Author Topic: FDA vaccine panel on boosters  (Read 1542 times)

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Offline PSForever

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FDA vaccine panel on boosters
« on: September 17, 2021, 05:29:14 PM »
From the FDA presentation today by the Vaccine Advisory Committee:

 


Some stats mentioned by various presenters:

- 1 in 317 boys ages 16-17 will develop myocarditis.
- After the booster it could be 1 in 25.
- Israel the most vaccinated country now one of the highest covid cases, numbers higher than last year pre-vaccine.
- Maddie de Garay 12 year old trial participant paralyzed after second dose
- Between 2-6 people killed by the vaccine per COVID death prevented. 
- May have less side effects with 3rd dose except for blood and lymphatic disorders
- May be a need for booster due to waning vaccine effectiveness after 5 months.
- A sharp increase in adverse side effects report/death from vaccine for 2021 compared to last 10 years   https://openvaers.com/covid-data  (scroll down to graph)
  (see attached graph below from the presentation- pretty interesting.)


FDA panel overwhelmingly rejects boosters on a vote of 16 to 2.
https://www.pbs.org/newshour/health/fda-advisory-panel-rejects-widespread-pfizer-vaccine-booster-shots

What I got out of this is that the vaccine does work for 3 - 6 months but not worth doing boosters because of its side effect profile which likelihood may increase with successive boosters.  And not worth risking multiple lives to save less people with 99.999+% recovery rate for the young.  The FDA panel did recommend boosters for the elderly with an 18 - 0 vote.
« Last Edit: September 17, 2021, 07:24:19 PM by PSForever »

Offline fatduck

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Re: FDA vaccine panel on boosters
« Reply #1 on: September 17, 2021, 07:09:23 PM »
From the FDA presentation today by the Vaccine Advisory Committee, approximately 411 deaths per 1 million doses of COVID vaccine.  Between 2-6 people killed by the vaccine per COVID death prevented. 

I don't think this is what you meant to say ...

Offline nosuchreality

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Re: FDA vaccine panel on boosters
« Reply #2 on: September 17, 2021, 07:21:55 PM »
Everything after the 4:00 mark is Open Public Speaker.  In other words, Chad and JT.

Offline freedomcm

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Re: FDA vaccine panel on boosters
« Reply #3 on: September 18, 2021, 08:24:36 AM »
So all of these scare fake statistics were presented by wack job 'public commenters'?



From the FDA presentation today by the Vaccine Advisory Committee:

Some stats mentioned by various presenters:

- 1 in 317 boys ages 16-17 will develop myocarditis.
- After the booster it could be 1 in 25.
- Israel the most vaccinated country now one of the highest covid cases, numbers higher than last year pre-vaccine.
- Maddie de Garay 12 year old trial participant paralyzed after second dose
- Between 2-6 people killed by the vaccine per COVID death prevented. 
- May have less side effects with 3rd dose except for blood and lymphatic disorders
- May be a need for booster due to waning vaccine effectiveness after 5 months.
- A sharp increase in adverse side effects report/death from vaccine for 2021 compared to last 10 years   https://openvaers.com/covid-data  (scroll down to graph)
  (see attached graph below from the presentation- pretty interesting.)


FDA panel overwhelmingly rejects boosters on a vote of 16 to 2.
https://www.pbs.org/newshour/health/fda-advisory-panel-rejects-widespread-pfizer-vaccine-booster-shots

What I got out of this is that the vaccine does work for 3 - 6 months but not worth doing boosters because of its side effect profile which likelihood may increase with successive boosters.  And not worth risking multiple lives to save less people with 99.999+% recovery rate for the young.  The FDA panel did recommend boosters for the elderly with an 18 - 0 vote.


