Elements of Good and Bad neighborhoods.

bkshopr_IHB

bkshopr_IHB

New member
<strong>Here are the visual facets that are consistent in bad neighborhoods:</strong>



Single story homes with a very flat pitch roof where the eave line along the front of the houses. Many homes like this lack visual interest to the composition.



Repetition of the same houses with similar elevation pattern does not allow owners to express their individuality except for their trashy garage d?cor identity when the garage doors are raised.



Repetition of garages lining both sides of street and front doors are hidden in the shadow of the garages that makes walking up the door an uncomfortable indefensible experience.



Lacking foundation planting with just grass or dirt that ran directly to the base of houses have no curb appeal.



Small street trees or no street trees in the parkway create a sterile environment driving down the street.



Long straight run streets.



Site is totally flat



Neighborhood stores are mostly Korean shop owners, Laundromats, and liquor stores.



The list can go on and on.







<strong>Here are the visual facets of nice neighborhoods:</strong>



Mature street trees



Houses have identity and no 2 homes alike.



Garages are not dominant.



Deep front yard with nice landscape



Good side yard distance between neighors.



Curving streets



Topography that create visual interest



Variety of architectural styles with dramatic roof pitches.



Approach into neighborhood is defined by scenic landscape.



Boutique stores in the neighborhood and especially luxury linen and bath store.



Gourmet grocery stores are in the neighborhood.
 
What do you think of the pattern that you sometimes see when there is a very large, square, flat lot that is sold to a developer, who builds a large wall around the entire lot, a couple access entrances, and then builds houses on streets inside the lot? You get a gated community without the gates, in effect-the neighborhood is isolated from the rest of the city. Typically, the roads surrounding the large lot are at least four lanes, possible six, with heavy traffic, and no through traffic inside the community itself. Frequently, the nearest shopping is a great distance away-much too far to walk. I see this in semi-newer communities in Riverside County, like Moreno Valley and Temecula/Murrieta.
 
[quote author="Geotpf" date=1244869569]What do you think of the pattern that you sometimes see when there is a very large, square, flat lot that is sold to a developer, who builds a large wall around the entire lot, a couple access entrances, and then builds houses on streets inside the lot? You get a gated community without the gates, in effect-the neighborhood is isolated from the rest of the city. Typically, the roads surrounding the large lot are at least four lanes, possible six, with heavy traffic, and no through traffic inside the community itself. Frequently, the nearest shopping is a great distance away-much too far to walk. I see this in semi-newer communities in Riverside County, like Moreno Valley and Temecula/Murrieta.</blockquote>


Plenty in Arcadia, Alhambra, Temple City, and Monterey Park. The out of context projects hurt the image of the city and especially for outside visitors interested in buying there until they saw the mess and get turn off by it.
 
[quote author="Geotpf" date=1244869569]What do you think of the pattern that you sometimes see when there is a very large, square, flat lot that is sold to a developer, who builds a large wall around the entire lot, a couple access entrances, and then builds houses on streets inside the lot? You get a gated community without the gates, in effect-the neighborhood is isolated from the rest of the city. Typically, the roads surrounding the large lot are at least four lanes, possible six, with heavy traffic, and no through traffic inside the community itself. Frequently, the nearest shopping is a great distance away-much too far to walk. I see this in semi-newer communities in Riverside County, like Moreno Valley and Temecula/Murrieta.</blockquote>


Woodbury?
 
[quote author="Stuff It" date=1244870140][quote author="Geotpf" date=1244869569]What do you think of the pattern that you sometimes see when there is a very large, square, flat lot that is sold to a developer, who builds a large wall around the entire lot, a couple access entrances, and then builds houses on streets inside the lot? You get a gated community without the gates, in effect-the neighborhood is isolated from the rest of the city. Typically, the roads surrounding the large lot are at least four lanes, possible six, with heavy traffic, and no through traffic inside the community itself. Frequently, the nearest shopping is a great distance away-much too far to walk. I see this in semi-newer communities in Riverside County, like Moreno Valley and Temecula/Murrieta.</blockquote>


Woodbury?</blockquote> Trade secret leaked out to the Inland Empire?
 
[quote author="bkshopr" date=1244861520]<strong>Here are the visual facets that are consistent in bad neighborhoods:</strong>...

