4,820 CalPERS RETIREES RECEIVE ANNUAL PENSIONS IN EXCESS OF $100,000

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norcaljeff_IHB

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<a href="http://www.flashreport.org/featured-columns-library0b.php?faID=2009042908422871">4820 CALPERS Retirees have pensions over $100K</a>



As of May, 2008, there were 4,820 CalPERS retirees receiving annual pensions in excess of $100,000. That didn?t include government retirees in 80 other plans in California?judges, UC, STRS, charter cities, and 1937 Act counties. About half of these retirees were public safety workers: cops, firefighters, prison guards. The remaining half includes former city managers, assistant managers, county executives, district attorneys, engineers, finance officers, personnel directors, computer scientists, and physicists.



Since May 2008, more than 120 new retirees have joined the ?$100,000 Club? ? each month - every month. That?s been going on for the last 12 months ? more than 1,500 have joined that well-paid retirement group ; this rate of increase will accelerate as droves of retired public safety workers who are now in the $90,000 to $100,000 range receive annual cost of living increases.
 
I was doing research on the proposition and was not able to reach a clear cut conclusion on whether it's good or bad. If I understand it correctly, the proposition limits government spending at the same time extends the tax increase we just got stuck with for a couple of years.



My question is that suppose the proposition doesn't pass, which means the tax increase does not get extended, what's to prevent the politicians from passing another tax increase in a couple of years? Without the this proposition, it looks like government spending can just continue as it has before. I read that there are loopholes to the proposition. Can you point out any serious ones?



If you can help me reach a conclusion, that will be great. I was initially against the proposition from reading the few sentences describing it, but upon doing more research, I am not so sure anymore.
 
[quote author="norcaljeff" date=1241357021]<a href="http://www.flashreport.org/featured-columns-library0b.php?faID=2009042908422871">4820 CALPERS Retirees have pensions over $100K</a>



As of May, 2008, there were 4,820 CalPERS retirees receiving annual pensions in excess of $100,000. That didn?t include government retirees in 80 other plans in California?judges, UC, STRS, charter cities, and 1937 Act counties. About half of these retirees were public safety workers: cops, firefighters, prison guards. The remaining half includes former city managers, assistant managers, county executives, district attorneys, engineers, finance officers, personnel directors, computer scientists, and physicists.



Since May 2008, more than 120 new retirees have joined the ?$100,000 Club? ? each month - every month. That?s been going on for the last 12 months ? more than 1,500 have joined that well-paid retirement group ; this rate of increase will accelerate as droves of retired public safety workers who are now in the $90,000 to $100,000 range receive annual cost of living increases.</blockquote>


I remember some people mentioning this is where a lot (if not most) of our tax dollars go, and the expense is only growing. It really irks me since I hear over and over how a lot of government workers only really put in 3 ~ 4 hours worth of work a day. No pressure, no reason to be more efficient, and low accountability. In the mean time, our tax keeps on getting raised and we have to work harder to maintain our standard of living. For public safety workers, it's more understandable. However, there should be a limit. Office jobs? We should not pay nearly as much.
 
I fail to see the spending cap. The spending limit is set at the average of the previous few years revenue level plus growth. So the spending limit will be set at current spending levels if 1A passes. If it falls below, they raise taxes. If we get couple years of windfall, the spending limit starts to jump up wildly.



It's like a family saying their spending limit this year is the average of what they made the last two years. There are a lot families finding out that their income wasn't as solid as they thought. Just like the State.
 
[quote author="MacInThebox" date=1241395761]I was doing research on the proposition and was not able to reach a clear cut conclusion on whether it's good or bad. If I understand it correctly, the proposition limits government spending at the same time extends the tax increase we just got stuck with for a couple of years.



My question is that suppose the proposition doesn't pass, which means the tax increase does not get extended, what's to prevent the politicians from passing another tax increase in a couple of years? Without the this proposition, it looks like government spending can just continue as it has before. I read that there are loopholes to the proposition. Can you point out any serious ones?



If you can help me reach a conclusion, that will be great. I was initially against the proposition from reading the few sentences describing it, but upon doing more research, I am not so sure anymore.</blockquote>


It's what CA has become, putting each propsition in a catch 22 type situation. Cap politician spending but you then have to agree to a long term tax increase. It's nuts. Why can't we cut spending and cut taxes, or freeze taxes. It's an addiction they need to get off of. This is what Congressman Tim McClintock says about Prop 1A:



Prop 1A: Extend the Tax Increases. NO. This is the fig leaf that hides certain deficiencies suffered by the legislators who caved into pressure for the biggest tax increase in California's history. <strong>This measure EXTENDS the tax increases for up to two ADDITIONAL years in exchange for a spending limit that doesn't limit spending. </strong>The "spending limit" is laughable ? it requires placing "unanticipated revenues" into a special fund that is then to be spent for a variety of additional purposes including education, debt service and health care. And since all funds are interchangeable, this merely allows funds spent for one purpose to be shifted for another. The bottom line: If you were against the tax increase, you're against Prop. 1A.



