Affordable condo lottery

Laurel_IHB

New member
I know that this is old news that the lottery for the affordables in Tustin was a joke, but I would like to know about your experiences. I have found that there were dishonest things that occurred.



Can you tell me your experience and lottery number, what list you were on, and if you purchased or were turned down. Thanks.
 
[quote author="Darlene" date=1229508173]I know that this is old news that the lottery for the affordables in Tustin was a joke, but I would like to know about your experiences. I have found that there were dishonest things that occurred.



Can you tell me your experience and lottery number, what list you were on, and if you purchased or were turned down. Thanks.</blockquote>


It was usually sold to the "less rich" relatives of the people in the trade.
 
Wow, asking for a lot of detailed information, should we provide ssn and four major credit cards?



It's not that the lottery was a joke, the state law requiring that 1/3 of gross income go towards monthly housing payments when the houses (albeit half the price of the market rate homes) were still overpriced. Some people paid over $150K in DP.



That being said, I guess it could be argued they made a smart or lucky decision. The price of their homes has maintained while the prices in the market rate decreased by at least 20%, and even they had the $150K, probably would have lost 30% of it in the market.
 
Response to ratz - If you don't like the post, then don't respond. I'm looking for information. Yes, it was a joke and very dishonest. Did you know that one of the sales agents sold a home to her daughter that was almost at the bottom of the list? That 23 year old daughter was one of the first people to get a condo - over 1 1/2 years ago. That and other dishonest actions took away my opportunity to purchase. I saved very hard to have money ready to purchase.







This was the Tustin affordable lottery program. I was asking the developers and the City of Tustin a lot of questions about their management of the program, so Anthony from William Lyon Financial called me this last September and offered to sell me a home on the low income list (I was on the very low list). He said I would have to come up with over $100,000 and I would finance about $12,000.







If your response is going to be critical of me, please don't bother to respond.
 
[quote author="Darlene" date=1229847966]Response to ratz - If you don't like the post, then don't respond. I'm looking for information. Yes, it was a joke and very dishonest. Did you know that one of the sales agents sold a home to her daughter that was almost at the bottom of the list? That 23 year old daughter was one of the first people to get a condo - over 1 1/2 years ago. That and other dishonest actions took away my opportunity to purchase. I saved very hard to have money ready to purchase.







This was the Tustin affordable lottery program. I was asking the developers and the City of Tustin a lot of questions about their management of the program, so Anthony from William Lyon Financial called me this last September and offered to sell me a home on the low income list (I was on the very low list). He said I would have to come up with over $100,000 and I would finance about $12,000.







If your response is going to be critical of me, please don't bother to respond.</blockquote>


If you are serious about info on this, then PM me. But, I do ask that you disclose your true intentions, especially in the legal sense. I might be able to help shed some light on this situation for you.



I would also suggest not getting offended from posters here, since you have only posted twice now. If you do a search, then you might come up with some info that I have already provided. I could be wrong, but I could swear, I have posted about this before. Do some research here first, maybe even bump a thread that talks about what you want to find out about, and then you might get more info. Newbies like yourself are going to be tested, and until they pass the test, then you can't get offended until you do. That's how forums work, here, and on others, like bimmerforums. You do the work first, then ask questions when you don't find the answers you are looking for.
 
[quote author="Darlene" date=1229847966]Response to ratz - If you don't like the post, then don't respond. I'm looking for information. Yes, it was a joke and very dishonest. Did you know that one of the sales agents sold a home to her daughter that was almost at the bottom of the list? That 23 year old daughter was one of the first people to get a condo - over 1 1/2 years ago. That and other dishonest actions took away my opportunity to purchase. I saved very hard to have money ready to purchase.







This was the Tustin affordable lottery program. I was asking the developers and the City of Tustin a lot of questions about their management of the program, so Anthony from William Lyon Financial called me this last September and offered to sell me a home on the low income list (I was on the very low list). He said I would have to come up with over $100,000 and I would finance about $12,000.







If your response is going to be critical of me, please don't bother to respond.</blockquote>


Dear Darlene,



I apologize for being so brash and insensitive to your serious question. I have the highest respect for internet forums and their members. I never had the intent to criticize or even question the facts that you have stated.



Sincerely,



The Internet



P.s.



I don't believe that the affordable housing wait lists were public information, how do you know that the sales agent's daughter was last on the list and one of the first to purchase the low income home?



Are you suggesting that the city of Tustin and William Lyon offered to shut you up by allowing you to purchase a home?



Again, the fault lies with the state of california and their requirement that no more than 1/3 of gross monthly income be spent on mortgage and housing related costs. Yes, this does require that lower income families come up with a much larger than ususal down payment, however, this was also an effective tool to prevent irresponsible people from purchasing a home (albeit affordable) that they could not afford. Down payment assistance would be the answer or lower priced homes makes even more sense.



