Newer Irvine listings with crazy WTF asking prices from equity sellers

[sleepy5136]

One thing that hasn?t been mentioned is the amount of FCBs that are getting loans based off of 40% down payment with East West Bank with adjustable rates. No income check with that bank if you do 40% down. If interest rates ever climb significantly, a lot of those buyers might be forced to sell. But who knows if it will be an issue since they are probably loaded with $$.

Why would FCBs take out a loan? If they need to take out a loan, then they wouldn't be called FCB.

Same reason why you get a loan. Why would u put more money when u can put the minimum and use the remaining money for other investments? And they have it better since they don?t need to have their incomes checked if they do 40% down. FCBs are getting these loans via East West Bank and Cathay.

 

[CalBears96]

One thing that hasn?t been mentioned is the amount of FCBs that are getting loans based off of 40% down payment with East West Bank with adjustable rates. No income check with that bank if you do 40% down. If interest rates ever climb significantly, a lot of those buyers might be forced to sell. But who knows if it will be an issue since they are probably loaded with $$.

Why would FCBs take out a loan? If they need to take out a loan, then they wouldn't be called FCB.

Same reason why you get a loan. Why would u put more money when I can put the minimum and use the remaining money for other investments? And they have it better since they don?t need to have their incomes checked if they do 40% down. FCBs are getting these loans via East West Bank and Cathay.

You realize that FCB stands for Foreign Cash Buyers, yes?

 

[TestingIrvine]

One thing that hasn?t been mentioned is the amount of FCBs that are getting loans based off of 40% down payment with East West Bank with adjustable rates. No income check with that bank if you do 40% down. If interest rates ever climb significantly, a lot of those buyers might be forced to sell. But who knows if it will be an issue since they are probably loaded with $$.

Why would FCBs take out a loan? If they need to take out a loan, then they wouldn't be called FCB.

Lol this is hilarious. FCB has different meaning for University of Spoiled Children. Folks, this is what money can buy for ur kids.  Go Bruin.

For the record Black Knight your troll game is terrible. Try harder next time and improve.

 

[sleepy5136]

One thing that hasn?t been mentioned is the amount of FCBs that are getting loans based off of 40% down payment with East West Bank with adjustable rates. No income check with that bank if you do 40% down. If interest rates ever climb significantly, a lot of those buyers might be forced to sell. But who knows if it will be an issue since they are probably loaded with $$.

Why would FCBs take out a loan? If they need to take out a loan, then they wouldn't be called FCB.

Same reason why you get a loan. Why would u put more money when I can put the minimum and use the remaining money for other investments? And they have it better since they don?t need to have their incomes checked if they do 40% down. FCBs are getting these loans via East West Bank and Cathay.

You realize that FCB stands for Foreign Cash Buyers, yes?

No, FCB stands for Foreign Chinese Buyers AFAIK

 

[CalBears96]

No, FCB stands for Foreign Chinese Buyers AFAIK

irvinehomeowner would so disappointed in you. He practically has it in his sig.

Once you go 3-car garage... your junk can never go back.
3CWG: 3-Car Wide Garage
FCB: Foreign Cash Buyer

 

[sleepy5136]

No, FCB stands for Foreign Chinese Buyers AFAIK

irvinehomeowner would so disappointed in you. He practically has it in his sig.

Once you go 3-car garage... your junk can never go back.
3CWG: 3-Car Wide Garage
FCB: Foreign Cash Buyer

I'm not sure if you checked before, but if you're talking about cash buyers, there aren't that many. But there are a bunch of Mainland Chinese folks that are transferring tons of $$ to scoop up homes here and taking out loans with no income check with 40% down. And also, how many foreign buyers are not Chinese in Irvine? Some areas feel like you live in China.

 

[CalBears96]

Can you look at Orchard Hills for example and tell me how many foreigners are not Chinese? That place literally looks like China. Altair too.

What does that have to do with the term FCB? So if foreigners are Chinese, then it would be just Chinese buyers. Does Foreign Chinese even make sense? As opposed to American Chinese? So then, how can you tell if those buyers are American Chinese or Foreign Chinese?

Point is, FCB stands for Foreign Cash Buyers.