Here's a link to what he says on the rest of them: http://blog.tommcclintock.com/2009/05/05/mcclintock-on-the-propositions-2/
 
http://www.examiner.com/x-9382-Mari...ve-annual-pensions-of-100k-or-more--for-life-



Paste and read more of this disgusting story. Break the Unions and slash the pensions. These guys get lifetime medical worth a cool million in their lifetime on top of the 6 figure income. I hope that the state goes BK as the Feds will break up this waste. As a voter i will continue to vote against new taxes to protect these overpaid workers. California is circling the drain and the legislature and the Governor is to blame.
 
[quote author="Geotpf" date=1242306187]You guys move to Irvine for good schools.



Yet you say you are going to vote against funding them properly.



Hmm...</blockquote>
They want their cake and eat it too. I thought the high Mello Roos took care of all the schools in Irvine.
 
The days of Defined Benefits are OVER.

We all must live in the world of Defined Contribution.



Its going to hit all of these groups.

Police, Fire, Teachers, Prison Guards, All CalPERS.

The Gravey Train is going to come to an end.

We all live in California and its in trouble.

What makes these people exempt from the cuts we all face ?



Everybody needs to live like the rest of us. You are given a contribution

and how you invest it or manage it is your affair.

No more gravy train at the public expense for LIFE and up to 90% pay at retirement for life.



When the State Fire Fighters Union said that people will die in fires unless

we pass those propositions on Tuesday. Thats the last straw for me.



"Let me tell you this is a matter of life and death," said Pat McOsker, California Professional Firefighters. "Property will be lost, memories will be lost and people will die."
 
[quote author="bltserv" date=1242334174]The days of Defined Benefits are OVER.

We all must live in the world of Defined Contribution.



Its going to hit all of these groups.

Police, Fire, Teachers, Prison Guards, All CalPERS.

The Gravey Train is going to come to an end.

We all live in California and its in trouble.

What makes these people exempt from the cuts we all face ?



Everybody needs to live like the rest of us. You are given a contribution

and how you invest it or manage it is your affair.

No more gravy train at the public expense for LIFE and up to 90% pay at retirement for life.



When the State Fire Fighters Union said that people will die in fires unless

we pass those propositions on Tuesday. Thats the last straw for me.



"Let me tell you this is a matter of life and death," said Pat McOsker, California Professional Firefighters. "Property will be lost, memories will be lost and people will die."</blockquote>


Well, they aren't lying. If the propositions fail, fire fighters (and teachers, and cops, and...) will be laid off. That will hurt response times. In a fire, minutes matter. People will die in fires that would be saved if those fire fighters were not laid off.



The whole premise of this thread is that cops and teachers and fire fighters are paid too much. (A pension is merely deferred compensation.) Really? You folks REALLY think cops and teachers and fire fighters are paid too much?
 
The real question is the value of public goods. I have NEVER seen the value of a policeman, FF, or teacher broken down into economic terms. Has anyone else?



I would suspect that there is a fairly wide variation in the value of individuals, this is particularly true of teachers as countless studies have demonstrated. The general lack of progress on crime and education, while ever increasing amounts of tax dollars are poured into these sectors, is a large factor in the unwillingness of taxpayers to devote more resources.
 
[quote author="Geotpf" date=1242336062][quote author="bltserv" date=1242334174]The days of Defined Benefits are OVER.

We all must live in the world of Defined Contribution.



Its going to hit all of these groups.

Police, Fire, Teachers, Prison Guards, All CalPERS.

The Gravey Train is going to come to an end.

We all live in California and its in trouble.

What makes these people exempt from the cuts we all face ?



Everybody needs to live like the rest of us. You are given a contribution

and how you invest it or manage it is your affair.

No more gravy train at the public expense for LIFE and up to 90% pay at retirement for life.



When the State Fire Fighters Union said that people will die in fires unless

we pass those propositions on Tuesday. Thats the last straw for me.



"Let me tell you this is a matter of life and death," said Pat McOsker, California Professional Firefighters. "Property will be lost, memories will be lost and people will die."</blockquote>


Well, they aren't lying. If the propositions fail, fire fighters (and teachers, and cops, and...) will be laid off. That will hurt response times. In a fire, minutes matter. People will die in fires that would be saved if those fire fighters were not laid off.



The whole premise of this thread is that cops and teachers and fire fighters are paid too much. (A pension is merely deferred compensation.) Really? You folks REALLY think cops and teachers and fire fighters are paid too much?</blockquote>


Dont worry. All those sneeky propositions WILL FAIL. The Taxpayers have had it with the Public Employees and their level of entitlement. Its been years since the private sector has

given employees Pensions or what is called "Defined Benefits". 99% of working Americans are given. Defined Contributions. Like 401K, Matching Retirement Contributions, Medical Benefits.

But open ended Medical and 80-90% Pay for Life ? Lets get real.



Does it seem fair and good business to pay a public employee grossly more than the private sector ? And then when the cuts come that we have all had to face. They threaten us with death ? How about we fire all of them and let them have their jobs back for 50% of pay.

They are here to SERVE the public. Not order us to give them money under threat.



Look at what happened to the Air Traffic Controllers once upon a time. They played that game and got fired for playing hardball. It can happen again. EVERYBODY is replaceable.
 
