Talk Irvine

General => Around Town => Topic started by: . on July 21, 2014, 11:25:46 PM

Title: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: . on July 21, 2014, 11:25:46 PM
There might be a Veterans Cemetery coming at Great Park.

If you don't want to have a Cemetery at Great Park, please go protest tomorrow 07/22 at 3:30pm and don't vote for Larry Agran any more.

http://www.voiceofoc.org/county/article_f3ba519e-10b1-11e4-af02-001a4bcf887a.html

PS.  Really really want to buy Qwerty bat right now
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: ZeroLot on July 21, 2014, 11:34:36 PM
There might be a Veterans Cemetery coming at Great Park.

If you don't want to have a Cemetery at Great Park, please go protest tomorrow 07/22 at 3:30pm and don't vote for Larry Agran any more.

http://www.voiceofoc.org/county/article_f3ba519e-10b1-11e4-af02-001a4bcf887a.html

PS.  Really really want to buy Qwerty bat right now

Wow this is big news. I was just joking with Mr. Z the other day about a big cemetery in Irvine. 

However if it's a Veteran's Cemetery it's not as bad as a regular one.  Used to live right next to the National Veterans Cemetery in LA for a couple years, it wasn't bad.  Most people are very respectful of the property and it always got cleaned and decked out for 4th of July and Veteran's Day.  I saw no wondering ghosts either.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: OCgasman on July 22, 2014, 07:05:45 AM
There might be a Veterans Cemetery coming at Great Park.

If you don't want to have a Cemetery at Great Park, please go protest tomorrow 07/22 at 3:30pm and don't vote for Larry Agran any more.

http://www.voiceofoc.org/county/article_f3ba519e-10b1-11e4-af02-001a4bcf887a.html

PS.  Really really want to buy Qwerty bat right now
Why would you protest?  This is a cemetery and memorial for ppl that have served and fought for our country.  The great park is huge.  I think it's a nice gesture to our armed forces.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: ob1 on July 22, 2014, 07:09:18 AM
There might be a Veterans Cemetery coming at Great Park.

If you don't want to have a Cemetery at Great Park, please go protest tomorrow 07/22 at 3:30pm and don't vote for Larry Agran any more.

http://www.voiceofoc.org/county/article_f3ba519e-10b1-11e4-af02-001a4bcf887a.html

PS.  Really really want to buy Qwerty bat right now
Why would you protest?  This is a cemetery and memorial for ppl that have served and fought for our country.  The great park is huge.  I think it's a nice gesture to our armed forces.

I hope this becomes the most "thanked" post on TI.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: bones on July 22, 2014, 07:12:08 AM
sdf
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: irvinehomeowner on July 22, 2014, 07:12:30 AM
I saw no wondering ghosts either.
Throwback Tuesday time:

Do you know bkshoppr?

#ghostphysics
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: irvinehomeowner on July 22, 2014, 07:17:34 AM
I don't think the fact that it's a Veteran's cemetery will keep people from protesting.

People just don't like cemeteries, whether it be because of fear of Casper (or Sgt. Casper), increased traffic in the surrounding area, perception of decreasing real estate value, etc etc.

You have to be honest, would you live next to a cemetery... even a Veteran's one... paying Irvine prices?
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: bones on July 22, 2014, 07:19:52 AM
[quote author=irvineasdf
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: . on July 22, 2014, 07:34:27 AM
There might be a Veterans Cemetery coming at Great Park.

If you don't want to have a Cemetery at Great Park, please go protest tomorrow 07/22 at 3:30pm and don't vote for Larry Agran any more.

http://www.voiceofoc.org/county/article_f3ba519e-10b1-11e4-af02-001a4bcf887a.html

PS.  Really really want to buy Qwerty bat right now
Why would you protest?  This is a cemetery and memorial for ppl that have served and fought for our country.  The great park is huge.  I think it's a nice gesture to our armed forces.

If I knew there will be any cemetery (including Veterans), I will NEVER purchase the house.  If you dont mind Veterans cemetery, I will gladly sell my house to you.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: irvinehomeowner on July 22, 2014, 07:34:58 AM
I don't think the fact that it's a Veteran's cemetery will keep people from protesting.

People just don't like cemeteries, whether it be because of fear of Casper (or Sgt. Casper), increased traffic in the surrounding area, perception of decreasing real estate value, etc etc.

You have to be honest, would you live next to a cemetery... even a Veteran's one... paying Irvine prices?

Well that's the point. Will it be "next to" PP?  No. I mean heck I hate the giant orange balloon at the great park but honestly that thing is probably closer to other irvine developments than PP.
Distance is relative... even if it was on the opposite side of GP at the furthest corner from PP, people will protest.

Is the Musick Jail "next to" PP? Not really... but it comes up in the discussion.

Most people don't think the Great Balloon is haunted unless your are Charlie Brown.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: bones on July 22, 2014, 07:43:44 AM
[quote aasdf
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: Irvinecommuter on July 22, 2014, 07:44:27 AM
There might be a Veterans Cemetery coming at Great Park.

If you don't want to have a Cemetery at Great Park, please go protest tomorrow 07/22 at 3:30pm and don't vote for Larry Agran any more.

http://www.voiceofoc.org/county/article_f3ba519e-10b1-11e4-af02-001a4bcf887a.html

PS.  Really really want to buy Qwerty bat right now
Why would you protest?  This is a cemetery and memorial for ppl that have served and fought for our country.  The great park is huge.  I think it's a nice gesture to our armed forces.

This is a direct clash of cultures.  Americans have a long tradition of honoring veterans and soldiers.  This is not true in many Asian cultures.  Most Asian cultures see soldiers as "necessary" but not honor-worthy.  Several Asian countries have mandatory service (i.e. S.K, Taiwan, and Singapore) that a lot of people actually dislike because it takes 2 years away from prime academic learning time.   

On the other hand, many Asian cultures have visceral aversion to cemetery and it would greatly diminish home values having to live next to one. 
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: Vinster on July 22, 2014, 08:06:03 AM
Most people don't think the Great Balloon is haunted unless your are Charlie Brown.

Actually, Linus is the one who believes in the Great Pumpkin.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: ob1 on July 22, 2014, 08:15:35 AM
I don't think the fact that it's a Veteran's cemetery will keep people from protesting.

People just don't like cemeteries, whether it be because of fear of Casper (or Sgt. Casper), increased traffic in the surrounding area, perception of decreasing real estate value, etc etc.

You have to be honest, would you live next to a cemetery... even a Veteran's one... paying Irvine prices?

Well that's the point. Will it be "next to" PP?  No. I mean heck I hate the giant orange balloon at the great park but honestly that thing is probably closer to other irvine developments than PP.

You hate the crown jewel of GP? 
That's like saying you hate orange bicycles.  #sacrelig
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: bones on July 22, 2014, 08:18:20 AM
asdf
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: ob1 on July 22, 2014, 08:23:33 AM

You hate the crown jewel of GP? 
That's like saying you hate orange bicycles.  #sarcelig

Ok lemme clue you in here. If you hashtag - you have to spell it right. #category3

Damn it, i was trying so hard to be cool. #canttypeforshit
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: 0$ on July 22, 2014, 08:27:34 AM
 :o
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: Irvinecommuter on July 22, 2014, 08:32:49 AM
Protesting a Veteran's cemetery... Way to represent Irvine to the world!

BTW, is this substantiated? Anecdotes from PP are such that the demographic is diverse, not concentrated:

Quote
At the same time, FivePoint Communities, the developer of thousands of homes around the park, has been concerned about how the cemetery would impact home sales. They are planning to sell most of their units to buyers from Asia, and a cemetery near the neighborhood is considered bad feng shui.

It may not be "concentrated" but I would imagine that a significant portion of the buyers are Asian.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: bones on July 22, 2014, 08:35:59 AM
asdf
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: OCgasman on July 22, 2014, 08:43:11 AM
Protesting a Veteran's cemetery... Way to represent Irvine to the world!
This.  I think if it was just a regular commercial cemetery planned, a protest might gain some traction.  But protesting a Veteran's Cemetery and Memorial...I could see that being viewed as unAmerican and disrespectful to ppl that have lost their lives in service for our country, especially since the Great Park is supposed to be for all of Orange County, not just Irvine.  What is some FOB going to say when a reporter puts a microphone in front of his face asking why he's protesting a Veteran's memorial?
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: Irvinecommuter on July 22, 2014, 09:05:55 AM
Protesting a Veteran's cemetery... Way to represent Irvine to the world!
This.  I think if it was just a regular commercial cemetery planned, a protest might gain some traction.  But protesting a Veteran's Cemetery and Memorial...I could see that being viewed as unAmerican and disrespectful to ppl that have lost their lives in service for our country, especially since the Great Park is supposed to be for all of Orange County, not just Irvine.  What is some FOB going to say when a reporter puts a microphone in front of his face asking why he's protesting a Veteran's memorial?

I don't think there will protests...I do think it's going to hurt 5 Points' ability to sell to FOBs and oversea buyers.  Regardless of "proximity", it's going to be bad press.  Same issue with Baker's Ranch.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: irvinehomeowner on July 22, 2014, 09:23:51 AM

You hate the crown jewel of GP? 
That's like saying you hate orange bicycles.  #sarcelig

Ok lemme clue you in here. If you hashtag - you have to spell it right. #category3
But hashtags can be misspelled for "cool" reasons right? You know... like #valuvlg instead of #valuevillage?

#srcsm?
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: The California Court Company on July 22, 2014, 09:33:58 AM
personally i like cemeteries. it adds a unique feel to the area. I think there is no better use of toxic land.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: ob1 on July 22, 2014, 09:38:44 AM
personally i like cemeteries. it adds a unique feel to the area. I think there is no better use of toxic land.

You're right, probably better than the massive park originally planned.
Less liability anyway.  #deadmencantsue
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: irvinehomeowner on July 22, 2014, 09:42:26 AM
personally i like cemeteries. it adds a unique feel to the area. I think there is no better use of toxic land.
But... that could lead to... #zmbeez.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: eyephone on July 22, 2014, 09:59:08 AM
personally i like cemeteries. it adds a unique feel to the area. I think there is no better use of toxic land.
But... that could lead to... #zmbeez.
I ain't afraid of no ghost.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: jmoney74 on July 22, 2014, 09:59:18 AM
I guess it depends on where the cemetery is going to be located.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: Kangen.Irvine on July 23, 2014, 08:44:40 PM
If the decision made by the City Council last night stands, this is a great decision by Irvine. Irvine is a great city, which needs to remember the many veterans who fought and sacrificed for the freedom this country benefits from and oftentimes forgets.

Families and veterans deserve a wonderful place to pay their respects and we can all learn by visiting a place of such honor. Let us unite as residents of Irvine to support those who have fought to support and protect us.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: eyephone on July 23, 2014, 08:58:12 PM
If the decision made by the City Council last night stands, this is a great decision by Irvine. Irvine is a great city, which needs to remember the many veterans who fought and sacrificed for the freedom this country benefits from and oftentimes forgets.

Families and veterans deserve a wonderful place to pay their respects and we can all learn by visiting a place of such honor. Let us unite as residents of Irvine to support those who have fought to support and protect us.

I have a suggestion/proposal have a wonderful cemetary in Riverside. No one wants to live by a cemetary.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: ps9 on July 23, 2014, 08:59:15 PM
But the bottom line is that a cemetery can potentially decrease surrounding property value.  A city like Irvine with new home sales supported by a large contingent of Chinese buyers will be affected.  Is it fair for Great Park homeowners to shoulder the risk?  We all want to support vets, but in the end it comes down to money:  if my home is going to depreciate or not appreciate as much, I will vote against the cemetery. 

Unfortunately the wants of the majority will overturn the needs of the few. 

So where's the site?  Near the 5th HS mentioned in the OC Register articles? 
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: bones on July 23, 2014, 09:11:47 PM
asdf
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: qwerty on July 23, 2014, 09:16:29 PM
dont worry everyone, for the chinese, the allure of irvine schools > i see dead people.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: ZeroLot on July 23, 2014, 10:45:58 PM
dont worry everyone, for the chinese, the allure of irvine schools > i see dead people.

Perhaps someone can use feng shui to convince the Chinese that it's good to have a VETERAN cemetery.  Veterans are people who died for a worthy cause, they will keep all the other evil spirits at bay.  How does that sound?
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: Irvinecommuter on July 24, 2014, 07:08:49 AM
dont worry everyone, for the chinese, the allure of irvine schools > i see dead people.

Perhaps someone can use feng shui to convince the Chinese that it's good to have a VETERAN cemetery.  Veterans are people who died for a worthy cause, they will keep all the other evil spirits at bay.  How does that sound?

It's not feng shui.  Ghosts are considered bad by many Chinese people, especially those from overseas.  Cemeteries have ghosts because many died with regret, lost love, or just because they're angry.  Again, most overseas Asians have no affinity toward the military or veterans.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: Kangen.Irvine on July 24, 2014, 03:11:59 PM
This land was originally El Toro MCAS and Five Pointe needs to honor Americans and set aside land to honor our veterans.

Do we value property values, which people assume will drop or the freedom we all enjoy due to the sacrifice?

Why do so many people value America...the freedom that exists and this cemetery is the least we can do. People who travel abroad appreciate returning home to the safety and security. People who come to America usually do so for this same freedom.

Think of what's best for our country and support these men and women. Irvine and anyone truly valuing all that we are blessed with should support our veterans. This is something the city of Irvine and its people should take the lead on.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: ob1 on July 24, 2014, 03:23:55 PM
This land was originally El Toro MCAS and Five Pointe needs to honor Americans and set aside land to honor our veterans.

Do we value property values, which people assume will drop or the freedom we all enjoy due to the sacrifice?

Why do so many people value America...the freedom that exists and this cemetery is the least we can do. People who travel abroad appreciate returning home to the safety and security. People who come to America usually do so for this same freedom.

Think of what's best for our country and support these men and women. Irvine and anyone truly valuing all that we are blessed with should support our veterans. This is something the city of Irvine and its people should take the lead on.

Hummed Battle Hymn of the Republic while reading this.

Unfortunately, I'm sure most people care more about their property values or Keeping up with the Kardashians for that matter.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: Irvinecommuter on July 24, 2014, 03:36:15 PM
This land was originally El Toro MCAS and Five Pointe needs to honor Americans and set aside land to honor our veterans.

Do we value property values, which people assume will drop or the freedom we all enjoy due to the sacrifice?

Why do so many people value America...the freedom that exists and this cemetery is the least we can do. People who travel abroad appreciate returning home to the safety and security. People who come to America usually do so for this same freedom.

Think of what's best for our country and support these men and women. Irvine and anyone truly valuing all that we are blessed with should support our veterans. This is something the city of Irvine and its people should take the lead on.

I don't disagree with you and believe that there won't be any protests but just don't be surprised if housing values in the area is depressed.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: Kangen.Irvine on July 24, 2014, 03:55:37 PM
And what a great day for the city of Irvine to choose deserving people over the potential of another dollar.

You want to really increase the value of homes in the GP area, then return to the original great park plan instead of the commercialized excuse for a park consisting of a golf course.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: ob1 on July 24, 2014, 03:57:45 PM
And what a great day for the city of Irvine to choose deserving people over the potential of another dollar.

You want to really increase the value of homes in the GP area, then return to the original great park plan instead of the commercialized excuse for a park consisting of a golf course.

You go girl!
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: ZeroLot on July 24, 2014, 08:40:11 PM
This land was originally El Toro MCAS and Five Pointe needs to honor Americans and set aside land to honor our veterans.

Do we value property values, which people assume will drop or the freedom we all enjoy due to the sacrifice?

Why do so many people value America...the freedom that exists and this cemetery is the least we can do. People who travel abroad appreciate returning home to the safety and security. People who come to America usually do so for this same freedom.

Think of what's best for our country and support these men and women. Irvine and anyone truly valuing all that we are blessed with should support our veterans. This is something the city of Irvine and its people should take the lead on.

You're preaching to the choir here.  I have no problems with a Veteran's Cemetery in Irvine and I think it's a very honorable idea.  Especially now that you reminded me that the Great Park used be be El Toro (LOVE the days where I watched the Blue Angels perform each summer).

I'm just trying to think of ways to convince the more superstitious crowd that it's NOT all bad.    Guess I'm not doing very well in that department.  I'll stick to just reviewing vendors.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: . on July 24, 2014, 08:44:25 PM
And what a great day for the city of Irvine to choose deserving people over the potential of another dollar.

You want to really increase the value of homes in the GP area, then return to the original great park plan instead of the commercialized excuse for a park consisting of a golf course.

I want another dollar.

I support Veterans Cemetery as long as it is NOT next to my house.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: . on July 24, 2014, 08:49:40 PM
I think this is proposed location

see Img

(http://i57.tinypic.com/206kigp.jpg)
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: wrigley on July 24, 2014, 08:50:34 PM
How do you define "next to your house?"  Probably going to be a good distance from PP, maybe the same or greater than Musick.
If the jail didn't bother buyers I'm sure the cemetery won't.

Besides, we all complain that FCBs keep driving up prices in Irvine, if they're scared off by a few dead soldiers, then that means more affordable homes for the rest of us patriotic 'Mericans!
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: eyephone on July 25, 2014, 03:26:17 PM
And what a great day for the city of Irvine to choose deserving people over the potential of another dollar.

You want to really increase the value of homes in the GP area, then return to the original great park plan instead of the commercialized excuse for a park consisting of a golf course.

Is this a joke? All your emotional words ain't working. (deserving people, freedom)
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: momopi on July 25, 2014, 11:37:24 PM
There might be a Veterans Cemetery coming at Great Park.

If you don't want to have a Cemetery at Great Park, please go protest tomorrow 07/22 at 3:30pm and don't vote for Larry Agran any more.

http://www.voiceofoc.org/county/article_f3ba519e-10b1-11e4-af02-001a4bcf887a.html

PS.  Really really want to buy Qwerty bat right now
Why would you protest?  This is a cemetery and memorial for ppl that have served and fought for our country.  The great park is huge.  I think it's a nice gesture to our armed forces.

If I knew there will be any cemetery (including Veterans), I will NEVER purchase the house.  If you dont mind Veterans cemetery, I will gladly sell my house to you.

I'd be happy to buy your house at cemetery discount prices.

I'm Asian, and I think cemetery = "quiet neighbors".  If I take my air rifle out to plink, nobody is going to rise from their graves and complain about it.


(http://www.airforceairguns.com/v/vspfiles/photos/AF-POSTER3-2T.jpg)
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: ob1 on July 28, 2014, 09:02:56 AM
And what a great day for the city of Irvine to choose deserving people over the potential of another dollar.

You want to really increase the value of homes in the GP area, then return to the original great park plan instead of the commercialized excuse for a park consisting of a golf course.

Is this a joke? All your emotional words ain't working. (deserving people, freedom)

The emotional words are working for me.
I'm a retired Marine, though, so I'm biased.

But, let me get this straight, you're OK with a toxic plume, but not a veteran's memorial? 
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: eyephone on July 28, 2014, 09:17:52 AM
And what a great day for the city of Irvine to choose deserving people over the potential of another dollar.

You want to really increase the value of homes in the GP area, then return to the original great park plan instead of the commercialized excuse for a park consisting of a golf course.

Is this a joke? All your emotional words ain't working. (deserving people, freedom)

The emotional words are working for me.
I'm a retired Marine, though, so I'm biased.

But, let me get this straight, you're OK with a toxic plume, but not a veteran's memorial?

So every closed base there should be a military memorial? Should there be a memorial or something to honor them for farm workers, farmers, factory workers, etc..?
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: irvinehomeshopper on July 28, 2014, 09:45:29 AM
Applaud for the Five Points thinking about what is right for People rather than what is right for the pocket book. I am glad that finally a sliver of Irvine finally has some sort of dignity.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: . on July 28, 2014, 09:57:20 AM
And what a great day for the city of Irvine to choose deserving people over the potential of another dollar.

You want to really increase the value of homes in the GP area, then return to the original great park plan instead of the commercialized excuse for a park consisting of a golf course.

Is this a joke? All your emotional words ain't working. (deserving people, freedom)

The emotional words are working for me.
I'm a retired Marine, though, so I'm biased.

But, let me get this straight, you're OK with a toxic plume, but not a veteran's memorial?

I have respect for veteran/soldier and I understand what they sacrifice to bring peace.  I support to have a veteran cemetery. 

However, why in Irvine?  We, Asian, are afraid of ghost and Irvine is 40~50% Asian.  Why can't the veteran cemetery in the Non-Asian community?
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: qwerty on July 28, 2014, 09:59:53 AM
This is probably not going to come off as very PC but I've never been a big fan if honoring one group of people over another, like eye phone said, why should a soldiers life be considered more honorable than a janitor, retail clerk, fast food worker, white collar worker, etc. also, let's not pretend that most soldiers join the military because they love this country and want to protect it. There probably are some but most aren't that altruistic. A lot of soldiers are people who were not, by societies standard, very smart and had no other choice but to join the military. I will say though that I don't think a lot of soldiers are appropriately taken care of by the govt when they come back after actually serving in actual combat.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: qwerty on July 28, 2014, 10:00:58 AM
Ok. I can't take an argument seriously when u bring up ghosts.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: jmoney74 on July 28, 2014, 10:11:27 AM
Ok. I can't take an argument seriously when u bring up ghosts.

How do the homes sell around Rose Hills?
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: ob1 on July 28, 2014, 10:18:56 AM
This is probably not going to come off as very PC but I've never been a big fan if honoring one group of people over another, like eye phone said, why should a soldiers life be considered more honorable than a janitor, retail clerk, fast food worker, white collar worker, etc. also, let's not pretend that most soldiers join the military because they love this country and want to protect it. There probably are some but most aren't that altruistic. A lot of soldiers are people who were not, by societies standard, very smart and had no other choice but to join the military. I will say though that I don't think a lot of soldiers are appropriately taken care of by the govt when they come back after actually serving in actual combat.

Couldn't your comments could apply equally to police and firemen?

Regardless of their motives, or level of intelligence, they volunteered and gave their lives fighting for your freedom to do things like express your thoughts and feelings on message boards.

If a janitor or farmer sacrificed their lives, yes, it would be appropriate for the benefited to show their appreciation.
Since, you and I and all americans have benefited from the veterans' sacrifice, it is appropriate for all of us to show our appreciation.  IMO 

Unfortunately, most people have no idea what others have sacrificed and assume they are simply entitled to everything this country provides. 

You cannot force anyone to be appreciative, so I won't try.  But realize that your freedom was not a gift, it was hard fought and won. 
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: qwerty on July 28, 2014, 10:31:11 AM
I do feel the same way about police officers and firefighters.  And I do think intent should be considered. Who should I be more grateful to,  a screw up, who had no where else to go, joins the military and ends up in fighting in a war or someone like pat Tillman who could have played in the nfl and made the choice to go fight for his country. That i think is truly honorable, the other guy not so much.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: eyephone on July 28, 2014, 10:38:22 AM
This is probably not going to come off as very PC but I've never been a big fan if honoring one group of people over another, like eye phone said, why should a soldiers life be considered more honorable than a janitor, retail clerk, fast food worker, white collar worker, etc. also, let's not pretend that most soldiers join the military because they love this country and want to protect it. There probably are some but most aren't that altruistic. A lot of soldiers are people who were not, by societies standard, very smart and had no other choice but to join the military. I will say though that I don't think a lot of soldiers are appropriately taken care of by the govt when they come back after actually serving in actual combat.

Couldn't your comments could apply equally to police and firemen?

Regardless of their motives, or level of intelligence, they volunteered and gave their lives fighting for your freedom to do things like express your thoughts and feelings on message boards.

If a janitor or farmer sacrificed their lives, yes, it would be appropriate for the benefited to show their appreciation.
Since, you and I and all americans have benefited from the veterans' sacrifice, it is appropriate for all of us to show our appreciation.  IMO 

Unfortunately, most people have no idea what others have sacrificed and assume they are simply entitled to everything this country provides. 

You cannot force anyone to be appreciative, so I won't try.  But realize that your freedom was not a gift, it was hard fought and won.

The US BENEFITED from cheap food/vegetables. Due to the cheap labor of farm workers. Do you think it's fun working in the sun or poor working conditions or working for less than minimum wage? I never heard of them complaining for a memorial.

Another thing I would like to add: farm workers who picked vegetables are exposed to pesticides
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: qwerty on July 28, 2014, 10:55:38 AM
This is probably not going to come off as very PC but I've never been a big fan if honoring one group of people over another, like eye phone said, why should a soldiers life be considered more honorable than a janitor, retail clerk, fast food worker, white collar worker, etc. also, let's not pretend that most soldiers join the military because they love this country and want to protect it. There probably are some but most aren't that altruistic. A lot of soldiers are people who were not, by societies standard, very smart and had no other choice but to join the military. I will say though that I don't think a lot of soldiers are appropriately taken care of by the govt when they come back after actually serving in actual combat.

Couldn't your comments could apply equally to police and firemen?

Regardless of their motives, or level of intelligence, they volunteered and gave their lives fighting for your freedom to do things like express your thoughts and feelings on message boards.

If a janitor or farmer sacrificed their lives, yes, it would be appropriate for the benefited to show their appreciation.
Since, you and I and all americans have benefited from the veterans' sacrifice, it is appropriate for all of us to show our appreciation.  IMO 

Unfortunately, most people have no idea what others have sacrificed and assume they are simply entitled to everything this country provides. 

You cannot force anyone to be appreciative, so I won't try.  But realize that your freedom was not a gift, it was hard fought and won.

The US BENEFITED from cheap food/vegetables. Due to the cheap labor of farm workers. Do you think it's fun working in the sun or poor working conditions or working for less than minimum wage? I never heard of them complaining for a memorial.

i grew up in a farming community where it gets to 120 degrees in the summer.  these guys bust their ass for minimum wage or less wearing long sleeve shirts because the direct sun is even worse.  my dad was also a laborer. blew out his back in his late 40s from constantly being bent over picking vegetables his whole life making minimum wage. he also severed the tips of two fingers. blown out back and severed finger tips, made for a great quality of life up until he died in 2012, like eyephone said, where is his memorial?
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: irvinehomeshopper on July 28, 2014, 11:26:24 AM
It didn't during the 70's when the Rose Hill community started. No Asians live in Whittier! They all live all around the Holy Temple in Hacienda Hts.

Ok. I can't take an argument seriously when u bring up ghosts.

How do the homes sell around Rose Hills?
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: ob1 on July 28, 2014, 11:33:12 AM
It's a sad commentary that you believe picking vegetables is comparable to war.

There is nothing I can do to talk sense to those so divorced from reality.
I don't mean that as a cheap insult, just that your comments reflect that you have aboslutely no idea what war is like.
That you have been spared the horror of war is completely lost on you.

Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: qwerty on July 28, 2014, 11:50:30 AM
It's a sad commentary that you believe picking vegetables is comparable to war.

There is nothing I can do to talk sense to those so divorced from reality.
I don't mean that as a cheap insult, just that your comments reflect that you have aboslutely no idea what war is like.
That you have been spared the horror of war is completely lost on you.



i think you are trying to get others to embrace your thoughts and beliefs.  its too bad you cant see that everyone is different and value different things.  i value all humans the same, you apparently dont. and thats fine. we are all entitled to our own opinions. just dont try to push them on me or others.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: qwerty on July 28, 2014, 11:52:09 AM
It's a sad commentary that you believe picking vegetables is comparable to war.

There is nothing I can do to talk sense to those so divorced from reality.
I don't mean that as a cheap insult, just that your comments reflect that you have aboslutely no idea what war is like.
That you have been spared the horror of war is completely lost on you.



the fact that you have food on your table is completely lost on you.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: ob1 on July 28, 2014, 12:00:00 PM
It's a sad commentary that you believe picking vegetables is comparable to war.

There is nothing I can do to talk sense to those so divorced from reality.
I don't mean that as a cheap insult, just that your comments reflect that you have aboslutely no idea what war is like.
That you have been spared the horror of war is completely lost on you.



i think you are trying to get others to embrace your thoughts and beliefs.  its too bad you cant see that everyone is different and value different things.  i value all humans the same, you apparently dont. and thats fine. we are all entitled to our own opinions. just dont try to push them on me or others.

In my last post, I just said that I cant convince you.
I recognize a lost cause when I see one.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: irvinehomeshopper on July 28, 2014, 01:26:31 PM
I love the serenity of living by the cemetery. I love the quiet neighbors. I actually prefer this adjacency than to a bunch of Chinese nationals as my neighbors. At my current stage in life I value quality of life vs incredible appreciation on a home that I must sell in order to reap the gain.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: qwerty on July 28, 2014, 01:29:12 PM
It's a sad commentary that you believe picking vegetables is comparable to war.

There is nothing I can do to talk sense to those so divorced from reality.
I don't mean that as a cheap insult, just that your comments reflect that you have aboslutely no idea what war is like.
That you have been spared the horror of war is completely lost on



i think you are trying to get others to embrace your thoughts and beliefs.  its too bad you cant see that everyone is different and value different things.  i value all humans the same, you apparently dont. and thats fine. we are all entitled to our own opinions. just dont try to push them on me or others.

In my last post, I just said that I cant convince you.
I recognize a lost cause when I see one.


yeah but by making a derogatory comment against someone who doesnt share your views you are implying that your view is superior. 
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: ob1 on July 28, 2014, 01:35:13 PM
It's a sad commentary that you believe picking vegetables is comparable to war.

There is nothing I can do to talk sense to those so divorced from reality.
I don't mean that as a cheap insult, just that your comments reflect that you have aboslutely no idea what war is like.
That you have been spared the horror of war is completely lost on



i think you are trying to get others to embrace your thoughts and beliefs.  its too bad you cant see that everyone is different and value different things.  i value all humans the same, you apparently dont. and thats fine. we are all entitled to our own opinions. just dont try to push them on me or others.

In my last post, I just said that I cant convince you.
I recognize a lost cause when I see one.


yeah but by making a derogatory comment against someone who doesnt share your views you are implying that your view is superior.

It wasnt meant to be derogatory, just a fact that you would never make such a statement if you had ever experienced war.

But I know I will never convince you that we all owe a debt of gratitude to those who have laid down their lives for us.

Let's just agree to disagree.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: irvinehomeshopper on July 28, 2014, 01:46:12 PM
Just in SoCal there are numerous $2m+ neighborhoods next to the cemetery. Can you name them?
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: bones on July 28, 2014, 01:54:33 PM
xcvb
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: bones on July 28, 2014, 02:00:12 PM
xcvb
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: . on July 28, 2014, 02:41:51 PM
It's a sad commentary that you believe picking vegetables is comparable to war.

There is nothing I can do to talk sense to those so divorced from reality.
I don't mean that as a cheap insult, just that your comments reflect that you have aboslutely no idea what war is like.
That you have been spared the horror of war is completely lost on you.



i think you are trying to get others to embrace your thoughts and beliefs.  its too bad you cant see that everyone is different and value different things.  i value all humans the same, you apparently dont. and thats fine. we are all entitled to our own opinions. just dont try to push them on me or others.

Completely agreed with qwerty. 
The argument I want to make is location.  We, Asian, dont like cemetery because we believe in ghost.  Why can't the cemetery build in a non-Asian community.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: jmoney74 on July 28, 2014, 03:04:04 PM
It's a sad commentary that you believe picking vegetables is comparable to war.

There is nothing I can do to talk sense to those so divorced from reality.
I don't mean that as a cheap insult, just that your comments reflect that you have aboslutely no idea what war is like.
That you have been spared the horror of war is completely lost on you.



i think you are trying to get others to embrace your thoughts and beliefs.  its too bad you cant see that everyone is different and value different things.  i value all humans the same, you apparently dont. and thats fine. we are all entitled to our own opinions. just dont try to push them on me or others.

Completely agreed with qwerty. 
@O Hills, do you think the war is winning by soldiers in the battlefield, or scientists in Mahnattan project or woman in factories manufacture bullets and bombs?

The argument I want to make is location.  We, Asian, dont like cemetery because we believe in ghost.  Why can't the cemetery build in a non-Asian community.

Well.. I have to say that it's not supposed to be an "Asian community" per say.  I mean it is because a bunch of us bought here.. but that doesn't make it an asian community.  Woodbury Towncenter is as American as it gets. 
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: . on July 28, 2014, 03:27:52 PM
It's a sad commentary that you believe picking vegetables is comparable to war.

There is nothing I can do to talk sense to those so divorced from reality.
I don't mean that as a cheap insult, just that your comments reflect that you have aboslutely no idea what war is like.
That you have been spared the horror of war is completely lost on you.



i think you are trying to get others to embrace your thoughts and beliefs.  its too bad you cant see that everyone is different and value different things.  i value all humans the same, you apparently dont. and thats fine. we are all entitled to our own opinions. just dont try to push them on me or others.

Completely agreed with qwerty. 
@O Hills, do you think the war is winning by soldiers in the battlefield, or scientists in Mahnattan project or woman in factories manufacture bullets and bombs?

The argument I want to make is location.  We, Asian, dont like cemetery because we believe in ghost.  Why can't the cemetery build in a non-Asian community.

Well.. I have to say that it's not supposed to be an "Asian community" per say.  I mean it is because a bunch of us bought here.. but that doesn't make it an asian community.  Woodbury Towncenter is as American as it gets.

http://www.talkirvine.com/index.php/topic,11751.msg231141.html

Top 5 names of homebuyers in Irvine in 2013 were Chen, Lee, Wang, Liu and Kim.  How more Asian do you still need?
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: irvinehomeowner on July 28, 2014, 03:29:36 PM
I do see qwerty's point but I do think it's not fair to compare what someone chooses (or may not choose) to do for a living versus someone who volunteers (or was drafted) into a position where the chance of losing their life is very high.

This isn't a commentary on whose "labor" is more important but rather risk and duty. I can take a stance and say what about all the nerds who made your Internet possible and the fact that you have electricity... but I would not make that comparison to someone who puts his life at risk to protect my freedom.

Yes, maybe qwerter's dad's labor put food on my table... but the fact that I have that table and am even here is due to the various wars that were fought in the past.

I am not in the military but I know enough history to be thankful for those who are.

And I don't believe in ghosts, but would not be too keen on living next to a cemetary.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: Vinster on July 28, 2014, 03:33:09 PM
Don't worry, the Ghostbusters are coming back.

Ghostbusters 30th Anniversary remastered version to be re-released in movie theaters for a limited run starting Labor Day weekend.

http://www.ghostbusters.com/
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: OCgasman on July 28, 2014, 03:35:21 PM
The argument I want to make is location.  We, Asian, dont like cemetery because we believe in ghost.  Why can't the cemetery build in a non-Asian community.
Is this your argument?  Seriously?  You don't speak for every Asian.  Also, nobody wants a cemetery near them.  Why don't you go ask Newport Beach, Costa Mesa, or Huntington Beach if they would rather have the cemetery cuz "Asians are scared of ghosts".  Gimme a f'ing break.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: ob1 on July 28, 2014, 03:37:46 PM
I do see qwerty's point but I do think it's not fair to compare what someone chooses (or may not choose) to do for a living versus someone who volunteers (or was drafted) into a position where the chance of losing their life is very high.

This isn't a commentary on whose "labor" is more important but rather risk and duty. I can take a stance and say what about all the nerds who made your Internet possible and the fact that you have electricity... but I would not make that comparison to someone who puts his life at risk to protect my freedom.

