Author Topic: Selfish, Hateful NIMBYs  (Read 4134 times)

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Offline Burn That Belly

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Re: Selfish, Hateful NIMBYs
« Reply #30 on: April 24, 2018, 04:20:46 PM »
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« Last Edit: August 03, 2018, 03:46:41 PM by Burn That Belly »
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Offline paydawg

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Re: Selfish, Hateful NIMBYs
« Reply #31 on: April 24, 2018, 04:27:01 PM »
Do you think Irvine is too dense and the roads are not big enough?
Try visiting other cities around. Not to mention LA county has way more cars with way narrower roads with way much more expensive 800sq condos asking for about $800K - $1M and they are built in 1920s. I'm originally from Beverly Hills and Irvine is almost too wide and open space for me (which I like).

Yes I do. Then again, I have been in the area since the 1980's when Bryan and Culver was a four way stop and Bryan was one lane in each direction.

It shouldn't take 30-45 min to go a few miles on Jamboree at 5 PM.

To say well this isn't like traffic in Beverly Hills is like saying well the recent downturn the economy wasn't that bad. We could have been worse like in the Great Depression and maybe the farmers should be glad we don't have the dustbowl because it could always be worse.

The point is GOING FORWARD, not what was. The roads are congested enough and we have enough houses. The kids and grandkids can and will find a place to live. Building more NOW helps them buy a house in 20-40 years? Yeah, I'd like to see how that works. Cuz THEN there is no more land. We built it all out now.

AND building, building, building and then complaining we don't have enough water for everyone? Don't even get me started on that.

I work near the airport and live in WB.  I use Jamboree going home at 5pm everyday and it takes me 25 minutes door-to-door.  it never takes me 45 minutes. 
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Offline HMart

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Re: Selfish, Hateful NIMBYs
« Reply #32 on: April 24, 2018, 05:10:04 PM »
Fortunately YOU don't "want to excess."  Your wants are JUST RIGHT.   So are John Kerry's, Hillary Clinton's, Barack Obama's, Richard Branson's, and all the Hollywood Limousine Liberals who preach climate change before getting on their private jets.

What a strange left (right?) turn for this thread. I don't know what the FYGM attitude of NIMBYs has to do with (relatively centrist) Democrats, and I would actually suggest that most anti-development folks on this forum vote Republican. I think it's more important to focus on economic competitiveness, and meeting increasing employment/housing needs.

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Offline fortune11

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Re: Selfish, Hateful NIMBYs
« Reply #33 on: April 24, 2018, 06:00:43 PM »
Fortunately YOU don't "want to excess."  Your wants are JUST RIGHT.   So are John Kerry's, Hillary Clinton's, Barack Obama's, Richard Branson's, and all the Hollywood Limousine Liberals who preach climate change before getting on their private jets.

What a strange left (right?) turn for this thread. I don't know what the FYGM attitude of NIMBYs has to do with (relatively centrist) Democrats, and I would actually suggest that most anti-development folks on this forum vote Republican. I think it's more important to focus on economic competitiveness, and meeting increasing employment/housing needs.


You are correct

Starlord just needs a place to vent his frustrations at living and working in a state run by Democrats  -- probably got his MBA at Trump University ;)

Offline StarmanMBA

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Re: Selfish, Hateful NIMBYs
« Reply #34 on: April 24, 2018, 08:10:28 PM »
Fortunately YOU don't "want to excess."  Your wants are JUST RIGHT.   So are John Kerry's, Hillary Clinton's, Barack Obama's, Richard Branson's, and all the Hollywood Limousine Liberals who preach climate change before getting on their private jets.

What a strange left (right?) turn for this thread. I don't know what the FYGM attitude of NIMBYs has to do with (relatively centrist) Democrats, and I would actually suggest that most anti-development folks on this forum vote Republican. I think it's more important to focus on economic competitiveness, and meeting increasing employment/housing needs.