You state that you needed a $100K down payment and would need to finance $12K. Finance $12K?! That's a on a 30yr fix which is around $75 a month!! Factor in hoa, taxes, mellow, and utilities, that's about $500 a month in home costs which implies that you make $1,500 a month.



Well, I understand why you are upset with the loss of the opportunity to purchase a subsidized home (although it seems that you were offered to purchase a home at a later date), however, I just can't sympathize due to your sense of entitlement. Furthermore, based upon my calcs, you are not in a fincially strong enough position to purchase a home, and its a benefit that you don't have your life and emergency savings locked up in a deed restricted home. You need the liquidity (no refi's or heloc's for a subsidized home allowed) and you need the mobility to move to where the jobs are at.



Also, market rate homes will be the same price as the afforable homes in no time. Use that money you saved for a condo in quail hill, not a toxified military base near a home shelter next to the train tracks.
 
[quote author="Darlene" date=1229847966]





If your response is going to be critical of me, please don't bother to respond.</blockquote>


I asked somebody else (not you) a pointed question a couple of days ago and they got all butt hurt becasue they couldn't answer it and they thought I was giving them grief, when the reality was I really wanted to know the answer to the pointed question.



If you're going to get your feelers hurt so easy, please don't particpate.
 
Darlene,

Since no one's responded to you who actually purchased a house in the Tustin lottery, I thought I'd add my two cents (I'm new to the forum also). My younger brother was in the original lottery, had his number picked fairly early, selected a Clarendon townhome and closed escrow on it in spring 2007. I'm a CPA, so I spent a lot of time reviewing the documents, crunching the numbers, etc. for him.



We never saw any evidence of fraud in the proceedings. There seemed to be a lot of confusion, since it was the first time the city had run a program like this. The biggest problem, as mentioned above, is that the city didn't finally crunch the down payment numbers until well after the original "winners" had selected their homes. The state required that the winner's housing payment, including mortgage, property taxes, Mello Roos and association fees, not be more than 33% (per above, I don't remember exactly) of their monthly gross income. This was a reasonable requirement to ensure that the new homeowners could make their payments, but it seemed unreasonable to many purchasers used to the crazy loans given at the time.



When the city calculated the down payment requirements, they had fixed costs of high association fees, property taxes (at the fair market rate, NOT the discounted affordable purchase rate) and Mello Roos (I remember they got a discount on the Mello Roos, but it was still about $1k a year). The "plug" was then the mortage payment. Since the other costs were so high, they ended up having to require enormous down payments to get the monthly mortage payment low enough to qualify. My brother had to put down around $80k and he was definitely at the low end. The only way he made the down payment was because he had a generous father-in-law. Otherwise, he would have dropped out. The city required full documentation of where the down payment came from; his father-in-law had to show he had the money and sign a letter stating it was a gift and he had no expectation of being reimbursed. The city was trying to keep people from getting loans for the down payment and pretending they were gifts.



I remember the builder reps telling my brother that they had tons of people dropping out of the program because they couldn't meet the down payment requirements. If a lot of the houses ended up going to relatives of rich real estate agents, it may be because they were the only ones who could get the down payments.



You say the program was a joke and you had saved a down payment to purchase. How much was the down payment you saved? Unless it was close to $100k, as quoted to you by the sales rep, then I don't think you would have qualified based on the monthly housing payment to gross income ratio set by the STATE, not the city. For example, if you made $45k a year, that gives you $3750 a month and, at 33%, $1238 a month for housing. I don't recall the exact numbers, but assuming the association fees are $350/month, property taxes are $4k/year and Mello Roos is $1k/year, then you have $471 left to pay the mortage. At the 6.5% rate, 30-year-fixed that the program was offering (you had to use their mortgage program), you could have a mortage of $75k. The difference between that and your affordable purchase price was your down payment. The purchase price was set based on your income level and family size.



I know it's a long post, but it sounded like you didn't fully understand the program requirements. The real joke was not how the program was run, but in thinking that you could have affordable housing in a new condo complex with massive homeowners' dues, property taxes and Mello Roos. It just isn't possible. I think the City of Tustin meant well in creating the program, but they should have estimated the down payment numbers BEFORE the lottery, instead of hitting people with them afterwards. If you have a down payment saved and are looking to purchase, you'd probably find it much more affordable in an older complex with low HOA and no mello roos after prices come down a bit more in the next year or two. Good luck.
 
[quote author="NorthwoodMom" date=1229908599]Darlene,

Since no one's responded to you who actually purchased a house in the Tustin lottery, I thought I'd add my two cents (I'm new to the forum also). My younger brother was in the original lottery, had his number picked fairly early, selected a Clarendon townhome and closed escrow on it in spring 2007. I'm a CPA, so I spent a lot of time reviewing the documents, crunching the numbers, etc. for him.</blockquote>


Okay ... so someone who has purchased a house via the affordable housing program has still yet to respond and you've pretty much restated everything stated on this forum and others.



CPA reviewing the deed restrictions? Kind of out of your scope isn't it?
 