Yes, maybe qwerter's dad's labor put food on my table... but the fact that I have that table and am even here is due to the various wars that were fought in the past.

I am not in the military but I know enough history to be thankful for those who are.

And I don't believe in ghosts, but would not be too keen on living next to a cemetary.

Correct, this is about those who made the ultimate sacrifice, not everyone who may have contributed to a war or your cushy OC lifestyle.

A memorial is a small gratitude to pay.


Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: Rice Vino on July 28, 2014, 04:03:36 PM
The Veteran's Cemetery proposal looks like nothing more than Councilmember Larry Agran creating a smokescreen and jamming Five Points as payback for the last Great Park re-shuffle.

He needs a smokescreen (Wag the Dog style) because the wagons are being circled around him for corruption; even the left-leaning OC Weekly has picked up on the trail.

Here's their recent article... this would be like WSJ doing a hit piece on Ronald Reagan.
http://www.ocweekly.com/2014-07-24/news/moxley-confidential-larry-agran-great-park-irvine/

It's a shame that Agran is exploiting veterans to accomplish his task.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: Kangen.Irvine on July 28, 2014, 04:08:11 PM
How about looking at this differently. The cemetery wouldn't end up in our backyards. Instead we have chosen to live in the backyard of the El Toro MCAS.

Not everyone lived in this surrounding area when the Marine base was a major contributing part of our region, but it is a fact and this piece of history must be kept as a part of Orange County.

The Preamble to the US Constitution mentions six points, one of which is the provision of a common defense for America and Americans. Every person who wishes to call the United States their home pledges allegiance to this point upon receiving their citizenship. This is not an attempt to argue citizenship, but to emphasize a goal of the USA and a way to honor those who provided for our freedom.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: Irvinecommuter on July 28, 2014, 04:10:15 PM
How about looking at this differently. The cemetery wouldn't end up in our backyards. Instead we have chosen to live in the backyard of the El Toro MCAS.

Not everyone lived in this surrounding area when the Marine base was a major contributing part of our region, but it is a fact and this piece of history must be kept as a part of Orange County.

The Preamble to the US Constitution mentions six points, one of which is the provision of a common defense for America and Americans. Every person who wishes to call the United States their home pledges allegiance to this point upon receiving their citizenship. This is not an attempt to argue citizenship, but to emphasize a goal of the USA and a way to honor those who provided for our freedom.

Only if you want to be a citizen...non-citizen aren't subject to the draft.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: Vinster on July 28, 2014, 04:24:53 PM
Only if you want to be a citizen...non-citizen aren't subject to the draft.

https://www.sss.gov/fswho.htm

Non-citizens who are not required to register with Selective Service include men who are in the U.S. on student or visitor visas, and men who are part of a diplomatic or trade mission and their families. Almost all other male non-citizens are required to register, including undocumented immigrants, legal permanent residents, and refugees.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: Irvinecommuter on July 28, 2014, 04:27:35 PM
Only if you want to be a citizen...non-citizen aren't subject to the draft.

https://www.sss.gov/fswho.htm

Non-citizens who are not required to register with Selective Service include men who are in the U.S. on student or visitor visas, and men who are part of a diplomatic or trade mission and their families. Almost all other male non-citizens are required to register, including undocumented immigrants, legal permanent residents, and refugees.


Good to know :)
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: qwerty on July 28, 2014, 05:20:47 PM
I never said I wasn't grateful for those guys that die in war to protect our freedom. A lot of recent deaths in the military in Iraq and Afghanistan have nothing to do with protecting our freedom. All I am saying is that I don't value one persons contributions over another. I don't see why I should put soldiers life on a pedestal but not a teacher who got killed by some armed student. My point is we are all humans, we all play a role in making the world go round and one life is not more honorable than the next. Put us all in the same cemetery. Society tends to hammer certain beliefs into people, you need to get married and have kids, military/cops/firefighters lives are more honorable than yours or mine, etc. just my view. Not arguing or trying to change anyone's view points or sound insensitive to those with military family members who have been killed in service
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: irvinehomeshopper on July 28, 2014, 06:19:31 PM
I am all for the Veteran Cemetery but Irvine is a poor choice not because of the Chinese population reason. Veteran Cemetery location must be monumental or powerful in its planned location. I was at Arlington just a few days ago and over the Veteran Day at Westwood. Both locations are inspiring and next to famous federal or government buildings. Axial planning, city beautiful movement and Beaux Art monuments are the proper tribute to a cemetery of significance. Driving through cookie cutter homes on the way to a Veteran cemetery is bad taste and insulting to those who fought for this country.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: . on July 28, 2014, 10:46:51 PM
The argument I want to make is location.  We, Asian, dont like cemetery because we believe in ghost.  Why can't the cemetery build in a non-Asian community.
Is this your argument?  Seriously?  You don't speak for every Asian.  Also, nobody wants a cemetery near them.  Why don't you go ask Newport Beach, Costa Mesa, or Huntington Beach if they would rather have the cemetery cuz "Asians are scared of ghosts".  Gimme a f'ing break.

I dont understand your argument.  I understand I can't speak for every Asian.  However, can you find me an Asian family that loves live next to the cemetery.

According to city data, Irvine currently has 40% Asian.  And top 5 buyers of Pavilion Park are Asian. 
http://www.city-data.com/city/Irvine-California.html

As For Costa Mesa, Asian is only 8.6%.  Newport Beach, 7.0% and Huntington Beach 10.5%.
http://www.city-data.com/city/Costa-Mesa-California.html
http://www.city-data.com/city/Newport-Beach-California.html
http://www.city-data.com/city/Huntington-Beach-California.html

Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: ZeroLot on July 28, 2014, 10:52:18 PM

If you read this carefully, there are people dont mind live next to the cemetery.  Let's build more cemetery next to their house.

Just chiming in ... I'm ok with a VETERAN'S cemetery near my house ... Not a Rose Hills. 
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: qwerty on July 29, 2014, 12:10:12 AM

If you read this carefully, there are people dont mind live next to the cemetery.  Let's build more cemetery next to their house.

Just chiming in ... I'm ok with a VETERAN'S cemetery near my house ... Not a Rose Hills. 

What's the difference?
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: irvinehomeowner on July 29, 2014, 08:01:23 AM
I never said I wasn't grateful for those guys that die in war to protect our freedom.
No one said that. What was said is it's hard to compare the risks of a farming job that you get paid for to position of duty where dying is an every day possibility.
Quote
A lot of recent deaths in the military in Iraq and Afghanistan have nothing to do with protecting our freedom.
That's arguable. Some would say it's not just American freedom being protected there but that's a topic that will never be resolved.
Quote
All I am saying is that I don't value one persons contributions over another. I don't see why I should put soldiers life on a pedestal but not a teacher who got killed by some armed student.
Again, it's not the "value". A soldier's life is at risk every day, a teacher's really isn't. You don't see teachers dying daily doing their jobs... but soldiers do... and not because they are paid to, but because that is their duty and they know the risks yet still do it. If you were to tell a teacher that every day, every single student could have a handgun or an IED, I doubt many would show up to work (well... maybe some of these more urban teachers are braver than most).
Quote

My point is we are all humans, we all play a role in making the world go round and one life is not more honorable than the next. Put us all in the same cemetery. Society tends to hammer certain beliefs into people, you need to get married and have kids, military/cops/firefighters lives are more honorable than yours or mine, etc. just my view.
And the fact that is it your view and opinion and that you can express it is a result of what? In other countries, that would not be possible... the very freedoms you possess is related to the wars fought by the soldiers who died fighting them. Not by the teachers, not by the farmers and not by the computer programmers.
Quote
Not arguing or trying to change anyone's view points or sound insensitive to those with military family members who have been killed in service
I think sometimes that many of us are spoiled by our way of life in America and in the world. If any of us spend some time in the Middle East or any area that is in turmoil, I think our viewpoints will change.

And, yes, like you, I'm not trying to change your view or opinion, I'm just trying to explain how I look at it. I understand that we shouldn't be "classifying" groups of people but that's not how I see a Veteran's cemetery. If anyone wants to create a teacher's cemetery, a vegetable picker's cemetery, a fire fighter's cemetery... go for it... but the very idea that such a thing can be done is because we have the freedom to do so, and that is a large part of the reason why so many honor and respect the military.

I think it just comes down to perspective and since most of us have lived during a time of peace, we don't feel sense the "value" of military. I'm sure that if a foreign power decided to invade the US and hordes of enemy combatants were attacking Irvine, most of us would "value" soldiers standing around our home than some guys picking fruit or a firefighter. But in our everyday life, yes, the latter seems to have more "value" than the military. :)
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: OCgasman on July 29, 2014, 08:40:14 AM
The argument I want to make is location.  We, Asian, dont like cemetery because we believe in ghost.  Why can't the cemetery build in a non-Asian community.
Is this your argument?  Seriously?  You don't speak for every Asian.  Also, nobody wants a cemetery near them.  Why don't you go ask Newport Beach, Costa Mesa, or Huntington Beach if they would rather have the cemetery cuz "Asians are scared of ghosts".  Gimme a f'ing break.

I dont understand your argument.  I understand I can't speak for every Asian.  However, can you find me an Asian family that loves live next to the cemetery.

According to city data, Irvine currently has 40% Asian.  And top 5 buyers of Pavilion Park are Asian. 
http://www.city-data.com/city/Irvine-California.html

As For Costa Mesa, Asian is only 8.6%.  Newport Beach, 7.0% and Huntington Beach 10.5%.
http://www.city-data.com/city/Costa-Mesa-California.html
http://www.city-data.com/city/Newport-Beach-California.html
http://www.city-data.com/city/Huntington-Beach-California.html

If you read this carefully, there are people dont mind live next to the cemetery.  Let's build more cemetery next to their house.

What I'm saying is that nobody, no matter what race, wants to have a cemetery in close proximity to where they live, just human nature with the potential depreciation, bad luck, etc.  But, using an ethnocentric argument that Asians prefer it less than other races holds no water.  Just like WTTCMN said, your viewpoint is classic "Not In My Backyard".  You have to come up with a better reason than "Asians are scared of ghosts", cuz quite frankly, that sounds stupid. 

I don't know the reasons why Irvine City Council proposed the Veteran's Cemetery and Memorial.  And at this point it doesn't matter, cuz the proposal is out there.  But, it would be a difficult public protest in the face of families who have lost loved ones in protection of our nation.  What are you going to say to them?  Drive an extra hour to Riverside County to pay respects to your son/daughter/father/mother/brother/sister because Asians don't want a Veteran's Cemetery near their neighborhood?  If that's your argument, I want no part of it.  You have to come up with something more tangible, because it has to face public scrutiny.  Asians usually hate public confrontation and this is what it will come down to, a battle of public opinion.  How are you going to argue against a crying mother who wants to visit her dead son in a nearby location who lost his life in defense of our country?  And make that argument with a reporter sticking a microphone in your face with a camera on.  Good luck with that.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: irvinehomeowner on July 29, 2014, 08:49:21 AM
@OCgasman:

On the proximity question, and maybe partially to qwerty's point, they don't have to use a Veteran's cemetery. That mother can bury her son at Fairhaven or Ascension which is close to Irvine.

I'm assuming there is also a cost benefit to using a Veteran's facility, but if non-military families are able to make due, nothing should prevent her from doing so either.

My qualms with living next to a cemetery would be the additional traffic and visitors on weekends and memorial holidays (not just Veteran's Day but also Mother's Day, Father's Day etc). Do people still remember the movie Poltergeist?
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: ob1 on July 29, 2014, 08:58:08 AM
I never said I wasn't grateful for those guys that die in war to protect our freedom. A lot of recent deaths in the military in Iraq and Afghanistan have nothing to do with protecting our freedom. All I am saying is that I don't value one persons contributions over another. I don't see why I should put soldiers life on a pedestal but not a teacher who got killed by some armed student. My point is we are all humans, we all play a role in making the world go round and one life is not more honorable than the next. Put us all in the same cemetery. Society tends to hammer certain beliefs into people, you need to get married and have kids, military/cops/firefighters lives are more honorable than yours or mine, etc. just my view. Not arguing or trying to change anyone's view points or sound insensitive to those with military family members who have been killed in service

I truly respect your "I aint drinking the cool-aid" point of view.
And I think we all agree that life should be equally valued.

The issue with a cemetery, though, is honoring sacrifice.
I've seen our young men and women perform extraordinary acts of bravery and valor in battle. 
It's disheartening to hear those acts equated to vegetable picking. 

Most of us have no idea of the sacrifices our troops make for our security.
We simply enjoy the safe and comfortable cocoons they provide for us.
I'm not trying to convince you to think differently, just trying to give you the full picture.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: ob1 on July 29, 2014, 09:03:32 AM
The argument I want to make is location.  We, Asian, dont like cemetery because we believe in ghost.  Why can't the cemetery build in a non-Asian community.
Is this your argument?  Seriously?  You don't speak for every Asian.  Also, nobody wants a cemetery near them.  Why don't you go ask Newport Beach, Costa Mesa, or Huntington Beach if they would rather have the cemetery cuz "Asians are scared of ghosts".  Gimme a f'ing break.

I dont understand your argument.  I understand I can't speak for every Asian.  However, can you find me an Asian family that loves live next to the cemetery.

According to city data, Irvine currently has 40% Asian.  And top 5 buyers of Pavilion Park are Asian. 
http://www.city-data.com/city/Irvine-California.html

As For Costa Mesa, Asian is only 8.6%.  Newport Beach, 7.0% and Huntington Beach 10.5%.
http://www.city-data.com/city/Costa-Mesa-California.html
http://www.city-data.com/city/Newport-Beach-California.html
http://www.city-data.com/city/Huntington-Beach-California.html

If you read this carefully, there are people dont mind live next to the cemetery.  Let's build more cemetery next to their house.

Can't spirits travel between cities?
How many miles away do you need to be to feel safe?
What's the level of asian-american population a city should consider acceptable for cemetery placement?


Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: OCgasman on July 29, 2014, 09:11:35 AM
@OCgasman:

On the proximity question, and maybe partially to qwerty's point, they don't have to use a Veteran's cemetery. That mother can bury her son at Fairhaven or Ascension which is close to Irvine.

I'm assuming there is also a cost benefit to using a Veteran's facility, but if non-military families are able to make due, nothing should prevent her from doing so either.

My qualms with living next to a cemetery would be the additional traffic and visitors on weekends and memorial holidays (not just Veteran's Day but also Mother's Day, Father's Day etc). Do people still remember the movie Poltergeist?
First, nice rebuttal to Qwerty's argument.  Well said.  Qwerty, I don't discount any of your points, but I agree with IHO and O Hills.  Comparing risks between a soldier on the front with someone else in the U.S. isn't really apples to apples.

Besides the potential cost benefit, and I don't know, does the government pay for all funeral services in a national cemetery?  If so, that's not insignificant, cuz funerals are so expensive.  Some armed forces personnel or families of those might prefer to be buried alongside their fellow soldier or in a national cemetery as a reminder they gave their lives in defense of our nation.

I don't worry about traffic or visitors.  It'll be tiny in comparison to all the families that bring their kids to the sports complex for sports.  Parking lots are full just for AYSO, little league baseball/softball/basketball/football/volleyball/etc at tiny little regional parks and schools on weekends.  Now add club and other elite level teams to the rec teams that will use the sports complex and you have thousands going to the sports complex on weekends.  Not to mention the golf course traffic.  The Cemetery will be the least of the concern for traffic in that area.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: Rice Vino on July 29, 2014, 09:17:06 AM
Why the Great Park and not the majestic hills behind it?

(Hint: one location jams 5P, the other does not)
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: bones on July 29, 2014, 09:20:58 AM
zxcv
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: . on July 29, 2014, 09:38:01 AM
I doubt this thing is gonna get built. So in the end - it's all talk.

Why do you doubt?  The bill is already passed by city council.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: qwerty on July 29, 2014, 09:45:21 AM
Quote
No one said that. What was said is it's hard to compare the risks of a farming job that you get paid for to position of duty where dying is an every day possibility.

the military get paid as well, not well, but they get paid.

there were 27 military deaths classified as hostile action in 2010, the last year reported.
https://www.dmdc.osd.mil/dcas/pages/report_number_serve.xhtml

there were 38 fisherman death in 2008 per the link below, its supposed to be 2013 data not sure why they reference 2008 deaths.  Sure seems like those fisherman know death is a possibility every day and yet they still do the job.
http://jobs.aol.com/articles/2013/11/12/the-15-most-dangerous-jobs-in-america/

Quote
That's arguable. Some would say it's not just American freedom being protected there but that's a topic that will never be resolved.

well i think most americans would say that our freedoms probably arent being protected with us in Iraq/Afghanistan.

Quote
Again, it's not the "value". A soldier's life is at risk every day, a teacher's really isn't. You don't see teachers dying daily doing their jobs... but soldiers do... and not because they are paid to, but because that is their duty and they know the risks yet still do it. If you were to tell a teacher that every day, every single student could have a handgun or an IED, I doubt many would show up to work (well... maybe some of these more urban teachers are braver than most).

again, 38 fisherman died in 2008, they go to work knowing death is a real possibility every day. there are other jobs where death is a possibility every day.

Quote
And the fact that is it your view and opinion and that you can express it is a result of what? In other countries, that would not be possible... the very freedoms you possess is related to the wars fought by the soldiers who died fighting them. Not by the teachers, not by the farmers and not by the computer programmers.

this is more the result of a democratic government, not the military.  i know, the past wars allowed the democratic government to give us these freedoms.

Quote
I think sometimes that many of us are spoiled by our way of life in America and in the world. If any of us spend some time in the Middle East or any area that is in turmoil, I think our viewpoints will change.

And, yes, like you, I'm not trying to change your view or opinion, I'm just trying to explain how I look at it. I understand that we shouldn't be "classifying" groups of people but that's not how I see a Veteran's cemetery. If anyone wants to create a teacher's cemetery, a vegetable picker's cemetery, a fire fighter's cemetery... go for it... but the very idea that such a thing can be done is because we have the freedom to do so, and that is a large part of the reason why so many honor and respect the military.

I think it just comes down to perspective and since most of us have lived during a time of peace, we don't feel sense the "value" of military. I'm sure that if a foreign power decided to invade the US and hordes of enemy combatants were attacking Irvine, most of us would "value" soldiers standing around our home than some guys picking fruit or a firefighter. But in our everyday life, yes, the latter seems to have more "value" than the military. :)

i agree that we are spoiled by our way of life and take things for granted. just look at that meme, which was hilarious by the way, about that little kid saying we have so much clean water we actually shit in it.  and just like we are spoiled by the safety the military affords us, we are spoiled by all the other comforts that other people who put their life on the line every day provide for us.  that is all im trying to say. if there were no vegetable pickers or fisherman and you had to pick your own food or fish for yourself, i think we would all of sudden be a little more respectful of those groups. so the argument you make pretty much applies to a lot of different things, which is why i believe one groups is not more honorary than the next.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: ob1 on July 29, 2014, 09:56:55 AM

there were 27 military deaths classified as hostile action in 2010, the last year reported.
https://www.dmdc.osd.mil/dcas/pages/report_number_serve.xhtml
there were 38 fisherman death in 2008 per the link below, its supposed to be 2013 data not sure why they reference 2008 deaths.  Sure seems like those fisherman know death is a possibility every day and yet they still do the job.
http://jobs.aol.com/articles/2013/11/12/the-15-most-dangerous-jobs-in-america/

You lose credibility when you use distorted data to support your position. 
The number of American troops who have died fighting the wars in Iraq and Afghanistan alone totaled 6,802 as of April 2014.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: eyephone on July 29, 2014, 09:57:06 AM
How about looking at this differently. The cemetery wouldn't end up in our backyards. Instead we have chosen to live in the backyard of the El Toro MCAS.

Not everyone lived in this surrounding area when the Marine base was a major contributing part of our region, but it is a fact and this piece of history must be kept as a part of Orange County.

The Preamble to the US Constitution mentions six points, one of which is the provision of a common defense for America and Americans. Every person who wishes to call the United States their home pledges allegiance to this point upon receiving their citizenship. This is not an attempt to argue citizenship, but to emphasize a goal of the USA and a way to honor those who provided for our freedom.

1. There are many military bases that closes in the US. Should the land be kept for military related purposes? I don't understand when you say "must be kept as a piece of history." That's your point of view. If the base (El Torro) was such an asset, the Navy/Pentagon would have not closed the base.

2. Pledge Allegiance has nothing to do with this argument. It means to be loyal to the United States and no other country.

The First Amendment guarantees freedoms concerning religion, expression, assembly, and the right to petition.  It forbids Congress from both promoting one religion over others and also restricting an individual’s religious practices.  It guarantees freedom of expression by prohibiting Congress from restricting the press or the rights of individuals to speak freely.  It also guarantees the right of citizens to assemble peaceably and to petition their government.   

Everybody has a right to their opinion.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: bones on July 29, 2014, 09:57:10 AM
[quote author=yaliu07 link=topic=11986.msg238592#msg238592 dazxcv
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: jmoney74 on July 29, 2014, 10:02:44 AM
I'm kind of indifferent either way.  However, recognize that this Argan guy is trying to buy votes left and right.  He's due to get booted out. 
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: Rice Vino on July 29, 2014, 10:27:12 AM
I'm kind of indifferent either way.  However, recognize that this Argan guy is trying to buy votes left and right.  He's due to get booted out.

Now you're getting it !
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: qwerty on July 29, 2014, 10:40:53 AM

there were 27 military deaths classified as hostile action in 2010, the last year reported.
https://www.dmdc.osd.mil/dcas/pages/report_number_serve.xhtml
there were 38 fisherman death in 2008 per the link below, its supposed to be 2013 data not sure why they reference 2008 deaths.  Sure seems like those fisherman know death is a possibility every day and yet they still do the job.
http://jobs.aol.com/articles/2013/11/12/the-15-most-dangerous-jobs-in-america/

You lose credibility when you use distorted data to support your position. 
The number of American troops who have died fighting the wars in Iraq and Afghanistan alone totaled 6,802 as of April 2014.

i wasnt using distorted data, just what i found, i did say it only went through 2010, didnt intentionally stop there to use certain numbers to make an argument.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: qwerty on July 29, 2014, 10:44:24 AM

there were 27 military deaths classified as hostile action in 2010, the last year reported.
https://www.dmdc.osd.mil/dcas/pages/report_number_serve.xhtml
there were 38 fisherman death in 2008 per the link below, its supposed to be 2013 data not sure why they reference 2008 deaths.  Sure seems like those fisherman know death is a possibility every day and yet they still do the job.
http://jobs.aol.com/articles/2013/11/12/the-15-most-dangerous-jobs-in-america/

You lose credibility when you use distorted data to support your position. 
The number of American troops who have died fighting the wars in Iraq and Afghanistan alone totaled 6,802 as of April 2014.

and as sad as it is, 6,802 people have died - can we objectively say they are protecting our freedom? yes, they are doing work on behalf of our elected politicians but im not quite sure they are dying to protect our freedom. however, still very unfortunate that they had to die.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: Irvinecommuter on July 29, 2014, 11:56:28 AM

there were 27 military deaths classified as hostile action in 2010, the last year reported.
https://www.dmdc.osd.mil/dcas/pages/report_number_serve.xhtml
there were 38 fisherman death in 2008 per the link below, its supposed to be 2013 data not sure why they reference 2008 deaths.  Sure seems like those fisherman know death is a possibility every day and yet they still do the job.
http://jobs.aol.com/articles/2013/11/12/the-15-most-dangerous-jobs-in-america/

You lose credibility when you use distorted data to support your position. 
The number of American troops who have died fighting the wars in Iraq and Afghanistan alone totaled 6,802 as of April 2014.

and as sad as it is, 6,802 people have died - can we objectively say they are protecting our freedom? yes, they are doing work on behalf of our elected politicians but im not quite sure they are dying to protect our freedom. however, still very unfortunate that they had to die.

But that's not really up to the soldiers' to decide.  There are always politicians and wars...some wars are "good" and some are "bad" but soldiers don't decide that.  Does a soldier dying in WW2 more honorable than someone who died in Iraq or Vietnam?
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: qwerty on July 29, 2014, 12:21:03 PM
I've been discussing that no death is more honorable than another.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: Irvinecommuter on July 29, 2014, 12:23:08 PM
I've been discussing that no death is more honorable than another.

But you also make the distinction of death by soldiers in Iraq:

Quote
"can we objectively say they are protecting our freedom? yes, they are doing work on behalf of our elected politicians but im not quite sure they are dying to protect our freedom.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: qwerty on July 29, 2014, 12:29:34 PM
That was to point out that it's not always to protect our freedom
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: Irvinecommuter on July 29, 2014, 12:52:10 PM
That was to point out that it's not always to protect our freedom

Okay...what difference would it make if it was or wasn't. 
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: qwerty on July 29, 2014, 01:05:08 PM
That was to point out that it's not always to protect our freedom



Okay...what difference would it make if it was or wasn't. 

IHO mentioned that he was grateful to the military for dying protecting our freedom. Those soldiers are dying but not protecting our freedom.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: ob1 on July 29, 2014, 01:08:14 PM

there were 27 military deaths classified as hostile action in 2010, the last year reported.
https://www.dmdc.osd.mil/dcas/pages/report_number_serve.xhtml
there were 38 fisherman death in 2008 per the link below, its supposed to be 2013 data not sure why they reference 2008 deaths.  Sure seems like those fisherman know death is a possibility every day and yet they still do the job.
http://jobs.aol.com/articles/2013/11/12/the-15-most-dangerous-jobs-in-america/

You lose credibility when you use distorted data to support your position. 
The number of American troops who have died fighting the wars in Iraq and Afghanistan alone totaled 6,802 as of April 2014.

and as sad as it is, 6,802 people have died - can we objectively say they are protecting our freedom? yes, they are doing work on behalf of our elected politicians but im not quite sure they are dying to protect our freedom. however, still very unfortunate that they had to die.

Do you mean to suggest that we only honor those who we agree objectively protected our freedom?
How do you suppose we make that determination?
Whether you support a war is a separate question from whether you appreciate and honor the fallen. 

But I guess unless you personally feel the impact, you will not appreciate the sacrifice.
These ideas (duty, honor and sacrifice) are apparently too intangible to be meaningful.

This is all academic since the the memorial might not happen and if it does, probably not anywhere near homes.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: irvinehomeowner on July 29, 2014, 01:49:38 PM
That was to point out that it's not always to protect our freedom



Okay...what difference would it make if it was or wasn't. 

IHO mentioned that he was grateful to the military for dying protecting our freedom. Those soldiers are dying but not protecting our freedom.
Actually, you are mixing up the topics.

1. I am grateful to the military... but not for dying to protect our freedom, but for risking their lives to protect not just our freedom but the freedom of many. As I alluded to before, it can be argued that Iraq/Afghanistan is not just for America's "freedom", but for the freedom of many in that area of the world and for the freedom of any nations that will be subjected to terrorism that originates from there. I spoke to someone stationed in Iraq (I believe I mentioned this before), and he stated that no matter what side of this topic you are on, the Iraqis he met are so appreciative that Hussein is no longer in power and for that alone, he felt it was the right thing. Again, this is an arguable point but what I'm trying to convey is it's not just about *American* freedom. It's about a group of people fighting for the ideals/rights of another group of people no matter the risk.

2. You were originally comparing the lives of groups of people, not the deaths. I don't think you can properly make that comparison but that's my opinion.

3. You have now moved over to whose death is more "honorable" than another's. That's not my point, my point was that military puts their lives at greater risk than any other occupation you've mentioned (although you can make the argument for police on a smaller scale). That alone deserves some consideration. Your fisherman comparison was a good attempt but I don't think it measures up. Where is your stat on how many vegetable pickers died in the last year or so? Do you honestly think that the risk to their lives is the same as that of a soldier stationed in the Middle East (regardless of what he is there for)?

Again, I understand what you are saying, but in trying to illustrate your opinion, which I do see, you are muddying mine. Or maybe you just don't see it the way I do, which is fine... but I will clarify if I feel my stance is being misrepresented.

I know what you are really trying to do... you want Irvine to build an Accountants Memorial cemetery. :)
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: ZeroLot on July 29, 2014, 03:59:33 PM

If you read this carefully, there are people dont mind live next to the cemetery.  Let's build more cemetery next to their house.

Just chiming in ... I'm ok with a VETERAN'S cemetery near my house ... Not a Rose Hills. 

What's the difference?

I think IHO made a good point in the difference.  But my mine main case is that we all get "Veteran's Day" off for a reason and it's not to go shopping or get great discounts.

And yes the military comes with many perks and benefits.  But again the Great Park is built on the old El Toro Marine base.  I think it's a great way to give back to El Toro.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: Irvinecommuter on July 29, 2014, 04:30:12 PM

If you read this carefully, there are people dont mind live next to the cemetery.  Let's build more cemetery next to their house.

Just chiming in ... I'm ok with a VETERAN'S cemetery near my house ... Not a Rose Hills. 

What's the difference?

I think IHO made a good point in the difference.  But my mine main case is that we all get "Veteran's Day" off for a reason and it's not to go shopping or get great discounts.

And yes the military comes with many perks and benefits.  But again the Great Park is built on the old El Toro Marine base.  I think it's a great way to give back to El Toro.

It's interesting that they want to do a cemetary...I mean a memorial would probably serve a similar purpose without the concerns.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: irvinehomeshopper on July 29, 2014, 06:28:31 PM
Really? Parents of deceased veterans want to bury their children close by so they can visit them. This logic sounds good then I stopped and think. How many Irvine or Newport Beach kids really are in the military? Santa Ana is likely the city with many children in the military and a veteran cemetery make more sense in Santa Ana than Irvine.

Oh No that is a double whammies. Cemetery and Mexican visitors.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: . on July 31, 2014, 07:59:02 AM
The argument I want to make is location.  We, Asian, dont like cemetery because we believe in ghost.  Why can't the cemetery build in a non-Asian community.
Is this your argument?  Seriously?  You don't speak for every Asian.  Also, nobody wants a cemetery near them.  Why don't you go ask Newport Beach, Costa Mesa, or Huntington Beach if they would rather have the cemetery cuz "Asians are scared of ghosts".  Gimme a f'ing break.

I dont understand your argument.  I understand I can't speak for every Asian.  However, can you find me an Asian family that loves live next to the cemetery.

According to city data, Irvine currently has 40% Asian.  And top 5 buyers of Pavilion Park are Asian. 
http://www.city-data.com/city/Irvine-California.html

As For Costa Mesa, Asian is only 8.6%.  Newport Beach, 7.0% and Huntington Beach 10.5%.
http://www.city-data.com/city/Costa-Mesa-California.html
http://www.city-data.com/city/Newport-Beach-California.html
http://www.city-data.com/city/Huntington-Beach-California.html

If you read this carefully, there are people dont mind live next to the cemetery.  Let's build more cemetery next to their house.

What I'm saying is that nobody, no matter what race, wants to have a cemetery in close proximity to where they live, just human nature with the potential depreciation, bad luck, etc.  But, using an ethnocentric argument that Asians prefer it less than other races holds no water.  Just like WTTCMN said, your viewpoint is classic "Not In My Backyard".  You have to come up with a better reason than "Asians are scared of ghosts", cuz quite frankly, that sounds stupid. 

I don't know the reasons why Irvine City Council proposed the Veteran's Cemetery and Memorial.  And at this point it doesn't matter, cuz the proposal is out there.  But, it would be a difficult public protest in the face of families who have lost loved ones in protection of our nation.  What are you going to say to them?  Drive an extra hour to Riverside County to pay respects to your son/daughter/father/mother/brother/sister because Asians don't want a Veteran's Cemetery near their neighborhood?  If that's your argument, I want no part of it.  You have to come up with something more tangible, because it has to face public scrutiny.  Asians usually hate public confrontation and this is what it will come down to, a battle of public opinion.  How are you going to argue against a crying mother who wants to visit her dead son in a nearby location who lost his life in defense of our country?  And make that argument with a reporter sticking a microphone in your face with a camera on.  Good luck with that.

According to their poll, 80 percent said it wouldn't bother them to live near a cemetery.  (See below for reference).   Again, I argue on the location. Why does the cemetery has to be next to the residential area and why does the cemetery has to be next to the park?  Do the dead really need a place to play golf and basketball?

http://m.voiceofoc.org/healthy_communities/health_news/article_75867eac-56ac-11e3-b250-001a4bcf887a.html?mode=jqm

Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: ob1 on July 31, 2014, 10:22:51 AM
Really? Parents of deceased veterans want to bury their children close by so they can visit them. This logic sounds good then I stopped and think. How many Irvine or Newport Beach kids really are in the military? Santa Ana is likely the city with many children in the military and a veteran cemetery make more sense in Santa Ana than Irvine.

Oh No that is a double whammies. Cemetery and Mexican visitors.

I can hear the protest chants now:  "No Ghosts! No Mexicans!  Survival of the Fittest!"
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: . on July 31, 2014, 01:53:55 PM
Really? Parents of deceased veterans want to bury their children close by so they can visit them. This logic sounds good then I stopped and think. How many Irvine or Newport Beach kids really are in the military? Santa Ana is likely the city with many children in the military and a veteran cemetery make more sense in Santa Ana than Irvine.

Oh No that is a double whammies. Cemetery and Mexican visitors.

I can hear the protest chants now:  "No Ghosts! No Mexicans!  Survival of the Fittest!"

...
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: OCgasman on July 31, 2014, 02:01:46 PM
If I want certain race in my backyard, I will buy home in Santa Ana.  If I want ghost in my backyard, I will buy home in Whittier.  But, when I am paying for such high price home and high property tax in Irvine, I dont want see neither.
<shaking head> I don't even know what to say about your race comment.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: ob1 on July 31, 2014, 02:30:21 PM
If I want certain race in my backyard, I will buy home in Santa Ana.  If I want ghost in my backyard, I will buy home in Whittier.  But, when I am paying for such high price home and high property tax in Irvine, I dont want see neither.
<shaking head> I don't even know what to say about your race comment.


If that's the first time you're shaking your head, you must be new to this thread.   ;)
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: GH on July 31, 2014, 02:34:08 PM
If I want certain race in my backyard, I will buy home in Santa Ana.  If I want ghost in my backyard, I will buy home in Whittier.  But, when I am paying for such high price home and high property tax in Irvine, I dont want see neither.
<shaking head> I don't even know what to say about your race comment.

At least he/she speaks out his/her mind rather than trying to be politically correct  :P  I wouldn't be surprised if majority of the FCBs in Irvine feels the same way but are just trying to be politically correct.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: ob1 on July 31, 2014, 02:36:04 PM
If I want certain race in my backyard, I will buy home in Santa Ana.  If I want ghost in my backyard, I will buy home in Whittier.  But, when I am paying for such high price home and high property tax in Irvine, I dont want see neither.
<shaking head> I don't even know what to say about your race comment.

At least he/she speaks out his/her mind rather than trying to be politically correct  :P  I wouldn't be surprised if majority of the FCBs in Irvine feels the same way but are just trying to be politically correct.

