Orchard Hills 4 - "The Summit" Updates

YOY appreciation, a "price floor" in a buyers market relative to other areas in OC, and zero issues renting a property quickly overcomes any concerns about AAA or the landfill for most Irvine buyers. That's not to say people shouldn't be concerned, but comparing the kerfuffle over AAA to the thermonuclear war waged over the Veterans Cemetery tells me this isn't a very big issue for most. Look at Newport Coast and where the 1960's-early 1980's landfill was located. Hasn't stopped many people from living nearby. The San Clemente landfill is enormous, but no one seems to want to move out of that area either.
 
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CogNeuroSci said:
Not even the cancer part? Still doesn't compute? AAA is a concern but landfill isn't? Umm, ok.
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I'm not an expert, but in terms of cancer, isn't asphalt more of a concern than landfill?

From what I read, 90-98% of landfill contain methane and carbon dioxide. The main health effect of these two gases is reduced oxygen. At worst, you would have fatigue, nausea, vomit, etc. But I don't think cancer is an effect from them, right?
 
CalBears96 said:
I'm not an expert, but in terms of cancer, isn't asphalt more of a concern than landfill?

From what I read, 90-98% of landfill contain methane and carbon dioxide. The main health effect of these two gases is reduced oxygen. At worst, you would have fatigue, nausea, vomit, etc. But I don't think cancer is an effect from them, right?
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Not sure, because I've forgotten what I learned about the landfill chemicals from 3 years ago (I focused more on wind direction in the end), about how the garbage is stored, treated, and/or processed.

But I can talk about another sore subject for which I have done a bunch of research, and that is the Great Park, which used to be the El Toro Marine Corps Air Station. Toluene was heavily used to clean airplane parts and tools, even after it was banned. Servicemen have reported filling large tubs with toluene and dipping their arms into the aqueous solution like it was nothing. Years later some of these guys got stomach cancers and brain tumors. However, proving a causal effect in a court of law has been difficult. Toluene from the airbase has seeped into the ground water (the so-called toxic plume), and it extends southwest to underneath Irvine city hall.

So like with toluene, orchard pesticides, exhaust from the toll road & 5 fwy, AAA, and COVID, the landfill has to also be considered. Selective concern might indicate an inconsistency and flaw in analysis. Maybe Ratchet has done all the research and he/she has reason to not be too worried about the landfill but hasn't detailed it to us here.
 
I just did a quick search on landfill risks to health, and concerns include just about everything, even if they don't burn the garbage.
 
I'm not sure if people realize but Irvine compared to other cities has probably the most foreigner population in a given city. With that said, if one doesn't speak the language or speaks enough to get by, it's difficult for them to know all this information you guys are providing. They completely rely on their realtors or the builder salesperson. Which realtor/salesperson would be that honest? Even I figured out that there was a jail nearby from reading the disclosures, not from my realtor... So we can't say they "ignore" it, they simply weren't aware and by the time they know, they've been living in the property for years...

Hopefully that gives one a different perspective as to why AAA/Landfills will not deter Irvine buyers/renters.
 
Buyers don't seem to care unless they can see or smell it. If it's buried underground no problem with sales.
 
sleepy5136 said:
I'm not sure if people realize but Irvine compared to other cities has probably the most foreigner population in a given city. With that said, if one doesn't speak the language or speaks enough to get by, it's difficult for them to know all this information you guys are providing. They completely rely on their realtors or the builder salesperson. Which realtor/salesperson would be that honest? Even I figured out that there was a jail nearby from reading the disclosures, not from my realtor... So we can't say they "ignore" it, they simply weren't aware and by the time they know, they've been living in the property for years...

Hopefully that gives one a different perspective as to why AAA/Landfills will not deter Irvine buyers/renters.
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You do realize the builder sales HAVE to disclose all of that stuff, right? It's not about being honest, but to protect the builder. When I bought Bluffs, the sales lady disclosed every single detail, AAA, landfills, El Toro base, Musick Facility. Buyer can legally back out of a contract if seller fails to disclose something like that.
 
