Constructive Feedback for Emile Haddad and FivePoint on Pavilion Park

notTHEoc said:
Pretty certain Emile and/or some of his top few planning folks monitor this board.

It behooves them to pay attention to current and prospective PP residents since
1) competition with TIC, others heats up next year and beyond
2) FivePoint reputation going to be determined by success of PP
3) makes biz sense

My $0.02 below...

Good job in Pavilion Park on
1) lower density than nearby TIC villages
2) less of a cookie-cutter neighborhood feel
3) good variety of builders / home styles in PP

Make PP / GP better by
1) Commercial space off Trabuco should be creative / vibrant. Look at Third Street Promenade in Santa Monica or Santana Row in San Jose for inspiration. Another Woodbury Towncenter = boring failure

2) Overpass from PP to GP over Irvine blvd - must be very wide (shared by bikers / walkers), safe, very nicely landscaped and easily accessible from PP

3) NEED 1-2 basic tennis courts in PP. Expected with ~$130+ HOA. Sports complex too far for PP

4) Add a Pavilion Park "visual marker" near intersection of Ridge Valley & Pavilion Park Dr. Doesn't need to be TIC-style massive stone edifice. But something nice

That's all for now. If lurkers want to chime in, contact admin@talkirvine.com for an account.

Power to the peeps.
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You should ask him about the water quality and soil relating to the base.
 
notTHEoc said:
Make PP / GP better by
1) Commercial space off Trabuco should be creative / vibrant. Look at Third Street Promenade in Santa Monica or Santana Row in San Jose for inspiration. Another Woodbury Towncenter = boring failure
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LA is very different from OC.
 
Isn't Stonegate across the street from Bee Canyon road which leads to the landfill?

Just wondering why people think Portola Springs is closer to landfill than Stonegate since it is pretty close as well.
 
See image. Lambert Ranch and certain Portola Springs enclaves are much closer than Stonegate.

That being said, there is no bad smell in PS.
 

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paperboyNC said:
See image. Lambert Ranch and certain Portola Springs enclaves are much closer than Stonegate.

That being said, there is no bad smell in PS.
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closer, but not by much.  a reasonable mind would not trash Portola Springs and Lambert Ranch and pretend whatever "issues" the landfill creates for PS and LR do not apply to stonegate.
 
if you were able to take a direct path to the landfill from the corner of portola parkway and sand canyon to the closest point of the landfill it would be about 7,000 ft away. portola springs would be about 4,000 ft away. 3,000 ft is a little more than half a mile.
 
True mixed use tends to be really tough to finance and when the underlying business fades, the neighborhood goes to pot. Take a look at Vantis sometime. That Aliso Viejo mixed use tract started out with professionals, but now is stylists and nail places for the most part. Ladera tried mixed use with some success, but it wasn't embraced like the kind of mixed use you see in Newport, Orange or Laguna.

My .02c
 
Tyler Durden said:
if you can be self contained or close to it, the people will use the nearby services (even at a slightly higher cost), than trying to save a few pennies by going to Wal mart or Costco.
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i still dont understand why/how people will wait in a line for gas at costco that is 5-10 cars deep. crazy. sometimes i feel like going there and handing out $1 bills to the people waiting in line so they can go get gas at a regular gas station.
 
Tyler Durden said:
test said:
Irvine is suburban sprawl.  If you want mixed use in new construction go here http://www.talkirvine.com/index.php/topic,1988.msg214017.html#msg214017
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Ironically non-master planned cities understand how to execute mixed use, yet the ones designed by the "city planners" can't figure it out.


So in your mind, all the condos and apartment complexes that exist are perfectly set up?


Any of those could have easily taken a few units on the ground floor and designated them for commercial use.
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I think it's about noise / crime. The obvious store is to have in a community is a general store / convenience store (a 7-Eleven). 7-Elevens end up being known as the corner liquor store that attracts noise/crime, etc.
 
paperboyNC said:
Tyler Durden said:
test said:
Irvine is suburban sprawl.  If you want mixed use in new construction go here http://www.talkirvine.com/index.php/topic,1988.msg214017.html#msg214017
Click to expand...


Ironically non-master planned cities understand how to execute mixed use, yet the ones designed by the "city planners" can't figure it out.


So in your mind, all the condos and apartment complexes that exist are perfectly set up?


Any of those could have easily taken a few units on the ground floor and designated them for commercial use.
Click to expand...

I think it's about noise / crime. The obvious store is to have in a community is a general store / convenience store (a 7-Eleven). 7-Elevens end up being known as the corner liquor store that attracts noise/crime, etc.
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It's about density.  People who like big yards, separation and big houses buy in a suburb like Irvine.  Those that don't buy in the city.  It's ironic for someone buying in PP to complain it's not mixed use enough.

 
test said:
It's about density.  People who like big yards, separation and big houses buy in a suburb like Irvine.  Those that don't buy in the city.  It's ironic for someone buying in PP to complain it's not mixed use enough.
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People who like tiny yards, 3 feet of separation and compact houses buy in Irvine.

The communities in Irvine already have very densely packed areas (apartment complexes and attached condos and some detached condos). There would be nothing wrong density wise with putting a few stores in the middle of communities - but they are considered bad for the reasons I gave (noise / crime) plus traffic since people from outside your community may come to your stores.

 
Of course the lots in Irvine won't be as large as if you bought in, say, Murrieta.  Irvine, as well as other areas of OC, is urbanizing, some parts faster than others.  The city is trying to convert the IBC to a mixed use zone.  I've written extensively about the IBC and places like Tustin Legacy and the Platinum Triangle.  Search.
 
paperboyNC said:
plus traffic since people from outside your community may come to your stores.
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nobody outside of irvine is going to come to your mixed-use 7-11.
 
qwerty said:
paperboyNC said:
plus traffic since people from outside your community may come to your stores.
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nobody outside of irvine is going to come to your mixed-use 7-11.
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It could come up on a GPS for a traveler if the community is near the freeway. I was mostly talking about customers from other communities.
 
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