Irvine Great Park Property Tax Question

I like to keep sharing a study published by Irvine Housing Blog a long time ago, about the intrinsic value of several house attributes; everything else being the same, 3rd story is the most negative value wise, # of bedrooms is neutral if sq footage is the same, and single story and extra bathroom are the most positive.
Irvine/South Orange County has plenty of land for new builds so there is no reason to build 3rd story homes except builder greed. The ongoing downturn is a good lesson for developers not become so greedy and build these abominations and end up holding the bag.
 
I like to keep sharing a study published by Irvine Housing Blog a long time ago, about the intrinsic value of several house attributes; everything else being the same, 3rd story is the most negative value wise, # of bedrooms is neutral if sq footage is the same, and single story and extra bathroom are the most positive.
Irvine/South Orange County has plenty of land for new builds so there is no reason to build 3rd story homes except builder greed. The ongoing downturn is a good lesson for developers not become so greedy and build these abominations and end up holding the bag.

Very well put. When the market is hot everything sells including garbage properties but when the cools the garage sits and ultimately takes a huge hit. One of my job as a realtor is to explain how important the concept of exit strategy is to my buyers because eventually that home will be sold. I tell my clients, the better they do the better that I do.
 
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Not just 3 vs 2, same would go for 2 vs 1. I personally prefer 1 story vs 2. Too bad, Irvine doesnt have that many options for new single story home.

Aside from early built area like Cadence & Pavilion Park, GP is too densely built with mostly 3 level homes. This turns off buyers like me. Instead of paying extra GP tax, i would use the money for condos in area like Portola Spring. They are little more expensive but have better appreciation should I sell in the future.
 
While I agree that single story homes have better values than 2-story homes, I still prefer 2-story homes over single story homes. I just like having the bedrooms upstairs more, separate from the living/family room, kitchen, and dining room.
 
This was insightful. I had no idea about the 3 story floor plans and it makes sense and answered my internal question.
At least from looking at the new builds in City of Cypress Belmont Community, the 3 story floor plans with the same sqft as the 2 story floor plan was 20-40k cheaper. I wondered why it would be cheaper if the living space was the same. I also did not know about stairs being part of the sqft so that was something I learned as well.
Never thought about hauling groceries or forgetting keys in the 3rd floor as well. Thanks for the information!
 
This was insightful. I had no idea about the 3 story floor plans and it makes sense and answered my internal question.
At least from looking at the new builds in City of Cypress Belmont Community, the 3 story floor plans with the same sqft as the 2 story floor plan was 20-40k cheaper. I wondered why it would be cheaper if the living space was the same. I also did not know about stairs being part of the sqft so that was something I learned as well.
Never thought about hauling groceries or forgetting keys in the 3rd floor as well. Thanks for the information!

I think most buyers don't think about those things and when they see pricing that is lower for the same size home that's 3-levels vs 2-levels they think that it's a good bargain. Remember, there is a reason why those 3-level homes are priced lower than 2-level homes of the same size because at the end of the day you get what you pay for.
 
There is no reason. Some people just like to push their own personal preferences on others. I would have no issue living in a home like this.

Allegedly they are harder to sell. Which just makes me laugh and laugh. No homes have a hard time selling in Irvine.
It's not always like that. A house is somewhere to live, number one. But if you plan on reselling it, then it's an investment too and you have to think how u will compete with other resales. Irvine is nearly built out so it will be resale vs resale. If there is anything that u r using to get a price reduction now, WILL come back when u resell it. The market we just had is a once in a lifetime event. I've been thru several booms and busts and this one isn't coming our way again unless rates are extremely low, highly unlikely.

There was a guy on here who bought a three story place and ended up renting it out. I can't remember his name. We tried to warn him of the perils of a three story but he ended up buying it anyway and regretted it. Maybe he's still here and has some thoughts?

I always have an idea of what issues will come up when I try to sell it and factor that in when I buy. So when u go to sell, u NEED the least negatives possible and three story is a big negative, imo (unless u have a prime view). Irvine is great. But within Irvine u will still have to compete with other places: newer/older, quiet/street noise, two story/three story, sq footage, distance to freeway/shops, taxes/affordability.

Irvine will be mostly resales in the next run. Me........ I rather buy an older or smaller two story home than a newer three story. Maybe not YOU, but a three story will eliminate alot of people with babies and old people who don't want to navigate that many stairs 10 years after they purchase it.

In a big downturn u look to buy the BEST properties at a discount, not the ones with issues for what you see is a bigger discount. In the next run up, those better properties will outperform. Look for view and location and hope to negotiate.
 
To follow up, you're buying in Irvine because u feel it's the best area in the center of the county, right? Of course that will keep values higher than other areas, assuming nothing changes (schools, crime, etc). It will also appreciate the best as those looking to buy will want the better areas. It's the same thing with negative attributes. People will want the least negatives. Conversely, those people in properties with "issues" will put their places up for sale, wanting out. You'll see many more homes for sale (or rent).......... lots of competition.

Do you want to live in a community with a high rate of rentals? That is much more likely to happen with three story units, imo.
 