 

[sleepy5136]

Can you look at Orchard Hills for example and tell me how many foreigners are not Chinese? That place literally looks like China. Altair too.

What does that have to do with the term FCB? So if foreigners are Chinese, then it would be just Chinese buyers. Does Foreign Chinese even make sense? As opposed to American Chinese? So then, how can you tell if those buyers are American Chinese or Foreign Chinese?

Point is, FCB stands for Foreign Cash Buyers.

Your definition of FCB is Cash. Mine is Chinese. Agree to disagree.

 

[CalBears96]

I'm not sure if you checked before, but if you're talking about cash buyers, there aren't that many. But there are a bunch of Mainland Chinese folks that are transferring tons of $$ to scoop up homes here and taking out loans with no income check with 40% down. And also, how many foreign buyers are not Chinese in Irvine? Some areas feel like you live in China.

Dude, you just don't know what you're talking about, so just stop.

 

[CalBears96]

Your definition of FCB is Cash. Mine is Chinese. Agree to disagree.

Okay, so you just don't know what you're talking about.

 

[sleepy5136]

I'm not sure if you checked before, but if you're talking about cash buyers, there aren't that many. But there are a bunch of Mainland Chinese folks that are transferring tons of $$ to scoop up homes here and taking out loans with no income check with 40% down. And also, how many foreign buyers are not Chinese in Irvine? Some areas feel like you live in China.

Dude, you just don't know what you're talking about, so just stop.

Do you actually want me to give you proof? Do you even know what you're talking about?

6 Hawkeye, 44% down payment, Adjustable Rate
8 Hawkeye, 67% down payment, Adjustable Rate
18 Hawkeye, 53% down payment, Adjustable Rate
24 Hawkeye, 40% down payment, Adjustable Rate

FYI this is only one street.

 

[irvinehomeowner]

Just for clarification, FCB as I coined it is Foreign Cash Buyer.

Doesn?t need to be Chinese foreign as there are many other non-Chinese buyers in Irvine? Korean, Middle Eastern, Indian? etc. And it doesn?t have to be 100% cash, large down payments over 20% counts as ?cash? buyers because it means the homes are well financed and can stand empty or withstand upticks in mortgage rates or a down economy (less undserwater).

But apply it as you wish? the point is the FCB affects the Irvine market it very non-fundamental ways.

 

[usctrojancpa]

I'm not sure if you checked before, but if you're talking about cash buyers, there aren't that many. But there are a bunch of Mainland Chinese folks that are transferring tons of $$ to scoop up homes here and taking out loans with no income check with 40% down. And also, how many foreign buyers are not Chinese in Irvine? Some areas feel like you live in China.

Dude, you just don't know what you're talking about, so just stop.

Do you actually want me to give you proof? Do you even know what you're talking about?

6 Hawkeye, 44% down payment, Adjustable Rate
8 Hawkeye, 67% down payment, Adjustable Rate
18 Hawkeye, 53% down payment, Adjustable Rate
24 Hawkeye, 40% down payment, Adjustable Rate

FYI this is only one street.

What is your point sleepy?  That these buyers will somehow be forced to sell their homes when their adjustable rates go up?  With 40%+ down, it's easy to be cash flow positive on most Irvine homes.

 

[sleepy5136]

I'm not sure if you checked before, but if you're talking about cash buyers, there aren't that many. But there are a bunch of Mainland Chinese folks that are transferring tons of $$ to scoop up homes here and taking out loans with no income check with 40% down. And also, how many foreign buyers are not Chinese in Irvine? Some areas feel like you live in China.

Dude, you just don't know what you're talking about, so just stop.

Do you actually want me to give you proof? Do you even know what you're talking about?

6 Hawkeye, 44% down payment, Adjustable Rate
8 Hawkeye, 67% down payment, Adjustable Rate
18 Hawkeye, 53% down payment, Adjustable Rate
24 Hawkeye, 40% down payment, Adjustable Rate

FYI this is only one street.

What is your point sleepy?  That these buyers will somehow be forced to sell their homes when their adjustable rates go up?  With 40%+ down, it's easy to be cash flow positive on most Irvine homes.