You are correct

Starlord just needs a place to vent his frustrations at living and working in a state run by Democrats  -- probably got his MBA at Trump University ;)

Anywhere someone posted an opinion contrary to your own exalted missives, you could call it "a place to vent his frustrations."  Read the LA Times any day.  All they do in every section is vent their spleens in typical Democrat style.

As to where I earned my MBA, let me say this.  I challenged a financial adviser a few years ago when she wrote an inane article published in the Register.  She responded that she earned HER MBA at USC.  I offered her a wager of $10,000 that my portfolio return exceeded her model portfolio and she declined the wager. Wise of her.

I could go on at some length, but there is no need to do so.  My portfolio earns more than you do, I'm quite sure.
qwerty:  Hey StarmanMBA, go fuck yourself.
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Classy bunch.

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Offline fortune11

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Re: Selfish, Hateful NIMBYs
« Reply #35 on: April 24, 2018, 08:34:20 PM »
Sigh .. another trump loving financial advisor .. someone tell him we already have enough of those on this forum — where is diversity when you need it :)

But , Seriously you need to chill once in a while ...don’t turn everything from civilized discourse into a hate-fest

Offline Compressed-Village

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Re: Selfish, Hateful NIMBYs
« Reply #36 on: April 24, 2018, 08:51:18 PM »
Fortunately YOU don't "want to excess."  Your wants are JUST RIGHT.   So are John Kerry's, Hillary Clinton's, Barack Obama's, Richard Branson's, and all the Hollywood Limousine Liberals who preach climate change before getting on their private jets.

What a strange left (right?) turn for this thread. I don't know what the FYGM attitude of NIMBYs has to do with (relatively centrist) Democrats, and I would actually suggest that most anti-development folks on this forum vote Republican. I think it's more important to focus on economic competitiveness, and meeting increasing employment/housing needs.


You are correct

Starlord just needs a place to vent his frustrations at living and working in a state run by Democrats  -- probably got his MBA at Trump University ;)

ROTFLMAO

Offline acpme

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Re: Selfish, Hateful NIMBYs
« Reply #37 on: April 25, 2018, 08:14:35 AM »
Name five.

LA, SF, SJ, OC, Sac, you name it...
« Last Edit: April 25, 2018, 08:30:02 AM by acpme »

Offline acpme

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Re: Selfish, Hateful NIMBYs
« Reply #38 on: April 25, 2018, 08:19:47 AM »
You know a thread has gone sideways when the OP starts attacking both people responding in support and against his original thesis.

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Offline acpme

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Re: Selfish, Hateful NIMBYs
« Reply #39 on: April 25, 2018, 08:29:03 AM »
Name five.

LA, SF, SJ, OC, Sac, you name it... use google. Honestly trying to deny there's not even a few YIMBY movements out there? Are you living under a rock and what people are saying about housing and affordability in CA?

How can you be against NIMBYism and at the same time be defensive about YIMBYism?  ???

https://yimbyla.com/
http://www.citywatchla.com/index.php/los-angeles-for-rss/14931-move-over-nimbys-and-make-room-for-yimbys

www.sfyimby.org/
yimbyaction.org/

https://cayimby.org/take-action/local/orange-county/
http://www.peopleforhousing.org/
https://www.ocregister.com/2017/09/10/meet-yimby-pro-development-groups-join-the-battle-in-california-housing-wars/

https://www.mercurynews.com/2017/11/12/homes-for-human-beings-millennial-driven-anti-nimby-movement-is-winning-with-a-simple-message/

http://www.sacbee.com/opinion/opn-columns-blogs/erika-d-smith/article162699668.html



Quote
In other words, so long as he's making money - which he's making plenty of - he's not trying to optimize pricing.

Right, so you're saying Donald Bren COULD sell land for $75 per square foot, but since "he's not trying to optimize pricing, " he is selling it for $50 per square foot.

Does this make sense to anyone else?  NOBODY gives away free stuff in that manner.

Have you any idea of what Bren's cash flow is?  I do.