<strong>Here are the visual facets of nice neighborhoods:</strong>

...

</blockquote>


Bk, you just described the difference between dense mass construction versus non-dense, non-mass construction.
 
So, in your opinion, bk, City Place is an asset to Park Santiago? I worry that if the businesses there start going under, the whole place will be a detriment to the neighborhood.
 
[quote author="bkshopr" date=1244861520]

Boutique stores in the neighborhood and especially luxury linen and bath store.



Gourmet grocery stores are in the neighborhood.</blockquote>


Bk, you're the man! You know exactly what people like. What you said is true. Please also plant a Crabtree & Evelyn to spoil us.



The grocery store should always carry many international products. We need our challah bread, hummus, pine nuts, and pancetta to be happy. Even us guailos don't like searching too hard for our 12 oz. pack of Dynasty wonton wrappers. Thank you, Bk. :)
 
[quote author="SoCal78" date=1244892267][quote author="bkshopr" date=1244861520]

Boutique stores in the neighborhood and especially luxury linen and bath store.



Gourmet grocery stores are in the neighborhood.</blockquote>


Bk, you're the man! You know exactly what people like. What you said is true. Please also plant a Crabtree & Evelyn to spoil us.



The grocery store should always carry many international products. We need our challah bread, hummus, pine nuts, and pancetta to be happy. Even us guailos don't like searching too hard for our 12 oz. pack of Dynasty wonton wrappers. Thank you, Bk. :)</blockquote>


Stuff White People Like:



<a href="http://stuffwhitepeoplelike.com/2008/10/27/112-hummus/">#112 - Hummus.</a>



<a href="http://stuffwhitepeoplelike.com/2008/01/31/45-asian-fusion-food/">Asian Fusion Food.</a>



There are others, like Facebook.



<a href="http://stuffwhitepeoplelike.com/">http://stuffwhitepeoplelike.com/</a>
 
[quote author="no_vaseline" date=1245032193]

Stuff White People Like:



<a href="http://stuffwhitepeoplelike.com/2008/10/27/112-hummus/">#112 - Hummus.</a>



<a href="http://stuffwhitepeoplelike.com/2008/01/31/45-asian-fusion-food/">Asian Fusion Food.</a>



There are others, like Facebook.



<a href="http://stuffwhitepeoplelike.com/">http://stuffwhitepeoplelike.com/</a></blockquote>


... Hey, there, white man. :lol: Don't forget <a href="http://stuffwhitepeoplelike.com/2008/01/31/44-public-radio/">NPR</a>, <a href="http://stuffwhitepeoplelike.com/2008/02/04/53-dogs/">dogs</a>, and <a href="http://stuffwhitepeoplelike.com/2008/11/18/116-black-music-that-black-people-dont-listen-to-anymore/">Black music </a>that blacks don't listen to anymore. Ring a bell? :)
 
[quote author="no_vaseline" date=1245056332]Hey, I'm just trying to help BK do research!</blockquote>


The list is great - it's very funny and I will admit, it's pretty darn accurate! :)
 
[quote author="SoCal78" date=1245056616][quote author="no_vaseline" date=1245056332]Hey, I'm just trying to help BK do research!</blockquote>


The list is great - it's very funny and I will admit, it's pretty darn accurate! :)</blockquote>


<a href="http://www.irvinehousingblog.com/forums/viewthread/5516/">I'm just keeping it real.</a>



<a href="http://stuffwhitepeoplelike.com/2008/08/18/107-self-aware-hip-hop-references/">http://stuffwhitepeoplelike.com/2008/08/18/107-self-aware-hip-hop-references/</a>
 
[quote author="Stuff It" date=1244870140][quote author="Geotpf" date=1244869569]What do you think of the pattern that you sometimes see when there is a very large, square, flat lot that is sold to a developer, who builds a large wall around the entire lot, a couple access entrances, and then builds houses on streets inside the lot? You get a gated community without the gates, in effect-the neighborhood is isolated from the rest of the city. Typically, the roads surrounding the large lot are at least four lanes, possible six, with heavy traffic, and no through traffic inside the community itself. Frequently, the nearest shopping is a great distance away-much too far to walk. I see this in semi-newer communities in Riverside County, like Moreno Valley and Temecula/Murrieta.</blockquote>