Offline fatduck

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Re: FDA vaccine panel on boosters
« Reply #4 on: September 18, 2021, 09:26:21 AM »
right wingers taking VAERS data out of context, left wingers taking opensecrets.org data out of context, same energy

Offline morekaos

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Re: FDA vaccine panel on boosters
« Reply #5 on: September 18, 2021, 10:40:20 AM »
…and Kaos reigns. ;D ;D >:D

Offline nosuchreality

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Re: FDA vaccine panel on boosters
« Reply #6 on: September 18, 2021, 07:54:42 PM »
https://www.washingtonpost.com/outlook/2021/09/17/pediatrician-coronavirus-vaccine-kids/

Actually a very good write up.
Quote

That teenager was unlucky. About 1 in 3,164 children infected with the coronavirus will develop MIS-C, a life-threatening inflammatory condition. 3,163 will not. Hemorrhagic strokes in teenagers with covid are known to happen, but they are so rare that we can’t accurately say how often they occur. So I keep my answer to this father factual: Myocarditis, or inflammation of the heart, is the one potentially serious side effect we’ve seen from the vaccines. It is rare: An estimated 63 in every 1 million boys between ages 12 and 17 get myocarditis after vaccination; 999,937 do not. (It is so rare in girls that we can’t yet estimate the incidence.) Most kids who do get vaccine-induced myocarditis recover quickly with an anti-inflammatory medicine like ibuprofen, and no children have died because of it.


Offline someguy

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Re: FDA vaccine panel on boosters
« Reply #7 on: September 18, 2021, 08:47:52 PM »
https://www.washingtonpost.com/outlook/2021/09/17/pediatrician-coronavirus-vaccine-kids/

Actually a very good write up.
Quote

That teenager was unlucky. About 1 in 3,164 children infected with the coronavirus will develop MIS-C, a life-threatening inflammatory condition. 3,163 will not. Hemorrhagic strokes in teenagers with covid are known to happen, but they are so rare that we can’t accurately say how often they occur. So I keep my answer to this father factual: Myocarditis, or inflammation of the heart, is the one potentially serious side effect we’ve seen from the vaccines. It is rare: An estimated 63 in every 1 million boys between ages 12 and 17 get myocarditis after vaccination; 999,937 do not. (It is so rare in girls that we can’t yet estimate the incidence.) Most kids who do get vaccine-induced myocarditis recover quickly with an anti-inflammatory medicine like ibuprofen, and no children have died because of it.


I'd like to see the study this person bases their claims on. In August the FDA identified that 1 in 5,000 teenage males will experience myocarditis from the 2nd dose of a covid 19 vaccination.  The CDC reported 95% of teenage males who experience myocarditis from the vaccine will need hospitalization.

Using those odds, the chance of a healthy teenager requiring hospitalization from the 2nd dose of a covid vaccine is 3.7 times greater than from actual covid with no vaccine.  That equation flips if the teenager has at least one covid 19 pre existing malady (i.e. unhealthy unvaccinated teenagers are more likely to require hospitalization from covid than vaccine). 

https://www.news-medical.net/news/20210913/The-rate-of-vaccine-induced-heart-inflammation-in-children.aspx

I wish I could find the study the FDA used in it's August publication, but the best I could find was this one published in July

https://www.ahajournals.org/doi/10.1161/CIRCULATIONAHA.121.056135

It shows 1 in 15,000 chance of myo/peri carditis in teenage males, which suggest hospitalization from vaccine vs actual covid unvaccinated for a healthy teenage male is about a push.

There is a massive public, media, and governmental effort to vaccinate every human with a heartbeat and punish anyone who chooses not to vaccinate.  It's very odd.

Offline nosuchreality

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Re: FDA vaccine panel on boosters
« Reply #8 on: September 18, 2021, 09:11:58 PM »

Quote
There is a massive public, media, and governmental effort to vaccinate every human with a heartbeat and punish anyone who chooses not to vaccinate.  It's very odd.
No that’s standard conspiracy theory logic.
« Last Edit: September 18, 2021, 09:23:13 PM by nosuchreality »

Offline PSForever

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Re: FDA vaccine panel on boosters
« Reply #9 on: September 19, 2021, 08:17:55 AM »
Ok, so even the FDA seem to agree that vaccine effectiveness wanes after about 5 months, but if you contract covid, do you still need the boosters? How about kids who already had covid?