Have you ever met a FCB that had any concern about being politically correct?
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: GH on July 31, 2014, 02:38:35 PM
If I want certain race in my backyard, I will buy home in Santa Ana.  If I want ghost in my backyard, I will buy home in Whittier.  But, when I am paying for such high price home and high property tax in Irvine, I dont want see neither.
<shaking head> I don't even know what to say about your race comment.

At least he/she speaks out his/her mind rather than trying to be politically correct  :P  I wouldn't be surprised if majority of the FCBs in Irvine feels the same way but are just trying to be politically correct.

Have you ever met a FCB that had any concern about being politically correct?

ok .. wrong term.. FCB just not expressing out for fear of consequence.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: ob1 on July 31, 2014, 03:23:22 PM
If I want certain race in my backyard, I will buy home in Santa Ana.  If I want ghost in my backyard, I will buy home in Whittier.  But, when I am paying for such high price home and high property tax in Irvine, I dont want see neither.
<shaking head> I don't even know what to say about your race comment.

At least he/she speaks out his/her mind rather than trying to be politically correct  :P  I wouldn't be surprised if majority of the FCBs in Irvine feels the same way but are just trying to be politically correct.

Have you ever met a FCB that had any concern about being politically correct?

ok .. wrong term.. FCB just not expressing out for fear of consequence.

No, that was probably the right term, it just seems you're hangin with a better class of FCBs than I am.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: qwerty on July 31, 2014, 03:49:12 PM
Really? Parents of deceased veterans want to bury their children close by so they can visit them. This logic sounds good then I stopped and think. How many Irvine or Newport Beach kids really are in the military? Santa Ana is likely the city with many children in the military and a veteran cemetery make more sense in Santa Ana than Irvine.

Oh No that is a double whammies. Cemetery and Mexican visitors.

I can hear the protest chants now:  "No Ghosts! No Mexicans!  Survival of the Fittest!"

If I want certain race in my backyard, I will buy home in Santa Ana.  If I want ghost in my backyard, I will buy home in Whittier.  But, when I am paying for such high price home and high property tax in Irvine, I dont want see neither.

man, i can only imagine what you would say if you had a black neighbor.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: eyephone on July 31, 2014, 04:00:45 PM
If I want certain race in my backyard, I will buy home in Santa Ana.  If I want ghost in my backyard, I will buy home in Whittier.  But, when I am paying for such high price home and high property tax in Irvine, I dont want see neither.
<shaking head> I don't even know what to say about your race comment.

At least he/she speaks out his/her mind rather than trying to be politically correct  :P  I wouldn't be surprised if majority of the FCBs in Irvine feels the same way but are just trying to be politically correct.

Have you ever met a FCB that had any concern about being politically correct?

ok .. wrong term.. FCB just not expressing out for fear of consequence.

I wonder if the builders at PP disclosed the potential cemetery to the buyers.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: jmoney74 on July 31, 2014, 04:07:34 PM
If I want certain race in my backyard, I will buy home in Santa Ana.  If I want ghost in my backyard, I will buy home in Whittier.  But, when I am paying for such high price home and high property tax in Irvine, I dont want see neither.
<shaking head> I don't even know what to say about your race comment.

At least he/she speaks out his/her mind rather than trying to be politically correct  :P  I wouldn't be surprised if majority of the FCBs in Irvine feels the same way but are just trying to be politically correct.

Have you ever met a FCB that had any concern about being politically correct?

ok .. wrong term.. FCB just not expressing out for fear of consequence.

I wonder if the builders at PP disclosed the potential cemetery to the buyers.

Are they even required to?  Not like it's in view of PP. 
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: ob1 on July 31, 2014, 04:10:21 PM
Really? Parents of deceased veterans want to bury their children close by so they can visit them. This logic sounds good then I stopped and think. How many Irvine or Newport Beach kids really are in the military? Santa Ana is likely the city with many children in the military and a veteran cemetery make more sense in Santa Ana than Irvine.

Oh No that is a double whammies. Cemetery and Mexican visitors.


I can hear the protest chants now:  "No Ghosts! No Mexicans!  Survival of the Fittest!"

If I want certain race in my backyard, I will buy home in Santa Ana.  If I want ghost in my backyard, I will buy home in Whittier.  But, when I am paying for such high price home and high property tax in Irvine, I dont want see neither.

man, i can only imagine what you would say if you had a black neighbor.

Imagine a black soldier burried in the nearby cemetery.  #completeFCBfreakout #canghostsbeblack?
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: tooslow4u on July 31, 2014, 04:18:18 PM

If I want certain race in my backyard, I will buy home in Santa Ana.  If I want ghost in my backyard, I will buy home in Whittier.  But, when I am paying for such high price home and high property tax in Irvine, I dont want see neither.

Yea well I'm "paying for such high price home and high property tax in Irvine, [as well, and] I dont want" people like you living next to me. You give us Asians a bad name.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: ob1 on July 31, 2014, 04:18:39 PM
If I want certain race in my backyard, I will buy home in Santa Ana.  If I want ghost in my backyard, I will buy home in Whittier.  But, when I am paying for such high price home and high property tax in Irvine, I dont want see neither.
<shaking head> I don't even know what to say about your race comment.

At least he/she speaks out his/her mind rather than trying to be politically correct  :P  I wouldn't be surprised if majority of the FCBs in Irvine feels the same way but are just trying to be politically correct.

Have you ever met a FCB that had any concern about being politically correct?

ok .. wrong term.. FCB just not expressing out for fear of consequence.

I wonder if the builders at PP disclosed the potential cemetery to the buyers.

Are they even required to?  Not like it's in view of PP.

It's probably more a matter of timing. 
Builders disclose anything that might potentially be an issue.
For OH, they even listed the former Marine Corp. Air Station Tustin (the District), which is about 6 miles away.

I'm not sure the cemetery was on the radar until recently.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: eyephone on July 31, 2014, 04:24:12 PM
If I want certain race in my backyard, I will buy home in Santa Ana.  If I want ghost in my backyard, I will buy home in Whittier.  But, when I am paying for such high price home and high property tax in Irvine, I dont want see neither.
<shaking head> I don't even know what to say about your race comment.

At least he/she speaks out his/her mind rather than trying to be politically correct  :P  I wouldn't be surprised if majority of the FCBs in Irvine feels the same way but are just trying to be politically correct.

Have you ever met a FCB that had any concern about being politically correct?

ok .. wrong term.. FCB just not expressing out for fear of consequence.

I wonder if the builders at PP disclosed the potential cemetery to the buyers.

Are they even required to?  Not like it's in view of PP.

Possibly. Maybe yaliu can sue the builder and 5P for non disclosure.
(I pay all cash, nobody told me)
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: jmoney74 on July 31, 2014, 04:32:02 PM
I think we'll mostly likely see a memorial.. rather than full blown cemetery.  I know the Golf Course is a full green light.. next to cemetery?  Doesn't made sense.  This Argan clown was also blocking an audit on the Great Park scandal and he also tried to block the build of HS #5.. whatever he can do to garner more votes I guess.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: jmoney74 on July 31, 2014, 04:35:13 PM
All these politicians crumble in front of vets.

With the overflowing crowd of veterans,even Choi and Shea voted in favor of the vets to make it a unanimous result. Watching the discussion however, It was almost embarrassing to watch Choi slobber over Supervisor Todd Spitzer’s efforts to hijack the Great Park site to anywhere else in his district including the Saddleback Vineyard site that offers limited space and perhaps 40 developable acres.

The folks at Five Point and their army of consultants will likely shift their attention to Spitzer’s efforts to move the Cemetery and Memorial anywhere but the Great Park.  A battle was won last night but the war continues.  FivePoint has the right of first refusal in 2017 for that parcel, and should they deny the Vet’s a resting place at the Great Park, even Emile Haddad’s millions won’t help them.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: eyephone on July 31, 2014, 04:44:49 PM
All these politicians crumble in front of vets.

With the overflowing crowd of veterans,even Choi and Shea voted in favor of the vets to make it a unanimous result. Watching the discussion however, It was almost embarrassing to watch Choi slobber over Supervisor Todd Spitzer’s efforts to hijack the Great Park site to anywhere else in his district including the Saddleback Vineyard site that offers limited space and perhaps 40 developable acres.

The folks at Five Point and their army of consultants will likely shift their attention to Spitzer’s efforts to move the Cemetery and Memorial anywhere but the Great Park.  A battle was won last night but the war continues.  FivePoint has the right of first refusal in 2017 for that parcel, and should they deny the Vet’s a resting place at the Great Park, even Emile Haddad’s millions won’t help them.
I think 5p will move it also, there are more homes to be sold at GP.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: bones on July 31, 2014, 05:01:37 PM
asdf
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: irvinehomeowner on July 31, 2014, 05:39:09 PM
#canghostsbeblack?
Nominated for TI hashtag of the day.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: bones on July 31, 2014, 05:44:15 PM
[quotasdf
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: . on August 07, 2014, 08:13:47 AM
Any latest news?
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: irvinehomeshopper on August 09, 2014, 02:02:34 PM


A Veteran cemetery is where veterans are buried who could have died in battle or passed long after serving our country.

That was to point out that it's not always to protect our freedom



Okay...what difference would it make if it was or wasn't. 

IHO mentioned that he was grateful to the military for dying protecting our freedom. Those soldiers are dying but not protecting our freedom.
Actually, you are mixing up the topics.

1. I am grateful to the military... but not for dying to protect our freedom, but for risking their lives to protect not just our freedom but the freedom of many. As I alluded to before, it can be argued that Iraq/Afghanistan is not just for America's "freedom", but for the freedom of many in that area of the world and for the freedom of any nations that will be subjected to terrorism that originates from there. I spoke to someone stationed in Iraq (I believe I mentioned this before), and he stated that no matter what side of this topic you are on, the Iraqis he met are so appreciative that Hussein is no longer in power and for that alone, he felt it was the right thing. Again, this is an arguable point but what I'm trying to convey is it's not just about *American* freedom. It's about a group of people fighting for the ideals/rights of another group of people no matter the risk.

2. You were originally comparing the lives of groups of people, not the deaths. I don't think you can properly make that comparison but that's my opinion.

3. You have now moved over to whose death is more "honorable" than another's. That's not my point, my point was that military puts their lives at greater risk than any other occupation you've mentioned (although you can make the argument for police on a smaller scale). That alone deserves some consideration. Your fisherman comparison was a good attempt but I don't think it measures up. Where is your stat on how many vegetable pickers died in the last year or so? Do you honestly think that the risk to their lives is the same as that of a soldier stationed in the Middle East (regardless of what he is there for)?

Again, I understand what you are saying, but in trying to illustrate your opinion, which I do see, you are muddying mine. Or maybe you just don't see it the way I do, which is fine... but I will clarify if I feel my stance is being misrepresented.

I know what you are really trying to do... you want Irvine to build an Accountants Memorial cemetery. :)
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: irvinehomeshopper on August 09, 2014, 02:36:07 PM
I bet all of FOBFCBs think what you just mentioned. They just bought their final exit strategy for investing $500,000 here.


If you read this carefully, there are people dont mind live next to the cemetery.  Let's build more cemetery next to their house.

Just chiming in ... I'm ok with a VETERAN'S cemetery near my house ... Not a Rose Hills. 

What's the difference?

I think IHO made a good point in the difference.  But my mine main case is that we all get "Veteran's Day" off for a reason and it's not to go shopping or get great discounts.

And yes the military comes with many perks and benefits.  But again the Great Park is built on the old El Toro Marine base.  I think it's a great way to give back to El Toro.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: irvinehomeshopper on August 09, 2014, 02:46:39 PM
I made a point never to live among FCBs. I don't know how all of you could take that day after day. I feel there is a lost of dignity if you subject yourself to live among the rude and entitled because the smell of money and home appreciation are more important in your value system.

If I want certain race in my backyard, I will buy home in Santa Ana.  If I want ghost in my backyard, I will buy home in Whittier.  But, when I am paying for such high price home and high property tax in Irvine, I dont want see neither.
<shaking head> I don't even know what to say about your race comment.

At least he/she speaks out his/her mind rather than trying to be politically correct  :P  I wouldn't be surprised if majority of the FCBs in Irvine feels the same way but are just trying to be politically correct.

Have you ever met a FCB that had any concern about being politically correct?

ok .. wrong term.. FCB just not expressing out for fear of consequence.

No, that was probably the right term, it just seems you're hangin with a better class of FCBs than I am.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: . on August 09, 2014, 05:18:04 PM
The state Assembly bill to establish a veterans cemetery in Southern California is "in suspense" after consideration by the appropriations committee Monday.

http://www.dailypilot.com/news/tn-dpt-me-0809-vet-cemetery-20140808,0,7273349.story?track=rss
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: bones on August 26, 2014, 10:03:42 PM
Upasdf
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: jmoney74 on August 26, 2014, 10:11:09 PM
Update:
http://m.ocregister.com/articles/-632858--.html

Highlight:
City News Service spoke to Orange County Supervisor John Moorlach, who supports having a veterans cemetery in Orange County but said political leaders advocating for it ought to be honest with veterans and their supporters that it is a long shot.

“What I have real trouble with is you’re manipulating veterans with such a low likelihood of getting the funding,” Moorlach told City News Service.

“When you kind of give out hope – when the chance of getting funding is so remote – and then use it in campaign mail pieces to say, ‘Hey, I’m doing this for veterans,’ then you’re manipulating a group of people I’m very sensitive to.”

Someone needs to expose Argan for trying to manipulate voters.. the doooode has to go!
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: eyephone on August 26, 2014, 10:39:12 PM
The state Assembly bill to establish a veterans cemetery in Southern California is "in suspense" after consideration by the appropriations committee Monday.

http://www.dailypilot.com/news/tn-dpt-me-0809-vet-cemetery-20140808,0,7273349.story?track=rss

Express your opinion and contact assemblywoman Sharon Quirk-Silva (D-Fullerton). This is interesting, she is the author of the bill AB 1453, but she doesn't even represent IRVINE. She represents Buena Park, Cypress, Fullerton, Hawaiian Gardens, La Palma, Stanton and West Anaheim.

A lot of cities support the cemetery. (You know how it goes. I support it - as long as it is not in my city)
http://asmdc.org/members/a65/attachments/ab_1453_factsheet_sqs_letterhead-updated.pdf

Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: . on August 26, 2014, 11:42:55 PM
Update:
http://m.ocregister.com/articles/-632858--.html

Highlight:
City News Service spoke to Orange County Supervisor John Moorlach, who supports having a veterans cemetery in Orange County but said political leaders advocating for it ought to be honest with veterans and their supporters that it is a long shot.

“What I have real trouble with is you’re manipulating veterans with such a low likelihood of getting the funding,” Moorlach told City News Service.

“When you kind of give out hope – when the chance of getting funding is so remote – and then use it in campaign mail pieces to say, ‘Hey, I’m doing this for veterans,’ then you’re manipulating a group of people I’m very sensitive to.”

think it is too late..  :(   most likely governor is going to sign it and eventually they will have funding to build the cemetery.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: jmoney74 on August 27, 2014, 07:02:16 AM
Update:
http://m.ocregister.com/articles/-632858--.html

Highlight:
City News Service spoke to Orange County Supervisor John Moorlach, who supports having a veterans cemetery in Orange County but said political leaders advocating for it ought to be honest with veterans and their supporters that it is a long shot.

“What I have real trouble with is you’re manipulating veterans with such a low likelihood of getting the funding,” Moorlach told City News Service.

“When you kind of give out hope – when the chance of getting funding is so remote – and then use it in campaign mail pieces to say, ‘Hey, I’m doing this for veterans,’ then you’re manipulating a group of people I’m very sensitive to.”

think it is too late..  :(   most likely governor is going to sign it and eventually they will have funding to build the cemetery.

Sources?
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: . on August 27, 2014, 07:15:36 AM
Update:
http://m.ocregister.com/articles/-632858--.html

Highlight:
City News Service spoke to Orange County Supervisor John Moorlach, who supports having a veterans cemetery in Orange County but said political leaders advocating for it ought to be honest with veterans and their supporters that it is a long shot.

“What I have real trouble with is you’re manipulating veterans with such a low likelihood of getting the funding,” Moorlach told City News Service.

“When you kind of give out hope – when the chance of getting funding is so remote – and then use it in campaign mail pieces to say, ‘Hey, I’m doing this for veterans,’ then you’re manipulating a group of people I’m very sensitive to.”

think it is too late..  :(   most likely governor is going to sign it and eventually they will have funding to build the cemetery.

Sources?

No sources.  just guess...
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: jmoney74 on August 27, 2014, 07:50:56 AM
Update:
http://m.ocregister.com/articles/-632858--.html

Highlight:
City News Service spoke to Orange County Supervisor John Moorlach, who supports having a veterans cemetery in Orange County but said political leaders advocating for it ought to be honest with veterans and their supporters that it is a long shot.

“What I have real trouble with is you’re manipulating veterans with such a low likelihood of getting the funding,” Moorlach told City News Service.

“When you kind of give out hope – when the chance of getting funding is so remote – and then use it in campaign mail pieces to say, ‘Hey, I’m doing this for veterans,’ then you’re manipulating a group of people I’m very sensitive to.”

think it is too late..  :(   most likely governor is going to sign it and eventually they will have funding to build the cemetery.

Sources?

No sources.  just guess...

would be interesting to see if it does even get approved.  The state has no money. 
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: OCgasman on August 27, 2014, 08:19:50 AM
Couldn't there be some federal funding since it's a national memorial and cemetery?
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: eyephone on August 27, 2014, 10:24:24 AM
http://www.fivepointcommunities.com/contact-us/

Voice your opinion and contact five point communities. (I don't know if they can do anything, but it's worth a shot.) there is a phone number and address on their website.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: . on August 27, 2014, 10:43:06 AM
Update:
http://m.ocregister.com/articles/-632858--.html

Highlight:
City News Service spoke to Orange County Supervisor John Moorlach, who supports having a veterans cemetery in Orange County but said political leaders advocating for it ought to be honest with veterans and their supporters that it is a long shot.

“What I have real trouble with is you’re manipulating veterans with such a low likelihood of getting the funding,” Moorlach told City News Service.

“When you kind of give out hope – when the chance of getting funding is so remote – and then use it in campaign mail pieces to say, ‘Hey, I’m doing this for veterans,’ then you’re manipulating a group of people I’m very sensitive to.”

think it is too late..  :(   most likely governor is going to sign it and eventually they will have funding to build the cemetery.

Sources?

No sources.  just guess...

would be interesting to see if it does even get approved.  The state has no money.

they may just raise tax.  it will be funny that we have to pay and it devalue our home....
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: The California Court Company on September 04, 2014, 08:47:05 AM
Larry Agran is as corrupted as it can get and has too many cronies. Every time near the election, there is always some fake Irvine community news that carry only positive articles on Larry and his cronies. maybe we should start a TI thread to expose Larry.


Update:
http://m.ocregister.com/articles/-632858--.html

Highlight:
City News Service spoke to Orange County Supervisor John Moorlach, who supports having a veterans cemetery in Orange County but said political leaders advocating for it ought to be honest with veterans and their supporters that it is a long shot.

“What I have real trouble with is you’re manipulating veterans with such a low likelihood of getting the funding,” Moorlach told City News Service.

“When you kind of give out hope – when the chance of getting funding is so remote – and then use it in campaign mail pieces to say, ‘Hey, I’m doing this for veterans,’ then you’re manipulating a group of people I’m very sensitive to.”

Someone needs to expose Argan for trying to manipulate voters.. the doooode has to go!
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: Bullsback on September 04, 2014, 09:06:57 AM
Yeah...Agran is such a joke and completely crooked. Sad part is, I actually agree with some of the stuff. I think it is a travesty how dense our city planners are allowing the new projects and developments to be. But insert any Agran supporter somewhere to fix the problem....LOL.  Great Park...guy made millions and robbed us blindly. He's just as bad as those clowns from the city of bell. 
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: traceimage on September 04, 2014, 10:14:19 AM
ewspap
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: momopi on September 04, 2014, 03:52:58 PM
Really? Parents of deceased veterans want to bury their children close by so they can visit them. This logic sounds good then I stopped and think. How many Irvine or Newport Beach kids really are in the military? Santa Ana is likely the city with many children in the military and a veteran cemetery make more sense in Santa Ana than Irvine.

Oh No that is a double whammies. Cemetery and Mexican visitors.

I can hear the protest chants now:  "No Ghosts! No Mexicans!  Survival of the Fittest!"

If I want certain race in my backyard, I will buy home in Santa Ana.  If I want ghost in my backyard, I will buy home in Whittier.  But, when I am paying for such high price home and high property tax in Irvine, I dont want see neither.


According to the government of South Africa, all Chinese are reclassified as blacks.  I hope "a certain race" does not mean Black or Chinese.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/africa/7461099.stm

Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: . on September 29, 2014, 11:08:01 AM
Governer signed the bill...

http://www.ocregister.com/articles/veterans-636538-cemetery-county.html
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: eyephone on September 29, 2014, 11:10:29 AM
I wonder if there will be more traffic.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: test on September 29, 2014, 02:10:20 PM
Why is someone in Fullerton lobbying someone in Sacramento to use federal tax money to build a cemetery in Irvine?
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: aquabliss on September 29, 2014, 02:17:36 PM
People will be dying to get into this place...
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: . on September 30, 2014, 07:47:34 AM
Why is someone in Fullerton lobbying someone in Sacramento to use federal tax money to build a cemetery in Irvine?
EXACTLY
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: . on September 30, 2014, 08:18:01 AM
IS this a done deal???  Veteran Cemetery WILL COME???  Anything that 5point can do?
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: irvinehomeowner on September 30, 2014, 08:40:58 AM
Maybe black walls keep ghosts out?
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: Irvinecommuter on September 30, 2014, 08:46:59 AM
IS this a done deal???  Veteran Cemetery WILL COME???  Anything that 5point can do?

Don't know if it will come but no 5 points have nothing to say about it.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: RandomLetters on September 30, 2014, 08:51:48 AM
IS this a done deal???  Veteran Cemetery WILL COME???  Anything that 5point can do?

There will be lots of bargains in PP as FCBs start #theGreatGhostExodus.

Yaliu you should PM USCTrojan before he gets too busy.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: Homer_Simpson on September 30, 2014, 09:07:31 AM
If the cemetery gets built.... The FCB's will all leave and it'll be Lake Forest...
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: RandomLetters on September 30, 2014, 09:13:15 AM
If the cemetery gets built.... The FCB's will all leave and it'll be Lake Forest...

The question is will they flee all of Irvine or just PP?
The answer will depend on how far ghosts can freely travel.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: test on October 21, 2014, 01:36:29 PM
That's a LARGE cemetery.  The Great Undead Park?

(http://images.onset.freedom.com/ocregister//nd3rto-statevetscem.gif)


Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: irvinehomeowner on October 21, 2014, 01:53:56 PM
Military trained zombies/ghosts are scary.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: . on October 26, 2014, 12:25:08 AM
IS this a done deal???  Veteran Cemetery WILL COME???  Anything that 5point can do?

Don't know if it will come but no 5 points have nothing to say about it.

I read somewhere that 5P still have the right to reject by 2017...

Quote
The area is south of Irvine Boulevard, across from FivePoint Communities’ Great Park Neighborhoods homes and near a future high school. While it’s the city’s land to give, Irvine has an agreement with the developer barring the city from developing it before the end of 2017. And even then, FivePoint has the first right of refusal before the city can transfer the land to someone else, something that City Attorney Jeff Melching has said shouldn’t affect a cemetery plan.

http://www.ocregister.com/articles/state-629589-veterans-city.html
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: IrvineLife on October 28, 2014, 10:22:33 AM
http://www.cityofirvine.org/cityhall/citymanager/proposed_southern_california_state_veterans_cemetery/default.asp
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: test on October 28, 2014, 10:50:16 AM
http://www.cityofirvine.org/cityhall/citymanager/proposed_southern_california_state_veterans_cemetery/default.asp

This looks like a ploy by TIC.  That cemetery will decimate housing at the GP, and decimate 5P in the process.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: IrvineLife on October 28, 2014, 02:00:23 PM
We should propose to build the cemetery in Fullerton where the Assemblywoman Quirk-Silva represents!!  She's the one who proposed this!!
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: eyephone on October 28, 2014, 02:10:19 PM
We should propose to build the cemetery in Fullerton where the Assemblywoman Quirk-Silva represents!!  She's the one who proposed this!!

You said it not me.  ;)
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: eyephone on October 30, 2014, 08:07:42 PM
We should propose to build the cemetery in Fullerton where the Assemblywoman Quirk-Silva represents!!  She's the one who proposed this!!

I have a solution. I will post another link to another thread shortly.

http://www.talkirvine.com/index.php/topic,12393.0.html
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: test on October 31, 2014, 09:13:52 AM
If you don't want the cemetery vote Choi

http://www.theliberaloc.com/2014/10/30/is-chois-planning-commissioner-promising-to-kill-veterans-cemetery/

Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: momopi on October 31, 2014, 10:39:33 AM
Hmmm.  If the cemetary was built, would it make nearby homes more affordable?
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: test on October 31, 2014, 10:40:57 AM
http://1001politics.blogspot.com/
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: irvinehomeowner on October 31, 2014, 10:53:10 AM
Hmmm.  If the cemetary was built, would it make nearby homes more affordable?


Just the ghost view lots. :)
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: irvinehusky on October 31, 2014, 12:59:47 PM
When I see a cemetery, I always think I would never buy the houses adjacent to it.  And, I would not buy anything remotely near it.  How far away would housing have to be from the cemetery to undo that "not near the cemetery" effect for you folks?  I would have to say at least a few miles.  How about you?   

Hmmm.  If the cemetary was built, would it make nearby homes more affordable?


Just the ghost view lots. :)
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: zubs on October 31, 2014, 01:07:28 PM
Cemetaries will cause housing to go down.  They should really only allow cemeteries in the ghetto.
This also goes for nuclear waste and garbage dumps.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: momopi on October 31, 2014, 02:22:25 PM
Hmmm.  If the cemetary was built, would it make nearby homes more affordable?
Just the ghost view lots. :)


If the price is low enough, I'd be happy to buy one.

One of my first jobs out of HS was setting up computers and data entry at a mortuary.  Look on the bight side, the dead won't play loud music, park in front of your house, increase congestion/traffic, or disturb the peace.  Also the dead and buried cannot sell their plot to someone who's alive and obnoxious.  And if you want to switch to a new profession in necromancy, it'd be convenient to have a graveyard nearby.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: irvinehomeowner on October 31, 2014, 02:46:34 PM
@momopi:

But in case of a Thrillerpocalypse... you are in trouble.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: The California Court Company on October 31, 2014, 02:56:41 PM
Yup. more affordable housing in Irvine is a good thing. People like SoCal now will be able to buy in Irvine. It will also help offset the white flight trend. 
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: test on October 31, 2014, 03:12:47 PM
Yup. more affordable housing in Irvine is a good thing. People like SoCal now will be able to buy in Irvine. It will also help offset the white flight trend. 


All the whites will be in GP by the cemetery.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: eyephone on October 31, 2014, 04:41:04 PM
Yup. more affordable housing in Irvine is a good thing. People like SoCal now will be able to buy in Irvine. It will also help offset the white flight trend. 


All the whites will be in GP by the cemetery.

So test, are you upgrading Portola Springs and downgrading GP due to the cemetary?
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: test on October 31, 2014, 10:40:09 PM
Yup. more affordable housing in Irvine is a good thing. People like SoCal now will be able to buy in Irvine. It will also help offset the white flight trend. 


All the whites will be in GP by the cemetery.

So test, are you upgrading Portola Springs and downgrading GP due to the cemetary?

Cemetery downgrades PS even more since now you'll need to drive by the cemetery every day just to get home to PS.  GP is definitely a goner.  This further upgrades CV, WB, SG which are all TIC properties and will all go the HS #6, part of TIC's master plan it seems to me.


Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: oc_dreamer on November 03, 2014, 03:45:16 PM
http://1001politics.blogspot.com/
Those pdf documents on dropbox are apparently being mailed out to registered voters who indicated a Chinese ethnicity. We received a paper copy of them at my household. It is interesting how voters with a Chinese background are being targeted in this election. We've received several mailers that were so targeted and claimed that certain candidates were anti-Chinese, etc, etc.

As a person of Irish ancestry, I've been waiting for a leprechaun pamphlet to arrive in my mailbox to tell me how to vote. Sadly none has appeared. I guess I'll have to decide for myself.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: Jo on November 03, 2014, 10:43:23 PM
Definitely not voting for Agran.  When he promised that the great park would be to Irvine what Central Park is to NY, I definitely did not imagine a cemetery to be part of the vision.  Very disappointed in our councilmen.  Are they representing the residents of Irvine or just pulling a move for popularity?  It's just morbid to have kids playing next to the cemetery. I live close to the park and very disappointed that my representatives did not vote on my or my community's interest. I hope he is not re-elected.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: The California Court Company on November 04, 2014, 11:48:02 AM
Agran knows public opinion is not on his side; it is really difficult to justify 200+ millions with a giant balloon, a handful of Palm trees and a couple of soccer fields. He is trying to win votes by getting veterans' support and using the slow growth slogan. Probably a calculated move as the number of PP residents is probably smaller than veterans and their family.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: GH on November 04, 2014, 12:13:13 PM

Cemetery downgrades PS even more since now you'll need to drive by the cemetery every day just to get home to PS.  GP is definitely a goner.  This further upgrades CV, WB, SG which are all TIC properties and will all go the HS #6, part of TIC's master plan it seems to me.

PS resident doesn't really need to pass by the cemetery to go home unless they come from the Lake Forest / Foothill Ranch area through Irvine Blvd and this goes the same for CV, WB and SG resident.  With regards to distance to the cemetery, direct distance wise, most part of PS is about the same direct distance with CV and WB, so am not really sure how the cemetery would downgrade PS but upgrade CV and WB.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: The California Court Company on November 04, 2014, 12:57:30 PM
I think Test meant this:
Portola High/HS#5 is next to the cemetery. GP neighborhoods are assigned to HS#5, for certain.

IUSD will have to build HS#6 in the future, and CV/SG/WB (TIC hoods) are probably going to be assigned to HS#6, so not proximate to the cemetery.


Cemetery downgrades PS even more since now you'll need to drive by the cemetery every day just to get home to PS.  GP is definitely a goner.  This further upgrades CV, WB, SG which are all TIC properties and will all go the HS #6, part of TIC's master plan it seems to me.

PS resident doesn't really need to pass by the cemetery to go home unless they come from the Lake Forest / Foothill Ranch area through Irvine Blvd and this goes the same for CV, WB and SG resident.  With regards to distance to the cemetery, direct distance wise, most part of PS is about the same direct distance with CV and WB, so am not really sure how the cemetery would downgrade PS but upgrade CV and WB.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: jmoney74 on November 04, 2014, 01:27:58 PM
Vote Yuliu... he will put a stop to this!
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: irvinehomeshopper on November 04, 2014, 04:08:47 PM
Not to worry when Suklee runs and win the next term he will nail shut the cemetery in the coffin and ship it out of Irvine.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: . on November 05, 2014, 06:50:22 AM
with Agran and Silva lost in this election, what's the chance the cemetery still get build in GP?
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: jmoney74 on November 05, 2014, 07:03:18 AM
I think the question is.. what can be done to reverse it since it's already been signed off by Gov. Brown? 
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: irvinehomeshopper on November 05, 2014, 05:55:40 PM
The State can't force Irvine to build a cemetery if the local jurisdiction and politicians decide to overturn the decision if it is culturally unfit and has a negative land use effect.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: . on November 05, 2014, 09:21:59 PM
see attachment
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: jmoney74 on November 05, 2014, 09:39:54 PM
see attachment

Yaliu.. please run for mayor!
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: . on November 05, 2014, 09:56:24 PM
see attachment

Yaliu.. please run for mayor!

Nah, i am voting for qwerty.  we need someone with big bat... 
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: jmoney74 on November 06, 2014, 12:19:12 AM
who can take this thing to the Interwebs?  I see the petitions going around.. but nothing online yet.  Someone start one and send it to our new council!
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: The California Court Company on November 06, 2014, 09:10:41 AM
just handing out flyers in Ranch 99s and Zion. Organize the Asian mobs
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: . on November 20, 2014, 08:53:51 AM
There is online petition to relocate veteran cemetery. 

http://icity168.blogspot.com/
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: . on December 12, 2014, 10:51:47 AM

San Ramon City take action to reverse Cemetery.

http://www.contracostatimes.com/contra-costa-times/ci_27111093/san-ramon-city-council-takes-action-oppose-tassajara

Quote

SAN RAMON -- Facing a crowd of 400 people and amid a flurry of impassioned speeches, the City Council on Tuesday took a stand against a plan to build a large cemetery in Tassajara Valley.

The council voted 4-0, with Councilman Dave Hudson abstaining, to send a letter to Contra Costa County to oppose building the $35 million Creekside Memorial Cemetery -- with some 100,000 to 150,000 plots and a 50-year capacity. It also would house a chapel and indoor and outdoor mausoleums with extensive landscaping on 221 acres at 7000 Camino Tassajara.

The project was proposed about nine years ago, but since then many homes have been built nearby in Dougherty Valley. The cemetery would be about 2,300 feet from homes on Windemere Parkway.

"What's happened is that thousands of people have moved within a stone's thrown of where this development is proposed," said Councilman Phil O'Loane. "I don't think this passes muster from an environmental standpoint. I don't think it makes sense from a cultural standpoint to a lot of folks. I honor the dead as much as anyone ... but this is an idea whose time has come and gone."

More than 30 people spoke, none in support.

They expressed worries that the cemetery would destroy the area's picturesque landscape, deplete its already scarce water resources, clog its already traffic-ridden streets, lower property values and regularly expose children to the specter of death at too-young an age.

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"In the Asian culture, we don't mix the living and the dead," said Crystal Lu, a San Ramon resident, adding that she and her husband moved to the area for its good schools and natural landscape to raise their children. "But if this cemetery would be built, it would be forcing the idea and image of death down our children's throats. It would be the last thing that my husband and I would want to see.

"And in talking to my neighbors, be it Chinese, Indian or Caucasian, I was not surprised to see that my concerns were echoed by all of them," she said.

Others, such as student Andi Mo, argued that there's plenty of burial capacity in surrounding Bay Area cemeteries, especially with cremation becoming a more popular option.

Holly Newman, who lives next to where the cemetery would be built in unincorporated Contra Costa County, was among a chorus of voices who urged the council to withdraw the city's support of a 2005 resolution to support the idea of a cemetery in Tassajara Valley.

A Tri-Valley task force was created at the time to explore the idea after former San Ramon Councilman Curt Kinney needed to find a place to bury his daughter, who died suddenly on her wedding day.

It led to Danville, Dublin and Pleasanton passing resolutions similar to San Ramon's, though Livermore rejected the idea.

City Attorney Bob Saxe said that because the resolution was passed by a city council so long ago, an action to withdraw support for it wasn't necessary. A letter to the county to express the current council's opposition would suffice, he said.

Councilman Scott Perkins said his biggest concern was how the cemetery would impact water resources in the area. As proposed, the cemetery would use as much as 45 acre feet of water per year, but only 27 acre feet of water is currently available.

"To me, that would have an unacceptable impact on the Tri-Valley wells in existing ranches, farms and residences out there," he said. "They are suffering right now through a drought of historic dimensions. And even in good year, this project could drain that aquifer to an extent that would make the current wells unusable."