It's not always like that. A house is somewhere to live, number one. But if you plan on reselling it, then it's an investment too and you have to think how u will compete with other resales. Irvine is nearly built out so it will be resale vs resale. If there is anything that u r using to get a price reduction now, WILL come back when u resell it. The market we just had is a once in a lifetime event. I've been thru several booms and busts and this one isn't coming our way again unless rates are extremely low, highly unlikely.

There was a guy on here who bought a three story place and ended up renting it out. I can't remember his name. We tried to warn him of the perils of a three story but he ended up buying it anyway and regretted it. Maybe he's still here and has some thoughts?

I always have an idea of what issues will come up when I try to sell it and factor that in when I buy. So when u go to sell, u NEED the least negatives possible and three story is a big negative, imo (unless u have a prime view). Irvine is great. But within Irvine u will still have to compete with other places: newer/older, quiet/street noise, two story/three story, sq footage, distance to freeway/shops, taxes/affordability.

Irvine will be mostly resales in the next run. Me........ I rather buy an older or smaller two story home than a newer three story. Maybe not YOU, but a three story will eliminate alot of people with babies and old people who don't want to navigate that many stairs 10 years after they purchase it.

In a big downturn u look to buy the BEST properties at a discount, not the ones with issues for what you see is a bigger discount. In the next run up, those better properties will outperform. Look for view and location and hope to negotiate.
We won't be buying a home as an investment. It will be to have a roof over our heads and stability. We are in our mid 40s and have never owned a home. When we finally buy, it will be our first and last, and we will pass it down to our sons to live in after we are gone (they are disabled and will live with us probably forever).

We like the 3 story homes with the main living area on ground level, bedrooms on 2nd and large bonus room and deck on 3rd. My husband and son have an impressive collection of Lego and Action figures that needs a space so those huge 3rd floor bonus rooms are perfect. I love those floorplans and applaud the builders for using them. There is a massive housing shortage in this country and the solution is to build up, not out. These floor plans make a lot of sense and they use space very efficiently, which I appreciate. Clearly there are enough people who like these homes because they are going up all over Southern CA.

Also, views are overrated. I couldn't care less what is outside my window. It's easy enough to actually go outside to any of the hundreds of parks and trails in Irvine and enjoy the views. The less sun exposure, the better too. Cuts way down on electricity and I like the darkness. The house we rent has a view of cinderblock walls all around the first floor and it hasn't bothered me in the slightest for the last 8 years. The upstairs views are just the houses across the way. It's been fine. We keep the plantation shutters closed all day anyway.
 
To follow up, you're buying in Irvine because u feel it's the best area in the center of the county, right? Of course that will keep values higher than other areas, assuming nothing changes (schools, crime, etc). It will also appreciate the best as those looking to buy will want the better areas. It's the same thing with negative attributes. People will want the least negatives. Conversely, those people in properties with "issues" will put their places up for sale, wanting out. You'll see many more homes for sale (or rent).......... lots of competition.

Do you want to live in a community with a high rate of rentals? That is much more likely to happen with three story units, imo.

We already live in a community with a high number of rentals. We have been renters for our entire adult lives. I have no problem with renters, as I am one. I would never look down on them as neighbors.
 
We won't be buying a home as an investment. It will be to have a roof over our heads and stability. We are in our mid 40s and have never owned a home. When we finally buy, it will be our first and last, and we will pass it down to our sons to live in after we are gone (they are disabled and will live with us probably forever).

We like the 3 story homes with the main living area on ground level, bedrooms on 2nd and large bonus room and deck on 3rd. My husband and son have an impressive collection of Lego and Action figures that needs a space so those huge 3rd floor bonus rooms are perfect. I love those floorplans and applaud the builders for using them. There is a massive housing shortage in this country and the solution is to build up, not out. These floor plans make a lot of sense and they use space very efficiently, which I appreciate. Clearly there are enough people who like these homes because they are going up all over Southern CA.

Also, views are overrated. I couldn't care less what is outside my window. It's easy enough to actually go outside to any of the hundreds of parks and trails in Irvine and enjoy the views. The less sun exposure, the better too. Cuts way down on electricity and I like the darkness. The house we rent has a view of cinderblock walls all around the first floor and it hasn't bothered me in the slightest for the last 8 years. The upstairs views are just the houses across the way. It's been fine. We keep the plantation shutters closed all day anyway.
This is the point Martin and I made. There are two types of 3-story homes.

The first type, which is quite undesirable, is the one like Soria, which has a bedroom and some type of bonus room on the first floor. Then it has kitchen, living/family room on the second floor, and the other bedrooms on the third floor. These will be more difficult to sell.

The second type, which is like Amara 3X, Sierra 2X, or Teresina, which has a bedroom (or den/office), kitchen, living/family room on the first floor. Then it has the other bedrooms on the second floor, with a bonus (with or without deck) on the third floor. This type is actually very good. And this is the one you described above.

Personally, I love to have city view. That's why those Ravello city view lots in Orchard Hills have $1.5M lot premium. Just think about it. $1.5M lot premium.
 