CalBears96 said:
You do realize the builder sales HAVE to disclose all of that stuff, right? It's not about being honest, but to protect the builder. When I bought Bluffs, the sales lady disclosed every single detail, AAA, landfills, El Toro base, Musick Facility. Buyer can legally back out of a contract if seller fails to disclose something like that.
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Of course they disclose it in the 100+ pages of documents they send over to you. Of course they will not lie when you ask them about it. But do you think someone coming from another country would even know about these things to ask?

Technically this is a realtors job, the realtors should be disclosing this information to the buyer prior to signing the contract. But can you speak for all realtors and tell me that they all disclose that type of information?
 
sleepy5136 said:
Of course they disclose it in the 100+ pages of documents they send over to you. Of course they will not lie when you ask them about it. But do you think someone coming from another country would even know about these things to ask?

Technically this is a realtors job, the realtors should be disclosing this information to the buyer prior to signing the contract. But can you speak for all realtors and tell me that they all disclose that type of information?
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Again, you make shit up.

They disclose these things to you at the office when you sign the reservation and ask you to initialize the disclosure pages. I'm specifically talking builder sales people.
 
CalBears96 said:
Again, you make shit up.

They disclose these things to you at the office when you sign the reservation and ask you to initialize the disclosure pages. I'm specifically talking builder sales people.
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Again, you don't listen. Did you hear me say that Irvine are mostly foreign buyers? Do you think most of them can read and understand what those 100+ documents are saying? And if they do, can you confidently say that the majority of them actually read those documents? When I say "disclose", I mean literally say it to their face. Not have it hidden in the 100+ documents.

Do I think buyers should do more diligence? Absolutely. However, I put the blame not only on the buyer but also their realtor as well if they have one. Especially when one cannot speak or read English.
 
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sleepy5136 said:
Again, you don't listen. Did you hear me say that Irvine are mostly foreign buyers? Do you think most of them can read and understand what those 100+ documents are saying? And if they do, can you confidently say that the majority of them actually read those documents? When I say "disclose", I mean literally say it to their face. Not have it hidden in the 100+ documents.

Do I think buyers should do more diligence? Absolutely. However, I put the blame not on the buyer but also their realtor as well if they have one. Especially when one cannot speak or read English.
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So you're STILL making shit up.

That's what I said. They're saying it to your face. What part of "they're disclosing it IN THE OFFICE and ask you to initialize the disclosure" do you not understand?

Also, you're making up the mostly foreign buyers part as well. Yes, there are a lot of Chinese cash buyers, bust MOSTLY? Don't make me laugh.
 
CalBears96 said:
So you're STILL making shit up.

That's what I said. They're saying it to your face. What part of "they're disclosing it IN THE OFFICE and ask you to initialize the disclosure" do you not understand?

Also, you're making up the mostly foreign buyers part as well. Yes, there are a lot of Chinese cash buyers, bust MOSTLY? Don't make me laugh.
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If all of them say it, we wouldn't have OH folks complaining about AAA would we? Also, I went to OH, EW, and GP when looking to buy. No sales agent said ANYTHING about AAA to my face nor the fact that GP was a marine corps station. However, they definitely disclose it in the documents.

Don't even talk about Irvine, even in LF they don't say it to you directly. They simply send you a docusign link and tell you to "sign these disclosures before continuing". You really think a sales person will speak out all the cons about a product unless you ask? Very few will and most will not. Instead they will send you documents and YOU have to read it yourself.
 
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sleepy5136 said:
If all of them say it, we wouldn't have OH folks complaining about AAA would we? Also, I went to OH, EW, and GP when looking to buy. No sales agent said ANYTHING about AAA to my face nor the fact that GP was a marine corps station.

Case closed.
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Still making shit up to fit your narrative.

Here's the FACT: You DIDN'T buy.

What part of "they disclose it at the reservation" do you NOT understand? They disclose it to buyers, not everyone looking to buy. They don't have time to disclose all kinds of information to everyone who just visits. Come on, use your brain.

Case closed.
 
CalBears96 said:
Still making shit up to fit your narrative.

Here's the FACT: You DIDN'T buy.