He urged those who felt passionately about fighting the project to direct their energies to the county's planning and supervisors boards, which ultimately will make the final decision, though no meeting date has been set on the issue.

"Coming here and telling us that we should pass a resolution against this is a flea on an elephant," he said. "If you really want to take action, you and your neighbors need to participate on whatever happens on the county level. That is where the decision will be made."

Contact Joyce Tsai at 925-847-2123. Follow her at Twitter.com/joycetsainews.




Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: Irvinecommuter on December 12, 2014, 03:17:42 PM
That's a regular cemetery...the one at GP is going to be a Veterans Memorial...very different politically.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: jmoney74 on December 12, 2014, 03:55:12 PM
That's a regular cemetery...the one at GP is going to be a Veterans Memorial...very different politically.

yes very much so.  However, they will build homes around GP before the cemetery so there will be some push back then. 
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: Homer_Simpson on December 14, 2014, 02:19:50 PM
There is online petition to relocate veteran cemetery. 

http://icity168.blogspot.com/

168??? seriously??? Sounding like my dad up in this bi**h...  should be icity164.com or 58but14.com
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: jmoney74 on December 16, 2014, 12:39:37 PM
There is online petition to relocate veteran cemetery. 

http://icity168.blogspot.com/

168??? seriously??? Sounding like my dad up in this bi**h...  should be icity164.com or 58but14.com

shut up!!!
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: Homer_Simpson on December 16, 2014, 01:37:35 PM
I'll deal with you Sunday J$
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: eyephone on December 16, 2014, 01:58:36 PM
How about if your address # is 187 (fill in street name).
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: . on December 18, 2014, 08:20:36 AM
got a response from the mayor.  Unfortunately, it does not really say much.

Quote
Mr. <Name>

With the Christmas Season around the corner, I wish you Merry Christmas and a Happy New Year

You sent me your email on December 7th expressing your concerns about the proposed Veterans' Cemetery at the OC Great Park

Thank you for taking the time to share your concerns with me regarding the State Veterans Cemetery.  I instructed my city staff to folow up with you on the status and the future prospects of the cemetery.  I  understand that you have been in contact with City staff as a result, and the information was provided to you.

City staff remains available if you further questions, as do I.

Best wishes,

Steven

Steven Choi, Ph.D.
Mayor
City of Irvine
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: RandomLetters on December 18, 2014, 08:26:51 AM
got a response from the mayor.  Unfortunately, it does not really say much.

Quote
Mr. <Name>

With the Christmas Season around the corner, I wish you Merry Christmas and a Happy New Year

You sent me your email on December 7th expressing your concerns about the proposed Veterans' Cemetery at the OC Great Park

Thank you for taking the time to share your concerns with me regarding the State Veterans Cemetery.  I instructed my city staff to folow up with you on the status and the future prospects of the cemetery.  I  understand that you have been in contact with City staff as a result, and the finromation was provided to you.

City staff remains available if you further questions, as do I.

Best wishes,

Steven

Steven Choi, Ph.D.
Mayor
City of Irvine

finromation, finromation, we need finromation.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: Homer_Simpson on December 18, 2014, 08:28:35 AM
finromation! LOL...
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: jmoney74 on December 18, 2014, 09:26:56 AM
ALL YOUR FINROMATION BELONG TO US!
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: . on December 18, 2014, 09:55:22 AM
what is finromation???
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: jmoney74 on December 18, 2014, 10:03:00 AM
"and the finromation was provided to you."

Obviously it's some code word that Mayor Choi uses.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: RandomLetters on December 18, 2014, 10:05:05 AM
"and the finromation was provided to you."

Obviously it's some code word that Mayor Choi uses.

It probably means the opposite of information.

So, when you go back and say you didnt receive the information, they'll say they only promised "finromation."
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: . on December 18, 2014, 10:20:42 AM
actually, that's my bad.  That's my typo mistake. 

the email is posted in wechat.  I type the email to TalkIrvine.  That's my typo mistake.  it should be "and that information was provided to you".  I will try to correct in my previous post.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: irvinehomeowner on December 18, 2014, 10:57:42 AM
So maybe they'll put in a metecery instead. :)
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: irvinehusky on December 19, 2014, 11:48:48 AM
"Merry Christmas"?  Oooh, not PC.   :P
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: eyephone on December 19, 2014, 11:52:42 AM
"Merry Christmas"?  Oooh, not PC.   :P

It's Happy Holidays.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: test on January 22, 2015, 08:05:24 PM
Cemetery canceled?  In the latest map from 5P it shows where the cemetery will be as Future Neighborhoods.  Hmmmmmmmmm.  Do they know something?  Big name developers always start their projects well before any official city approvals as they already got the approval before the approval so to speak.

(http://greatparkneighborhoods.com/media/img/locations/map.jpg)


Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: . on January 27, 2015, 09:12:46 AM
Cemetery canceled?  In the latest map from 5P it shows where the cemetery will be as Future Neighborhoods.  Hmmmmmmmmm.  Do they know something?  Big name developers always start their projects well before any official city approvals as they already got the approval before the approval so to speak.


My guess is 5P does not like cemetery either.

Latest news is calvet's 500K money is here.  Calvet will hold meeting 01/28 to discuss.

this is in chinese. 
http://site-8304-7039.weitie.co/?from=groupmessage&isappinstalled=0
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: SoCal on January 27, 2015, 07:34:54 PM
USCTrojan can put a stack of these dandy signs in his trunk for future cemetery listings at the great park.

(https://fbcdn-sphotos-b-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-xap1/v/t1.0-9/10922673_774952622589866_1585996162729882139_n.jpg?oh=07a39ebbbcb049a08a588f281b72e3cd&oe=5563A6E7&__gda__=1432534075_2b86bfeb990dd4d5e214cfd37eb8a05e)
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: irvinehomeshopper on January 27, 2015, 11:46:41 PM
Not to worry Yaliu the cemetery is going away. Irvine has no money to build it. In 2 years when Sukhee runs for mayor he will nail the coffin shut on the cemetery. Unless ........
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: . on January 28, 2015, 08:11:44 AM
Not to worry Yaliu the cemetery is going away. Irvine has no money to build it. In 2 years when Sukhee runs for mayor he will nail the coffin shut on the cemetery. Unless ........

I think the money is coming from calvet.  the money is NOT from Irvine.

went to city hall last night and make a request to relocate the cemetery.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: Irvinecommuter on January 28, 2015, 08:31:02 AM
Not to worry Yaliu the cemetery is going away. Irvine has no money to build it. In 2 years when Sukhee runs for mayor he will nail the coffin shut on the cemetery. Unless ........

I almost guarantee that it will be built.  Five Points will pony up the money as a gesture to the community...will probably be tax deductible.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: Roger on January 28, 2015, 08:37:23 AM
Not to worry Yaliu the cemetery is going away. Irvine has no money to build it. In 2 years when Sukhee runs for mayor he will nail the coffin shut on the cemetery. Unless ........

I almost guarantee that it will be built.  Five Points will pony up the money as a gesture to the community...will probably be tax deductible.
Is there any additional petition that we can sign up other than the one you provided earlier?  We got to get the cemetery out of great park area!!
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: Irvinecommuter on January 28, 2015, 08:49:14 AM
Not to worry Yaliu the cemetery is going away. Irvine has no money to build it. In 2 years when Sukhee runs for mayor he will nail the coffin shut on the cemetery. Unless ........

I almost guarantee that it will be built.  Five Points will pony up the money as a gesture to the community...will probably be tax deductible.
Is there any additional petition that we can sign up other than the one you provided earlier?  We got to get the cemetery out of great park area!!

I have to commend all you guys for trying but it's not going to happen.  It would be a political disaster for anyone to go against veterans in this country.   
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: Homer_Simpson on January 28, 2015, 09:03:16 AM
Is there a petition out there where I can petition the petition's that want the cemetery out of great park?
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: Roger on January 28, 2015, 09:15:55 AM
Not to worry Yaliu the cemetery is going away. Irvine has no money to build it. In 2 years when Sukhee runs for mayor he will nail the coffin shut on the cemetery. Unless ........

I almost guarantee that it will be built.  Five Points will pony up the money as a gesture to the community...will probably be tax deductible.
Is there any additional petition that we can sign up other than the one you provided earlier?  We got to get the cemetery out of great park area!!

I have to commend all you guys for trying but it's not going to happen.  It would be a political disaster for anyone to go against veterans in this country.
At least we tried.  And whose to say that it won't work just because you think it's not politically correct to be against the cemetery.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: Irvinecommuter on January 28, 2015, 09:19:15 AM
Not to worry Yaliu the cemetery is going away. Irvine has no money to build it. In 2 years when Sukhee runs for mayor he will nail the coffin shut on the cemetery. Unless ........

I almost guarantee that it will be built.  Five Points will pony up the money as a gesture to the community...will probably be tax deductible.
Is there any additional petition that we can sign up other than the one you provided earlier?  We got to get the cemetery out of great park area!!

I have to commend all you guys for trying but it's not going to happen.  It would be a political disaster for anyone to go against veterans in this country.
At least we tried.  And whose to say that it won't work just because you think it's not politically correct to be against the cemetery.

As I said, I commend you for your effort.  I don't think its a political correctness issue more as a cultural issue.

I personally have nothing against a veteran cemetery...I am not even sure that it would affect anyone's property values in PP as it is pretty far away.  It's certainly not a "disclosure" issue.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: The California Court Company on January 28, 2015, 09:21:05 AM
LGBT or race easily TRUMP the military.

So if you are against the veteran cemetery, propose something that's LGBT or race related instead.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: irvinehomeowner on January 28, 2015, 09:37:21 AM
Gay Mexican Farmer's Cemetery!
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: Roger on January 28, 2015, 09:42:10 AM
Not to worry Yaliu the cemetery is going away. Irvine has no money to build it. In 2 years when Sukhee runs for mayor he will nail the coffin shut on the cemetery. Unless ........

I almost guarantee that it will be built.  Five Points will pony up the money as a gesture to the community...will probably be tax deductible.
Is there any additional petition that we can sign up other than the one you provided earlier?  We got to get the cemetery out of great park area!!

I have to commend all you guys for trying but it's not going to happen.  It would be a political disaster for anyone to go against veterans in this country.
At least we tried.  And whose to say that it won't work just because you think it's not politically correct to be against the cemetery.

As I said, I commend you for your effort.  I don't think its a political correctness issue more as a cultural issue.

I personally have nothing against a veteran cemetery...I am not even sure that it would affect anyone's property values in PP as it is pretty far away.  It's certainly not a "disclosure" issue.
You even say your are not sure if it will affect the PP property value, so it might.  What we are trying to do here is to take that possibility away.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: . on January 28, 2015, 09:47:10 AM
we are NOT against the veteran cemetery.  we just try to relocate to somewhere else.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: irvinehomeowner on January 28, 2015, 09:59:29 AM
we are NOT against the veteran cemetery.  we just try to relocate to somewhere else.

#NIMBY
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: Roger on January 28, 2015, 10:12:03 AM
Talikng about NIMBY.  You obviously don't live in PP or PS nbd so easy for you to say this.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: SoCal on January 28, 2015, 10:14:55 AM
So, fill me in. Why is having a veterans' cemetery such a big deal. HOW CLOSE IS TOO CLOSE? Sharing a fence with the homes? On the same street? Half a mile away? 5 miles away? In the same city? County? Portola Springs has homes built on top of Indian graves. There are absolutely, undoubtedly additional human remains under other Irvine & O.C. homes whether you realize it or not. Then, maybe it's not a distance issue but rather a time issue. If the person died last week, not okay. But if they died 300 years ago, now it's okay? At what arbitrary point does it suddenly go from "Not okay" to "OK"? Sounds kinda ridiculous to me.

Anyway, it's not like living next door to a crematorium. I imagine the veterans' cemetery would be done with pride and respect and probably a very peaceful, beautifully-maintained open space. But, hey, I'm not Asian, so... 
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: irvinehomeowner on January 28, 2015, 10:22:05 AM
Talikng about NIMBY.  You obviously don't live in PP or PS nbd so easy for you to say this.
But that's the problem when buying new in an area where you have no guarantees what can be built next to your home.

You should know going in that there could be something built that you don't like (or not built).

Ask anyone who thought a school or a shopping center was supposed to be built in their area.

Another plus for buying in established neighborhoods.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: Roger on January 28, 2015, 10:28:09 AM
then why don't you start a petition to move the cemetery to your nbd instead if you don't think it's a big deal.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: Irvinecommuter on January 28, 2015, 10:30:07 AM
then why don't you start a petition to move the cemetery to your nbd instead if you don't think it's a big deal.

That makes no sense.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: Irvinecommuter on January 28, 2015, 10:30:25 AM
we are NOT against the veteran cemetery.  we just try to relocate to somewhere else.

So you are against it.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: . on January 28, 2015, 10:39:38 AM
we are NOT against the veteran cemetery.  we just try to relocate to somewhere else.

So you are against it.
please read the word carefully.  :) we are NOT against the veteran cemetery.  We are just try to relocate to somewhere else.  :) :)
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: eyephone on January 28, 2015, 10:40:24 AM
So, fill me in. Why is having a veterans' cemetery such a big deal. HOW CLOSE IS TOO CLOSE? Sharing a fence with the homes? On the same street? Half a mile away? 5 miles away? In the same city? County? Portola Springs has homes built on top of Indian graves. There are absolutely, undoubtedly additional human remains under other Irvine & O.C. homes whether you realize it or not. Then, maybe it's not a distance issue but rather a time issue. If the person died last week, not okay. But if they died 300 years ago, now it's okay? At what arbitrary point does it suddenly go from "Not okay" to "OK"? Sounds kinda ridiculous to me.

Anyway, it's not like living next door to a crematorium. I imagine the veterans' cemetery would be done with pride and respect and probably a very peaceful, beautifully-maintained open space. But, hey, I'm not Asian, so...

Just imagine hearing the 21 gun salute. Motorcade of cars by US agencies, news coverage, etc.

I'm just speculating.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: eyephone on January 28, 2015, 10:41:48 AM
we are NOT against the veteran cemetery.  we just try to relocate to somewhere else.

So you are against it.
please read the word carefully.  :) we are NOT against the veteran cemetery.  We are just try to relocate to somewhere else.  :) :)

Relocate it to the IE, maybe it can be 2x the size.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: irvinehomeowner on January 28, 2015, 10:46:06 AM
we are NOT against the veteran cemetery.  we just try to relocate to somewhere else.

So you are against it.
please read the word carefully.  :) we are NOT against the veteran cemetery.  We are just try to relocate to somewhere else.  :) :)
You are against it.

You are against it being against your home.

#GrammarTricks
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: . on January 28, 2015, 10:48:57 AM
So, fill me in. Why is having a veterans' cemetery such a big deal. HOW CLOSE IS TOO CLOSE? Sharing a fence with the homes? On the same street? Half a mile away? 5 miles away? In the same city? County? Portola Springs has homes built on top of Indian graves. There are absolutely, undoubtedly additional human remains under other Irvine & O.C. homes whether you realize it or not. Then, maybe it's not a distance issue but rather a time issue. If the person died last week, not okay. But if they died 300 years ago, now it's okay? At what arbitrary point does it suddenly go from "Not okay" to "OK"? Sounds kinda ridiculous to me.

Anyway, it's not like living next door to a crematorium. I imagine the veterans' cemetery would be done with pride and respect and probably a very peaceful, beautifully-maintained open space. But, hey, I'm not Asian, so...

Just imagine hearing the 21 gun salute. Motorcade of cars by US agencies, news coverage, etc.

I'm just speculating.

that's a very good point.  i should bring that up to city official.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: Roger on January 28, 2015, 10:52:42 AM
we are NOT against the veteran cemetery.  we just try to relocate to somewhere else.

So you are against it.
Make perfect sense.  I live in the nbd where they propose to have a cemetery built in walking distance so I am against it.  If you claim you don't think it's a big deal then why not having it built right next to where you live?  Need help reading plain English?
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: Irvinecommuter on January 28, 2015, 11:02:49 AM
So, fill me in. Why is having a veterans' cemetery such a big deal. HOW CLOSE IS TOO CLOSE? Sharing a fence with the homes? On the same street? Half a mile away? 5 miles away? In the same city? County? Portola Springs has homes built on top of Indian graves. There are absolutely, undoubtedly additional human remains under other Irvine & O.C. homes whether you realize it or not. Then, maybe it's not a distance issue but rather a time issue. If the person died last week, not okay. But if they died 300 years ago, now it's okay? At what arbitrary point does it suddenly go from "Not okay" to "OK"? Sounds kinda ridiculous to me.

Anyway, it's not like living next door to a crematorium. I imagine the veterans' cemetery would be done with pride and respect and probably a very peaceful, beautifully-maintained open space. But, hey, I'm not Asian, so...

Just imagine hearing the 21 gun salute. Motorcade of cars by US agencies, news coverage, etc.

I'm just speculating.

that's a very good point.  i should bring that up to city official.

Hmm...that's a good thing for Irvine.  Media attention and probably an annual event during Memorial Day to honor fallen soldiers.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: Irvinecommuter on January 28, 2015, 11:05:50 AM
we are NOT against the veteran cemetery.  we just try to relocate to somewhere else.

So you are against it.
Make perfect sense.  I live in the nbd where they propose to have a cemetery built in walking distance so I am against it.  If you claim you don't think it's a big deal then why not having it built right next to where you live?  Need help reading plain English?

No...it doesn't.  If you are not against it, it doesn't matter where it is located.  I mean if the proposed plan was a park...you wouldn't care it was located.

Why would I petition for it?  I am apathetic about it.  I wouldn't advocate for one nor would I really care if one was near me.  Distance wise, I don't live that far away from it either.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: peppy on January 28, 2015, 11:07:26 AM
So, fill me in. Why is having a veterans' cemetery such a big deal. HOW CLOSE IS TOO CLOSE? Sharing a fence with the homes? On the same street? Half a mile away? 5 miles away? In the same city? County? Portola Springs has homes built on top of Indian graves. There are absolutely, undoubtedly additional human remains under other Irvine & O.C. homes whether you realize it or not. Then, maybe it's not a distance issue but rather a time issue. If the person died last week, not okay. But if they died 300 years ago, now it's okay? At what arbitrary point does it suddenly go from "Not okay" to "OK"? Sounds kinda ridiculous to me.

Anyway, it's not like living next door to a crematorium. I imagine the veterans' cemetery would be done with pride and respect and probably a very peaceful, beautifully-maintained open space. But, hey, I'm not Asian, so...

Just imagine hearing the 21 gun salute. Motorcade of cars by US agencies, news coverage, etc.

I'm just speculating.

that's a very good point.  i should bring that up to city official.

Westwood VA cemetery had the opposite problem. It was too loud OUTSIDE of the cemetery for people to peacefully reflect over the graves of our fallen soldiers. There was a proposal to build a soundwall to keep the 405 traffic noise out of it but that never materialized. Having lived in its proximity, and being a witness to the serenity such a place offers, I have a hard time understanding most of the complaints voiced over it; well, other than being the outcome of superstitious believes that will lower the property value for certain demographics.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: Irvinecommuter on January 28, 2015, 11:10:12 AM
So, fill me in. Why is having a veterans' cemetery such a big deal. HOW CLOSE IS TOO CLOSE? Sharing a fence with the homes? On the same street? Half a mile away? 5 miles away? In the same city? County? Portola Springs has homes built on top of Indian graves. There are absolutely, undoubtedly additional human remains under other Irvine & O.C. homes whether you realize it or not. Then, maybe it's not a distance issue but rather a time issue. If the person died last week, not okay. But if they died 300 years ago, now it's okay? At what arbitrary point does it suddenly go from "Not okay" to "OK"? Sounds kinda ridiculous to me.

Anyway, it's not like living next door to a crematorium. I imagine the veterans' cemetery would be done with pride and respect and probably a very peaceful, beautifully-maintained open space. But, hey, I'm not Asian, so...

Just imagine hearing the 21 gun salute. Motorcade of cars by US agencies, news coverage, etc.

I'm just speculating.

that's a very good point.  i should bring that up to city official.

Westwood VA cemetery had the opposite problem. It was too loud OUTSIDE of the cemetery for people to peacefully reflect over the graves of our fallen soldiers. There was a proposal to build a soundwall to keep the 405 traffic noise out of it but that never materialized. Having lived in its proximity, and being a witness to the serenity such a place offers, I have a hard time understanding most of the complaints voiced over it; well, other than being the outcome of superstitious believes that will lower the property value for certain demographics.

You basically set out the two major reasons for complaints. 
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: test on January 28, 2015, 11:12:51 AM
we are NOT against the veteran cemetery.  we just try to relocate to somewhere else.

So you are against it.
please read the word carefully.  :) we are NOT against the veteran cemetery.  We are just try to relocate to somewhere else.  :) :)

I am against it.  Let the dead bury the dead.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: peppy on January 28, 2015, 11:13:41 AM
So, fill me in. Why is having a veterans' cemetery such a big deal. HOW CLOSE IS TOO CLOSE? Sharing a fence with the homes? On the same street? Half a mile away? 5 miles away? In the same city? County? Portola Springs has homes built on top of Indian graves. There are absolutely, undoubtedly additional human remains under other Irvine & O.C. homes whether you realize it or not. Then, maybe it's not a distance issue but rather a time issue. If the person died last week, not okay. But if they died 300 years ago, now it's okay? At what arbitrary point does it suddenly go from "Not okay" to "OK"? Sounds kinda ridiculous to me.

Anyway, it's not like living next door to a crematorium. I imagine the veterans' cemetery would be done with pride and respect and probably a very peaceful, beautifully-maintained open space. But, hey, I'm not Asian, so...

Just imagine hearing the 21 gun salute. Motorcade of cars by US agencies, news coverage, etc.

I'm just speculating.

that's a very good point.  i should bring that up to city official.

Westwood VA cemetery had the opposite problem. It was too loud OUTSIDE of the cemetery for people to peacefully reflect over the graves of our fallen soldiers. There was a proposal to build a soundwall to keep the 405 traffic noise out of it but that never materialized. Having lived in its proximity, and being a witness to the serenity such a place offers, I have a hard time understanding most of the complaints voiced over it; well, other than being the outcome of superstitious believes that will lower the property value for certain demographics.

You basically set out the two major reasons for complaints.

The thing is, though, that a lot of people also loved living near it. But I guess it was mainly renters up there but there was certainly a strong positive association with it as well.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: Roger on January 28, 2015, 11:14:41 AM
we are NOT against the veteran cemetery.  we just try to relocate to somewhere else.

So you are against it.
Make perfect sense.  I live in the nbd where they propose to have a cemetery built in walking distance so I am against it.  If you claim you don't think it's a big deal then why not having it built right next to where you live?  Need help reading plain English?

No...it doesn't.  If you are not against it, it doesn't matter where it is located.  I mean if the proposed plan was a park...you wouldn't care it was located.

Why would I petition for it?  I am apathetic about it.  I wouldn't advocate for one nor would I really care if one was near me.  Distance wise, I don't live that far away from it either.
I got your point.  For my part I am just not thrilled by the fact it might hurt the future resale.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: eyephone on January 28, 2015, 11:19:07 AM
So, fill me in. Why is having a veterans' cemetery such a big deal. HOW CLOSE IS TOO CLOSE? Sharing a fence with the homes? On the same street? Half a mile away? 5 miles away? In the same city? County? Portola Springs has homes built on top of Indian graves. There are absolutely, undoubtedly additional human remains under other Irvine & O.C. homes whether you realize it or not. Then, maybe it's not a distance issue but rather a time issue. If the person died last week, not okay. But if they died 300 years ago, now it's okay? At what arbitrary point does it suddenly go from "Not okay" to "OK"? Sounds kinda ridiculous to me.

Anyway, it's not like living next door to a crematorium. I imagine the veterans' cemetery would be done with pride and respect and probably a very peaceful, beautifully-maintained open space. But, hey, I'm not Asian, so...

Just imagine hearing the 21 gun salute. Motorcade of cars by US agencies, news coverage, etc.

I'm just speculating.

that's a very good point.  i should bring that up to city official.

Westwood VA cemetery had the opposite problem. It was too loud OUTSIDE of the cemetery for people to peacefully reflect over the graves of our fallen soldiers. There was a proposal to build a soundwall to keep the 405 traffic noise out of it but that never materialized. Having lived in its proximity, and being a witness to the serenity such a place offers, I have a hard time understanding most of the complaints voiced over it; well, other than being the outcome of superstitious believes that will lower the property value for certain demographics.
I think we are ALL going back and forth regarding this plot of land. The fact of the matter is: this was never disclosed to the homeowners/potential buyers that they are building a national war cemetery. If they did disclose it - it's fair game. My response would be, too bad you didn't read the disclosure and could of walked away.

So basically Yaliu has to "potentially" leave his house during the weekend to avoid hearing the cannons/rifles for the 21 gun solute ceremony. I assume not every funeral will have a 21 gun solute. (Who knows) Also, he has to deal with the stoppage of traffic around the cemetary for the motorcades. This also might be against Yaliu faith/beliefs to live by a cemetary.

Yaliu - please confirm if my points represent your opinion. If not, I can modify them.  ;)


Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: Irvinecommuter on January 28, 2015, 11:23:35 AM
So, fill me in. Why is having a veterans' cemetery such a big deal. HOW CLOSE IS TOO CLOSE? Sharing a fence with the homes? On the same street? Half a mile away? 5 miles away? In the same city? County? Portola Springs has homes built on top of Indian graves. There are absolutely, undoubtedly additional human remains under other Irvine & O.C. homes whether you realize it or not. Then, maybe it's not a distance issue but rather a time issue. If the person died last week, not okay. But if they died 300 years ago, now it's okay? At what arbitrary point does it suddenly go from "Not okay" to "OK"? Sounds kinda ridiculous to me.

Anyway, it's not like living next door to a crematorium. I imagine the veterans' cemetery would be done with pride and respect and probably a very peaceful, beautifully-maintained open space. But, hey, I'm not Asian, so...

Just imagine hearing the 21 gun salute. Motorcade of cars by US agencies, news coverage, etc.

I'm just speculating.

that's a very good point.  i should bring that up to city official.

Westwood VA cemetery had the opposite problem. It was too loud OUTSIDE of the cemetery for people to peacefully reflect over the graves of our fallen soldiers. There was a proposal to build a soundwall to keep the 405 traffic noise out of it but that never materialized. Having lived in its proximity, and being a witness to the serenity such a place offers, I have a hard time understanding most of the complaints voiced over it; well, other than being the outcome of superstitious believes that will lower the property value for certain demographics.
I think we are ALL going back and forth regarding this plot of land. The fact of the matter is: this was never disclosed to the homeowners/potential buyers that they are building a national war cemetery. If they did disclose it - it's fair game. My response would be, too bad you didn't read the disclosure and could of walked away.

So basically Yaliu has to "potentially" leave his house during the weekend to avoid hearing the cannons/rifles for the 21 gun solute ceremony. I assume not every funeral will have a 21 gun solute. (Who knows) Also, he has to deal with the stoppage of traffic around the cemetary for the motorcades. This also might be against Yaliu faith/beliefs to live by a cemetary.

Yaliu - please confirm if my points represent your opinion. If not, I can modify them.  ;)

It's fair game now...don't forget, the Great Park was slated to be an airport before Irvine moved to get that plan nixed. 

You don't get to sue for use of land unless it's toxic or will somehow hurt you physically.   

Disclosures are very specific and legal things...you don't get disclosures just because some future development may be to your disliking. 
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: eyephone on January 28, 2015, 11:25:30 AM
So, fill me in. Why is having a veterans' cemetery such a big deal. HOW CLOSE IS TOO CLOSE? Sharing a fence with the homes? On the same street? Half a mile away? 5 miles away? In the same city? County? Portola Springs has homes built on top of Indian graves. There are absolutely, undoubtedly additional human remains under other Irvine & O.C. homes whether you realize it or not. Then, maybe it's not a distance issue but rather a time issue. If the person died last week, not okay. But if they died 300 years ago, now it's okay? At what arbitrary point does it suddenly go from "Not okay" to "OK"? Sounds kinda ridiculous to me.

Anyway, it's not like living next door to a crematorium. I imagine the veterans' cemetery would be done with pride and respect and probably a very peaceful, beautifully-maintained open space. But, hey, I'm not Asian, so...

Just imagine hearing the 21 gun salute. Motorcade of cars by US agencies, news coverage, etc.

I'm just speculating.

that's a very good point.  i should bring that up to city official.

Westwood VA cemetery had the opposite problem. It was too loud OUTSIDE of the cemetery for people to peacefully reflect over the graves of our fallen soldiers. There was a proposal to build a soundwall to keep the 405 traffic noise out of it but that never materialized. Having lived in its proximity, and being a witness to the serenity such a place offers, I have a hard time understanding most of the complaints voiced over it; well, other than being the outcome of superstitious believes that will lower the property value for certain demographics.
I think we are ALL going back and forth regarding this plot of land. The fact of the matter is: this was never disclosed to the homeowners/potential buyers that they are building a national war cemetery. If they did disclose it - it's fair game. My response would be, too bad you didn't read the disclosure and could of walked away.

So basically Yaliu has to "potentially" leave his house during the weekend to avoid hearing the cannons/rifles for the 21 gun solute ceremony. I assume not every funeral will have a 21 gun solute. (Who knows) Also, he has to deal with the stoppage of traffic around the cemetary for the motorcades. This also might be against Yaliu faith/beliefs to live by a cemetary.

Yaliu - please confirm if my points represent your opinion. If not, I can modify them.  ;)

It's fair game now...don't forget, the Great Park was slated to be an airport before Irvine moved to get that plan nixed.  You don't get to sue for use of land unless it's toxic or will somehow hurt you physically.

It's fair game now for the new buyers, but how about the people that bought during the phases that this was not disclosed?
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: irvinehomeowner on January 28, 2015, 11:25:55 AM
I think they should relocate Disneyland... their nightly fireworks bothers me.

I'm not a real estate lawyer, but I don't think have to disclose anything if it's not environmentally impactful or an issue of safety.

Maybe the approach here is to say the bodies will leak chemicals into the soil or that if they turn into zombies the homes are in danger. :)
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: Irvinecommuter on January 28, 2015, 11:28:52 AM

It's fair game now for the new buyers, but how about the people that bought during the phases that this was not disclosed?

It's not something to be "disclosed"...flood plains, toxic soil, potential factory pollution...disclosures.  Things that you don't like, no disclosure.

What if you don't like kids and are bothered by traffic near a school?  Should there be a disclosure if the community decides to build a school?  What about a recreation center?
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: Irvinecommuter on January 28, 2015, 11:34:56 AM
I think they should relocate Disneyland... their nightly fireworks bothers me.

I'm not a real estate lawyer, but I don't think have to disclose anything if it's not environmentally impactful or an issue of safety.

Maybe the approach here is to say the bodies will leak chemicals into the soil or that if they turn into zombies the homes are in danger. :)

Of course...PP is sitting on top of a former military base and next to a form superfund site.  I'm not sure that's going to work. 

The zombies thing may work.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: SoCal on January 28, 2015, 12:01:51 PM
Oh my God! I actually agree with Irvinecommuter on something. This is the first time ever! Pinch me! I think I'm dreaming. This can not really be happening. Hang on, hang on... I'm going to run outside and look for flying pigs...
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: SoCal on January 28, 2015, 12:48:40 PM
So, fill me in. Why is having a veterans' cemetery such a big deal. HOW CLOSE IS TOO CLOSE? Sharing a fence with the homes? On the same street? Half a mile away? 5 miles away? In the same city? County? Portola Springs has homes built on top of Indian graves. There are absolutely, undoubtedly additional human remains under other Irvine & O.C. homes whether you realize it or not. Then, maybe it's not a distance issue but rather a time issue. If the person died last week, not okay. But if they died 300 years ago, now it's okay? At what arbitrary point does it suddenly go from "Not okay" to "OK"? Sounds kinda ridiculous to me.

Anyway, it's not like living next door to a crematorium. I imagine the veterans' cemetery would be done with pride and respect and probably a very peaceful, beautifully-maintained open space. But, hey, I'm not Asian, so...

Just imagine hearing the 21 gun salute. Motorcade of cars by US agencies, news coverage, etc.

I'm just speculating.

Oh, come now. A motorcade = slower traffic once in a while, for a brief period. Additional homes built instead of cemetery plots = traffic jams everyday. Like that's better?
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: . on January 28, 2015, 01:42:08 PM
DEMOCRACY.  let's settle this by our own little vote poll
http://www.talkirvine.com/index.php?topic=12692.0
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: eyephone on January 28, 2015, 01:43:59 PM
I'm going over a summary disclosure chart by CAR. (California Association of Realtors)
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: Irvinecommuter on January 28, 2015, 01:50:22 PM
DEMOCRACY.  let's settle this by our own little vote poll
http://www.talkirvine.com/index.php?topic=12692.0

We don't have a democracy...we have a representative republic.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: jayl23 on January 28, 2015, 01:52:35 PM
Proof that zombies exist! >:D

http://miami.cbslocal.com/2015/01/28/zombie-cat-in-tampa-rises-from-the-grave/

Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: Irvinecommuter on January 28, 2015, 01:53:47 PM
I'm going over a summary disclosure chart by CAR. (California Association of Realtors)

Here you go:

http://www.car.org/6447/67397/138399/new-home-disclosure-chart
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: Irvinecommuter on January 28, 2015, 01:55:44 PM
Proof that zombies exist! >:D

http://miami.cbslocal.com/2015/01/28/zombie-cat-in-tampa-rises-from-the-grave/

That's Florida...it's on a different level of reality.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: irvinehomeowner on January 28, 2015, 01:59:26 PM
Does yaliu live in PP or PS?

PP is soooo far from the cemetery this shouldn't even be an issue.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: Irvinecommuter on January 28, 2015, 02:01:06 PM
Does yaliu live in PP or PS?

PP is soooo far from the cemetery this shouldn't even be an issue.

I believe he lives in PP...it's the association with GP that I think is getting him.  I agree regarding distance...maybe ghosts don't cross streets.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: irvinehomeowner on January 28, 2015, 02:16:27 PM
They have cross the park, some streets and Portola Springs before they can get to PP (do I have that mapped right?):

(http://i62.tinypic.com/2vug6zb.jpg)

Good news though... Ghostbusters reboot in 2016... yaliu can call them. :) :) :)
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: Irvinecommuter on January 28, 2015, 02:18:48 PM
They have cross the park, some streets and Portola Springs before they can get to PP (do I have that mapped right?):

(http://i62.tinypic.com/2vug6zb.jpg)

Good news though... Ghostbusters reboot in 2016... yaliu can call them. :) :) :)

If it's south of Irvine Blvd...it's nowhere near PS or PP...I thought it was south of Portola.  Now I have no idea what the concern is.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: qwerty on January 28, 2015, 02:34:00 PM
Yaliu - supporting the veterans cemetery is a great way for you to show you are assimilating into the American culture, you should strive to be a chinese American not a chinese person living in America :-)
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: eyephone on January 28, 2015, 02:46:57 PM
Yaliu - get black ops 2 and play zombies. Explain to your children that you have to play the video game to gain experience to fight the zombies.

Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: zubs on January 28, 2015, 03:26:32 PM
Not chinese American, American chinese! fuck the rest of the world

America FVCK YEAH!