We won't be buying a home as an investment. It will be to have a roof over our heads and stability. We are in our mid 40s and have never owned a home. When we finally buy, it will be our first and last, and we will pass it down to our sons to live in after we are gone (they are disabled and will live with us probably forever).

We like the 3 story homes with the main living area on ground level, bedrooms on 2nd and large bonus room and deck on 3rd. My husband and son have an impressive collection of Lego and Action figures that needs a space so those huge 3rd floor bonus rooms are perfect. I love those floorplans and applaud the builders for using them. There is a massive housing shortage in this country and the solution is to build up, not out. These floor plans make a lot of sense and they use space very efficiently, which I appreciate. Clearly there are enough people who like these homes because they are going up all over Southern CA.
I agree. When 3rd story is just traditional 2nd story plus a bonus room/deck on the 3rd floor, it is an ideal way to get more living space w/o requiring a bigger lot.

But for a forever home, I kind of like the floor plans with downstairs master and secondary bedrooms upstairs with their own bonus room. Unfortunately this kind of floor plan is not efficient as it means the 1st story square footage would be much bigger than 2nd story’s so it is rare to find them in dense areas like Irvine.
 
I agree. When 3rd story is just traditional 2nd story plus a bonus room/deck on the 3rd floor, it is an ideal way to get more living space w/o requiring a bigger lot.

But for a forever home, I kind of like the floor plans with downstairs master and secondary bedrooms upstairs with their own bonus room. Unfortunately this kind of floor plan is not efficient as it means the 1st story square footage would be much bigger than 2nd story’s so it is rare to find them in dense areas like Irvine.
It’s actual not that rare having master suite downstairs. My Fresco Model 3+ has dual master suite bedrooms (one on each floor). If I remember correctly Cielo & Azul have similar design.
 
It’s actual not that rare having master suite downstairs. My Fresco Model 3+ has dual master suite bedrooms (one on each floor). If I remember correctly Cielo & Azul have similar design.
The design at Cielo & Azul is a little bit different. Your Fresco Plan 3+ is a master suite. However, at Cielo & Azul, it has an option of turning a bedroom + den/office into a bedroom with a suite.

The bedroom + den/office option gives you a little walk-in closet for the bedroom, with the den/office having no door and blocked from the bath.

The bedroom + suite option would turn the den/office into the bedroom and the bedroom into a suite with a hallway through the bath between the bedroom and suite. But this option also cuts into the walk-in closet, making it a small closet, half the size of the walk-in closet. This option would work well if you have an adult child still living where (s)he would have his/her workspace.
 
I'll enlist your help when we start looking! Hoping this downturn will finally give us a way in.

I'm ready whenever you are, just ping me when it's time to get started. Also, those 3-level homes where the 3rd level is a bonus room/loft/deck is totally fine to buy from a resale perspective but it should trade a bit lower on a price per SF basis than a 2-level home of the same size because of the additional SF of the 2nd set of stairs. You'll have a handful of floor plans to pick from and you'll see lower pricing in 2023 so being patient will be rewarded with a lower purchase price.
 
I'm ready whenever you are, just ping me when it's time to get started. Also, those 3-level homes where the 3rd level is a bonus room/loft/deck is totally fine to buy from a resale perspective but it should trade a bit lower on a price per SF basis than a 2-level home of the same size because of the additional SF of the 2nd set of stairs. You'll have a handful of floor plans to pick from and you'll see lower pricing in 2023 so being patient will be rewarded with a lower purchase price.
Any chance we will ever see sub $1M pricing on any of these again? That's our limit, really.
 
Any chance we will ever see sub $1M pricing on any of these again? That's our limit, really.

Depends on the square footage of the home. We are currently around $660 per SF in Irvine on the average but that is coming down and will be in the low $600s sometime next year.
 
Depends on the square footage of the home. We are currently around $660 per SF in Irvine on the average but that is coming down and will be in the low $600s sometime next year.
Gotcha. But you said these homes trade for lower per sq ft, right? We are thinking somewhere around 2000-2400 sq feet. 3 or 4 br with a large loft or bonus room. Don't care as much about the actual size as the floorplan being functional. I'm seeing some new construction in GP priced around $450/sq ft for these types of units. But we aren't quite ready to buy yet. Will likely be late 2023 through mid 2024.
 
Gotcha. But you said these homes trade for lower per sq ft, right? We are thinking somewhere around 2000-2400 sq feet. 3 or 4 br with a large loft or bonus room. Don't care as much about the actual size as the floorplan being functional. I'm seeing some new construction in GP priced around $450/sq ft for these types of units. But we aren't quite ready to buy yet. Will likely be late 2023 through mid 2024.

The 3-level detached condos where the 3rd level is a loft/bonus room are currently trading in the low $600s per SF and while the 3-level detached condos where the living area is on the 2nd floor are trading around the mid $500s per SF. If you are seeing prices in the $400s per SF then you are most likely talking about 3-level attached condos with the living area on the 3rd level. Remember that attached condos at the Great Park have total HOA cost in the mid $400 per month or more than 2x the monthly HOA for Great Park detached condos. Attached condos trade at a discount of 10%+ on a price per SF as compared to detached condos.
 
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