Point is these are considered potential shady/junk loans that are being handed out. In the event interest rates go up, there is risk and I'm specifically mentioning homes at the 2m+ range. Assuming sale price of 2m, 40% down payment, 1.2% in taxes (low end), HOA at $150, interest rate at 3.5%, we're looking at 7k+ in rent that is needed to break even. And that's assuming 3.5% interest rate. These loans are adjustable, so if rates go to 4%+, we are looking at 8k in rent to break even.  And also, these loans have no income checked, so you don't know what their finances are. I don't know how easy it is to rent out a place for 7k+ during a high interest rate environment. But if it's easy, then no worries. If not, more inventory will come available in that price range which will stabilize/slow down RE sales at that price range.

This isn't an Irvine specific thing FYI, this is something that can impact any loans that are taken out with no income checked with 40%+ down. It just so happens that it's VERY common in Irvine.

 

[TestingIrvine]

I'm not sure if you checked before, but if you're talking about cash buyers, there aren't that many. But there are a bunch of Mainland Chinese folks that are transferring tons of $$ to scoop up homes here and taking out loans with no income check with 40% down. And also, how many foreign buyers are not Chinese in Irvine? Some areas feel like you live in China.

Dude, you just don't know what you're talking about, so just stop.

Do you actually want me to give you proof? Do you even know what you're talking about?

6 Hawkeye, 44% down payment, Adjustable Rate
8 Hawkeye, 67% down payment, Adjustable Rate
18 Hawkeye, 53% down payment, Adjustable Rate
24 Hawkeye, 40% down payment, Adjustable Rate

FYI this is only one street.

What is your point sleepy?  That these buyers will somehow be forced to sell their homes when their adjustable rates go up?  With 40%+ down, it's easy to be cash flow positive on most Irvine homes.

I?m not sure what Sleepy?s point is. Those four Hawkeye properties are large 4,000sqft homes bought in Jan 2020 or earlier. The owners homes have appreciated significantly and have put down large initial down payments.

Even if ARM % goes up and worst case scenario there is no renter (unlikely) the owners has huge amounts of equity.

This isn?t 2008 where owners were under-water nor are these ?junk loans? as you claim.

Your wish of having huge amounts of inventory suddenly available is not likely to happen.

The cost of borrowing is so low (especially for jumbo loans) to purchase a home 100% cash is not smart. Those people ?only? putting down 40% with no American income are doing the right thing. They may have no American income but they have income from their homeland for sure.

 

[sleepy5136]

I'm not sure if you checked before, but if you're talking about cash buyers, there aren't that many. But there are a bunch of Mainland Chinese folks that are transferring tons of $$ to scoop up homes here and taking out loans with no income check with 40% down. And also, how many foreign buyers are not Chinese in Irvine? Some areas feel like you live in China.

Dude, you just don't know what you're talking about, so just stop.

Do you actually want me to give you proof? Do you even know what you're talking about?

6 Hawkeye, 44% down payment, Adjustable Rate
8 Hawkeye, 67% down payment, Adjustable Rate
18 Hawkeye, 53% down payment, Adjustable Rate
24 Hawkeye, 40% down payment, Adjustable Rate

FYI this is only one street.

What is your point sleepy?  That these buyers will somehow be forced to sell their homes when their adjustable rates go up?  With 40%+ down, it's easy to be cash flow positive on most Irvine homes.

I?m not sure what Sleepy?s point is. Those four Hawkeye properties are large 4,000sqft homes bought in Jan 2020 or earlier. The owners homes have appreciated significantly and have put down large initial down payments.

Even if ARM % goes up and worst case scenario there is no renter (unlikely) the owners has huge amounts of equity.

This isn?t 2008 where owners were under-water nor are these ?junk loans? as you claim.

Your wish of having huge amounts of inventory suddenly available is not likely to happen.

The cost of borrowing is so low (especially for jumbo loans) to purchase a home 100% cash is not smart. Those people ?only? putting down 40% with no American income are doing the right thing. They may have no American income but they have income from their homeland for sure.

I'm not sure what your definition of "junk" loan is, but when you loan someone money and you don't know if they are capable of paying that loan back, that is risk and my definition of junk loan. Sure, they "should" be able to pay it back, but the key thing is the lenders do not check and quite frankly do not even know if they are able to pay the loan back. I also never said this would be equivalent to 2008...

