dont make a living as an attorney.
Do you have a bomb shelter in your back yard and a tin foil hat collection as well ?
Lets check those facts of yours again.
http://blog.washingtonpost.com/fact-checker/2008/02/obamas_weatherman_connection.html
You are still getting spoon fed propaganda. The Ayers link is so weak you?re embarrassing
yourself and ruining any credibility you have.
"Obama was 8. No he was 11". Come on man. Lets work that Muslim school stuff or his drug
use. That at least is a first hand issue and not guilt by simple association.
Sure hope you dont make a living as an attorney.
Do you have a bomb shelter in your back yard and a tin foil hat collection as well ?