Author Topic: Pfizer Trial  (Read 522 times)

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Offline hpjet

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Pfizer Trial
« on: December 30, 2021, 01:29:43 AM »
More detail on Pfizer trial by Canadian Covid Care Alliance. Interesting video with further analysis on testing/trial data.  "Canadian Covid Care Alliance is a movement of independent Canadian scientists and doctors providing top quality, balanced, evidence-based information to educate the Canadian public about COVID-19 so that hospitalizations can be reduced, lives saved, and our country restored as quickly as possible."
https://sp.rmbl.ws/s8/2/l/P/E/S/lPESc.caa.mp4

I understood that the vax was not properly tested or trialed and that is why it received the EUA, but did not realize the big difference in testing time between Pfizer Covid vax and our usual childhood vax (go to P. 13 in video - Time 9:39).  People say you already got the vax, why are you hesitant to get the Pfizer vax for your kids esp. when you have no issues with the other childhood vax.  Well the P. 13 pictograph definitely gives me pause.  They also unblinded the trial and no longer have a control group (P. 8 on video - Time 5:04).

« Last Edit: December 31, 2021, 03:00:42 PM by hpjet »

Offline hpjet

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Re: Pfizer Trial
« Reply #1 on: December 30, 2021, 02:13:31 AM »
Normal vax trials require extensive animal testing before human testing.  Only when it is deemed safe after this animal testing does it go on to human testing.

With the covid vax, they were authorized to do animal testing and human testing at the same time.  Whereas regular childhood vax went through 10-16 years testing prior to full approval with animal testing done first.

So covid vax skipped the preliminary animal testing and went straight to human testing which is still in phase 3 and continue until 2023-2024.  They couldn't have known safety and efficacy when it got it's EUA in 2020. 

They said safe and effective end of last year when this came out.  We thought it was 2 shots and fully protected.  Even President Biden said you will NOT get Covid if you get vax'd. Now we find out efficacy wanes in 10 weeks?  https://www.webmd.com/vaccines/covid-19-vaccine/news/20211227/covid-booster-protection-wanes-new-data

So instead of life time, or years, or months, now it's in terms of weeks?  I am mad because had I known all this (informed consent), I don't think I would have made the same choice.  I didn't bother to do my own research and just listened to the TV.  Now I have been looking at CDC and FDA docs and am learning more. 

I do know that I don't want to get a vaccine every 10 weeks (or maybe even shorter - how about every month?).  Can it still be called a vaccine when you have to get it all the time and it doesn't stop you from getting the disease?  How safe is it to have your cells produce spikes every 10 weeks and have your body attack your own cells?  I eat organic because I don't want to eat corn that was genetically modified to produce toxins to repel insects (Monsanto).  I mean why would anyone want to eat food that's changed to produce poison?  Logically, can't be good for you. 

So why do I want my own body genetically modified (although probably temporarily) to produce toxins/spikes that my own body attacks.  Logically, how could that even be good for you? 
« Last Edit: January 10, 2022, 09:02:00 PM by hpjet »

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Offline freedomcm

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Re: Pfizer Trial
« Reply #2 on: January 13, 2022, 06:46:31 AM »
Efficacy against *infection* appears to wane for omicron (not delta), but protection against serious disease/ICU/death apparently is holding up well.

Offline akula1488

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Re: Pfizer Trial
« Reply #3 on: January 13, 2022, 07:33:02 AM »
Or Omnicron itself is weaker?
https://www.nature.com/articles/d41586-022-00007-8

Efficacy against *infection* appears to wane for omicron (not delta), but protection against serious disease/ICU/death apparently is holding up well.

Offline morekaos

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Re: Pfizer Trial
« Reply #4 on: January 13, 2022, 08:07:08 AM »
Maybe I just haven't seen it but is there any proof to the "I had Covid but it would have been worse if I hadn't been vaccinated." trope?  I can tell from my experiences that in our cluster of 2 with vaccines and 2 without, the two with vaccines had worse symptoms not better.  Everyone says that but you can't prove a negative. 

Offline Goriot

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Re: Pfizer Trial
« Reply #5 on: January 13, 2022, 08:27:42 AM »
https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2022-01-10/singapore-lists-death-rate-divergence-on-covid-vaccine-type

Looks like Moderna is most effective.

Singapore saw the fewest deaths among those administered with a Moderna Inc. shot and the most among those who received Sinovac Biotech Ltd.’s vaccine, as the city-state’s highly inoculated population provides a glimpse into how different immunizations are holding up in the real world.

Of the 802 people who died from Covid-19 last year in the city-state, 555 or about 70% weren’t fully vaccinated, health minister Ong Ye Kung told the parliament Monday, showing the life-saving impact of inoculation.

Singapore found 11 deaths per 100,000 among people who received Sinovac shots and 7.8 deaths among those with Sinopharm. This number fell to 6.2 deaths for those with mRNA shots from Pfizer Inc.-BioNTech SE and 1 fatality in those who were administered the vaccines from Moderna.

Offline akula1488

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Re: Pfizer Trial
« Reply #6 on: January 13, 2022, 08:41:00 AM »
In my small personal circle it is the same thing. For Omnicron unvaccinated or people who had COVID before barely got effected but those who are current on the vaccine and booster shots have had worse outcomes, that on top of some post shot reactions. It is like double whammy.

Maybe I just haven't seen it but is there any proof to the "I had Covid but it would have been worse if I hadn't been vaccinated." trope?  I can tell from my experiences that in our cluster of 2 with vaccines and 2 without, the two with vaccines had worse symptoms not better.  Everyone says that but you can't prove a negative. 