Thanks to those that have responded. Yes, I am looking for specific information; however, the answers can be helpful to others as more lotterys will be coming up.



I have gathered information through the Public Records Act, my own detective work, and through others. I only state what I know to be true. Unfortunately for them, there are some people out there that didn't think that I had the know how to take information that I was given and run with it.



I'm not looking for sympathy just information. I don't feel that I have a sense of entitlement - just being treated fairly. We all have different experiences in this life. Because of my life experiences and choices, I have struggled financially but do not waste money or live off of credit cards. I am considered very low income - for the purposes of the lottery means no more that about $27,000 per year. Prior to the lottery, I spoke with the city and was told how much money I would need for the down and and all associated taxes and fees. So I actually had knowledge that the majority of others didn't have. I'm sure they were surprized when they became aware of how it actually worked.



The condo that I was offered for purchase if I could come up with the money(around $100,000) was priced in the low income catagory - about $112,000. If it was priced in my income catagory, then it would have been around $69,000. I originally was on the list for a 1 bedroom(City of Tustin employee told me that because I am a one person family that I could only buy a 1 bedroom) in the $55K range and would have put down a substantial amount of my own money. I later became aware that I could go for a 2 bedroom and had the help of a relative for additional money.



I don't know what was really on Anthony's mind when he made the offer to sell me a low income condo, but it was a stupid and silly thing to do. He even suggested that I ask my clients for money and was serious about it.



My income will not allow me to purchase a condo in Southern California - even as the prices continue to drop.



Again, sense of entitlement NO - fairness - YES. Ratz - some people benefit tax wise because they own a home, are married, or have children. I was able to participate because of my income.
 
Not everyone should own a condo. Is it fair that just because you make less than someone else you should own the same condo for a quarter the cost? Is it fair that someone works their ass off just so their hard earned tax money goes to pay for someone else's condo?
 
[quote author="asianinvasian" date=1229937724]Not everyone should own a condo. </blockquote>


You're right. Some of us who can own a condo rent a SFR of 2x the s.f. for about half the price. Go kill yourself or something.
 
[quote author="asianinvasian" date=1229937724]Not everyone should own a condo. Is it fair that just because you make less than someone else you should own the same condo for a quarter the cost? Is it fair that someone works their ass off just so their hard earned tax money goes to pay for someone else's condo?</blockquote>


Tax money does not goes toward the subsidized affordable homes, they are developer subsidized and are required as part of their condition of approval.
 
I don't quite recall my number, but it was pretty low, less than 50.



In this case, it was the City of Irvine complexes in the old Tustin military base. I too felt there was a lot of shennanigans going on and I complained loudly to the City of Irvine and to the home builders in question.



In particular, my number was lower than some people who ended up buying units, but they never sent me my number because they sent it the wrong address and promised to mail it again, never did so, and finally after a year of unanswered phone calls and emails, did I find out what the number was. I was quite obviously angry and talked to the President of the company as well as 2 people in the City of Irvine. The whole process was really under-handed and I also heard instances of people connected to the agents getting the homes out of line. Its rather unfortunate, but in the end, nothing was done in my case.
 
I know someone who is buying a place. That person is lying about their situation.

They are claiming of making less money then they really do. I am sad and angry

about how many people should have this chance, that have been in this country not just for

a couple of years. I have many frineds that would love a chance like this. I angry

at the builder for not looking into things more. They just want their down payments.

I am angry I bought a home in the area for the full price. I always thought these programs

were great, not anymore. I know they claim no tax money is used for this. But I believe

somehow, someway I am helping pay for this. Please let me know your thougths? Should

I be this angry. Because I am I don't like people doing these things. It makes me understand

why sometimes people don't think we should have programs like this. I am angry kids are

missing the chance to attend such a good district becuase the builders are not checking

the real incomes of these people. And people that deserve this chance are not getting it

becuase dishonest people are.
 
Whenever you see new construction of condos, there should be a certain amount set aside for affordables. So keep your eyes opened. Call the redevelopment department in the city where you see new developments.
 
[quote author="tkaratz" date=1229992501][quote author="asianinvasian" date=1229937724]Not everyone should own a condo. Is it fair that just because you make less than someone else you should own the same condo for a quarter the cost? Is it fair that someone works their ass off just so their hard earned tax money goes to pay for someone else's condo?</blockquote>


Tax money does not goes toward the subsidized affordable homes, they are developer subsidized and are required as part of their condition of approval.</blockquote>


This is not correct. Affordable housing units in new construction are usually subsidized by public money in the form of Redevelopment Tax Increment 20% set-aside funds. All Redevelopment Agencies must set aside 20% of their tax increment funds for the sole purpose of affordable housing, which takes the form in many different forms like low interest loans, buying affordability covenants from developers to subsidize affordable units. In the scenario the OP discusses, the redevelopment agency either paid the developer a large sum of money to reserve these units for low-moderate income individuals/families or they sold the land to the developer at a reduced price.
 
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