Israeli Researchers:
Study: Natural immunity 'stronger, longer' than vaccine immunity
https://www.israelnationalnews.com/News/News.aspx/312538

Individuals who have had SARS-CoV-2 infection are unlikely to benefit from COVID-19 vaccination, and vaccines can be safely prioritized to those who have not been infected before.  (This med pub is not yet peer reviewed.)
https://www.medrxiv.org/content/10.1101/2021.06.01.21258176v2

Natural immunity to covid is powerful. Policymakers seem afraid to say so.
https://www.washingtonpost.com/outlook/2021/09/15/natural-immunity-vaccine-mandate/

Offline eyephone

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Re: FDA vaccine panel on boosters
« Reply #10 on: September 19, 2021, 09:55:48 AM »
Ok, so even the FDA seem to agree that vaccine effectiveness wanes after about 5 months, but if you contract covid, do you still need the boosters? How about kids who already had covid?

Israeli Researchers:
Study: Natural immunity 'stronger, longer' than vaccine immunity
https://www.israelnationalnews.com/News/News.aspx/312538

Individuals who have had SARS-CoV-2 infection are unlikely to benefit from COVID-19 vaccination, and vaccines can be safely prioritized to those who have not been infected before.  (This med pub is not yet peer reviewed.)
https://www.medrxiv.org/content/10.1101/2021.06.01.21258176v2

Natural immunity to covid is powerful. Policymakers seem afraid to say so.
https://www.washingtonpost.com/outlook/2021/09/15/natural-immunity-vaccine-mandate/

I havent made a post in days. But when I saw this misinformation. I had to say something.

Currently there is a greater percentage of people with out the vaccine in the icu. (I dont know the death rate % of unvaccinated to vaccinated, but I am guessing it is higher)

It is obvious that the vaccine is working. Do you get other vaccines before covid?
« Last Edit: September 19, 2021, 10:03:17 AM by eyephone »

Offline eyephone

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Re: FDA vaccine panel on boosters
« Reply #11 on: September 19, 2021, 10:18:55 AM »
Ok, so even the FDA seem to agree that vaccine effectiveness wanes after about 5 months, but if you contract covid, do you still need the boosters? How about kids who already had covid?

Israeli Researchers:
Study: Natural immunity 'stronger, longer' than vaccine immunity
https://www.israelnationalnews.com/News/News.aspx/312538

Individuals who have had SARS-CoV-2 infection are unlikely to benefit from COVID-19 vaccination, and vaccines can be safely prioritized to those who have not been infected before.  (This med pub is not yet peer reviewed.)
https://www.medrxiv.org/content/10.1101/2021.06.01.21258176v2

Natural immunity to covid is powerful. Policymakers seem afraid to say so.
https://www.washingtonpost.com/outlook/2021/09/15/natural-immunity-vaccine-mandate/

I havent made a post in days. But when I saw this misinformation. I had to say something.

Currently there is a greater percentage of people with out the vaccine in the icu. (I dont know the death rate % of unvaccinated to vaccinated, but I am guessing it is higher)

It is obvious that the vaccine is working. Do you get other vaccines before covid?

Source from Politco:
The Mississippi governor indicated, that 89% of the people hospitalized and around 87% of those are deaths. (unvaccinated)

https://www.politico.com/news/2021/09/19/reeves-biden-vaccine-mandate-mississippi-512750




Offline PSForever

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Re: FDA vaccine panel on boosters
« Reply #12 on: September 22, 2021, 11:01:05 AM »
Ok, so even the FDA seem to agree that vaccine effectiveness wanes after about 5 months, but if you contract covid, do you still need the boosters? How about kids who already had covid?

Israeli Researchers:
Study: Natural immunity 'stronger, longer' than vaccine immunity
https://www.israelnationalnews.com/News/News.aspx/312538

Individuals who have had SARS-CoV-2 infection are unlikely to benefit from COVID-19 vaccination, and vaccines can be safely prioritized to those who have not been infected before.  (This med pub is not yet peer reviewed.)
https://www.medrxiv.org/content/10.1101/2021.06.01.21258176v2

Natural immunity to covid is powerful. Policymakers seem afraid to say so.
https://www.washingtonpost.com/outlook/2021/09/15/natural-immunity-vaccine-mandate/

I havent made a post in days. But when I saw this misinformation. I had to say something.