What part of "they disclose it at the reservation" do you NOT understand? They disclose it to buyers, not everyone looking to buy. They don't have time to disclose all kinds of information to everyone who just visits. Come on, use your brain.

Case closed.
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I almost bought. Stop saying people are making shit up. You don't speak for everyone in Irvine. My initial post was to give a different perspective. If you don't agree, good for you. Show some respect to people on the forum and stop acting like your perspective is the ONLY way or the highway. Grow up.
 
sleepy5136 said:
I almost bought. Stop saying people are making shit up. You don't speak for everyone in Irvine. My initial post was to give a different perspective. If you don't agree, good for you. Show some respect to people on the forum and stop acting like your perspective is the ONLY way or the highway. Grow up.
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Don't act as if every foreign buyer in Irvine is completely illiterate when it comes to speaking and understanding English. CalBears is right, they disclose all this information to you in the office. If a foreign person happens to not understand what a landfill is, I'm sure they would ask and it would be explained to them clearly.

In 2019-2020, not a single household in Irvine reported a non-English language as a primary language. Everyone knows English and everyone understands the risks of buying a house near landfills, asphalt plants, military bases, or whatever it may be. I understand that you are trying to share a new perspective and I get where you are coming from, but that is too farfetched of a claim to be legitimate. You're telling us that hundreds of buyers purchase thousands of homes in North Irvine without realizing the risks? I'm sure that applies to a small percentage of the buyers but definitely not the majority. Foreign does not equate to illiteracy.

The sad truth is people do not care until it gets as dangerously close as Oh4 is getting. And the city doesn't care until enough people do, and even then its a big effort to get them to do something.
 
Some Chinese buyers don't even realize that there is property taxes that need to be paid every year since property tax is not a thing in China.
So ya ....some buyers have too much money and don't do their research

I'm sure the sellers in Irvine are all too happy to not bring up any negatives when doing a sale.
So I agree that the disclosures that one signs when buying is all that is required by law. No need for sales to bring anything up.
 
ratchet_resident said:
Don't act as if every foreign buyer in Irvine is completely illiterate when it comes to speaking and understanding English. CalBears is right, they disclose all this information to you in the office. If a foreign person happens to not understand what a landfill is, I'm sure they would ask and it would be explained to them clearly.

In 2019-2020, not a single household in Irvine reported a non-English language as a primary language. Everyone knows English and everyone understands the risks of buying a house near landfills, asphalt plants, military bases, or whatever it may be. I understand that you are trying to share a new perspective and I get where you are coming from, but that is too farfetched of a claim to be legitimate. You're telling us that hundreds of buyers purchase thousands of homes in North Irvine without realizing the risks? I'm sure that applies to a small percentage of the buyers but definitely not the majority. Foreign does not equate to illiteracy.

The sad truth is people do not care until it gets as dangerously close as Oh4 is getting. And the city doesn't care until enough people do, and even then its a big effort to get them to do something.
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I hear where you are coming from. But using us as an example is not a great example. We are fluent in the language. I know people that bought in OH/EW/GP that do not know of AAA/Landfill/marine corps in those areas. Some of them bought a home at GP and didn’t realize how expensive the taxes are until the bill came to their mail…. List goes on…

Folks might think it’s not believable but one needs to understand they are coming from another country…. It’s like us buying a property in another country… one can only know so much and unfortunately you cannot rely on the realtors. Like buying a property in China only allows you to hold the property for 75 years… the government can always buy you out and you have no choice but to abide by it…
 
CalBears96 said:
So you're STILL making shit up.

That's what I said. They're saying it to your face. What part of "they're disclosing it IN THE OFFICE and ask you to initialize the disclosure" do you not understand?

Also, you're making up the mostly foreign buyers part as well. Yes, there are a lot of Chinese cash buyers, bust MOSTLY? Don't make me laugh.
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Do they actually walk you through every page and tell you about each disclosure on each page and then have you initial each page? I have only purchased new construction once and they gave me all of the disclosures and I had to sign everything but they definitely did not walk me through the disclosures.
 
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