(http://americandigest.org/ronald_reagan_riding_a_velociraptor_by_sharpwriter-d55rsh7.jpg)

Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: Soylent Green Is People on January 28, 2015, 03:56:57 PM
Let's see....

(OK) Military chem waste - legacy issue
(OK) High auto traffic smog and noise - current, and building
(OK) Agriculture pesticides - legacy issue as well as the newly applied
(OK) Down wind from a dump - ongoing.
(OK) Garden pesticides used by landscapers - ongoing
(Not OK) Military Cemetary.

"Google-fu" enough (hat tip, PS9) and you'll find info on just how many Native American remains were relocated from areas much closer to PP than where this expected cemetary will be constructed. I'm sure TIC didn't excavate every single corpse so know well that when out for a walk in the neighborhood and you hear a crunching underfoot, that sound might not be just from dry leaves.

In Irvine, expecially close to ancient water channels, have plenty of burial sites, yet no one seemed to care much about those as long as property values hold steady. A small-ish military cemetary is hardly something to be fretting over given what's already under most newly constructed slab foundations now.

My .02c. 
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: rkp on January 28, 2015, 04:06:49 PM
Grew up in WLA and Westwood and Bel Air pricing was always high regardless of the veterans cemetery right next to those towns.  Want to keep your property values high?  Invest in your community and keep making it a great place to live.  Outside factors that you can't control will always be lurking. 

I personally am not voting for it or against it...just don't care enough either way.

Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: SoCal on January 28, 2015, 04:10:45 PM
Back in 2010, I discovered a document at irvinequickrecords.com which spoke of human remains buried in the earth under Stonegate being disturbed by construction. Here is the link to that thread. (http://www.talkirvine.com/index.php/topic,1242.msg13891.html#msg13891) (They yanked the document.)

A member in that thread replied that this was bad joojoo and FCBs would not like that. Everyone ask yourself if that turned out to be true.

Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: SoCal on January 28, 2015, 04:16:47 PM

Just imagine hearing the 21 gun salute.

Shots ringing out to honor a fallen soldier = not okay. Shots ringing out daily at the Portola Springs dump by workers firing to scare away the birds as they backfill = okay. Smh. I think people have their priorities messed up.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: eyephone on January 28, 2015, 04:45:20 PM

Just imagine hearing the 21 gun salute.

Shots ringing out to honor a fallen soldier = not okay. Shots ringing out daily at the Orchard Hills dump by workers firing to scare away the birds as they backfill = okay. Smh. I think people have their priorities messed up.

I googled 21 gun solute and came across a Wikipedia page.
http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/21-gun_salute

If you click the link, you will see a high powered cannon or military artillery firing.

So worst case scenario, Yaliu might wake up on a weekend to a high powered cannon or rifles going off.




Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: rkp on January 28, 2015, 04:53:57 PM

Just imagine hearing the 21 gun salute.

Shots ringing out to honor a fallen soldier = not okay. Shots ringing out daily at the Orchard Hills dump by workers firing to scare away the birds as they backfill = okay. Smh. I think people have their priorities messed up.

The shots for birds accomplishes getting rid of the birds.  The shots for a fallen soldier are just continuing a tradition that we associate as respectful but nothing is being accomplished by shooting in the air.  Respect is good but traditions and customs can adapt and don't have to continue something. 
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: irvinehomeowner on January 28, 2015, 04:57:26 PM
They have cross the park, some streets and Portola Springs before they can get to PP (do I have that mapped right?):

(http://i62.tinypic.com/2vug6zb.jpg)

Good news though... Ghostbusters reboot in 2016... yaliu can call them. :) :) :)

If it's south of Irvine Blvd...it's nowhere near PS or PP...I thought it was south of Portola.  Now I have no idea what the concern is.
My bad.

My Ghost Migration Path isn't even correct, I keep thinking PP is off of Irvine Blvd when it's Portola. Here is the correct routes Casper needs to take to find Yaliu and Roger:

(http://i62.tinypic.com/35bfh1y.jpg)
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: The California Court Company on January 28, 2015, 05:57:14 PM
would you kindly add SG to the picture for PS9 and me.

My bad.

My Ghost Migration Path isn't even correct, I keep thinking PP is off of Irvine Blvd when it's Portola. Here is the correct routes Casper needs to take to find Yaliu and Roger:

(http://i62.tinypic.com/35bfh1y.jpg)
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: rkp on January 28, 2015, 06:08:37 PM
http://www.cityofirvine.org/civica/filebank/blobdload.asp?BlobID=25623

That shows you every village and where they are in relation to the cemetery.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: qwerty on January 28, 2015, 06:30:40 PM
That cemetery looks pretty far from columbus square :-)
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: . on January 28, 2015, 07:45:52 PM
This also might be against Yaliu faith/beliefs to live by a cemetary.

Yaliu - please confirm if my points represent your opinion. If not, I can modify them.  ;)
YES

Does yaliu live in PP or PS?

PP

PP is soooo far from the cemetery this shouldn't even be an issue.
soooo far? I am only one mile away.


Good news though... Ghostbusters reboot in 2016... yaliu can call them. :) :) :)
Can't.  City of Irvine took all my money with 1.7% property tax.  :(

Yaliu - supporting the veterans cemetery is a great way for you to show you are assimilating into the American culture, you should strive to be a chinese American not a chinese person living in America :-)
you know my answer :)

Yaliu - get black ops 2 and play zombies. Explain to your children that you have to play the video game to gain experience to fight the zombies.

Sorry.  No video games for my kid.

Let's see....

(OK) Military chem waste - legacy issue
(OK) High auto traffic smog and noise - current, and building
(OK) Agriculture pesticides - legacy issue as well as the newly applied
(OK) Down wind from a dump - ongoing.
(OK) Garden pesticides used by landscapers - ongoing
(Not OK) Military Cemetary.

(OK) Military chem waste - legacy issue
Yaliu: I live in PP.  it is build a farm land. (OK)
(OK) High auto traffic smog and noise - current, and building
Yaliu: welcome to S. Cal.  there is always auto traffic, smog and noise.  (OK)
(OK) Agriculture pesticides - legacy issue as well as the newly applied
Yaliu: dont eat anything that grow here (OK)
(OK) Down wind from a dump - ongoing.
Yaliu: Close the window.  Turn on the AC (OK)
(OK) Garden pesticides used by landscapers - ongoing
Yaliu: Again, welcome to S. Cal  (OK)
(Not OK) Military Cemetary.
Yaliu: you know my answer :)
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: WTTCHMN on January 28, 2015, 08:47:54 PM
Everyone on this board gives Yaliu a hard time, and in many ways, it's his own fault.  He dug his own grave (pun intended) when he said he's afraid of ghosts.  But the reality is no one wants to live next to a cemetery.  It's just human nature and our own discomfort with death.  It has nothing to do with veterans...  It could be a pet cemetery and we'd feel the same way.  So all the bashing against Yaliu for being unpatriotic, ungrateful, and un-American is really unwarranted.

Yaliu, remember that in America, like in China, money talks.  My advice would be to gather all of the most influential realtors who represented buyers in PP.  Have them go directly to Emile Haddad and tell him that if this cemetery gets built, the Chinese buyers will surely walk away. I bet the cemetery idea will get magically tabled, if it hasn't already (as Test has alluded to).
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: irvinehomeowner on January 28, 2015, 10:21:25 PM
I think the point is PP is not even close to the cemetery site.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: test on January 28, 2015, 10:49:46 PM
http://www.cityofirvine.org/civica/filebank/blobdload.asp?BlobID=25623

That shows you every village and where they are in relation to the cemetery.

PP is the closest.  Soon it will be BP.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: aquabliss on January 29, 2015, 12:56:45 AM
I clocked the distance from the proposed cemetery site to the PP entrance at Irvine Blvd. and Ridge Valley.  Total distance is 1.2 miles.  Majority of the homes sit near the back of PP which makes the distance even further.

What's the radius that ghosts will haunt homebuyers from a nearby grave? 

There are actually a lot of Portola Springs homes that will be much closer to the site than *all* PP homes.  I don't hear Portala Springs residence complaining. 
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: Roger on January 29, 2015, 06:58:04 AM
They have cross the park, some streets and Portola Springs before they can get to PP (do I have that mapped right?):

(http://i62.tinypic.com/2vug6zb.jpg)

Good news though... Ghostbusters reboot in 2016... yaliu can call them. :) :) :)

If it's south of Irvine Blvd...it's nowhere near PS or PP...I thought it was south of Portola.  Now I have no idea what the concern is.
My bad.

My Ghost Migration Path isn't even correct, I keep thinking PP is off of Irvine Blvd when it's Portola. Here is the correct routes Casper needs to take to find Yaliu and Roger:

(http://i62.tinypic.com/35bfh1y.jpg)
After seeing different objects and cases about the cemetery I rest my case.  I am still not for it but will remain neutral for this subject.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: . on January 29, 2015, 07:51:46 AM
I clocked the distance from the proposed cemetery site to the PP entrance at Irvine Blvd. and Ridge Valley.  Total distance is 1.2 miles.  Majority of the homes sit near the back of PP which makes the distance even further.

What's the radius that ghosts will haunt homebuyers from a nearby grave? 

There are actually a lot of Portola Springs homes that will be much closer to the site than *all* PP homes.  I don't hear Portala Springs residence complaining.

To me, 1.2 mile is CLOSE.  also keep in mind that Elementary, Junior High and High school are very very close. 
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: WTTCHMN on January 29, 2015, 07:58:01 AM
I clocked the distance from the proposed cemetery site to the PP entrance at Irvine Blvd. and Ridge Valley.  Total distance is 1.2 miles.  Majority of the homes sit near the back of PP which makes the distance even further.

What's the radius that ghosts will haunt homebuyers from a nearby grave? 

There are actually a lot of Portola Springs homes that will be much closer to the site than *all* PP homes.  I don't hear Portala Springs residence complaining. 

Portola Springs is not complaining because your kid's voodoo vomit has repelled all the ghosts.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: PatrickStar on January 29, 2015, 09:14:32 AM
My advice would be to gather all of the most influential realtors who represented buyers in PP. Have them go directly to Emile Haddad and tell him that if this cemetery gets built, the Chinese buyers will surely walk away. I bet the cemetery idea will get magically tabled, if it hasn't already (as Test has alluded to).

Good idea. Maybe after they push out the Veterans they can park the new balloon in that location.

(http://www.orangejuiceblog.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/07/Chinese-Flag-Great-Park-Balloon1.jpg)
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: irvinehomeowner on January 29, 2015, 09:30:58 AM
My advice would be to gather all of the most influential realtors who represented buyers in PP. Have them go directly to Emile Haddad and tell him that if this cemetery gets built, the Chinese buyers will surely walk away. I bet the cemetery idea will get magically tabled, if it hasn't already (as Test has alluded to).

Good idea. Maybe after they push out the Veterans they can park the new balloon in that location.

(http://www.orangejuiceblog.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/07/Chinese-Flag-Great-Park-Balloon1.jpg)
Quoted for perpetuity.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: . on January 29, 2015, 09:35:08 AM
My advice would be to gather all of the most influential realtors who represented buyers in PP. Have them go directly to Emile Haddad and tell him that if this cemetery gets built, the Chinese buyers will surely walk away. I bet the cemetery idea will get magically tabled, if it hasn't already (as Test has alluded to).

Good idea. Maybe after they push out the Veterans they can park the new balloon in that location.

(http://www.orangejuiceblog.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/07/Chinese-Flag-Great-Park-Balloon1.jpg)
Quoted for perpetuity.

what does veteran cemetery has to do w/ China?
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: irvinehomeowner on January 29, 2015, 09:38:56 AM
I clocked the distance from the proposed cemetery site to the PP entrance at Irvine Blvd. and Ridge Valley.  Total distance is 1.2 miles.  Majority of the homes sit near the back of PP which makes the distance even further.

What's the radius that ghosts will haunt homebuyers from a nearby grave? 

There are actually a lot of Portola Springs homes that will be much closer to the site than *all* PP homes.  I don't hear Portala Springs residence complaining.

To me, 1.2 mile is CLOSE.  also keep in mind that Elementary, Junior High and High school are very very close. 
If you want to have an interesting time, please Google "How far can ghosts travel?".

1.2m isn't very close considering you have to go down Irvine Blvd (which I've been told is at least a 15 minute drive).

Most people won't even know there is a cemetery there. I think Irvine's reputation for schools, ethnic food and pick-up basketball games will trump whatever trepidation people have about a cemetery.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: SoCal on January 29, 2015, 09:40:52 AM
^ Speaking of... I can't imagine how it must feel for PatrickStar to read this thread. I have a great deal of respect for veterans who make personal sacrifices to support and defend our country, including all of the ungrateful people in it. Patrick, if you really are serious about being buried at the Great Park when the time comes, and I am still just down the road, I promise that my family and I will look for you and lay a flower on your grave.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: PatrickStar on January 29, 2015, 09:58:29 AM
Quoted for perpetuity.

I'll do you one better, IHO.  Here is the link.  Easy to find noise on this subject with a simple Google search.

http://www.orangejuiceblog.com/2014/10/treachery-in-irvine-chinese-language-documents-suggest-choi-and-lalloway-may-betray-veterans-on-great-park-cemetery/ (http://www.orangejuiceblog.com/2014/10/treachery-in-irvine-chinese-language-documents-suggest-choi-and-lalloway-may-betray-veterans-on-great-park-cemetery/)

http://www.orangejuiceblog.com/2014/10/to-help-eliminate-the-great-park-veterans-cemetery-bob-huffs-wife-lies-about-my-orange-juice-articles/ (http://www.orangejuiceblog.com/2014/10/to-help-eliminate-the-great-park-veterans-cemetery-bob-huffs-wife-lies-about-my-orange-juice-articles/)


Are the residents of Pavilion Park planning to protest Veteran funerals, similar to how the Westboro Baptist Church does?
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: PatrickStar on January 29, 2015, 10:09:19 AM
Patrick, if you really are serious about being buried at the Great Park when the time comes, and I am still just down the road, I promise that my family and I will look for you and lay a flower on your grave.

After reading this thread I am now strongly considering a triumphant return to Irvine in the afterlife .  As a matter of fact, in preparation for that day I have already started training to ensure my spirit will be able to traverse the 1.2 miles to Pavilion Park.  While I certainly have not finalized my plans to terrorize the residents, you can trust it would include tuning their home theater to MNet and blasting Kpop through their homes at obscene levels in the middle of the night. 
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: irvinehomeowner on January 29, 2015, 10:15:36 AM
As a matter of fact, in preparation for that day I have already started training to ensure my spirit will be able to traverse the 1.2 miles to Pavilion Park.  While I certainly have not finalized my plans to terrorize the residents, you can trust it would include tuning their home theater to MNet and blasting Kpop through their homes at obscene levels in the middle of the night. 
Hah. Now I know why I keep pestering you to visit TI more often... hilarious.

#GhostPilates
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: WTTCHMN on January 29, 2015, 10:36:06 AM
My advice would be to gather all of the most influential realtors who represented buyers in PP. Have them go directly to Emile Haddad and tell him that if this cemetery gets built, the Chinese buyers will surely walk away. I bet the cemetery idea will get magically tabled, if it hasn't already (as Test has alluded to).

Good idea. Maybe after they push out the Veterans they can park the new balloon in that location.

(http://www.orangejuiceblog.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/07/Chinese-Flag-Great-Park-Balloon1.jpg)
Quoted for perpetuity.

what does veteran cemetery has to do w/ China?

Nothing.  PatrickStar is just resentful that he was priced out of Irvine.  He thinks he can be buried amongst the rich people in Westwood but doesn't realize that cemetery is full.  He can dream of Irvine, but the reality is he will most likely end up in Riverside.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: The California Court Company on January 29, 2015, 10:40:00 AM
too bad SoCal is a house wife and Mr. SoCal doesn't qualify as a senior IT engineer.

My advice would be to gather all of the most influential realtors who represented buyers in PP. Have them go directly to Emile Haddad and tell him that if this cemetery gets built, the Chinese buyers will surely walk away. I bet the cemetery idea will get magically tabled, if it hasn't already (as Test has alluded to).

Good idea. Maybe after they push out the Veterans they can park the new balloon in that location.

(http://www.orangejuiceblog.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/07/Chinese-Flag-Great-Park-Balloon1.jpg)
Quoted for perpetuity.

what does veteran cemetery has to do w/ China?

Nothing.  PatrickStar is just resentful that he was priced out of Irvine.  He thinks he can be buried amongst the rich people in Westwood but doesn't realize that cemetery is full.  He can dream of Irvine, but the reality is he will most likely end up in Riverside.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: Soylent Green Is People on January 29, 2015, 10:42:16 AM
That Ghost Migration map is way too confusing for the recently departed. I'd sooner take the 5 mile float straight down Irvine Blvd from Ascension Cemetary to the Pavillion Park community center. Less twists and turns. Probably an OCTD Bus that's headed down that route as well.

Sure, I get there is a genuine sensitivity on this issue for some. On the other hand, there are many, many human remains already underfoot, making the NIMBY problem less supportive than other present concerns. Example:

http://ochistorical.blogspot.com/2008/12/strandts-indian-map.html (http://ochistorical.blogspot.com/2008/12/strandts-indian-map.html)

Note the location 104, an "Oak Grove peoples" burial site in relation to PP and Portola Springs. Looks also as if there was a "112" on this document - a second burial area that might be the remains found in Stonegate. That's not counting the criminal gunned down in Tomato Springs - bodies buried somewhere - as noted here:

http://patch.com/california/lakeforest-ca/shootout-at-tomato-springs (http://patch.com/california/lakeforest-ca/shootout-at-tomato-springs)

My .02c

SGIP
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: PatrickStar on January 29, 2015, 10:52:56 AM

Nothing.  PatrickStar is just resentful that he was priced out of Irvine.  He thinks he can be buried amongst the rich people in Westwood but doesn't realize that cemetery is full.  He can dream of Irvine, but the reality is he will most likely end up in Riverside.

You can reassure yourself that you hold economic superiority over everyone outside of Irvine all day as you relax in your California Room and gaze upon your four foot deep backyard while the people from the five adjoining houses peek out of their second floor bedroom windows at you.  But it does not change the fact that balloon image has EVERYTHING to do with this issue.  And you know it.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: WTTCHMN on January 29, 2015, 12:11:07 PM

Nothing.  PatrickStar is just resentful that he was priced out of Irvine.  He thinks he can be buried amongst the rich people in Westwood but doesn't realize that cemetery is full.  He can dream of Irvine, but the reality is he will most likely end up in Riverside.

You can reassure yourself that you hold economic superiority over everyone outside of Irvine all day as you relax in your California Room and gaze upon your four foot deep backyard while the people from the five adjoining houses peek out of their second floor bedroom windows at you.  But it does not change the fact that balloon image has EVERYTHING to do with this issue.  And you know it.


I don't claim to hold economic superiority over anyone.  If I did, I'd live in Newport Coast like Homie and Test.

The balloon really has nothing to do the cemetery.  Please don't conflate the two.  As IHO has said multiple times, it's just a classic case of NIMBY.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: SoCal on January 29, 2015, 03:15:44 PM
too bad SoCal is a house wife and Mr. SoCal doesn't qualify as a senior IT engineer.

Care to explain why I'm the target of your rage this time? Because I expressed my appreciation for veterans?? Just wait until you find out I have previously volunteered for an American soldier memorial project. That ought to make you really blow a gasket.
Title: .
Post by: jumpcut on January 30, 2015, 07:21:51 AM
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Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: PatrickStar on January 30, 2015, 08:16:21 AM
Pat, I look forward to raising a glass of soju at your headstone. Just do me one favor: I plan on selling my home to an FCB so don't rattle my rafters during the open house.


Sounds like a plan JC.  I'll stay away from your house, but will terrorize any other open houses that same weekend to drive business your way.  Perhaps I'll enlist the help of some T-ara zombies to ensure the job is done correctly.

Title: .
Post by: jumpcut on January 30, 2015, 08:40:57 AM
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Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: PatrickStar on January 30, 2015, 09:14:33 AM
FWIW I was watching the city council meeting on TV Tuesday night (yes I have no life) and I saw yaliu hand his petition to the City Council. They looked at it in silence but but their body language said, "Where's the nearest round file."

I can only imagine; the city leaders must be mortified at the perception of this outside of the bubble. I can only hope that our trolling of this thread over the past couple of days has effectively killed it, and restored some order to Talk Irvine.  Now everybody can get back to questions like "should I go for the $1,500 recessed light option for my $2M townhome"?
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: Happiness on January 30, 2015, 09:56:02 AM
Demographically speaking, most of the first residents of our new vet cemetery will likely be Vietnam and even Korean war era vets.  In other words, they will likely not just be ordinary spirits, they will be ANTI-COMMUNIST spirits!  Potential buyers of nearby multi million dollar homes, you've been warned!
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: Happiness on January 30, 2015, 01:02:55 PM
In all seriousness, Irvine should be honored to host a veterans cemetery.  Last I checked, neither Westwood CA nor Arlington VA are ghettos.  We enjoy democracy, representative government, the rule of law, free expression, and human rights because some brave people were willing to fight and die to get it and keep it. I'm no military worshipper, I believe in General Patton's observation that not all who die in combat are heroes, some get killed because they are stupid.  Nevertheless, the critics of the vet cemetery should remember that they should be thankful to our vets that they are able to publicly oppose and petition against the vet cemetery and not be sent to a reeducation camp like they surely would if they did the same thing back in their old country. If you don't like it, you don't have to live there.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: irvinehomeowner on January 30, 2015, 01:11:52 PM
Heh... happiness brings up a very good point, one of the reasons why yaliu can even protest a vet cemetery is because of the vets that died to give us that right.

#Irony
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: eyephone on January 30, 2015, 01:19:37 PM
Heh... happiness brings up a very good point, one of the reasons why yaliu can even protest a vet cemetery is because of the vets that died to give us that right.

#Irony

Everybody is entitled to voice their opinion.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: The California Court Company on January 30, 2015, 01:25:16 PM
unless you are against a particular/special board member who accuses me of personal attack. I am about to be banned?

Heh... happiness brings up a very good point, one of the reasons why yaliu can even protest a vet cemetery is because of the vets that died to give us that right.

#Irony

Everybody is entitled to voice their opinion.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: eyephone on January 30, 2015, 01:27:03 PM
#whosBanningYou?

unless you are against a particular/special board member who accuses me of personal attack. I am about to be banned?

Heh... happiness brings up a very good point, one of the reasons why yaliu can even protest a vet cemetery is because of the vets that died to give us that right.

#Irony

Everybody is entitled to voice their opinion.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: The California Court Company on January 30, 2015, 01:35:10 PM
got a warning from admin. she gets a free pass by ridiculing Irvine and its residents all the time. Not sure what's the point for her to do that? Isn't she happy with her life at Foothill Ranch?

#whosBanningYou?

unless you are against a particular/special board member who accuses me of personal attack. I am about to be banned?

Heh... happiness brings up a very good point, one of the reasons why yaliu can even protest a vet cemetery is because of the vets that died to give us that right.

#Irony

Everybody is entitled to voice their opinion.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: irvinehomeowner on January 30, 2015, 01:41:25 PM
Only admin I know here is zovall.

AFAIK, SoCal isn't an overlord at TI anymore but I could be wrong.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: irvinehomeowner on January 30, 2015, 01:42:17 PM
Heh... happiness brings up a very good point, one of the reasons why yaliu can even protest a vet cemetery is because of the vets that died to give us that right.

#Irony

Everybody is entitled to voice their opinion.
Including signing a petition? Try that is some non-US countries and see how far it gets.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: PatrickStar on January 30, 2015, 03:16:39 PM
In all seriousness, Irvine should be honored to host a veterans cemetery.  Last I checked, neither Westwood CA nor Arlington VA are ghettos.  We enjoy democracy, representative government, the rule of law, free expression, and human rights because some brave people were willing to fight and die to get it and keep it. I'm no military worshipper, I believe in General Patton's observation that not all who die in combat are heroes, some get killed because they are stupid.  Nevertheless, the critics of the vet cemetery should remember that they should be thankful to our vets that they are able to publicly oppose and petition against the vet cemetery and not be sent to a reeducation camp like they surely would if they did the same thing back in their old country. If you don't like it, you don't have to live there.

Thank you.  You said what I was thinking much better than I did with the sarcasm and balloon. ;)
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: eyephone on January 30, 2015, 03:33:32 PM
Heh... happiness brings up a very good point, one of the reasons why yaliu can even protest a vet cemetery is because of the vets that died to give us that right.

#Irony

Everybody is entitled to voice their opinion.
Including signing a petition? Try that is some non-US countries and see how far it gets.

"Amendment I
Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the government for a redress of grievances."

"The Bill of Rights is a list of limits on government power. For example, what the Founders saw as the natural right of individuals to speak and worship freely was protected by the First Amendment’s prohibitions on Congress from making laws establishing a religion or abridging freedom of speech. For another example, the natural right to be free from unreasonable government intrusion in one’s home was safeguarded by the Fourth Amendment’s warrant requirements."

http://billofrightsinstitute.org/founding-documents/bill-of-rights/


Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: irvinehomeowner on January 30, 2015, 03:36:28 PM
#eyephoneNotGettingIt
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: test on January 30, 2015, 03:41:02 PM
In all seriousness, Irvine should be honored to host a veterans cemetery.  Last I checked, neither Westwood CA nor Arlington VA are ghettos.  We enjoy democracy, representative government, the rule of law, free expression, and human rights because some brave people were willing to fight and die to get it and keep it. I'm no military worshipper, I believe in General Patton's observation that not all who die in combat are heroes, some get killed because they are stupid.  Nevertheless, the critics of the vet cemetery should remember that they should be thankful to our vets that they are able to publicly oppose and petition against the vet cemetery and not be sent to a reeducation camp like they surely would if they did the same thing back in their old country. If you don't like it, you don't have to live there.

(https://lh4.googleusercontent.com/-YLLO9VU42s4/VMriLxDmZwI/AAAAAAAAcdE/Ir3xNgYST-s/s633/dd14089c-4773-4364-b797-f98c7e85f526)


Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: eyephone on January 30, 2015, 04:02:14 PM
#eyephoneNotGettingIt
This is what you previously said:
"Including signing a petition? Try that is some non-US countries and see how far it gets."

Apparently, you don't know or don't remember about the right to congregate and have free speech.

The United States in a way signed a petition to Great Britain, it's called the Declaration of Independence.

Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: eyephone on January 30, 2015, 04:09:49 PM
All this founding fathers talk, got me thinking about over taxation. (Boston Tea Party)
Bring forward today, Mello Roos. To some people this is a form of over taxation. Can Mello Roos be over turned? Let's say there was a referendum on the ballot to over turn the Mello Roos. Is this possible?

"Mello-Roos is a form of financing that can be used by cities, counties, and special districts (such as school disricts). Mello-Roos Community Facilities Districts (referred to as "CFDs") raise money through special taxes that must be approved by 2/3rds of the voters within the district. A CFD is formed to finance major improvements and services within the district which might include schools, roads, libraries, police and fire protection services, or ambulance services. The taxes are secured by a continuing lien and are levied annually against property within the district."

http://www.californiataxdata.com/a_mello_roos/index.asp
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: The California Court Company on January 30, 2015, 04:13:39 PM
There is some anti Chinese, anti Asian American thing going on here. yaliu is not against Veterans. He is against a cemetery. He wouldn't mind a memorial for Veterans I am sure.

What I don't get, is why do Foothill Ranch or Porter Ranch residents even bother to mind an Irvine specific matter? still holding a grudge that they are priced out of Irvine?
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: irvinehomeowner on January 30, 2015, 04:29:43 PM
#eyephoneNotGettingIt
This is what you previously said:
"Including signing a petition? Try that is some non-US countries and see how far it gets."

Apparently, you don't know or don't remember about the right to congregate and have free speech.

The United States in a way signed a petition to Great Britain, it's called the Declaration of Independence.


Sigh.

1. I said **NON** US countries.
2. How exactly did we (the US) get that "right" from England?
3. How did that "Declaration of Independence" come about?

Hints for 2&3: It wasn't because of Mexican farmers (sorry Qwermigo)
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: momopi on January 30, 2015, 04:31:21 PM
I'm Asian, ethnic Chinese from Taiwan, and own properties in the City of Irvine.  I support the Veteran's Cemetery.

If you're ethnic Chinese and am against the cemetery following Mencius's mother's example (孟母三遷), I'd point out that funerals, especially Veterans funerals in the US are solemn occasions, no flat-bed trucks with dressed up mourners crying into loud speakers and no funeral strippers (!).  Well run and maintained cemeteries like Rose Hills are like parks with nice lawns, though their fish pond really needs a cleaning.  Rather than shielding children from death, we should be more frank about it like Mr. Rogers explaining why the dead gold fish isn't coming back.

Oh and, I also think the great park should have a shooting range.  If firearms is not suitable then at least an Olympic Air Rifle range.  If not then maybe a larger lake like Lake Mission Viejo for fishing and emergency use water supply, for when folks in Central Cali decide that they finally had enough with us stealing their water and dynamite the aqueduct.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: irvinehomeowner on January 30, 2015, 04:31:35 PM
All this founding fathers talk, got me thinking about over taxation. (Boston Tea Party)
Bring forward today, Mello Roos. To some people this is a form of over taxation. Can Mello Roos be over turned? Let's say there was a referendum on the ballot to over turn the Mello Roos. Is this possible?

"Mello-Roos is a form of financing that can be used by cities, counties, and special districts (such as school disricts). Mello-Roos Community Facilities Districts (referred to as "CFDs") raise money through special taxes that must be approved by 2/3rds of the voters within the district. A CFD is formed to finance major improvements and services within the district which might include schools, roads, libraries, police and fire protection services, or ambulance services. The taxes are secured by a continuing lien and are levied annually against property within the district."

http://www.californiataxdata.com/a_mello_roos/index.asp

I've actually mentioned this before.

I think I said that I threw chai packets into the bathtub in protest of Mello Roos.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: PatrickStar on January 30, 2015, 04:57:52 PM
There is some anti Chinese, anti Asian American thing going on here. yaliu is not against Veterans. He is against a cemetery. He wouldn't mind a memorial for Veterans I am sure.

What I don't get, is why do Foothill Ranch or Porter Ranch residents even bother to mind an Irvine specific matter? still holding a grudge that they are priced out of Irvine?

Point 1: I could actually care less about your Irvine or its property values or who lives there.  I had not visited this site for like three years until someone called me out in another thread --- I was notified of that by a third party and decided to stop by and pay my respects. Remember, I left voluntarily. I was not priced out, I found better (for me). Heck, nobody is priced out of Irvine anymore, right?  With all that low income housing there now I could mow grass at the cemetery and still live there.  I chose "other". Truthfully, beyond my friends still there and in the context of some career opportunities I've considered in that area, Irvine isn't much of a factor for me.  Now, I know you and others here like to sit around and jerkoff about how much smarter and richer everyone is in Irvine and that everyone else wishes they could live there -- but please realize, that is pretty much just a circle jerk. Even if I ever do decide to move back to OC for work, I would not choose Irvine. 

Point 2: Unfortunately my plans to stop in and say hi were derailed when I then stumbled into this train wreck of a thread, which hit a little too close to home.  And to your point this is an "Irvine" issue --- no it is not. This a Veteran memorial issue --- a Veteran Cemetery IS a memorial. I'd make the same arguments against your efforts whether it was in Irvine or Idaho.  And if I'm to take you at your word that nobody is against Veterans, then you are trying to force this memorial out based only on NIMBY greed.  That almost sounds worse.  And even worse, at 1.2 miles away, it is not even a NIMBY issue.  Think of all the things (cemetery aside) within 1.2 miles of your home you would prefer not be there if you could rezone the entire city. I'm sure there are some. I have some too.  But you know what, I bought my home with full knowledge of those things --- or if I was not aware of them (or the potential of them) I was negligent by not doing my due diligence before purchasing.  Either way, it is my problem, nobody else. So I've got two choices --- shut up and accept, or move somewhere more personally tolerable.  But to try to impose my selfish or greedy will on others --- and particularly others who have sacrificed for my rights --- that's unacceptable.  Regardless of what your ethnicity is.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: Happiness on January 30, 2015, 05:01:25 PM
I'm Asian, ethnic Chinese from Taiwan,

Q: What's the difference between Taiwan and mainland China?

A:  In mainland China, you have freedom of speech.  In Taiwan, you have freedom after you speak.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: irvinehomeowner on January 30, 2015, 05:04:02 PM
There is only one China.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: The California Court Company on January 30, 2015, 05:09:53 PM
freedom of speech in China? seriously?

I'm Asian, ethnic Chinese from Taiwan,

Q: What's the difference between Taiwan and mainland China?

A:  In mainland China, you have freedom of speech.  In Taiwan, you have freedom after you speak.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: The California Court Company on January 30, 2015, 05:13:11 PM
@ Patstar
Remember We paid taxes for your service. You did your job protecting our freedom. it is not like you worked for free. show some respect to the tax payers
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: eyephone on January 30, 2015, 05:21:19 PM
@ Patstar
Remember We paid taxes for your service. You did your job protecting our freedom. it is not like you worked for free. show some respect to the tax payers

Tax payers paid for the following:salary, food, lodging/lodging allowance, moving expenses and education/GI Bill.

(Assuming you took advantage of the GI Bill)
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: PatrickStar on January 30, 2015, 05:23:17 PM
@ Patstar
Remember We paid taxes for your service. You did your job protecting our freedom. it is not like you worked for free. show some respect to the tax payers

You are a wonderful representative for Irvine.  When the news crews come calling to interview the people against the Veteran Memorial (and they will --- they love these stories about people who are perceived to be against the Veterans; ask Michael Moore how his week was) I suggest you go forward as the spokesman for the Irvine people.  Thankfully I am friends with an anchor at CBS2; I've already forwarded her this thread.  I'd love for the rest of Southern California to hear your tax struggle in comparison to those who fought for the country.  PM me if you'd like to tell it, I'll get you two in touch.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: eyephone on January 30, 2015, 05:23:27 PM
Correct me I'm wrong, isn't the Internet censored in China? The reason why it didn't get messy in HK because the media, actors like Kenny G were there, and the whole world was watching. Also, it seems like the protestors gave in.

freedom of speech in China? seriously?

I'm Asian, ethnic Chinese from Taiwan,

Q: What's the difference between Taiwan and mainland China?

A:  In mainland China, you have freedom of speech.  In Taiwan, you have freedom after you speak.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: The California Court Company on January 30, 2015, 05:27:21 PM
you will lose the battle. The media is left biased; I will use the race card to trump your veteran card.

@ Patstar
Remember We paid taxes for your service. You did your job protecting our freedom. it is not like you worked for free. show some respect to the tax payers

You are a wonderful representative for Irvine.  When the news crews come calling to interview the people against the Veteran Memorial (and they will --- they love these stories about people who are perceived to be against the Veterans; ask Michael Moore how his week was) I suggest you go forward as the spokesman for the Irvine people.  Thankfully I am friends with an anchor at CBS2; I've already forwarded her this thread.  I'd love for the rest of Southern California to hear your tax struggle in comparison to those who fought for the country.  PM me if you'd like to tell it, I'll get you two in touch.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: The California Court Company on January 30, 2015, 05:31:26 PM
and we are now paying for their burying site. I am not against the veteran cemetery. I am just fed up with PatStar's entitlement feelings. Being a veteran and fought for our freedom does not mean you are above the Constitution and can accuse us not being patriotic if things don't go your way.