Offline nosuchreality

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Re: Pfizer Trial
« Reply #7 on: January 13, 2022, 08:51:54 AM »
In my not personal, group of non-friends, living in my community, my local county health department publishes stats that show 87% percent of the people hospitalized are not vaccinated.


Offline morekaos

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Re: Pfizer Trial
« Reply #8 on: January 13, 2022, 09:17:58 AM »
Can you source and post those numbers please?

Offline NotAnEarlyBird

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Re: Pfizer Trial
« Reply #9 on: January 13, 2022, 09:56:06 AM »

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Offline irvinehomeowner

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Re: Pfizer Trial
« Reply #10 on: January 13, 2022, 10:55:55 AM »
Can you source and post those numbers please?

I've also posted the graph in the 'coronavirus' thread but I guess it wasn't purple enough for you.
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Offline irvinehomeowner

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Re: Pfizer Trial
« Reply #11 on: January 13, 2022, 10:58:51 AM »
Maybe I just haven't seen it but is there any proof to the "I had Covid but it would have been worse if I hadn't been vaccinated." trope?  I can tell from my experiences that in our cluster of 2 with vaccines and 2 without, the two with vaccines had worse symptoms not better.  Everyone says that but you can't prove a negative. 

And is there any proof of the "trope" that "natural immunity" will protect you from Omicron better?

Maybe not:

https://www.weforum.org/agenda/2021/12/omicron-immunity-from-prior-infection-less-effective/

Quote
- New research suggests the Omicron variant is associated with an increased ability to evade immunity from prior infection.
- This finding has important implications for public health planning, particularly in countries with high rates of immunity from prior infection.
- The ability of the virus to potentially evade natural immunity is the result of a complex mutation.

Take care of yourself morekaos... you're not invincible.
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Offline morekaos

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Re: Pfizer Trial
« Reply #12 on: January 13, 2022, 11:12:56 AM »
Maybe I just haven't seen it but is there any proof to the "I had Covid but it would have been worse if I hadn't been vaccinated." trope?  I can tell from my experiences that in our cluster of 2 with vaccines and 2 without, the two with vaccines had worse symptoms not better.  Everyone says that but you can't prove a negative. 

And is there any proof of the "trope" that "natural immunity" will protect you from Omicron better?

Maybe not:

https://www.weforum.org/agenda/2021/12/omicron-immunity-from-prior-infection-less-effective/

Quote
- New research suggests the Omicron variant is associated with an increased ability to evade immunity from prior infection.
- This finding has important implications for public health planning, particularly in countries with high rates of immunity from prior infection.
- The ability of the virus to potentially evade natural immunity is the result of a complex mutation.

Take care of yourself morekaos... you're not invincible.

Honestly, I really don't care...Omicron is tearing through almost everyone I know.  Most of my kids friends have either had it or have it now...all are just fine, some vaxed some not.  I've been exposed at least 5 times...If I get it I get it...whatever...as I said virus is virusing.
« Last Edit: January 13, 2022, 11:31:37 AM by morekaos »

Offline morekaos

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Re: Pfizer Trial
« Reply #13 on: January 13, 2022, 11:38:50 AM »
...and there's this...

Supreme Court blocks Biden vaccine mandate for businesses, backs health-care worker rule

The Supreme Court on Thursday blocked the Biden administration from enforcing its sweeping vaccine-or-test requirements for large private companies, but allowed similar requirements to stand for medical facilities that take Medicare or Medicaid payments.

The ruling came three days after the Occupational Safety and Health Administration’s emergency measure started to take effect.

That mandate required that workers at businesses with 100 or more employees must get vaccinated or submit a negative Covid test weekly to enter the workplace. It also required unvaccinated workers to wear masks indoors at work.

OSHA, which polices workplace safety for the Labor Department, issued the mandates under its emergency power established by Congress. OSHA can shortcut the normal rulemaking process, which can take years, if the Labor secretary determines a new workplace safety standard is necessary to protect workers from a grave danger.

The Biden administration argued before the high court Friday that the rules were necessary to address the “grave danger” posed by the Covid pandemic. Liberal justices, clearly sympathetic to the government’s position, highlighted the devastating death toll from the pandemic and the unprecedented wave of infection rolling across the nation due to the omicron variant.

https://www.cnbc.com/2022/01/13/supreme-court-ruling-biden-covid-vaccine-mandates.html

Offline akula1488

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Re: Pfizer Trial
« Reply #14 on: January 13, 2022, 12:00:08 PM »
World Economic Forum is your source for COVID/Science?
Whatever makes you sleep.

Maybe I just haven't seen it but is there any proof to the "I had Covid but it would have been worse if I hadn't been vaccinated." trope?  I can tell from my experiences that in our cluster of 2 with vaccines and 2 without, the two with vaccines had worse symptoms not better.  Everyone says that but you can't prove a negative. 

And is there any proof of the "trope" that "natural immunity" will protect you from Omicron better?

Maybe not:

https://www.weforum.org/agenda/2021/12/omicron-immunity-from-prior-infection-less-effective/

Quote
- New research suggests the Omicron variant is associated with an increased ability to evade immunity from prior infection.
- This finding has important implications for public health planning, particularly in countries with high rates of immunity from prior infection.
- The ability of the virus to potentially evade natural immunity is the result of a complex mutation.

Take care of yourself morekaos... you're not invincible.

 

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