No, I'm not saying he's selling anything at a discount. I'm saying he doesn't optimize his business. The apartment business on revenue mgmt. Properties next door to each other, controlled by a monopoly, often promote and price against each other. They willing to let developable land, office, or retail space sit vacant if they don't like the market clearing price.

TIC has the luxury to do so, but also because it doesn't have to meet qtrly growth numbers. Bren does comp against some of the REITs but overall he is not focused on hitting qtrly growth numbers like a public corporation would be. He actually doesn't run the business like the monopoly that it is... and that is favorable to Irvine in that prices for homes and rentals are not what they would be otherwise.

In other words, imagine the land basis in Central OC was marked to today's market value. This is not far off from reality as in most metro areas where most commercial RE and developable land that isn't owned by TIC has traded once or twice in this cycle given how much values have increased. From the new marked up basis, the master developer and developer has to make a profit. Imagine what the ultimate price to us, the retail buyer, would be? Probably a lot higher.

Offline fortune11

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Re: Selfish, Hateful NIMBYs
« Reply #40 on: April 25, 2018, 09:14:05 AM »
You know a thread has gone sideways when the OP starts attacking both people responding in support and against his original thesis.

Don’t forget — OPs portfolio is earning much more than yours so he cannot be wrong :)

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Offline irvinehomeowner

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Re: Selfish, Hateful NIMBYs
« Reply #41 on: April 25, 2018, 09:18:35 AM »
TLDR;

But I saw the "transit infrastructure solution" again.

I don't think people get it. No matter how much "light rail", "monorail", "teleporters" you put into Irvine, that's not going to cut down on the traffic. People love to drive here... and if they can't afford a car... they love to Uber/Lyft.

Also, 5000 new homes won't exactly bring in 10000 cars (I think that's the math those No on B signs are doing)... using BTB's FCB rule, many of those homes are vacant so maybe we are looking at only 5000 more cars. :)
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Offline acpme

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Re: Selfish, Hateful NIMBYs
« Reply #42 on: April 25, 2018, 09:58:03 AM »
Any discussion of mass transit that ignores the impact of ride sharing would be foolish. Humans by default will prioritize their own comfort and convenience. Big cities with decent public and private (yellow cab) transportation infrastructure are seeing huge disruption from ride sharing. And more cars on the street at all times of day.

Public transit might be cheaper, or even faster, but if it just costs incrementally more to sit in a private car that's what people will do. This is especially so high income areas where people have more means to splurge on ride sharing.

Offline StarmanMBA

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Re: Selfish, Hateful NIMBYs
« Reply #43 on: April 25, 2018, 10:08:19 AM »
Sigh .. another trump loving financial advisor .. someone tell him we already have enough of those on this forum — where is diversity when you need it :)

But , Seriously you need to chill once in a while ...don’t turn everything from civilized discourse into a hate-fest

I never said I was a financial advisor.  YOU did. 
I never said I loved trump (sic).  YOU did.  I simply recognize that anyone would be better than Hillary Clinton, most likely even you, but don't push your luck.
I am quite cool.  Just because you don't like what I have to say doesn't make what I say a "hate-fest."  Those appear daily in the LA Times letters to the editor, in Huffington Post, on CNN, on MSNBC, and on most fake news venues.

Moreover, NIMBYs, as you appear to be, demonstrate profound hatred of "greedy developers," of new developments, and then they hop in their cars and pick up their kids from school, oblivious to their pronouncements of "hating" traffic. 

When most of us were attending grade, middle, or high school, we walked or rode our bicycles.  Then we drove.  No longer.  Mommy drives her kiddies before protesting about the evil traffic.
qwerty:  Hey StarmanMBA, go fuck yourself.
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Classy bunch.

"...expos'd the fool and lash'd the knave." - Jonathan Swift

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Offline Liar Loan

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Re: Selfish, Hateful NIMBYs
« Reply #44 on: April 25, 2018, 10:20:47 AM »
Starman provides an important perspective to this board that has been missing for far too long.

 

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