#dontbitethehandsthatfeedyou

@ Patstar
Remember We paid taxes for your service. You did your job protecting our freedom. it is not like you worked for free. show some respect to the tax payers

Tax payers paid for the following:salary, food, lodging/lodging allowance, moving expenses and education/GI Bill.

(Assuming you took advantage of the GI Bill)
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: Happiness on January 30, 2015, 05:39:05 PM
Umm, I think this is about veterans in general from the revolution to today and not about pat star in particular.

If you think the media and the court of public opinion is against veterans, you have a lot to learn about the United States.

Just drop this issue, right now.  You will not like the inevitable backlash if you keep pushing this.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: eyephone on January 30, 2015, 05:43:26 PM
Umm, I think this is about veterans in general from the revolution to today and not about pat star in particular.

If you think the media and the court of public opinion is against veterans, you have a lot to learn about the United States.

Just drop this issue, right now.  You will not like the inevitable backlash if you keep pushing this.

So we can't question the validity of the location?
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: Irvine Dream on January 30, 2015, 05:52:08 PM
Fixed that for you


Q: What's the difference between Taiwan and mainland China?

A:  In mainland China, you don't have freedom of speech.  In Taiwan, you don't have freedom after you speak.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: Happiness on January 30, 2015, 05:54:50 PM
Umm, I think this is about veterans in general from the revolution to today and not about pat star in particular.

If you think the media and the court of public opinion is against veterans, you have a lot to learn about the United States.

Just drop this issue, right now.  You will not like the inevitable backlash if you keep pushing this.

So we can't question the validity of the location?

You can question whatever you want.  That's the beauty of living in America.  But just because you can do something doesn't mean it is smart of you to do it.  But don't take my word for it (generally bad idea to act on advice from internet postings) ask some natives what they think about your concerns.

By the way, the "we're not opposed to it we just want it somewhere else" statement just makes things worse because it adds insincerity on top of insensitivity.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: eyephone on January 30, 2015, 06:11:42 PM
Ha- is that a threat. By saying it's not a smart thing to do.

Interesting: first people say we don't have the right to talk about the cemetery. Then I bring up the bill of rights. So that argument gets shot down.

Come to think of it, me and Court are doing a service to people that are not informed of their rights. Not everybody went to school here in the US.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: The California Court Company on January 30, 2015, 06:22:28 PM
I fully support veterans. I respect them. but I do believe they are already compensated and recognized for their work and sacrifice.

I also respect and appreciate the US Constitution and I applaud yaliu for standing up and expressing his concerns, especially when Asian Americans are under-represented, and usually not very involved and active in politics.

what I don't like, is just because you are in some minority group, you are entitled to special treatments and no one can disagree with you. PatStar is threatening and bullying me with his reporter connection. Bring it on.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: jmoney74 on January 30, 2015, 06:22:35 PM
Hope they move that cemetery to under the 5 fwy.



Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: irvinehomeshopper on January 30, 2015, 06:30:51 PM
Not to worry Yaliu the cemetery is going away. Irvine has no money to build it. In 2 years when Sukhee runs for mayor he will nail the coffin shut on the cemetery. Unless ........

I almost guarantee that it will be built.  Five Points will pony up the money as a gesture to the community...will probably be tax deductible.

The best of both world is to have some sort of Feng shui rituals to calm the unrestful souls before each burial. Frankly, I like the open space and a lot more peaceful than the Chinese neighbors on their piano. I doubt that Five Points will pony up the money but someone else will to just to hurt land sale at the Greatpark. A proper Fengshui ritual should put the concerned buyers at ease. If I were ever to own another property I would buy in the Great Park. I have seen the overall master plan and it is amazing.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: jmoney74 on January 30, 2015, 06:39:35 PM
Not to worry Yaliu the cemetery is going away. Irvine has no money to build it. In 2 years when Sukhee runs for mayor he will nail the coffin shut on the cemetery. Unless ........

I almost guarantee that it will be built.  Five Points will pony up the money as a gesture to the community...will probably be tax deductible.

The best of both world is to have some sort of Feng shui rituals to calm the unrestful souls before each burial. Frankly, I like the open space and a lot more peaceful than the Chinese neighbors on their piano. I doubt that Five Points will pony up the money but someone else will to just to hurt land sale at the Greatpark. A proper Fengshui ritual should put the concerned buyers at ease. If I were ever to own another property I would buy in the Great Park. I have seen the overall master plan and it is amazing.

I wonder if there is a location that would be more appeasing. Doesn't make sense for it to neighbor the schools and homes. There has to be an area.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: irvinehomeshopper on January 30, 2015, 07:14:16 PM
City of Irvine owns the cemetery parcel and I think the area around it is zoned residential. Homes and schools are built paired to one another. I don't see other alternative uses without violating zonings.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: irvinehomeowner on January 30, 2015, 07:18:48 PM
Interesting: first people say we don't have the right to talk about the cemetery. Then I bring up the bill of rights. So that argument gets shot down.
You still aren't getting it.

What I'm saying is the reason we have that right is because of soldiers who fought in the war for American's independence... the same kind if people who are veterans today.

So the irony is the cemetery is for the very people who fight for and protect our way of life... yet those rights they fight for are being used to prevent it from being built in Irvine.

And again, it's not that yaliu is anti-veteran... it's just ironic.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: eyephone on January 30, 2015, 07:39:08 PM
Interesting: first people say we don't have the right to talk about the cemetery. Then I bring up the bill of rights. So that argument gets shot down.
You still aren't getting it.

What I'm saying is the reason we have that right is because of soldiers who fought in the war for American's independence... the same kind if people who are veterans today.

So the irony is the cemetery is for the very people who fight for and protect our way of life... yet those rights they fight for are being used to prevent it from being built in Irvine.

And again, it's not that yaliu is anti-veteran... it's just ironic.

I don't think you get it. The Constitution is the reason why I have a right to free speech.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: PatrickStar on January 30, 2015, 08:40:48 PM
I don't think you get it. The Constitution is the reason why I have a right to free speech.

I don't think anyone is saying you don't have a right to free speech. But for illustrative purposes, let's use a real world example to show why IHO finds it is so ironic you are invoking the Constitution to mock those who either did or were willing to give their life for this country with a "quit feeling entitled we pay taxes to pay your salary" argument.  So to help you understand, let's go back in time to 1941. Back then they had the very same Constitution you are invoking today.  But let's say back then people were so greedy and selfish the did not want to pay taxes to support a military. Nazi Germany is coming at the US from one shore, and Imperial Japan from the other. But without those men willing to give their lives to defend those shores and that very Constitution, what would the Constitution be worth today? Where would your right to live free today under that Constitution be in 2015 if those hundreds of thousands of men had not died to ensure our shores were not overrun by Nazi Germany or Imperial Japan? Those same men that are buried in the Veteran Cemeteries. The same men you are disparaging by suggesting their job holds about the same value as some cube jockey creating power point slides --- because that is just about what you demean it to when you say "we pay your salary". Those men gave their lives as teenagers so you could have your $1M home you mock them from.  They never had the chance to have what you have.  I'm sure any one of them would have gladly given up the "salary" you refer to for a chance to have that same life.

Do you see the connection?
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: SoCal on January 30, 2015, 08:45:06 PM
(http://files.enjin.com.s3.amazonaws.com/5765/modules/forum/attachments/307838_2108943283233_1235120806_31741907_1525261972_n_1321075330.jpg)
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: The California Court Company on January 30, 2015, 08:48:53 PM
iho,
people who fought for the Constitution are long dead. The cemetery will most likely bury veterans from the Vietnam war. That war has nothing to do with the Constitution. Comparing solders who fought for independence more than 200 years ago and today's veterans are quite different. Today's veterans got holidays in their name, paid decent salary and benefits, VA hospital, and special discounts in all kinds of goods and services, and often recognized in public events.

Yet there are a few veterans like PatStar who wants even more entitlement and think they are above all else. He is shaming his fellow veterans.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: SoCal on January 30, 2015, 08:57:42 PM
"Greater love hath no man than this, that a man lay down his life for his friends." - John 15:13

Let's show the vets & their families the same love they have shown us.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: eyephone on January 30, 2015, 09:06:51 PM
iho,
people who fought for the Constitution are long dead. The cemetery will most likely bury veterans from the Vietnam war. That war has nothing to do with the Constitution. Comparing solders who fought for independence more than 200 years ago and today's veterans are quite different. Today's veterans got holidays in their name, paid decent salary and benefits, VA hospital, and special discounts in all kinds of goods and services, and often recognized in public events.

Yet there are a few veterans like PatStar who wants even more entitlement and think they are above all else. He is shaming his fellow veterans.

Wow - CaL: that's kind of G.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: PatrickStar on January 30, 2015, 09:12:08 PM
Hope they move that cemetery to under the 5 fwy.

Thank you JMoney74, you have managed to sum up in one sentence exactly what everyone suspected was REALLY thought about that Veteran Memorial, but was danced around for so long by your colleagues with "we support it, just not around us".  Can't be any more clear of your real feelings than with a statement like "bury them under the freeway".  Appreciate and respect your honesty.

And with that, I'll sign off from here. Not much more to say on this matter. None of the vocal opponents to the Veterans Memorial (Mr. Court, Mr. Phone, or Mr. Money) took me up on my offer to connect them with CBS2 to tell their story, so I guess they are just internet tough talkers. Next time I promise I won't let IHS bait me back to this board and disrupt your party.  When I logged back on after all those years somebody said "you didn't miss much, its just a bunch of MikeIrvine's here now". I should have listened.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: . on January 30, 2015, 10:09:03 PM
Sorry.  it was a busy date at work and didn't get a chance to respond all the posts.

we are NOT against the veteran cemetery.  we just try to relocate to somewhere else.

again, we are NOT against the veteran cemetery.  we just try to relocate to somewhere else.


I knew I could count on you, Pat, even in the afterlife.

FWIW I was watching the city council meeting on TV Tuesday night (yes I have no life) and I saw yaliu hand his petition to the City Council. They looked at it in silence but but their body language said, "Where's the nearest round file."
I was actually there and I did sign the petition.  unfortunately that guy was NOT me.

Heh... happiness brings up a very good point, one of the reasons why yaliu can even protest a vet cemetery is because of the vets that died to give us that right.

#Irony
I agree with you and I have respect for all veteran for their service and sacrifice.  I understand a war can cause physical and emotional damage to the veteran.  Again I respect to all veterans.

There is some anti Chinese, anti Asian American thing going on here. yaliu is not against Veterans. He is against a cemetery. He wouldn't mind a memorial for Veterans I am sure.

Thank you
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: irvinehomeshopper on January 31, 2015, 12:49:06 AM
The reality really is Irvine is not worthy of a place to have a Veteran Cemetery. Patriotism is at a all time low and why built something there when no one wants it.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: irvinehomeowner on January 31, 2015, 01:20:34 AM
iho,
people who fought for the Constitution are long dead. The cemetery will most likely bury veterans from the Vietnam war. That war has nothing to do with the Constitution. Comparing solders who fought for independence more than 200 years ago and today's veterans are quite different. Today's veterans got holidays in their name, paid decent salary and benefits, VA hospital, and special discounts in all kinds of goods and services, and often recognized in public events.
I mentioned the difference.

But the fact doesn't change that the men and women today in the armed forces, yesterday from Vietnam, or fighting the British 200 years ago all have the same thing in common, they protect our freedoms with their lives.

Those freedoms include free speech and being able to protest and sign petitions... even against the a memorial cemetery that celebrates those very people who defend them.

I don't think you get it. The Constitution is the reason why I have a right to free speech.
You still haven't even answered my previous questions... how did that Constitution come about?

Did you think the Constitution just happened?

Not sure if you are just pretending not to get it or you really have no idea about history prior to when the Constitution was drafted.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: momopi on January 31, 2015, 08:08:56 AM
I'm Asian, ethnic Chinese from Taiwan,

Q: What's the difference between Taiwan and mainland China?

A:  In mainland China, you have freedom of speech.  In Taiwan, you have freedom after you speak.

1.  ROC vs PRC, and funeral strippers.

2.  Freedom to speak does not mean you are free from the liabilities and legal consequences of your words.

http://www.taipeitimes.com/News/front/archives/2011/06/26/2003506711
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: jmoney74 on January 31, 2015, 08:11:17 AM
Hope they move that cemetery to under the 5 fwy.

Thank you JMoney74, you have managed to sum up in one sentence exactly what everyone suspected was REALLY thought about that Veteran Memorial, but was danced around for so long by your colleagues with "we support it, just not around us".  Can't be any more clear of your real feelings than with a statement like "bury them under the freeway".  Appreciate and respect your honesty.

And with that, I'll sign off from here. Not much more to say on this matter. None of the vocal opponents to the Veterans Memorial (Mr. Court, Mr. Phone, or Mr. Money) took me up on my offer to connect them with CBS2 to tell their story, so I guess they are just internet tough talkers. Next time I promise I won't let IHS bait me back to this board and disrupt your party.  When I logged back on after all those years somebody said "you didn't miss much, its just a bunch of MikeIrvine's here now". I should have listened.


SUCCESS!!!
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: momopi on January 31, 2015, 10:26:43 AM

I wonder if there is a location that would be more appeasing. Doesn't make sense for it to neighbor the schools and homes. There has to be an area.

What cemetary in Southern California isn't near homes or schools?
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: Homer_Simpson on January 31, 2015, 11:49:11 AM
They should just build this by ROUNDTREE or SAGEWOOD..
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: The California Court Company on January 31, 2015, 05:26:24 PM
I find it funny people are complaining about Irvine residents expressing their desire to have the cemetery move to somewhere else, using their Constitutional rights. A lot of these people do not even live in Irvine, but minding Irvine's business. 

Why Irvine has to be the city to do this? How about other cities in Orange County? At least Irvine is open to consider this. No good will from other cities.

So you put these together, basically you see these are the people who are priced out of Irvine (SoCal, PatStar) and still holding grudges until this day. When the County is stuffing Irvine with low income housing and the cemetery, they come out and start mocking and making fun of Irvine residents. classic case of sour grapes.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: eyephone on January 31, 2015, 05:54:54 PM
I find it funny people are complaining about Irvine residents expressing their desire to have the cemetery move to somewhere else, using their Constitutional rights. A lot of these people do not even live in Irvine, but minding Irvine's business. 

Why Irvine has to be the city to do this? How about other cities in Orange County? At least Irvine is open to consider this. No good will from other cities.

So you put these together, basically you see these are the people who are priced out of Irvine (SoCal, PatStar) and still holding grudges until this day. When the County is stuffing Irvine with low income housing and the cemetery, they come out and start mocking and making fun of Irvine residents. classic case of sour grapes.

The Irvine City Council voted for this Resolution No. 14-92, which gave the land to the state. (The vote count 5 yes, 0 no, 0 absent)

http://www.cityofirvine.org/civica/filebank/blobdload.asp?BlobID=25624

Maybe leadership (city council) needs to be changed?
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: i1 on January 31, 2015, 07:28:59 PM
a
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: eyephone on January 31, 2015, 07:38:01 PM
Even veterans wouldn't want a cemetery right by their house.

I'd be surprised if PatStar or IHO would prefer to have a cemetery built right by their house relative to say more homes or a school or empty land.

Whatever happens with the cemetery, I am concerned city council isn't doing enough to keep Irvine a great city. Great Park and PS have been squandered opportunities so far. Hopefully they do better with the cultural terrace area and remainder of PS (which I think is as prime land as OH).

The shopping center/area would have been nice in PS. But it got changed)
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: SoCal on January 31, 2015, 07:56:19 PM
I find it funny people are complaining about Irvine residents expressing their desire to have the cemetery move to somewhere else, using their Constitutional rights. A lot of these people do not even live in Irvine, but minding Irvine's business. 

Why Irvine has to be the city to do this? How about other cities in Orange County? At least Irvine is open to consider this. No good will from other cities.

So you put these together, basically you see these are the people who are priced out of Irvine (SoCal, PatStar) and still holding grudges until this day. When the County is stuffing Irvine with low income housing and the cemetery, they come out and start mocking and making fun of Irvine residents. classic case of sour grapes.

Since you are bringing my name up again, I'll share my side of things.

Before I made my first post in this thread, I thought in my head: "This will be the first time in 3 years that California Court does not get mad at my post since I am supporting the plans and applaud the idea of the Veteran's Memorial. If I said that I was AGAINST the memorial, he would accuse me of insulting Irvine. At least this once, he will not have any reason to cry and everything will be peaceful."

And here we are.  :o
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: WTTCHMN on January 31, 2015, 08:29:28 PM
Even veterans wouldn't want a cemetery right by their house.

Exactly.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: . on January 31, 2015, 09:48:59 PM
I find it funny people are complaining about Irvine residents expressing their desire to have the cemetery move to somewhere else, using their Constitutional rights. A lot of these people do not even live in Irvine, but minding Irvine's business. 

Why Irvine has to be the city to do this? How about other cities in Orange County? At least Irvine is open to consider this. No good will from other cities.

So you put these together, basically you see these are the people who are priced out of Irvine (SoCal, PatStar) and still holding grudges until this day. When the County is stuffing Irvine with low income housing and the cemetery, they come out and start mocking and making fun of Irvine residents. classic case of sour grapes.

The Irvine City Council voted for this Resolution No. 14-92, which gave the land to the state. (The vote count 5 yes, 0 no, 0 absent)

http://www.cityofirvine.org/civica/filebank/blobdload.asp?BlobID=25624

Maybe leadership (city council) needs to be changed?

the bill is written by Sharon Quirk-Silva.  she is the former member of CA state Assembly representing the 65th district.  The district encompasses parts of north Orange County, centered on the city of Fullerton.  Agran saw the opportunity and worked with her to have cemetery in Irvine.  Many believes they did this to get veteran vote to win the 2014 election.  unfortunately, both LOST.

I think the bill was vote down in Nov 2013.  and when the bill reintroduced in july 2014, Choi tried to vote no or delay the vote.  however, it was unsuccessful.  with the veteran at the city hall to pressure mayor and council members, Choi and couple council member eventually switch and voted yes.  that was the reason of 5-0.

i think Sharon Quirk-Silva propose the cemetery somewhere else before, but it was shut down.  also, if Sharon Quirk-Silva is state assembly for 65th district, why did she propose the cemetery in fullerton.  I will support it :)

Please correct if any of my statement are incorrect.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: irvinehomeowner on January 31, 2015, 11:19:05 PM
I live in PP and I don't mind the cemetery... it's too far away to impact my hood.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: aquabliss on January 31, 2015, 11:34:48 PM
I live in PP and I don't mind the cemetery... it's too far away to impact my hood.

Yep, proposed site is over 1.2 miles from PP entrance at Ridge Valley.  Actual homes must be between 1.5 to 2 miles away from proposed site. 

I still don't really know what the dead zone is for Chinese buyers (no pun intended).
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: . on February 01, 2015, 01:01:13 AM
I live in PP and I don't mind the cemetery... it's too far away to impact my hood.

you live in PP...  you are my neighbor/stalker!!!!  :)
i thought you lived in irvine for long long time.  and PP is a new area.


Yep, proposed site is over 1.2 miles from PP entrance at Ridge Valley.  Actual homes must be between 1.5 to 2 miles away from proposed site. 

I still don't really know what the dead zone is for Chinese buyers (no pun intended).

k-12 are right next cemetery.

we were raised with ghost story; ghost are evil and cemetery has lots of ghost.  cemetery is always seem as negative.

Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: i1 on February 01, 2015, 06:48:15 AM
a
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: aquabliss on February 01, 2015, 08:10:08 AM
I'm completely fine with Yaliu feeling the way he does - I don't mean to give him a hard time about it, just trying to better understand the specifics.  I suppose it makes sense that Chinese buyers would shun PP not for the distance from the site but because they don't want their kids going to school so close to it.

However this.would also mean they would not buy in Woodbury or Cypress Village for the same reason, but I never hear anyone mention that.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: lnc on February 01, 2015, 09:32:46 AM
Yeah, PP is too far away for people there to be concerned. But Yaliu cares. That's fine.

I find it very ironic that Yaliu gets a hard time about it (patriotism, etc.) when no one would really prefer to have a cemetery next to them.

I have the exact same sentiment and kudo to Yaliu's passion regarding to this issue.

Whether one agree or disagree with those against the location of veteran cemetery, one should not ridicule home owner who speak out against the location of veteran cemetery as un-American, unpatriotic or anti-veterans due to their cultural believes and/or the potential impact on their home value.

Personally I don't believe PP or adjacent PS will be affected by the veterans cemetery due the distant and separation by the Irvine Blvd but I'll respect PP residence's concern.

To honoring the dead or vote for the living, that's the question.

Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: SoCal on February 01, 2015, 12:55:12 PM

I find it very ironic that Yaliu gets a hard time about it (patriotism, etc.) when no one would really prefer to have a cemetery next to them.

I have applied for a position at the new high school @ the park and am applying at the elementry when it becomes available.

I'm not concerned because I believe the souls of the departed are in heaven or hell, not riding the carousel at the great park or hitchhiking home with me.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: eyephone on February 01, 2015, 01:11:24 PM

I find it very ironic that Yaliu gets a hard time about it (patriotism, etc.) when no one would really prefer to have a cemetery next to them.

I have applied for a position at the new high school @ the park and am applying at the elementry when it becomes available.

I'm not concerned because I believe the souls of the departed are in heaven or hell, not riding the carousel at the great park or hitchhiking home with me.

What type of position? VP? Counselor? Admin? Cook?

#justasking
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: i1 on February 01, 2015, 01:31:46 PM
a
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: i1 on February 01, 2015, 01:48:13 PM
a
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: i1 on February 01, 2015, 02:02:02 PM
a
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: . on February 01, 2015, 02:58:38 PM
http://www.icity168.blogspot.com/2015/02/call-to-action-updates-petition-for.html

If you interested in relocate the cemetery, please sign the petition.

Thanks
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: . on February 01, 2015, 02:59:48 PM
There is online petition to relocate veteran cemetery. 

http://icity168.blogspot.com/
How is your petitioning going?

we are try to get more people to sign the petition.  we also communicate with government officials to relocate the cemetery.  the process is slow, how we are doing everything we can.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: . on February 01, 2015, 03:02:40 PM
http://www.icity168.blogspot.com/2015/02/call-to-action-updates-petition-for.html

If you interested in relocate the cemetery, please sign the petition and forward to your friends/family.

Thanks
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: irvinehomeowner on February 01, 2015, 07:59:54 PM
I live in PP and I don't mind the cemetery... it's too far away to impact my hood.
So you would have an issue if the cemetery was built inside PP by your home. Is that considered unpatriotic and lacking respect for veterans? I don't see much difference between your view and Yaliu's.

First, I don't think I ever said yailu was unpatriotic or lacking respect for veterans. I believe I said it was ironic. I even clarified that a few pages earlier.

Second, the cemetery is NOT being built inside PP. It's being built quite a distance away for all practical purposes.

Third, yaliu believes in ghosts.

It's far enough away that it doesn't bother me... but it's obviously not far enough away for yaliu or his fear of ghosts.

I would think most people would not desire a cemetery (veterans or otherwise) built close to their homes, but the distance from PP also seems large enough that most people wouldn't mind it either.

Not sure what 5Ps plan is for the areas immediately surrounding the cemetery but I'm fairly certain it won't be SFRs.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: qwerty on February 01, 2015, 09:54:18 PM
IHO - did you really buy in PP?
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: . on February 01, 2015, 11:02:33 PM

Not sure what 5Ps plan is for the areas immediately surrounding the cemetery but I'm fairly certain it won't be SFRs.

According to the picture, it will be SFRs.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: Homer_Simpson on February 02, 2015, 07:10:31 AM
IHO - did you really buy in PP?

He moved to JC with me and Panda.... No one in their right minds would move to PP or GP or even PS to live close to a cemetery... come on!!
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: momopi on February 02, 2015, 08:50:13 AM
Yeah, PP is too far away for people there to be concerned. But Yaliu cares. That's fine.

I find it very ironic that Yaliu gets a hard time about it (patriotism, etc.) when no one would really prefer to have a cemetery next to them.

Depends.  If it looks like this, then no:
(https://sonja2010taiwan.files.wordpress.com/2010/06/cemetery-copy.jpg)


If it looked like this, then yes:
(http://rosehillsmemorialpark.com/wp-content/flagallery/rose-hills-memorial-park/3.jpg)


A well designed and maintained cemetery parkland should be considered a premium addition to the city.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: eyephone on February 02, 2015, 09:01:53 AM
Premium addition to the city? #interesting
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: momopi on February 02, 2015, 09:45:08 AM
Premium addition to the city? #interesting

Quiet neighbors that don't contribute to rush hour traffic or night time parking issues.  Well-maintained parkland with fresh air and lots of open space to take your family for walks.  Food for CA mule deer and local rabbits (emergency food supply when SHTF).  I am however concerned about water usage and what happens when they have to cut back on watering the lawn.  Hopefully they'd work with the city and water department to use recycled/reclaimed water.

Cemetery parklands is also perfect for community events like jogging/walking.  Why expose all the joggers to dangerous traffic (having to close roads and such) on the street, when it's much safer to do at the cemetery/memorial park?  Also, why pay so much money on gardening expense when cemeteries can setup community flower gardens areas?  It'd be a great activity for widows/widowers to visit their loved one's and do some gardening to stay active and healthy.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: eyephone on February 02, 2015, 10:32:40 AM
Premium addition to the city? #interesting

Quiet neighbors that don't contribute to rush hour traffic or night time parking issues.  Well-maintained parkland with fresh air and lots of open space to take your family for walks.  Food for CA mule deer and local rabbits (emergency food supply when SHTF).  I am however concerned about water usage and what happens when they have to cut back on watering the lawn.  Hopefully they'd work with the city and water department to use recycled/reclaimed water.

Cemetery parklands is also perfect for community events like jogging/walking.  Why expose all the joggers to dangerous traffic (having to close roads and such) on the street, when it's much safer to do at the cemetery/memorial park?  Also, why pay so much money on gardening expense when cemeteries can setup community flower gardens areas?  It'd be a great activity for widows/widowers to visit their loved one's and do some gardening to stay active and healthy.

Are you "joking around"?
"Well-maintained parkland with fresh air and lots of open space to take your family for walks. Cemetery parklands is also perfect for community events like jogging/walking. "
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: momopi on February 02, 2015, 10:51:58 AM
Are you "joking around"?
"Well-maintained parkland with fresh air and lots of open space to take your family for walks. Cemetery parklands is also perfect for community events like jogging/walking. "

?  Why would it be a joke?

When they moved the koi from Puente Hills Mall to the lake at Rose Hills in Whittier, I used to go visit them and feed them when nobody is looking.  Pretty nice place & people bring their kids there all the time.  But they really need to keep the lake clean.

Back when my Ah-Gon was still alive, he taught me that you should taste all the nice food that you like when you're younger, because when you get old you can't eat anything.  And when buying burial plots, you should buy in places that you actually like while your'e alive, because if don't like the place then you wouldn't want to be buried there.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: irvinehomeowner on February 02, 2015, 11:16:52 AM
Seems like the detractors here have never been to a cemetery?

We go to Fairhaven about 2-3 times a year and there are always quite a few people there.

We've also been the Lake Forest one and that is actually quite a nice cemetery.

In cities more dense, cemeteries are actually part of the neighborhood and people do jog/walk through them... and families do stroll through them.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: eyephone on February 02, 2015, 11:29:43 AM
Seems like the detractors here have never been to a cemetery?

We go to Fairhaven about 2-3 times a year and there are always quite a few people there.

We've also been the Lake Forest one and that is actually quite a nice cemetery.

In cities more dense, cemeteries are actually part of the neighborhood and people do jog/walk through them... and families do stroll through them.

The times I went to a cemetery is to show/pay my respect. I think it will be disrespectful if your at a funeral and you see someone jogging half naked.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: rkp on February 02, 2015, 01:42:12 PM
Jogging in a cemetery...sounds like season 1 of House of Cards? 

The veterans cemetery in westwood definitely doesn't feel integrated with the community.  It sits by itself and has a big black gate surrounding it.  It would be interesting if they can do a better job of integrating cemeteries into the parks and open areas.  Imagine having bike paths and running trails while not disrespecting visitors.  Unfortunately I think it will be more closed off and isolated though.

As noted before, I don't care either way but don't understand why some people see being near a freeway as disrespect.  Seems like a good middle solution for all parties.  Something has to be built near a freeway.  Would it be better to have living people near the freeways or dead people? 

Most of my thinking comes from a utilitarian point of view and frankly, I don't understand why more people seek cremation. 
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: peppy on February 02, 2015, 01:56:26 PM
Jogging in a cemetery...sounds like season 1 of House of Cards? 

The veterans cemetery in westwood definitely doesn't feel integrated with the community.  It sits by itself and has a big black gate surrounding it.  It would be interesting if they can do a better job of integrating cemeteries into the parks and open areas.  Imagine having bike paths and running trails while not disrespecting visitors.  Unfortunately I think it will be more closed off and isolated though.

As noted before, I don't care either way but don't understand why some people see being near a freeway as disrespect.  Seems like a good middle solution for all parties.  Something has to be built near a freeway.  Would it be better to have living people near the freeways or dead people? 

Most of my thinking comes from a utilitarian point of view and frankly, I don't understand why more people seek cremation.

Back in the day you used to be able to cut through the Westwood VA cemetery by bike/foot. Not sure when that gate was closed - maybe around 9/11?
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: . on February 02, 2015, 02:52:23 PM
Are you "joking around"?
"Well-maintained parkland with fresh air and lots of open space to take your family for walks. Cemetery parklands is also perfect for community events like jogging/walking. "

?  Why would it be a joke?


I dont understand at all!!!  in the asian culture, we go cemetery to pay respect.  It is consider rude to walk over other people's "resting area".   if it is rude, then the ghost will haunt that person.  that's why the cemetery is always seem negative.

what  i REALLY DONT UNDERSTAND is why will you jog/walk in the cemetery when there is a 688 acres great park next door?
Why will you take your family there when there is 688 acres great park next door?

Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: momopi on February 02, 2015, 03:12:18 PM
I dont understand at all!!!  in the asian culture, we go cemetery to pay respect.  It is consider rude to walk over other people's "resting area".   if it is rude, then the ghost will haunt that person.  that's why the cemetery is always seem negative.

I'm Asian, myself and tens of thousands of Asians walk over "other people's graves" at Rose Hills every year.  Just 2 weeks ago I even "walked over" my grandparent's grave, and their neighbor's graves.  Nobody alive or dead complained to me that it was rude.  Parents bring their kids who run around in the cemetery park.  What part do you not understand?

Look, it's a nice park.  No Taiwanese Electric Flower Cars with funeral strippers and flat bed trucks with professional mourners dressed in hemp robes and crying into loud speakers.  Visit Rose Hills in early morning and you can see deer (try area by gate 17).  They love munching on the flowers.

If you think the cemetery is such a negative place, then ask yourself why you'd want to make it your resting place.  If you liked living in Irvine, why would you object to being buried here?  Perhaps the 688 acre great park planning can allocate some part of the land for general use memorial park.


(http://3.bp.blogspot.com/-uK888cDJlJ4/Ubo6TrULNpI/AAAAAAAACNA/LHIEzC_Dxnw/s1600/2013JuneRoseHillsDeerEating.jpg)

"num num num"
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: irvinehomeowner on February 02, 2015, 04:30:27 PM
Jogging in a cemetery...sounds like season 1 of House of Cards? 
Hey... I remember that. I thought it was going to lead to something but didn't... and Buttercup jogs weird.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: jmoney74 on February 02, 2015, 05:05:50 PM
Seems like the detractors here have never been to a cemetery?

We go to Fairhaven about 2-3 times a year and there are always quite a few people there.

We've also been the Lake Forest one and that is actually quite a nice cemetery.

In cities more dense, cemeteries are actually part of the neighborhood and people do jog/walk through them... and families do stroll through them.

Righht
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: . on February 02, 2015, 10:54:29 PM
I'm Asian, myself and tens of thousands of Asians walk over "other people's graves" at Rose Hills every year.  Just 2 weeks ago I even "walked over" my grandparent's grave, and their neighbor's graves.  Nobody alive or dead complained to me that it was rude.  Parents bring their kids who run around in the cemetery park.  What part do you not understand?
Maybe my logic is flaw.  I always think a resting place is same as a live person house and resting area is STILL a PRIVATE PROPERTY.  you can go to your live family member's house and fool around.  however, it is rude to walk around your neighbors yard or bring your kids on neighbors yard or go to your neighbor house.  if you "walked over" my family member's resting area, i will get mad at you and ask you to show respect.  No live person complain because they are probably NOT there and you definitely dont want the dead to complain to you at their "house" or your house.

Look, it's a nice park.  No Taiwanese Electric Flower Cars with funeral strippers and flat bed trucks with professional mourners dressed in hemp robes and crying into loud speakers.  Visit Rose Hills in early morning and you can see deer (try area by gate 17).  They love munching on the flowers.
Personally, I dont like these either.  however, it is a culture thing.  I dont like it, but i will respect it.

If you think the cemetery is such a negative place, then ask yourself why you'd want to make it your resting place.  If you liked living in Irvine, why would you object to being buried here?  Perhaps the 688 acre great park planning can allocate some part of the land for general use memorial park.
people chose their own resting place because no one can escape taxes and death. 
i still dont understand your logic.  How many of the veteran are currently lived in Irvine?  Assume you are dead, what attract YOU to bury in Irvine? 
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: irvinehomeowner on February 03, 2015, 06:35:51 AM
How many of the veteran are currently lived in Irvine?  Assume you are dead, what attract YOU to bury in Irvine? 
Irvine is usually considered the center of Orange County, so it would be an easily accessible resting place for families of veterans.

A relative of mine had their veteran placed at the Lake Forest cemetery because the Riverside one was too far away for them to visit.

My suggestion is to actually drive over to where the proposed site is to actually see how "close" it is to PP/your home.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: eyephone on February 03, 2015, 06:37:38 AM
How many of the veteran are currently lived in Irvine?  Assume you are dead, what attract YOU to bury in Irvine? 
Irvine is usually considered the center of Orange County, so it would be an easily accessible resting place for families of veterans.

A relative of mine had their veteran placed at the Lake Forest cemetery because the Riverside one was too far away for them to visit.

My suggestion is to actually drive over to where the proposed site is to actually see how "close" it is to PP/your home.

I thought you live in the PP hood, so you should already know.  ;)
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: irvinehomeowner on February 03, 2015, 06:39:15 AM
How many of the veteran are currently lived in Irvine?  Assume you are dead, what attract YOU to bury in Irvine? 
Irvine is usually considered the center of Orange County, so it would be an easily accessible resting place for families of veterans.

A relative of mine had their veteran placed at the Lake Forest cemetery because the Riverside one was too far away for them to visit.

My suggestion is to actually drive over to where the proposed site is to actually see how "close" it is to PP/your home.

I thought you live in the PP hood, so you should already know.  ;)
I'm not the one having the issue with proximity, yaliu is. Like I said, for me, that distance is out of sight, out of mind.