Currently there is a greater percentage of people with out the vaccine in the icu. (I dont know the death rate % of unvaccinated to vaccinated, but I am guessing it is higher)

It is obvious that the vaccine is working. Do you get other vaccines before covid?

I agree with you that the vaccine is working, but I think not as long as we all hoped for.  That is why our government wants to promote boosters.

Biden was promoting boosters after 8 months of the initial doses, then changed to 6 months after and finally changed again to 5 months.  This is after his meetings with the Israel government who are a few months ahead of us in where they are at with vaccination rates.  Now Biden seemed to have backed off regarding the timeline for boosters but the fact of the matter is, he did want 5 months and I have to believe that some information he had, convinced him that a booster was needed after 5 months of initial doses.

Coincidentally, Israel, who are now promoting a 4th shot, changed their guidelines for their green pass to requiring boosters every 6 months to allow entry to various places. 
https://corona.health.gov.il/directives/green-pass-info/ 
Partial translation from Hebrew to English using google translation:
"As of 10/3/21, the green pass will be changed and the following changes will apply:
- Those who received three vaccines and passed a week from the third vaccine - the note will be valid for six months from the third vaccine.
- Those who received two vaccines and passed a week from the second vaccine - the note will be valid for six months from the second vaccine.
- Those who have recovered from corona - the note will be valid for six months from the date of approval of the recovery. "

Even Israel is acknowledging via its new green pass rules that natural immunity is at least as effective as the vaccine ("Those who have recovered from corona - the note will be valid for six months from the date of approval of the recovery.")  I don't think there is any "misinformation" here. 

Again, I agree with you that the vaccine is working but does require boosters to continue to work.  My question is why not do further research in natural immunity for those who may have already had covid and to see how long that actually is effective for.  That type of knowledge will only help us reach some type of herd immunity and also potentially obviate the need for frequent booster shots for those who had covid either before or after their original shots.
« Last Edit: September 22, 2021, 11:06:43 AM by PSForever »

Offline iacrenter

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Re: FDA vaccine panel on boosters
« Reply #13 on: September 22, 2021, 12:59:07 PM »
My question is why not do further research in natural immunity for those who may have already had covid and to see how long that actually is effective for.  That type of knowledge will only help us reach some type of herd immunity and also potentially obviate the need for frequent booster shots for those who had covid either before or after their original shots.

I posted this a couple days ago in another thread:

https://www.cdc.gov/mmwr/volumes/70/wr/mm7032e1.htm

Reduced Risk of Reinfection with SARS-CoV-2 After COVID-19 Vaccination — Kentucky, May–June 2021

Summary
What is already known about this topic?

Reinfection with human coronaviruses, including SARS-CoV-2, the virus that causes COVID-19, has been documented. Currently, limited evidence concerning the protection afforded by vaccination against reinfection with SARS-CoV-2 is available.

What is added by this report?

Among Kentucky residents infected with SARS-CoV-2 in 2020, vaccination status of those reinfected during May–June 2021 was compared with that of residents who were not reinfected. In this case-control study, being unvaccinated was associated with 2.34 times the odds of reinfection compared with being fully vaccinated.

What are the implications for public health practice?

To reduce their likelihood for future infection, all eligible persons should be offered COVID-19 vaccine, even those with previous SARS-CoV-2 infection.

Offline nosuchreality

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Re: FDA vaccine panel on boosters
« Reply #14 on: September 22, 2021, 07:17:18 PM »
Reading a Facebook post from a hospital group in Minnesota.  Their last 30 days stats:
338 Covid Patients
285 not fully vaccinated
53 fully vaccinated.

52 patients required ICU stay
46 not fully vaccinated
6 fully vaccinated

33 patients required ventilators
31 not fully vaccinated
2 fully vaccinated.

Minnesota’s adult population is 69.6% fully vaccinated.

Two thirds of the population is 15% of hospitalization cases, 1/3rd is 85% of the cases.

 

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