I'm not in the mortgage field, but what is the point of having equity when you can't tap into it if you're a foreign owner? I think lenders do require income verification, credit score, and income verification in order to leverage HELOC or cash out refinance. They will then have no choice but to sell the home or rent it out. But what if a bunch of these homes start going into the market at once? How will the market react to that? Will they still have the equity in that case? no one knows...The repercussions of this is unknown and I have specifically said it might not even be an issue but something to be aware about. I will not go as far out to say that I know what will happen. If bubbles/issues were that easy to foresee, 2008 wouldn't have happened right?

FYI I have no wish to have more inventory. 

 

[TestingIrvine]

So your definition of Junk loan is ?when you loan someone money and you don't know if they are capable of paying the loan back?.

What the heck are you talking about? Those Hawkeye homes have 40%+ down payment + massive appreciation on the homes. Of course they can pay the loan back.  They have so much equity.

 

[sleepy5136]

So your definition of Junk loan is ?when you loan someone money and you don't know if they are capable of paying the loan back?.

What the heck are you talking about? Those Hawkeye homes have 40%+ down payment + massive appreciation on the homes. Of course they can pay the loan back.  They have so much equity.

You?re so focused on the Hawkeye homes. I simply brought that up as that was the last time I saw a bunch of them with 40%+ down with no income checked loans. Altair/GP has a good amount as well.

I?m simply trying to bring up a point that Irvine has a lot of buyers that are rate sensitive and in the event rates go up significantly, those type of loans can potentially put more inventory into the market and slow down the RE market. Those loans are also risky because who knows what equity they will have in the event that happens. That can potentially impact whether or not they will be able to pay back the loan fully. We?ve been so spoiled with low rates for 10+ years and while most of us have fixed rates, a good amount of buyers in Irvine and other places do not as shown by the Hawkeye homes. I don?t have time to list all streets in Irvine so I apologize.

Anyways I?m done. Not looking for people to agree with me tbh. Just wanted to bring up a point that hasn?t been discussed much.

 

[sleepy5136]

One thing that hasn?t been mentioned is the amount of FCBs that are getting loans based off of 40% down payment with East West Bank with adjustable rates. No income check with that bank if you do 40% down. If interest rates ever climb significantly, a lot of those buyers might be forced to sell. But who knows if it will be an issue since they are probably loaded with $$.

Why would FCBs take out a loan? If they need to take out a loan, then they wouldn't be called FCB.

Lol this is hilarious. FCB has different meaning for University of Spoiled Children. Folks, this is what money can buy for ur kids.  Go Bruin.

F-ucla. Please don?t bruin my day

 

[sgip]

Given that fixed rates during the time of purchase were in the low to mid 3's, accepting an ARM product starting in the mid 4's is telling. It's also clear from who funded some of these loans (Sterling Bank, East West Bank, and CTBC) that the ARM product wasn't so much about rate as it was about income, foreign assets, and immigration status. To that I add... "So what?"... with one caveat. If these homes are "see throughs" - non-occupied, no maintenance, zero back yard landscaping after 5 years, then these are homes being used to launder money for the most part. Investors will put renters in the property. Launderers do not. The practice of buying homes to park questionably sourced cash* until it's legally possible to sell should be squashed no matter if your a buyer, landlord, or renter priced out of the market.

*Yes, buyers stumbling off a tour bus into an open house hoisting suitcases of Benjamins isn't an urban legend. It still happens to this day.

To be clear a FCB from Tehran, Beijing, Acapulco, Milan, Rio, Cork, or Edmonton, can find reasonable financing with at least 30 percent down. Among the properties on Hawkeye there was at least one who took an ARM but from a very traditional bank. They had their reasons of course, but it isn't obvious from the funding lender. To that, some lenders require the down payment funds to be in the US for 30 days. I'd push that out to 6-12 months to squeeze some of the shenanigans out of the market.

Are buyers priced out of the market by the influence of FCB's flooding the market? It's hard to quantify. I see plenty of all cash offers from buyers purchasing in non IUSD cities. They are having just as much trouble competing against other multiple all cash, or well arranged financed buyers as those in Irvine.

My .02c