But for yaliu, he says it's too close, not sure if he's actually driven there to see how close. From what I can gather, until I posted the Ghost Migration Map, he may not have known how *far* it actually is.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: eyephone on February 03, 2015, 06:42:17 AM
Are you "joking around"?
"Well-maintained parkland with fresh air and lots of open space to take your family for walks. Cemetery parklands is also perfect for community events like jogging/walking. "

?  Why would it be a joke?

When they moved the koi from Puente Hills Mall to the lake at Rose Hills in Whittier, I used to go visit them and feed them when nobody is looking.  Pretty nice place & people bring their kids there all the time.  But they really need to keep the lake clean.

Back when my Ah-Gon was still alive, he taught me that you should taste all the nice food that you like when you're younger, because when you get old you can't eat anything.  And when buying burial plots, you should buy in places that you actually like while your'e alive, because if don't like the place then you wouldn't want to be buried there.

If you have to feed the Koi fish @ Rose Hills when no ones looking, probably means you shouldn't be feeding the fish.

Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: bones on February 03, 2015, 07:01:02 AM
How many of the veteran are currently lived in Irvine?  Assume you are dead, what attract YOU to bury in Irvine? 
Irvine is usually considered the center of Orange County, so it would be an easily accessible resting place for families of veterans.

A relative of mine had their veteran placed at the Lake Forest cemetery because the Riverside one was too far away for them to visit.

My suggestion is to actually drive over to where the proposed site is to actually see how "close" it is to PP/your home.

I thought you live in the PP hood, so you should already know.  ;)
I'm not the one having the issue with proximity, yaliu is. Like I said, for me, that distance is out of sight, out of mind.

But for yaliu, he says it's too close, not sure if he's actually driven there to see how close. From what I can gather, until I posted the Ghost Migration Map, he may not have known how *far* it actually is.

I don't want to speak for him but from the posts that I have read, I think it's the cemetery's association with the great park and thus, maybe affecting property values that may bother him as well as the actual distance. Which brings up another interesting point.  I wonder if in 5, 10 years, people will talk about each of the neighborhoods as individuals (pp, bp, etc) or lumped together as great park.  If it's individual, then the association with the cemetary won't be so obvious.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: . on February 03, 2015, 07:16:52 AM
How many of the veteran are currently lived in Irvine?  Assume you are dead, what attract YOU to bury in Irvine? 
Irvine is usually considered the center of Orange County, so it would be an easily accessible resting place for families of veterans.

A relative of mine had their veteran placed at the Lake Forest cemetery because the Riverside one was too far away for them to visit.

My suggestion is to actually drive over to where the proposed site is to actually see how "close" it is to PP/your home.

I thought you live in the PP hood, so you should already know.  ;)
I'm not the one having the issue with proximity, yaliu is. Like I said, for me, that distance is out of sight, out of mind.

But for yaliu, he says it's too close, not sure if he's actually driven there to see how close. From what I can gather, until I posted the Ghost Migration Map, he may not have known how *far* it actually is.

i know how "far" is it.  I saw the cemetery location and new 5th high school when i drove to costco.  it still bothers me.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: SoCal on February 03, 2015, 10:27:36 AM

I find it very ironic that Yaliu gets a hard time about it (patriotism, etc.) when no one would really prefer to have a cemetery next to them.

I have applied for a position at the new high school @ the park and am applying at the elementry when it becomes available.

I'm not concerned because I believe the souls of the departed are in heaven or hell, not riding the carousel at the great park or hitchhiking home with me.
Great, good luck. Would SoCal prefer to have a cemetery within 10 feet of HER HOME behind her backyard?

I don't think anyone cares about working near a cemetery, but people don't like one near their homes.

Hey, I'm not the one that needs convincing that it's not a problem to spend the day on a school campus near a cemetery. Yaliu is the one who disagrees with you, not me. He has inferred twice now (here (http://www.talkirvine.com/index.php/topic,11986.msg251459.html#msg251459) and here (http://www.talkirvine.com/index.php/topic,11986.msg251787.html#msg251787)) that aside from living near one, going to school also poses a demonic risk. That's why I brought up that I'd happily spend time on campus and, as a matter of fact, I am actively trying to. You make it sound like those in favor of a cemetery are hypocrites but I'm not a hypocrite, I stand by what I post here.

Yes, absolutely, I'd prefer to have a veteran's cemetery near me than Baker Ranch!! WHO would prefer more housing and traffic?!? Not I!
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: SoCal on February 03, 2015, 10:36:10 AM
I live in PP and I don't mind the cemetery... it's too far away to impact my hood.

Oh ya do, do ya?!?!

Interesting. Let the stalking commence! Now, I have to dress up like a pizza delivery person or a singing telegram or something and knock on every single door until I find the one Austrian in all of P.P.!! Try not to be too creeped out if you see me working at your kids' school, though. Just remember I applied before I knew where you lived. Actually, P.P. is one of the last places I thought you would buy. I pictured you as more of a "south central" Irvine person because you mentioned that's where your life revolves around. I guess I was predicting like Quail Hill area or Woodbridge or something. But it sounds like a good choice to meet your 3CG needs.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: eyephone on February 03, 2015, 10:54:39 AM
How many of the veteran are currently lived in Irvine?  Assume you are dead, what attract YOU to bury in Irvine? 
Irvine is usually considered the center of Orange County, so it would be an easily accessible resting place for families of veterans.

A relative of mine had their veteran placed at the Lake Forest cemetery because the Riverside one was too far away for them to visit.

My suggestion is to actually drive over to where the proposed site is to actually see how "close" it is to PP/your home.

I thought you live in the PP hood, so you should already know.  ;)
I'm not the one having the issue with proximity, yaliu is. Like I said, for me, that distance is out of sight, out of mind.

But for yaliu, he says it's too close, not sure if he's actually driven there to see how close. From what I can gather, until I posted the Ghost Migration Map, he may not have known how *far* it actually is.

You seem like a LR type of guy. #GetRidofMR/BostonTea
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: Happiness on February 03, 2015, 11:06:19 AM
I live in PP and I don't mind the cemetery... it's too far away to impact my hood.

So that explains the bigfoot sightings near the green house.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: Happiness on February 03, 2015, 11:10:30 AM
1.  Going from another Central Park / Balboa Park to oversized Heritage Park is disappointing.
2.  Going from 4,500 homes to 9,500 homes is appalling.
3.  Proposing a Veterans Cemetery, may not be appealing to everyone but certainly not in the same league as decisions 1 and 2 above.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: SoCal on February 03, 2015, 11:36:54 AM
We've also been the Lake Forest one and that is actually quite a nice cemetery.

I read that Nicole Brown Simpson is actually buried at Ascension Cemetery. Have you seen her grave?
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: irvinehomeowner on February 03, 2015, 12:23:12 PM
We've also been the Lake Forest one and that is actually quite a nice cemetery.

I read that Nicole Brown Simpson is actually buried at Ascension Cemetery. Have you seen her grave?
I wasn't wearing my half-naked jogging clothes so I didn't do laps.

It's much less crowded than Fairhaven though. Maybe South County people don't like to visit the dead as much? :)
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: irvinehomeowner on February 03, 2015, 12:24:14 PM
1.  Going from another Central Park / Balboa Park to oversized Heritage Park is disappointing.
2.  Going from 4,500 homes to 9,500 homes is appalling.
3.  Proposing a Veterans Cemetery, may not be appealing to everyone but certainly not in the same league as decisions 1 and 2 above.
Yep... where was the petition for the overcrowding and underamenitizing?
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: Irvine Dream on February 03, 2015, 12:37:18 PM
I live in PP and I don't mind the cemetery... it's too far away to impact my hood.

So that explains the bigfoot sightings near the green house.

I am losing faith in Humanity.  If IHO bought in PP to become neighbors with Yaliu, bones, and Aquabliss and didn't share his stories about kick-back rebate from his realtor, the overcharging by Builders Design Center, his circumventing the Design Center by doing flooring of his choice post-closing, what a great work the flooring contractor did without damaging the new house, trials and tribulations of hiring landscaping contractor and getting the design approved by HOA etc... then how do I trust anyone?   And his best pal Qwerty doesn't even know where to leave the left over food and change for IHO anymore.  Oh man!!
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: irvinehomeowner on February 03, 2015, 12:59:08 PM
Alright.

I live in Northwood. Or Westpark II. Or University Park. Or Woodbridge. Or Turtle Rock. Or Columbus Grove. Or Woodbury. Or Stonegate.

Pick one... or two.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: SoCal on February 03, 2015, 12:59:32 PM
I'm Asian, myself and tens of thousands of Asians walk over "other people's graves" at Rose Hills every year.  Just 2 weeks ago I even "walked over" my grandparent's grave, and their neighbor's graves.  Nobody alive or dead complained to me that it was rude.  Parents bring their kids who run around in the cemetery park.  What part do you not understand?
Maybe my logic is flaw.  I always think a resting place is same as a live person house and resting area is STILL a PRIVATE PROPERTY.  you can go to your live family member's house and fool around.  however, it is rude to walk around your neighbors yard or bring your kids on neighbors yard or go to your neighbor house.  if you "walked over" my family member's resting area, i will get mad at you and ask you to show respect.  No live person complain because they are probably NOT there and you definitely dont want the dead to complain to you at their "house" or your house.

I try to stay on the paved path or walk around the grave if I have to go into the plots.

One time, I was visiting a cemetery in Huntington Beach every week to visit my friend's grave. Near his grave, I kept seeing this newly-buried lady's grave. It was such a mess with flowers dumped all over, gardening gloves and tools left on top. I decided to fix it. I straightened everything up. Next week, same thing. It was a big mess again. I spent time a lot of time fixing it again. Next week, SAME THING. An unfortunate mess. What a disgrace. I fix it AGAIN. I'm getting tired of fixing it now but she deserves to have it not be a disaster. The next week, I see a person "decorating" her grave. Gardening junk spilled all over, way too many loose flowers. They said they were doing it on purpose because gardening was her passion in life so they want it to look the way her garden looked.   ::) Okay. I get it now. So much for my wasted effort.

Anyway, I don't think that's an issue at a Veteran's Memorial. I think they have rules about leaving items on grave; they may not allow it at all or they may have one of those small vases built into the headstone that you turn right-side-up to use it then upside down when you're done.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: lnc on February 03, 2015, 01:01:59 PM
I live in PP and I don't mind the cemetery... it's too far away to impact my hood.

So that explains the bigfoot sightings near the green house.

I am losing faith in Humanity.  If IHO bought in PP to become neighbors with Yaliu, bones, and Aquabliss and didn't share his stories about kick-back rebate from his realtor, the overcharging by Builders Design Center, his circumventing the Design Center by doing flooring of his choice post-closing, what a great work the flooring contractor did without damaging the new house, trials and tribulations of hiring landscaping contractor and getting the design approved by HOA etc... then how do I trust anyone?   And his best pal Qwerty doesn't even know where to leave the left over food and change for IHO anymore.  Oh man!!

Perhaps he's hiding from certain forum stalker... :)
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: momopi on February 03, 2015, 01:14:18 PM
If you have to feed the Koi fish @ Rose Hills when no ones looking, probably means you shouldn't be feeding the fish.

I fed them because they always looked hungry, and I might need them as emergecy food later.  But it's easier to stock MRE's and freeze-dried food at home.

Living creatures, be it fish, deer, rabbit, etc. are intelligent and knows when you're trying to hunt them for food.  They may be friendly and fearless when you feed them, but once you start hunting them they will learn quickly to keep longer and longer distance.  So it's a good idea to feed them something unique but not actually fish/hunt them.  When SHTF, you'll know what bait to use to yield excellent harvests in first few days.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: eyephone on February 03, 2015, 01:19:26 PM
Alright.

I live in Northwood. Or Westpark II. Or University Park. Or Woodbridge. Or Turtle Rock. Or Columbus Grove. Or Woodbury. Or Stonegate.

Pick one... or two.

You know how it goes: he says he lives at Pp to prove a point. But when people ask, the story changes.
#iDontKnow
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: momopi on February 03, 2015, 01:24:55 PM
Maybe my logic is flaw.  I always think a resting place is same as a live person house and resting area is STILL a PRIVATE PROPERTY.  you can go to your live family member's house and fool around.  however, it is rude to walk around your neighbors yard or bring your kids on neighbors yard or go to your neighbor house.  if you "walked over" my family member's resting area, i will get mad at you and ask you to show respect.  No live person complain because they are probably NOT there and you definitely dont want the dead to complain to you at their "house" or your house.
<snip>
people chose their own resting place because no one can escape taxes and death. 


1.  It is impossible to get to many grave sites at Rose Hills without walking over someone else's burial plot.  Not only do people walk over them, workers also drive diggers and lawnmowers over the graves on regular basis.

2.  If any of the deceased have issues with me walking over their burial plot, they're welcome to appear as ghosts and complain to me directly.

3.  You can escape some taxes by relocating to another state or abroad.  Although no one can escape death, you can choose to be buried in a nice place that makes you feel good.  To repeat my question, why would you want to be buried in a place that makes you feel "negative" ?
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: irvinehomeowner on February 03, 2015, 01:25:35 PM
#noweyephonegetsme

Have you figured out how veterans and right to petition are connected yet?
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: qwerty on February 03, 2015, 02:51:17 PM
I just leave the food and change at city hall for IHO now :-(
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: Happiness on February 03, 2015, 03:53:05 PM
If you have to feed the Koi fish @ Rose Hills when no ones looking, probably means you shouldn't be feeding the fish.

I fed them because they always looked hungry, and I might need them as emergecy food later.  But it's easier to stock MRE's and freeze-dried food at home.

What I thought reading momo's original post:  Momo made friends with a koi he regularly fed and talked to at Puente Hills Mall.  Momo goes to the mall one day and the pond and koi are gone!  He searches tirelessly for years until one day, he is visiting a grave at Rose Hills and he is reunited with his old friend.  The koi sees momo and jumps into his arms with joy.

Reality:  Momo was just fattening him up to eat him.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: WTTCHMN on February 03, 2015, 04:12:40 PM
Maybe then momo is just pro-cemetery so he can plant a vegetable garden on PatStar's grave.  He will use the cemetery not only to farm vegetables, but also as a trap to lure unsuspecting mule deer so he can shoot and eat them.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: eyephone on February 03, 2015, 05:58:58 PM
We've also been the Lake Forest one and that is actually quite a nice cemetery.

I read that Nicole Brown Simpson is actually buried at Ascension Cemetery. Have you seen her grave?
I wasn't wearing my half-naked jogging clothes so I didn't do laps.

Don't worry, you don't excercise. #watchingSportsdoesntcount
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: . on February 03, 2015, 11:02:01 PM
1.  It is impossible to get to many grave sites at Rose Hills without walking over someone else's burial plot.  Not only do people walk over them, workers also drive diggers and lawnmowers over the graves on regular basis.
Still have respect other people (dead or alive) private property. 
In addition, if people have trouble walk over or around it, why will people jog on it?  that just does not make any sense.

3.  You can escape some taxes by relocating to another state or abroad.  Although no one can escape death, you can choose to be buried in a nice place that makes you feel good.  To repeat my question, why would you want to be buried in a place that makes you feel "negative" ?
I thought I already answer your question.  because no one can escape death.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: . on February 03, 2015, 11:05:29 PM
Alright.

I live in Northwood. Or Westpark II. Or University Park. Or Woodbridge. Or Turtle Rock. Or Columbus Grove. Or Woodbury. Or Stonegate.

Pick one... or two.

Correct me if I am wrong.  I think IHO tried to say that he has a house in Northwood, second house in westpark, third house in university park, fourth house in woodbridge ....  if you see a white RICH man in Irvine, 95% chance that is IHO.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: SoCal on February 04, 2015, 08:24:24 AM
Alright.

I live in Northwood. Or Westpark II. Or University Park. Or Woodbridge. Or Turtle Rock. Or Columbus Grove. Or Woodbury. Or Stonegate.

Pick one... or two.

Wait. What?? You're NOT really in P.P.?! Sad SoCal!!! Do you have any idea how many fake pizza deliveries I had to make last night!  :'(
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: irvinehomeowner on February 04, 2015, 08:25:56 AM
Or PP.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: SoCal on February 04, 2015, 08:27:49 AM
Or PP.

YAY! So, you ARE within Walking Stalking distance from me!
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: irvinehomeowner on February 04, 2015, 08:33:16 AM
Or PP.

YAY! So, you ARE within Walking Stalking distance from me!
Well... if you think FR is withing Walking/Stalking distance to PP, than I can see that for yaliu the cemetery is within Jaunting/Haunting distance for ghosts. :)
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: The California Court Company on February 04, 2015, 08:34:59 AM
If the cemetery does get built, and PatStar is buried there, I will make sure my dog does her business on his grave every morning.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: momopi on February 04, 2015, 08:42:17 AM
I thought I already answer your question.  because no one can escape death.

...and wouldn't you rather be buried in an auspicious, positive location?

BTW, did you know that many city/regional parks around here allowed tree burials at one time or another, where you could pay to have your ashes buried under a new tree planting?  No grave markers allowed, but you could pay to have a park bench placed with your name on it.  My favorite HS teacher is buried under a tree at El Dorado Park in Long Beach.  Something to keep in mind next time when you visit the local parks!  :)
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: luckguy on February 04, 2015, 08:55:00 AM
is this true? We Are Now A Nuclear Waste Dump? that's scary

http://patch.com/california/lagunaniguel-danapoint/we-are-now-nuclear-waste-dump

Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: irvinehomeowner on February 04, 2015, 08:56:26 AM
(https://i.imgflip.com/h7myw.jpg)
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: SoCal on February 04, 2015, 09:01:17 AM
If the cemetery does get built, and PatStar is buried there, I will make sure my dog does her business on his grave every morning.

#troll
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: momopi on February 04, 2015, 09:09:48 AM
Maybe then momo is just pro-cemetery so he can plant a vegetable garden on PatStar's grave.  He will use the cemetery not only to farm vegetables, but also as a trap to lure unsuspecting mule deer so he can shoot and eat them.

The CA mule deer population has declined from 2 million down to 400,000 to 500,000 over the past 50 years due to a number of reasons.  Unlike rabbits they do not adopt to urbanization as well.  Given choice I think it's better not to depopulate the remaining mule deer near here and only hunt them for food in emergencies.

I think a mixed-use cemetery/conservation parkland strategy might be beneficial.  Instead of Rose Hills style cemetery, we could utilize local open space areas for "parkland buriel" by having trees & native vegetation planted on top over the graves & allowed to "return to nature" over time.  The area is then maintained using cemetery trust funds instead of public coffer, and won't be turned into suburbs.  Areas like Quail Hill and Laguna Crossing would've been perfect.  Folks can take a nice nature hike through the hills and visit their loved one's grave sites, and the local wildlife would benefit as well.  If the deer becomes overpopulated then a limited number of archery deer tags can be issued (high powered hunting rifles require at least 500-600+ yards for safe bullet drop and might not be suitable).

Local City, Regional, and State parks can all benefit from such an arrangement.  It cost a lot of money to build/maintain a park, and sale of on-site burial plots can offset the expense.  Cemetery trust funds can also contribute to the maintenance of the parkland.  However we would need better acceptance of burials without individual headstones.

Going even further, back in the 1970s-1980s many local school districts were selling land to developers to off-set their budget deficits.  How to return land to schools and prevent them from selling it off whenever they need money?  A dual use cemetery/sports area might work, where private investors purchase land next to the school and build baseball & football/soccor fields that is also used for burials, but no headstone is permitted. Maintenance of the land is paid for by cemetery trust (money from those who bought the plots) and the school is given permission to use it for sports.  New laws will need to be passed to protect the cemetery trust from lawsuits, and the school will not be in any position to sell off the land for money.  If you loved football, what better way to celebrite your love for sports by being buried under a football field?
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: . on February 04, 2015, 09:48:31 AM
...and wouldn't you rather be buried in an auspicious, positive location?


define POSITIVE location. 


BTW, did you know that many city/regional parks around here allowed tree burials at one time or another, where you could pay to have your ashes buried under a new tree planting?  No grave markers allowed, but you could pay to have a park bench placed with your name on it.  My favorite HS teacher is buried under a tree at El Dorado Park in Long Beach.  Something to keep in mind next time when you visit the local parks!  :)

where?  find me a park in Southern CA that allow this.  I google El Dorado Park and there is no information on tree burial. 
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: The California Court Company on February 04, 2015, 10:19:20 AM
easy there. I am just joking and don't even own a dog. this shows how yaliu feels being "violated" by having a cemetery that is close to his neighborhood. every day he drives by, he must feel like getting pooped on.

If the cemetery does get built, and PatStar is buried there, I will make sure my dog does her business on his grave every morning.

#troll
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: momopi on February 04, 2015, 10:27:32 AM
If the cemetery does get built, and PatStar is buried there, I will make sure my dog does her business on his grave every morning.

Many ciites require dog owners to keep their dogs on a leash in the park, and the dogs can't run and stay healthy.  Dog parks are few and far between.  But this presents an opportunity.  What if dog lovers are willing to be buried in a "cemetery dog park" where dog owners can let their dogs run?  Many dog parks are really small and crowded, but if enough dog lovers are willing, the cemetery dog park can be built to much larger scale.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: momopi on February 04, 2015, 10:40:09 AM
If you have to feed the Koi fish @ Rose Hills when no ones looking, probably means you shouldn't be feeding the fish.

I fed them because they always looked hungry, and I might need them as emergecy food later.  But it's easier to stock MRE's and freeze-dried food at home.

What I thought reading momo's original post:  Momo made friends with a koi he regularly fed and talked to at Puente Hills Mall.  Momo goes to the mall one day and the pond and koi are gone!  He searches tirelessly for years until one day, he is visiting a grave at Rose Hills and he is reunited with his old friend.  The koi sees momo and jumps into his arms with joy.

Reality:  Momo was just fattening him up to eat him.

There are many other places with koi to visit, such as Embassy Suites in Brea, Cerritos Public Library (by City Hall), etc.  Due to the chemicals used in the water, I don't recommend eating the koi for regular consumption (not to mention legal complications).  Only for dire emergencies.  I'd also suggest trimming the back, side, & belly fat and remove the skin.  Cook on grill and allow fish oil to drip away.  Avoid the koi at the Mission in SJC, they look ill.  Other sources include grass carp found at local Golf Course ponds.

But, as I mentioned earlier, it's easier/cheaper to just spend $100 on a case of MRE's.  I spend the $$ on gas to visit koi to reduce my blood pressure.

(http://t2.ftcdn.net/jpg/00/63/41/03/400_F_63410346_knrKH74Fap3Fq1TubVfyxyzxuIxqyG8Y.jpg)
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: irvinehomeowner on February 04, 2015, 10:48:00 AM
Don't they have koi at Fashion Island?
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: eyephone on February 04, 2015, 11:18:28 AM
Maybe then momo is just pro-cemetery so he can plant a vegetable garden on PatStar's grave.  He will use the cemetery not only to farm vegetables, but also as a trap to lure unsuspecting mule deer so he can shoot and eat them.

The CA mule deer population has declined from 2 million down to 400,000 to 500,000 over the past 50 years due to a number of reasons.  Unlike rabbits they do not adopt to urbanization as well.  Given choice I think it's better not to depopulate the remaining mule deer near here and only hunt them for food in emergencies.

I think a mixed-use cemetery/conservation parkland strategy might be beneficial.  Instead of Rose Hills style cemetery, we could utilize local open space areas for "parkland buriel" by having trees & native vegetation planted on top over the graves & allowed to "return to nature" over time.  The area is then maintained using cemetery trust funds instead of public coffer, and won't be turned into suburbs.  Areas like Quail Hill and Laguna Crossing would've been perfect.  Folks can take a nice nature hike through the hills and visit their loved one's grave sites, and the local wildlife would benefit as well.  If the deer becomes overpopulated then a limited number of archery deer tags can be issued (high powered hunting rifles require at least 500-600+ yards for safe bullet drop and might not be suitable).

Local City, Regional, and State parks can all benefit from such an arrangement.  It cost a lot of money to build/maintain a park, and sale of on-site burial plots can offset the expense.  Cemetery trust funds can also contribute to the maintenance of the parkland.  However we would need better acceptance of burials without individual headstones.

Going even further, back in the 1970s-1980s many local school districts were selling land to developers to off-set their budget deficits.  How to return land to schools and prevent them from selling it off whenever they need money?  A dual use cemetery/sports area might work, where private investors purchase land next to the school and build baseball & football/soccor fields that is also used for burials, but no headstone is permitted. Maintenance of the land is paid for by cemetery trust (money from those who bought the plots) and the school is given permission to use it for sports.  New laws will need to be passed to protect the cemetery trust from lawsuits, and the school will not be in any position to sell off the land for money.  If you loved football, what better way to celebrite your love for sports by being buried under a football field?

I think you want a forest at Great Park with fish and animals.

#HungerGames
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: PatrickStar on February 04, 2015, 12:58:49 PM
If the cemetery does get built, and PatStar is buried there, I will make sure my dog does her business on his grave every morning.

#troll

Can't I rest in peace in the cemetery without my name coming up?  And yes, SoCal --- I do agree that Cal Court is trolling this thread, but I actually believe he is trolling yaliu. If you refer back to one of Cal Courts earliest posts here, he clearly states he is for the cemetery:

personally i like cemeteries. it adds a unique feel to the area. I think there is no better use of toxic land.

Given that, it is completely reasonable to deduct that Cal Court knows that posting vicious anti-Veteran language in a thread started and presided over by yaliu -- a leader (the leader?) of the anti-Veteran Cemetery petition drive can only serve to undermine that effort and make a mockery of those associated with it.  Perhaps the reason the city council rolled their eyes when presented with the petition is they were aware of the language being used online around this effort --- and I know for certain they are aware, I made sure of that.  Cal Court is certainly aware that personal attacks on a Veteran does nothing to help the petition effort, and everything to hurt it.

I actually feel bad for yaliu.  I do respect his efforts, even if I don't agree.  But it is clear he is not sophisticated enough to understand that anti-Veteran discussion is a political landmine in the US. If he did, he surely would have repudiated Cal Courts trolling of his petition efforts long ago.  I would venture Cal Courts trolling of this thread has done far more damage to those presiding over the petition than anything I or others could say.  And yaliu does not even realize it.  If I was one of the other 428 people who signed his petition, I'd want to talk with yaliu about just what he thought he was accomplishing with this train wreck of a discussion thread.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: WTTCHMN on February 04, 2015, 01:17:45 PM
Yes, TI is like a train wreck.  PatStar says he'll walk away but can't help himself and comes back to look anyway.

#wishIwasinIrvine
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: eyephone on February 04, 2015, 01:19:35 PM
@Patrick - Again, Yalui has the constitutional right to ask why. This is America, where we can question without fear of prosecution. That is why the founding fathers created the constitution fear of government becoming too powerful.

Yalui is expressing his opinion which is not illegal. So what do you want the City Council to order the Irvine police to arrest Yalui? Would that make you happy? I can tell you that will never happen!!
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: PatrickStar on February 04, 2015, 01:36:39 PM
@Patrick - Again, Yalui has the constitutional right to ask why. This is America, where we can question without fear of prosecution. That is why the founding fathers created the constitution fear of government becoming too powerful.

Yalui is expressing his opinion which is not illegal. So what do you want the City Council to order the Irvine police to arrest Yalui? Would that make you happy? I can tell you that will never happen!!

eyephone, I will have to join IHO and say I don't think you get it.  Nobody is arguing yaliu or anyone else's rights to petition or protest.  I am well versed in those rights; remember I was one of those charged with upholding it. Nobody is suggesting yaliu go to jail. If you guys really wanted, you could even go picket outside actual funerals with signs that say "get out of Irvine Veterans". You would never be arrested --- that's your right.  But what IHO was telling you earlier is just because you have freedom of speech does not mean you have freedom from consequences.  Go walk into your bosses office right now and say "You are the dumbest and ugliest muthaf**ker I have ever met".  You will NOT be arrested. But you will probably be fired.  The Constitution protects your speech, but not its consequences.

Same thing here.  You can say anything you want, you won't be arrested. But in a country that is pro-Veteran (and it is), disparaging Veterans is probably not the best approach to get to your end goal. That's why the ugly language on this thread actually supports MY goal to get the Cemetery built. Cal Court can call me any name he wants, he won't be arrested.  But that does not mean his words will not damage him if they were attributed directly to him. I guarantee Cal Court would not go on record at Irvine City Hall and say that.  Or on camera on the TV news and say that. Why?  Not because he would be arrested, but because he would probably suffer personal backlash.

Google "freedom of speech but not from consequences" for other examples if you don't believe me.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: The California Court Company on February 04, 2015, 01:37:08 PM
I think PatStar is trolling. He does not even live in Irvine and the cemetery may not be for him when he passes away. Yaliu is opposing the cemetery which I am neutral (I have reasons both for and against it); PatStar is turning this into an anti Veteran thread, which it is absolutely not this is about. It is about the cemetery period. Being a Veterans cemetery or dog cemetery it is still a cemetery.
So I fail to see how PatStar has any interest in here other than trolling. And me against 1 single veteran Patstar is not because he is a veteran, is because he has entitlement issues and is still holding a grudge against Irvine does not mean I disrespect veterans in general.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: PatrickStar on February 04, 2015, 02:25:31 PM
I think PatStar is trolling. He does not even live in Irvine and the cemetery may not be for him when he passes away. Yaliu is opposing the cemetery which I am neutral (I have reasons both for and against it); PatStar is turning this into an anti Veteran thread, which it is absolutely not this is about. It is about the cemetery period. Being a Veterans cemetery or dog cemetery it is still a cemetery.
So I fail to see how PatStar has any interest in here other than trolling. And me against 1 single veteran Patstar is not because he is a veteran, is because he has entitlement issues and is still holding a grudge against Irvine does not mean I disrespect veterans in general.

The irony of it all is I really don't care about Irvine, Cal Court.  I only came back to this board after three years because somebody told me I was being talked about, and I wanted to have a little fun with old friends.  As a matter of fact --- even after I saw this mess of a thread I at first just laughed at it and even trolled it a little myself with a stupid balloon pic and some kpop, in hopes of playfully killing it.  But then you and others decided to get all personal and insulting --- and then I perked up.  See, what you don't realize is we Veteran's have this code of honor with each other.  Same with cops and firefighters.  Maybe you have seen stuff about this on your TV?  Most people will never get what we went through, so we MUST support each other. So even if I never step foot in Irvine again, and even if I am buried in Rose Hills with the rest of my extended family, I will still do everything I can to support the Veteran Cemetery for my brothers who will be, up to and including ensuring your City Council is aware of language attributed to the petition effort. So your stupid comments have only served to embolden me, and those who support this cemetery that I have shared your sentiment with.

So keep talking. You know what you are doing --- you are no dummy. You are the #1 troll on this board. I should actually be thanking you for all the material to fire up the pro-cemetery troops. After all, with the pro-Veteran sentiment in the US (and particularly in Orange County) the only real risk to losing the fight for the cemetery was apathy by its proponents. And you are doing your best to fire Veterans up and ensure we stand together in support of it.  Congratulations.   
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: WTTCHMN on February 04, 2015, 02:38:56 PM
I think you overestimate the pro-veteran sentiment in the US.  If this country really cared, we wouldn't be letting our veterans rot in the VA health care system.  If you really want to make a difference, you should be fighting for veterans rights while they are still alive... more so than a place for when they die.

#trainwreck #don'tcareaboutIrvinebutcan'tstopfromlooking
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: PatrickStar on February 04, 2015, 02:48:20 PM
If you really want to make a difference, you should be fighting for veterans rights while they are still alive... more so than a place for when they die.

What makes you think I don't, bones? Is there something I said to indicate I don't volunteer for or contribute to VA organizations? I thought this thread was about the cemetery?  If you have a thread on TI about VA health care I would be glad to participate if you would point me to it.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: bones on February 04, 2015, 02:58:35 PM
If you really want to make a difference, you should be fighting for veterans rights while they are still alive... more so than a place for when they die.

What makes you think I don't, bones? Is there something I said to indicate I don't volunteer for or contribute to VA organizations? I thought this thread was about the cemetery?  If you have a thread on TI about VA health care I would be glad to participate if you would point me to it.

Bones here. I don't think I directed anything towards you. Please don't get me and whoever you are talking to confused. Anyone can create a username to mimic another member. Case in point so-cal and socal.  I don't give two shits about this train wreck veterans cemetary thread bc I hold firm in my belief that it won't get built bc of various hurdles.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: Happiness on February 04, 2015, 03:20:13 PM
Whether the veterans cemetery gets built or not will depend on a lot of important things happening that are uncertain at this time.  However, I'm pretty sure a few superstitious residents or this silly thread will not weigh heavily in the process.  So why all this vitriol that in the end probably make no difference?  We're all going to live here for a long time whether the cemetery is built or not and we need to learn to be respectful of each other.  Patstar may not be very diplomatic, but his heart is in the right place; he is trying to save some people he believes to be underinformed from doing something self destructive.  Assuming what Patstar has posted about himself over the years is true, he would be the last person to want to see Asians maligned in America.

 
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: bones on February 04, 2015, 03:24:07 PM
Whether the veterans cemetery gets built or not will depend on a lot of important things happening that are uncertain at this time.  However, I'm pretty sure a few superstitious residents or this silly thread will not weigh heavily in the process.  So why all this vitriol that in the end probably make no difference?  We're all going to live here for a long time whether the cemetery is built or not and we need to learn to be respectful of each other.  Patstar may not be very diplomatic, but his heart is in the right place; he is trying to save some people he believes to be underinformed from doing something self destructive.  Assuming what Patstar has posted about himself over the years is true, he would be the last person to want to see Asians maligned in America.

 

Agree. Nothing anyone says in this thread will make a difference. I commend patstar for serving our country. But please don't drag my name on a reply to a post that I didn't make. Besides, if the whole "I only came back to this forum after 3 years Blah blah blah" is true, then how the fuck does he know I was WTTCMN last year. Something's not adding up here.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: jmoney74 on February 04, 2015, 03:31:35 PM
So Patrick Star has voted no on the cemetary..
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: . on February 04, 2015, 03:48:35 PM
AGAIN, we are just asking to relocate the cemetery.  I also respect Veteran and I mentioned that multiple times in this thread. 
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: PatrickStar on February 04, 2015, 03:55:27 PM
Whether the veterans cemetery gets built or not will depend on a lot of important things happening that are uncertain at this time.  However, I'm pretty sure a few superstitious residents or this silly thread will not weigh heavily in the process.  So why all this vitriol that in the end probably make no difference?  We're all going to live here for a long time whether the cemetery is built or not and we need to learn to be respectful of each other.  Patstar may not be very diplomatic, but his heart is in the right place; he is trying to save some people he believes to be underinformed from doing something self destructive.  Assuming what Patstar has posted about himself over the years is true, he would be the last person to want to see Asians maligned in America.

 

Agree as well. And for the record I am everything I have ever claimed to be.  I have never hid behind my computer, I know MANY on this board personally. And even though I've been gone four years, I'm sure I've logged more miles in Irvine than 75% of the people on this board. I left your fair town voluntarily, but does not mean I left behind my years there, or the investments I made in the community while there.  It will always be a part of me.