[quote author="usctrojanman29" date=1242309766][quote author="Geotpf" date=1242306187]You guys move to Irvine for good schools.



Yet you say you are going to vote against funding them properly.



Hmm...</blockquote>
They want their cake and eat it too. I thought the high Mello Roos took care of all the schools in Irvine.</blockquote>


Mello Roos pays for up front infrastructure improvements. Schools can be part of that. But it is just paying for the construction of the schools, not any of the ongoing operations.
 
[quote author="bltserv" date=1242344354][quote author="Geotpf" date=1242336062][quote author="bltserv" date=1242334174]The days of Defined Benefits are OVER.

We all must live in the world of Defined Contribution.



Its going to hit all of these groups.

Police, Fire, Teachers, Prison Guards, All CalPERS.

The Gravey Train is going to come to an end.

We all live in California and its in trouble.

What makes these people exempt from the cuts we all face ?



Everybody needs to live like the rest of us. You are given a contribution

and how you invest it or manage it is your affair.

No more gravy train at the public expense for LIFE and up to 90% pay at retirement for life.



When the State Fire Fighters Union said that people will die in fires unless

we pass those propositions on Tuesday. Thats the last straw for me.



"Let me tell you this is a matter of life and death," said Pat McOsker, California Professional Firefighters. "Property will be lost, memories will be lost and people will die."</blockquote>


Well, they aren't lying. If the propositions fail, fire fighters (and teachers, and cops, and...) will be laid off. That will hurt response times. In a fire, minutes matter. People will die in fires that would be saved if those fire fighters were not laid off.



The whole premise of this thread is that cops and teachers and fire fighters are paid too much. (A pension is merely deferred compensation.) Really? You folks REALLY think cops and teachers and fire fighters are paid too much?</blockquote>


Dont worry. All those sneeky propositions WILL FAIL. The Taxpayers have had it with the Public Employees and their level of entitlement. Its been years since the private sector has

given employees Pensions or what is called "Defined Benefits". 99% of working Americans are given. Defined Contributions. Like 401K, Matching Retirement Contributions, Medical Benefits.

But open ended Medical and 80-90% Pay for Life ? Lets get real.



Does it seem fair and good business to pay a public employee grossly more than the private sector ? And then when the cuts come that we have all had to face. They threaten us with death ? How about we fire all of them and let them have their jobs back for 50% of pay.

They are here to SERVE the public. Not order us to give them money under threat.



Look at what happened to the Air Traffic Controllers once upon a time. They played that game and got fired for playing hardball. It can happen again. EVERYBODY is replaceable.</blockquote>


So you do, in fact, think cops, teachers, and fire fighters make too much money. Fair enough.
 
[quote author="Geotpf" date=1242357826][quote author="bltserv" date=1242344354][quote author="Geotpf" date=1242336062][quote author="bltserv" date=1242334174]The days of Defined Benefits are OVER.

We all must live in the world of Defined Contribution.



Its going to hit all of these groups.

Police, Fire, Teachers, Prison Guards, All CalPERS.

The Gravey Train is going to come to an end.

We all live in California and its in trouble.

What makes these people exempt from the cuts we all face ?



Everybody needs to live like the rest of us. You are given a contribution

and how you invest it or manage it is your affair.

No more gravy train at the public expense for LIFE and up to 90% pay at retirement for life.



When the State Fire Fighters Union said that people will die in fires unless

we pass those propositions on Tuesday. Thats the last straw for me.



"Let me tell you this is a matter of life and death," said Pat McOsker, California Professional Firefighters. "Property will be lost, memories will be lost and people will die."</blockquote>


Well, they aren't lying. If the propositions fail, fire fighters (and teachers, and cops, and...) will be laid off. That will hurt response times. In a fire, minutes matter. People will die in fires that would be saved if those fire fighters were not laid off.



The whole premise of this thread is that cops and teachers and fire fighters are paid too much. (A pension is merely deferred compensation.) Really? You folks REALLY think cops and teachers and fire fighters are paid too much?</blockquote>


Dont worry. All those sneeky propositions WILL FAIL. The Taxpayers have had it with the Public Employees and their level of entitlement. Its been years since the private sector has

given employees Pensions or what is called "Defined Benefits". 99% of working Americans are given. Defined Contributions. Like 401K, Matching Retirement Contributions, Medical Benefits.

But open ended Medical and 80-90% Pay for Life ? Lets get real.



Does it seem fair and good business to pay a public employee grossly more than the private sector ? And then when the cuts come that we have all had to face. They threaten us with death ? How about we fire all of them and let them have their jobs back for 50% of pay.

They are here to SERVE the public. Not order us to give them money under threat.



Look at what happened to the Air Traffic Controllers once upon a time. They played that game and got fired for playing hardball. It can happen again. EVERYBODY is replaceable.</blockquote>


So you do, in fact, think cops, teachers, and fire fighters make too much money. Fair enough.</blockquote>


Yes i think the cops and firefighters and teachers are paid to much when they retire. In fact OCF can't hire new firefighters because they have to much legacy costs.
 
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