Woodbury?</blockquote>


i would say more like the original non-TIC northwood. you have the sidewalks right up against the cinderblocks behind the yards. the entire perimeter is very drab.



the perimeter of woodbury has the JOST along jeffrey. even the other bordering streets have wide meandering sidewalks with landscaping in between each of the curves. the homes are on a higher elevation than the sidewalks, separated with landscaping on the slopes. turtle rock drive and yale loop in woodbridge are similar.



it shows a lot about the neighborhoods when developers are willing to sacrifice valuable land for the overall aesthetic. BK mentioned before to notice the entrances to a community. the long wide roads flanked by trails, greenbelts, and monument landmarks all eat up space that could have squeezed out a few more homes. we shouldn't be surprised that when more effort is put into the outside of a community, the homes inside seem to reflect the same level of quality.



when developers chose to build homes right up to the edge of the developments and all you can see from the outside perimeter is concrete, concrete, and more concrete, you probably know what to expect behind those walls.
 
[quote author="acpme" date=1245113360][quote author="Stuff It" date=1244870140][quote author="Geotpf" date=1244869569]What do you think of the pattern that you sometimes see when there is a very large, square, flat lot that is sold to a developer, who builds a large wall around the entire lot, a couple access entrances, and then builds houses on streets inside the lot? You get a gated community without the gates, in effect-the neighborhood is isolated from the rest of the city. Typically, the roads surrounding the large lot are at least four lanes, possible six, with heavy traffic, and no through traffic inside the community itself. Frequently, the nearest shopping is a great distance away-much too far to walk. I see this in semi-newer communities in Riverside County, like Moreno Valley and Temecula/Murrieta.</blockquote>


Woodbury?</blockquote>


i would say more like the original non-TIC northwood. you have the sidewalks right up against the cinderblocks behind the yards. the entire perimeter is very drab.



the perimeter of woodbury has the JOST along jeffrey. even the other bordering streets have wide meandering sidewalks with landscaping in between each of the curves. the homes are on a higher elevation than the sidewalks, separated with landscaping on the slopes. turtle rock drive and yale loop in woodbridge are similar.



it shows a lot about the neighborhoods when developers are willing to sacrifice valuable land for the overall aesthetic. BK mentioned before to notice the entrances to a community. the long wide roads flanked by trails, greenbelts, and monument landmarks all eat up space that could have squeezed out a few more homes. we shouldn't be surprised that when more effort is put into the outside of a community, the homes inside seem to reflect the same level of quality.



when developers chose to build homes right up to the edge of the developments and all you can see from the outside perimeter is concrete, concrete, and more concrete, you probably know what to expect behind those walls.</blockquote>


A lot of the difference in the 2 communities you describe can also be attributed to how the land was owned/divided before development. Large, un-developed pieces of land with single owners will typically see the type of community you describe....where some land is dedicated to landscape and aesthetic improvement. Much of south OC had land ownership of this type which led to that kind of development.



Development done by smaller parcel landowners, infill development, etc will just not provide enough land flexibility to provide those types of buffers.....not 100% of the time, but frequently.
 
Here is a hint. Older developments land was in the yard. Newer developments, rob land from yard and put it on the perimeter of the project.
 
[quote author="bkshopr" date=1245138527]Here is a hint. Older developments land was in the yard. Newer developments, rob land from yard and put it on the perimeter of the project.</blockquote>


Absolutely true. Ladera is a good example. Most houses have tiny yards, certainly no space for a pool or running around on the grass. But they did put in a bunch of common area pools and parks to try to accomodate. On a big scale like that, the result is that they get a lot more houses on the land than if they had given people enough yard space for their own pools.



Another aspect of that though, is that by making people use parks and pools in common areas instead of backyards, I think it increases the amount of social interaction that happens in a community. People don't just hole up in their backyards. Of course in some neighborhoods that might be a negative.
 
What determines a good neighborhood is who lives there.

Look at the mature tree, large yards, great landscapes and mansions on Adams St. in L.A.

It went from the place to be, the place not to be, and after 40 years in the dumps, it return but not to its original glory.

The mansions and large lots remained, the neighborhood changed.



For crime, the main element is the parents.

Also it help with limited access to the freeway or highways. Traffic choke points reduce the chance to escape the police.

RPV has only 5 roads leading out of town, so almost no crime unless it's locals. The developments usually have only two or less access points.
 
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