Make note I never post here except when specifically called out by name.  But drag my name or the reputations of others who have served their country through the mud, suggest they be buried under the freeway or have their grave s**t on and I may make some time to log on to say hi. So for everyone here who wishes I would just go away, I'll make you a deal.  Turn your attention to your #1 Talk Irvine troll, and help him keep my name out of his mouth and off your thread. I already pointed out to you he is doing you more harm than good.  Sounds like a win/win for both of us. In a strange way, yaliu and I both have a common antagonist.  Cal Court just stated he has no honor on the matter, he is neither for it or against it --- so he tries to do damage to both positions. A true troll. 

I'll state it again, I hold no ill will toward anyone against the cemetery, as long as they do so respectfully, and based on fact.  Even if I don't agree, I respect you have every right to stand up for what you believe is right, as do I.  And yes, I understand your aversion to a cemetery at your back door, trust me --- I get it. And IF it was REALLY at your back door, I'd support it. But it is NOT at your back door. It is 1.2 miles away. You can't see it. You can't be afraid of it from that far. If fear of something 1.2 miles away is your motivator, you should contact a professional.  So as I see it, that leaves the effort to down this cemetery focused only greed --- a fear your property MIGHT lose value (not even substantiated). And I just can't get onboard with that. There are some things in life more important than a few thousand dollars, and honoring those that secure the right for you to enjoy that money is more important to me.   

That's all I'll say about it, as long as my name is not invoked again. Good luck.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: zubs on February 04, 2015, 04:01:37 PM
Pstar is a closet TI reader.  Don't worry, I won't tell anyone.

If you believe court is trolling you shouldn't be responding to his baits in a serious manner.  You should post a pic of Reagan on a raptor firing an Uzi.  Because, In the end that's what's important.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: irvinehomeowner on February 04, 2015, 04:34:07 PM
I think PStar brings up a good point, is yaliu really afraid of ghosts or just afraid of home devaluation?

I thought he didn't believe in God so why ghosts?
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: The California Court Company on February 04, 2015, 04:42:05 PM
home devaluation is my reason against the cemetery; adding an unique place to Irvine is my reason for the cemetery.

I think PStar brings up a good point, is yaliu really afraid of ghosts or just afraid of home devaluation?

I thought he didn't believe in God so why ghosts?
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: SoCal on February 04, 2015, 04:49:49 PM
I have asked numerous times, "HOW close is TOO close?" (http://www.talkirvine.com/index.php/topic,11986.msg251342.html#msg251342) and nobody will answer me.

I see on the petition it says: "Petition for the relocation of the proposed State Veterans Cemetery from the OC Great Park and Irvine."

That kind of makes it sound like anywhere in Irvine is unacceptable. (Seriously?) Or it could just be a funny way of saying the Great Park IN Irvine. Which is it?

Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: SoCal on February 04, 2015, 04:57:11 PM
I think PStar brings up a good point, is yaliu really afraid of ghosts or just afraid of home devaluation?

I thought he didn't believe in God so why ghosts?

I noticed ghosts are not specifically mentioned on the petition (https://www.change.org/p/mayor-petition-for-the-relocation-of-the-proposed-state-veterans-cemetery-from-the-oc-great-park-and-irvine). However, home values are. See Reason #5:

"The cemetery will drive down home values and increase blight."

Maybe ghosts are the new scapegoats.

#scapeghost
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: wrigley on February 04, 2015, 05:04:44 PM
As a country we believe in the constitutional right to free speech, but in reality, those in the majority determine who can say what.  True freedom of speech is censored by societal pressure, peer pressure, or threat of "consequences."

Pstar feels he has the majority on his side, he can shout down whoever he wants on this issue.  He is probably right. I have no problem with the cemetery as long as it is well maintained.  But if yaliu doesn't want it nearby because of personal beliefs or even monetary reasons, that is his right.  Given how silent Asians have been in this country when it comes to many issues, I'm glad he is speaking up.

Agree to disagree, and don't get all worked up about stupid shit said on an internet forum.

Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: lnc on February 04, 2015, 05:28:51 PM
It's not the ghost, its the dark energy and bad feng shui for living proximate to the cemetery.  But how close is too close? I have read 500 meter (1640 ft) to as far as 5 miles. 

Jail, hospital, and landfill are also no no but I guess cemetery trump all of them.

Feng Shui Says No Way to Cemetery (http://www.selfgrowth.com/articles/Miller37.html)
Quote
According to Feng Shui principles, home sites with a close proximity to a cemetery are highly undesirable. To a lesser degree, but still considered as unfavorable, are former hospital and prison sites. A cemetery has strong "yin" or dark energies of death. This imbalance of yin/yang energies can cause instability by lowering the energies around it. Depending on which direction the cemetery is at in relation to home, how large it is, and the nature of the people who are buried in the cemetery, there are different levels of effects. Although residents may not feel oppressed at first, over time, they may find it hard to excel.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: momopi on February 04, 2015, 05:43:19 PM
I have asked numerous times, "HOW close is TOO close?" (http://www.talkirvine.com/index.php/topic,11986.msg251342.html#msg251342) and nobody will answer me.

Coming from rural Taiwan, I can confirm that many families buried their grandparents on the farm behind their homes.  Sort of in the back-yard, with rice paddies around it.  The graves look like little islands when the rice paddy is flooded.




It's not the ghost, its the dark energy and bad feng shui for living proximate to the cemetery.  But how close is too close? I have read 500 meter (1640 ft) to as far as 5 miles. 

If the cemetery looked like this, I would likely object:

(http://img1.photographersdirect.com/img/8719/wm/pd757097.jpg)


No "dark energy" or "negative energy" here:

(http://www.rosehills.com/resources/dm20/assets/global/themed/rh/gallery/memorial_park/01/mp_fountainhead.jpg)

(http://www.rosehills.com/resources/dm20/assets/global/themed/rh/gallery/memorial_park/01/mp_deer.jpg)


A stroll through the beautiful cemetery park is healthy exercise and lowers blood pressure, will help you have happier, more productive, and longer life.  There's a few nice stone chess tables and chairs by the lake at Rose Hills with light shade, good place to read or telecommute.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: kalbi on February 05, 2015, 09:39:51 AM
I have asked numerous times, "HOW close is TOO close?" (http://www.talkirvine.com/index.php/topic,11986.msg251342.html#msg251342) and nobody will answer me.

Coming from rural Taiwan, I can confirm that many families buried their grandparents on the farm behind their homes.  Sort of in the back-yard, with rice paddies around it.  The graves look like little islands when the rice paddy is flooded. 





It's not the ghost, its the dark energy and bad feng shui for living proximate to the cemetery.  But how close is too close? I have read 500 meter (1640 ft) to as far as 5 miles. 

If the cemetery looked like this, I would likely object:

(http://img1.photographersdirect.com/img/8719/wm/pd757097.jpg)


No "dark energy" or "negative energy" here:

(http://www.rosehills.com/resources/dm20/assets/global/themed/rh/gallery/memorial_park/01/mp_fountainhead.jpg)

(http://www.rosehills.com/resources/dm20/assets/global/themed/rh/gallery/memorial_park/01/mp_deer.jpg)


A stroll through the beautiful cemetery park is healthy exercise and lowers blood pressure, will help you have happier, more productive, and longer life.  There's a few nice stone chess tables and chairs by the lake at Rose Hills with light shade, good place to read or telecommute.

Ok, momopi. You just made me laugh at loud.  With no shortages of parks in irvine, why would one stroll through a cemetery to exercise?!  Just ask your Taiwanese parents if they would read or telecommute in a cemetary....  I'm pretty sure their response would be 神經病!
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: The California Court Company on February 05, 2015, 09:48:09 AM
you are calling momopi to be mentally ill?

神經病!
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: SoCal on February 05, 2015, 09:55:37 AM
you are calling momopi to be mentally ill?

神經病!

#troll

I've met momo in real life. He's a very nice person.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: aquabliss on February 05, 2015, 10:04:33 AM
https://translate.google.com/#auto/en/%E7%A5%9E%E7%B6%93%E7%97%85

http://www.mayoclinic.org/diseases-conditions/peripheral-neuropathy/basics/definition/con-20019948
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: The California Court Company on February 05, 2015, 10:28:45 AM
SoCal #biggertroll
you are a bigger troll than me, figuratively and literally.
I did not call momopi that. I am just quoting kalbi.

you are calling momopi to be mentally ill?

神經病!

#troll

I've met momo in real life. He's a very nice person.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: . on February 05, 2015, 10:47:36 AM
Please dont personal attack momopi.

Distance: i personally prefer at 3~5 miles away.  even though PP is only 1.2 miles away.  K-12 school are very very close by.  i afraid that negative energy may affect my child's education.

@IHO. 
ghost - there are haunted houses.  there are halloween.  these are proof that ghost exists.  :)
God - i dont think there is a god house.  and i dont there there is a god holiday.  no proof that god exist.  :)


Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: aquabliss on February 05, 2015, 10:51:44 AM
God House = Church
God Holiday = Christmas

Proof!  :)
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: . on February 05, 2015, 10:53:06 AM
God House = Church
God Holiday = Christmas

Proof!  :)

I thought christmas is santa.   :) 
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: irvinehomeowner on February 05, 2015, 10:54:06 AM
@IHO. 
ghost - there are haunted houses.  there are halloween.  these are proof that ghost exists.  :)
What proof? Halloween celebrates the dead, not ghosts.
Quote
God - i dont think there is a god house.  and i dont there there is a god holiday.  no proof that god exist.  :)
What is a church? And technically, all homes are God houses.

No God holiday? Break down the word Christmas (I think you should know that over Halloween). What about Easter?

Yaliu just jumped the shark and nuked the fridge.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: momopi on February 05, 2015, 11:17:13 AM
Ok, momopi. You just made me laugh at loud.  With no shortages of parks in irvine, why would one stroll through a cemetery to exercise?!  Just ask your Taiwanese parents if they would read or telecommute in a cemetary....  I'm pretty sure their response would be 神經病!

?_?

Back when my grandparents were still alive, we took them shopping for 福地.  They really liked Rose Hills and picked out the plots that they wanted.  We bought 4 plots for my parents as well.  We used to take the grandparents for a stroll there on weekends from time to time.  The sunshine (vitamin D) and light exercise was good for them.

In ye olde days they used to say "born in Suzhou, live in Hangzhou, eat in Guangzhou, die in Liuzhou".  My grandfather used to say "good life is to marry a Japanese wife, live in American house, and eat Chinese food".  After his travels around the world, he commented that living in France (Paris) appeared more enjoyable than US, but being buried in American cemetery (Rose Hills) is better than Europe or Asia.

We paid good money for our plots there.  Why wait until you die to enjoy the beautiful amenities?

I wish my grandfather had been able to witness a Quaker service in his lifetime.  He may have said that American Quaker style funeral is better than others.  When my HS English/French teacher passed away we had a Quaker busines meeting style "funeral" and pot luck, it was probaby the nicest funeral I've ever attended, followed by buriel under a tree planting at El Dorado Park.  No wailing relatives, no lavish funerals, no tomb stone.  I just wished that I could've served his favorite potato pancakes at the funeral pot luck, but it's only good when freshly cooked.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: Ready2Downsize on February 05, 2015, 11:45:41 AM
Please dont personal attack momopi.

Distance: i personally prefer at 3~5 miles away.  even though PP is only 1.2 miles away.  K-12 school are very very close by.  i afraid that negative energy may affect my child's education.

@IHO. 
ghost - there are haunted houses.  there are halloween.  these are proof that ghost exists.  :)
God - i dont think there is a god house.  and i dont there there is a god holiday.  no proof that god exist.  :)

Whether you like it or not, you'll have your proof that God exists after you're dead.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: jmoney74 on February 05, 2015, 11:51:49 AM
sphhhh.. carbon freezing is where it's at.  Hopefully future Earth beings will revive me. 

(http://www.bitrebels.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/05/hans-solo-carbon-freezing.jpg)
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: WTTCHMN on February 05, 2015, 12:24:38 PM
Man, yaliu can't catch a break.  It reminds me of what happened to Chelsea Clinton when she was a teenager.  I should start making t-shirts that say "Leave Yaliu Alone".

On another note, PatStar could learn a thing or two from this guy:
http://www.nytimes.com/2015/02/06/us/a-veteran-works-to-break-the-broken-hero-stereotype.html

Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: lnc on February 05, 2015, 01:22:51 PM
Looks like the dark energy of cemetery is spreading to this TI thread by just talking about it. :(

Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: kalbi on February 05, 2015, 01:49:08 PM
you are calling momopi to be mentally ill?

神經病!

#troll

I've met momo in real life. He's a very nice person.

please don't call people a #troll when you don't even know what 神經病 means.  It basically is the chinese equivalent of "you're crazy" or "out of your mind."

Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: SoCal on February 05, 2015, 02:29:43 PM
you are calling momopi to be mentally ill?

神經病!

#troll

I've met momo in real life. He's a very nice person.

please don't call people a #troll when you don't even know what 神經病 means.  It basically is the chinese equivalent of "you're crazy" or "out of your mind."



I don't read Chinese but I do read Bully and I know a pot-stirrer when I see one. To understand any person's comments, you must first have a grasp of their character displayed here over a period of time. Thank you for your concern but this isn't my first day here nor his. I stand by my post. We will have to agree to disagree.

(P.S. I hope you didn't think I am referring to you. I was referring to the other member.)
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: momopi on February 05, 2015, 03:13:22 PM
sphhhh.. carbon freezing is where it's at.  Hopefully future Earth beings will revive me. 

http://www.alcor.org/CryonicsMagazine/index.html
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: . on February 26, 2015, 09:54:27 AM
we still need more signatures to relocate the cemetery.

https://www.change.org/p/mayor-petition-for-the-relocation-of-the-proposed-state-veterans-cemetery-from-the-oc-great-park-and-irvine
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: irvinehomeowner on February 26, 2015, 09:56:40 AM
Need more signatures for my petition to KEEP the cemetery:

http://www.iaintafraidofnoghosts.com
 (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dQw4w9WgXcQ)
:)

EDIT: Changed as not to be confused with the petition against the cemetery.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: The California Court Company on February 26, 2015, 10:11:22 AM
link not valid

Need more signatures for my petition:

https://www.change.org/p/petition-to-oppose-the-relocation-petition-of-the-proposed-state-veterans-cemetery-from-the-oc-great-park-and-irvine

:)
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: irvinehomeowner on February 26, 2015, 10:23:56 AM
link not valid
Sorry... fixed it.

:)
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: WTTCHMN on March 06, 2015, 11:09:22 AM
People like Pat Star should be more pissed about something like this than the Veterans Cemetery.  Displaying the American flag is now hate speech?  Interestingly, it's a Hispanic who wants it taken down.  The Iranian guy opposes it.


UC Irvine Students Vote To Remove American Flag From Campus Lobby

March 6, 2015 10:23 AM

IRVINE — Students at the University of California, Irvine, have voted for a more “inclusive space” by banning the American flag on part of the school’s campus.

Under resolution R50-70 passed Thursday, the Associated Students of University of California, Irvine (ASUCI) voted to remove all flags – including Old Glory – from the main lobby on campus, according to the ASUCI website.

A portion of the resolution reads: “(F)lags construct paradigms of conformity and sets homogenized standards for others to obtain which in this country typically are idolized as freedom, equality, and democracy.”

Authored by student Matthew Guevara, the resolution goes on to state that since “the American flag has been flown in instances of colonialism and imperialism”, its display “does not express only selective aspects of its symbolism but the entire spectrum of its interpretation.”

After citing freedom of speech as a “valued right that ASUCI supports,” the resolution states that “freedom of speech, in a space that aims to be as inclusive as possible can be interpreted as hate speech.”

The resolution concludes with the following: “Let it be resolved that ASUCI make every effort to make the Associated Students main lobby space as inclusive as possible. Let it further be resolved that no flag, of any nation, may be hanged on the walls of the Associate Student main lobby space.”

A final tally ended in six votes in favor of the resolution, four opposed, and two abstaining.

In a message posted on the group’s Facebook page Thursday evening, ASUCI President Reza Zomorrodian voiced his opposition to the resolution and said officials have yet to decide on a course of action regarding the vote.

“I stand firmly against this piece of legislation, though I understand the authors intent and supporters intent, I disagree with the solution [the ASUCI Legislative Council] has come to,” Zomorrodian said.

It wasn’t immediately clear when a final decision would be made.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: The California Court Company on March 06, 2015, 11:25:41 AM
WTF at UCI. look at what happens when they have too many international students. I won't be surprised if the following occur at UCI
1. ISIS attack
2. erection of Chairman Mao's statue, or raise of the China 5 star flag
3. change the school mascot from that meager anteater to dragon
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: rkp on March 06, 2015, 11:37:37 AM
they arent saying no flags on campus, just no flags in the lobby in an effort to create a true open space.  the intent might be good but the problem is that you are always bound to alienate someone

Quote
Let it be further be resolved that if a decorative item is in the Associate student lobby space and issues arise, the solution will be to remove the item if there is considerable request to do so.

imagine someone crying about the tile floor and how the quarries that produced the tile were in their home towns and destroyed their homes and hence, they want it removed. 

http://www.asuci.uci.edu/legislative/legislations/print.php?cnum=R50-70&gov_branch=ASUCI
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: Soylent Green Is People on March 06, 2015, 11:55:38 AM
These same students seem to be OK carrying US Currency with imperialist presidents on them as well as proclaiming "In God We Trust". Pretty selective outrage, oxymoronic like a leather shoe wearing vegan.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: Happiness on March 06, 2015, 12:00:31 PM
Ahh, this UCI resolution takes me back to my own college days....then as now, advocating crazy shit, speaking in gibberish, wearing Malcom X/Che/Mumia t-shirt, etc. was just a pathetic way of trying to get laid.  To misguided UCI students: give it up, didn't work then and won't work now.

Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: qwerty on March 06, 2015, 12:05:17 PM
im going to show up at this place draped in the american flag to see what happens.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: lnc on March 06, 2015, 12:52:15 PM
im going to show up at this place draped in the american flag to see what happens.

Like this.. :)

(http://i.istockimg.com/file_thumbview_approve/6033756/3/stock-photo-6033756-shirtless-caucasian-mature-man-wearing-american-flag.jpg)
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: aquabliss on March 22, 2015, 09:46:26 PM
I noticed late last week they demolished the cinder block wall on Irvine Blvd approximately where the cemetery is going.

Ground breaking soon perhaps?
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: eyephone on March 22, 2015, 09:48:30 PM
I noticed late last week they demolished the cinder block wall on Irvine Blvd approximately where the cemetery is going.

Ground breaking soon perhaps?

#AskYaliu
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: . on March 23, 2015, 02:44:37 PM
I noticed late last week they demolished the cinder block wall on Irvine Blvd approximately where the cemetery is going.

Ground breaking soon perhaps?

#AskYaliu

#Idontknow.

@aquabliss, come to city hall tomorrow

Btw, is there any TI forum rule about donation? 
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: irvinehomeowner on March 23, 2015, 03:50:08 PM
#ResistanceIsFutile
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: eyephone on March 23, 2015, 03:59:26 PM
I noticed late last week they demolished the cinder block wall on Irvine Blvd approximately where the cemetery is going.

Ground breaking soon perhaps?

#AskYaliu

#Idontknow.

@aquabliss, come to city hall tomorrow and protest. 

Btw, is there any TI forum rule about donation?

Yaliu - think peaceful.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: eyephone on March 23, 2015, 04:38:29 PM
I noticed late last week they demolished the cinder block wall on Irvine Blvd approximately where the cemetery is going.

Ground breaking soon perhaps?

#AskYaliu

#Idontknow.

@aquabliss, come to city hall tomorrow and protest. 

Btw, is there any TI forum rule about donation?

Don't you have work Yaliu?
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: SoCal on March 23, 2015, 05:41:52 PM
Protesting the veterans. Yah, right. Is this a joke?
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: The California Court Company on March 23, 2015, 06:05:56 PM
here we go again. Yaliu is pro veteran, anti cemetery. He thinks veterans deserve a better resting place than GP
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: . on March 23, 2015, 06:39:59 PM
I noticed late last week they demolished the cinder block wall on Irvine Blvd approximately where the cemetery is going.

Ground breaking soon perhaps?

#AskYaliu

#Idontknow.

@aquabliss, come to city hall tomorrow and protest. 

Btw, is there any TI forum rule about donation?

Don't you have work Yaliu?

sorry.  my word is incorrect.  i meant to say "voice your opinion in the public commentary section of city council meeting".  it is tuesday night at 6pm.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: eyephone on March 25, 2015, 10:10:30 PM
I noticed late last week they demolished the cinder block wall on Irvine Blvd approximately where the cemetery is going.

Ground breaking soon perhaps?

#AskYaliu

#Idontknow.

@aquabliss, come to city hall tomorrow and protest. 

Btw, is there any TI forum rule about donation?

Don't you have work Yaliu?

sorry.  my word is incorrect.  i meant to say "voice your opinion in the public commentary section of city council meeting".  it is tuesday night at 6pm.

How did it go?
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: . on March 25, 2015, 11:13:48 PM
I noticed late last week they demolished the cinder block wall on Irvine Blvd approximately where the cemetery is going.

Ground breaking soon perhaps?

#AskYaliu

#Idontknow.

@aquabliss, come to city hall tomorrow and protest. 

Btw, is there any TI forum rule about donation?

Don't you have work Yaliu?

sorry.  my word is incorrect.  i meant to say "voice your opinion in the public commentary section of city council meeting".  it is tuesday night at 6pm.

How did it go?

Not good.  not good.  we need more people.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: The California Court Company on March 26, 2015, 08:50:10 AM
not surprising. Chinese people, have more "I only care about myself" attitude. They don't usually work together for a common goal. Irvine has had what, TWO Korean mayors yest ZERO Chinese mayors despite there are more Chinese than Koreans.

Chinese people are also pretty submissive. TIC can pretty much charge as much as they want with as small lots as they can get and the Chinese will still line up and buy these new homes.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: SoCal on March 26, 2015, 08:54:27 AM
not surprising. Chinese people, have more "I only care about myself" attitude.

Are you not Chinese? I thought you were.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: The California Court Company on March 26, 2015, 09:06:52 AM
Chinese people have been under authoritarian rule for many thousand years; from the Dynasties, to KMT to Mao to the ruling Communist party. they've never tasted democracy and never fully understand the basic human rights. their history is full of internal conflicts and civil wars. just look at WWII. KMT and the communist party "briefly" worked together against the Japanese invader, but as soon as the war was over, instead of rebuilding they started fighting against each other. even more sadly, after the communists seized the mainland, they started fighting each other among themselves...the Cultural Revolution and so on.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: irvinehomeowner on March 26, 2015, 09:09:14 AM
I hate to break this to you yaliu... but you will find it hard to oppose a Veteran's cemetery that really isn't that close to residential housing.

You'll probably find it easier to Kickstarter this:

(http://moresay.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/10/ghostbusters-proton-pack-gun-ghost-trap-01.jpg)
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: Happiness on March 26, 2015, 09:31:57 AM
Chinese people have been under authoritarian rule for many thousand years; from the Dynasties, to KMT to Mao to the ruling Communist party. they've never tasted democracy and never fully understand the basic human rights. their history is full of internal conflicts and civil wars. just look at WWII. KMT and the communist party "briefly" worked together against the Japanese invader, but as soon as the war was over, instead of rebuilding they started fighting against each other. even more sadly, after the communists seized the mainland, they started fighting each other among themselves...the Cultural Revolution and so on.

The Chinese weren't always sheep and the West wasn't always free.  Go back a little more than 500 years ago, at that time, China encouraged free thinking and welcomed new ideas and even foreign ideas while at that time in Europe, if you said the earth revolved around the sun, you'd be burned at the stake.  So there is hope that the Chinese in the future will be more like their ancestors:  free and innovative instead of sheep and imitators.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: The California Court Company on March 26, 2015, 09:44:48 AM
yaliu you should run for the Mayor! I won't petition against the cemetery but I will vote for you. I control at least 4 votes

Chinese people have been under authoritarian rule for many thousand years; from the Dynasties, to KMT to Mao to the ruling Communist party. they've never tasted democracy and never fully understand the basic human rights. their history is full of internal conflicts and civil wars. just look at WWII. KMT and the communist party "briefly" worked together against the Japanese invader, but as soon as the war was over, instead of rebuilding they started fighting against each other. even more sadly, after the communists seized the mainland, they started fighting each other among themselves...the Cultural Revolution and so on.

The Chinese weren't always sheep and the West wasn't always free.  Go back a little more than 500 years ago, at that time, China encouraged free thinking and welcomed new ideas and even foreign ideas while at that time in Europe, if you said the earth revolved around the sun, you'd be burned at the stake.  So there is hope that the Chinese in the future will be more like their ancestors:  free and innovative instead of sheep and imitators.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: . on March 26, 2015, 09:50:17 AM
not surprising. Chinese people, have more "I only care about myself" attitude. They don't usually work together for a common goal. Irvine has had what, TWO Korean mayors yest ZERO Chinese mayors despite there are more Chinese than Koreans.

Chinese people are also pretty submissive. TIC can pretty much charge as much as they want with as small lots as they can get and the Chinese will still line up and buy these new homes.


somehow, i agreed with you...  i am concern that less chinese will move in because of cemetery.  with less potential buyers, the house value will drop down.  with house value drop down, more "ghetto" people will move in and cause school rating goes down.  this will cause more chinese to flee irvine and more house value drop.  this will start a bad cycle.  then IHO will become AHO (ArcadiaHomeOwner).  Irvinecommuter will become DiamondBarCommuter.

that's only my concern and my two cents. 
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: . on March 26, 2015, 09:51:20 AM
yaliu you should run for the Mayor! I won't petition against the cemetery but I will vote for you. I control at least 4 votes

Chinese people have been under authoritarian rule for many thousand years; from the Dynasties, to KMT to Mao to the ruling Communist party. they've never tasted democracy and never fully understand the basic human rights. their history is full of internal conflicts and civil wars. just look at WWII. KMT and the communist party "briefly" worked together against the Japanese invader, but as soon as the war was over, instead of rebuilding they started fighting against each other. even more sadly, after the communists seized the mainland, they started fighting each other among themselves...the Cultural Revolution and so on.

The Chinese weren't always sheep and the West wasn't always free.  Go back a little more than 500 years ago, at that time, China encouraged free thinking and welcomed new ideas and even foreign ideas while at that time in Europe, if you said the earth revolved around the sun, you'd be burned at the stake.  So there is hope that the Chinese in the future will be more like their ancestors:  free and innovative instead of sheep and imitators.

that's the worst part.  a lot of chinese wont vote.    :(
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: The California Court Company on March 26, 2015, 10:04:49 AM
wow. this reply has a lot of potential of turning into something else. I think the impact of house price will be limited. more diversity in Irvine is a good thing actually. More civilized, Western educated Chinese will not really shy away from the cemetery (nothing against you yaliu, just generally speaking) so that's good too.
We get more diversity and get the good Chinese (as oppose to those Chinese tourists or freeway bike riders). what's not to like.

Quote from: yaliu07 link=topic=11986.msg256225#msg256225
somehow, i agreed with you...  i am concern that less chinese will move in because of cemetery.  with less potential buyers, the house value will drop down.  with house value drop down, more "ghetto" people will move in and cause school rating goes down.  this will cause more chinese to flee irvine and more house value drop.  this will start a bad cycle.  then IHO will become AHO (ArcadiaHomeOwner).  Irvinecommuter will become DiamondBarCommuter.

that's only my concern and my two cents.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: irvinehomeowner on March 26, 2015, 10:15:13 AM
If FCBs will still buy a house with a '4' address... they will still buy near a cemetery.

#NotAllFCBsAreSuperstitious
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: Soylent Green Is People on March 26, 2015, 11:38:28 AM
Agreed.

If a $1.4m home in Irvine comes up for sale, located on 444 4th Avenue in the center of a T-intersection, with YOY values going up 44% per year, my bet is that those with an aversion to the supernatural will find true religion quickly.

"Hokey religions and ancient weapons are no match for a good bla$ter at your side".

 ::)
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: . on March 26, 2015, 01:29:31 PM
Agreed.

If a $1.4m home in Irvine comes up for sale, located on 444 4th Avenue in the center of a T-intersection, with YOY values going up 44% per year, my bet is that those with an aversion to the supernatural will find true religion quickly.

"Hokey religions and ancient weapons are no match for a good bla$ter at your side".

 ::)

Totally disagreed....  what about the resale value?  can that person buy the same value house in a different location (in irvine) with different address with 1.4 million?

When that person eventually sell that house, how many potential buyer will be there?  For example, if there are 10 qualified potential buy in Irvine, will all 10 of them interested in that house? 

if i am one of the 10 buyer, i will NOT be in interested in that house because i know with 1.4 million, i can buy some other house.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: qwerty on March 26, 2015, 01:40:42 PM
cmon yaliu - we know the chinese have crazy beliefs, but money supersedes everything. every belief system has a price.

STRAIGHT CASH HOMEY

Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: irvinehomeowner on March 26, 2015, 02:19:55 PM
$ > Feng Shui > Casper
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: . on March 26, 2015, 04:01:14 PM
$ > Feng Shui > Casper

IHO, if there are two similar house.  they both asking for 1M.  one address is 123 and another is 144.   which house will you pick and why?
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: irvinehomeowner on March 26, 2015, 04:13:10 PM
$ > Feng Shui > Casper

IHO, if there are two similar house.  they both asking for 1M.  one address is 123 and another is 144.   which house will you pick and why?
Uh... you are breaking the equation.

The price/location/features has to be less for 144 for me (or any FCB) to buy it.

That's why $ is at the top of the equation.

If 144 were $944k and 123 was $1.288m, I'm sure 144 would go first.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: momopi on March 26, 2015, 05:58:12 PM
?_?  I'm ethnic Chinese and I'd gladly buy a home next to a nice cemetery for quiet neighbors and parkland access.  Preferably with a population of small game (rabbits, squirrels) as 4-legged 500 calorie protein bars in case of emergency.

Mainlanders have been living under communist rule for over 6 decades.  Communism is about getting the lower classes to attack the middle class to attack the upper class, who are competition for power to the political elite.  When the upper class is killed off, and middle class destroyed so they cannot climb to upper class, the elites can dream that they'd be in power forever.  This is not a system of cooperation, it's one where the relationship between men is like that of wolves. 

Deng Xiaoping knew this and did what he could to reform the system.  However his efforts and that of his successors were more concerned with "hardware" aspect of agriculture/economic/scientific/national defense development, and less on "software' aspect of human development.  Beijing Government had to tell Taxi drivers not to spit out the window for 2008 Olympics.  In contrast, Lee Kuan Yew of Singapore prioritized & forced the "software" development by turning Singapore into a FINE city where feeding the birds or not flushing the toilet is a $500 FINE.

The Irvine that I knew was a city where young couples could afford a home and raise a family.  When I first moved to Irvine I was on first name basis with my neighbors and we exchanged phone #'s and had BBQ gatherings by the pool.  Years later I find myself among neighbors who did not want to talk to me and respond to my "good morning" greeting with a grunt.  I had to go buy another house in a "lesser" city's cul-de-sac where I'm on my neighbor's facebook, I walk their dog, attend their baby showers, we have each other's house keys for emergencies, and they pick up my mail while I'm on vacation.

Maybe, just maybe when fewer snobbish rich people move into this city, and more "ghetto" people (as Yaliu puts it) move in, I'd consider moving back to my house in Irvine and, when i say "good morning" to someone, that person will respond with a smile and "Buenos dias señor".  In the mean time, if the cemetery gets build and it's nice, you might find me there during lunch break with a croque monsieur or shooter's sandwich.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: Happiness on March 26, 2015, 06:19:14 PM
Communism is about getting the lower classes to attack the middle class to attack the upper class, who are competition for power to the political elite.

As momo indicates, after the Communist takeover of mainland China, the well off became "class enemies" who were hunted down by gangs of Red Guards.  One of the ways Communist thugs identified class enemies was to look for people displaying good manners in public.  At that time, having good manners in mainland China could cost you your life so the educated and formerly well off people had to act like backwards peasants as a survival tactic: "look at me, I spit on the sidewalk and put my bare feet on the restaurant table so I can't be a member of the bourgeoisie!"  Now, the Communists are embarrassed by the behavior of their own people overseas.  Too bad, you reap what you sow. 
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: eyephone on March 26, 2015, 06:52:11 PM
If FCBs will still buy a house with a '4' address... they will still buy near a cemetery.

#NotAllFCBsAreSuperstitious

I guess you don't know the magnitude of the cemetary to a Chinese born buyer. Our close friend told us they found a house in a gated community in Fullerton. (She Speaks English fluently)  Then she told us about the place she really liked, how she went to the open house, it has a park close by so her kids can play, she loves the layout of the house etc. blah blah.

I just said one sentence - you mean those houses across the cemetary. I showed her the map on my phone. Then it looked like her face turned pale and she said never mind.

I have family that lives around there, so I know it like that are like the back of my hand.

In summary, the cemetary is a no no.

Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: . on March 26, 2015, 10:57:08 PM
$ > Feng Shui > Casper

IHO, if there are two similar house.  they both asking for 1M.  one address is 123 and another is 144.   which house will you pick and why?
Uh... you are breaking the equation.

The price/location/features has to be less for 144 for me (or any FCB) to buy it.

That's why $ is at the top of the equation.

If 144 were $944k and 123 was $1.288m, I'm sure 144 would go first.

my understanding is that if two house have similar year build, similar square feet, similar lot size, within a mile (close by) and etc,

IHO will buy

since these two house are very similar, then they should have similar asking price.  but now 144 most likely will attract less buyer because of feng shu.

this can apply same to the cemetery.  that's one of the reason why we want to relocate the cemetery.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: qwerty on March 26, 2015, 11:00:57 PM
I don't want to offend my fellow asian TI members but why the heck do you guys believe in feng shui? You guys know its all bullshit right? You guys are supposed to be the smart minority.  You guys disappoint me :-(

And the whole number four thing is that feng shui as well or some other stupid belief?
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: . on March 26, 2015, 11:02:47 PM
?_?  I'm ethnic Chinese and I'd gladly buy a home next to a nice cemetery for quiet neighbors and parkland access.  Preferably with a population of small game (rabbits, squirrels) as 4-legged 500 calorie protein bars in case of emergency.

Mainlanders have been living under communist rule for over 6 decades.  Communism is about getting the lower classes to attack the middle class to attack the upper class, who are competition for power to the political elite.  When the upper class is killed off, and middle class destroyed so they cannot climb to upper class, the elites can dream that they'd be in power forever.  This is not a system of cooperation, it's one where the relationship between men is like that of wolves. 

Deng Xiaoping knew this and did what he could to reform the system.  However his efforts and that of his successors were more concerned with "hardware" aspect of agriculture/economic/scientific/national defense development, and less on "software' aspect of human development.  Beijing Government had to tell Taxi drivers not to spit out the window for 2008 Olympics.  In contrast, Lee Kuan Yew of Singapore prioritized & forced the "software" development by turning Singapore into a FINE city where feeding the birds or not flushing the toilet is a $500 FINE.

The Irvine that I knew was a city where young couples could afford a home and raise a family.  When I first moved to Irvine I was on first name basis with my neighbors and we exchanged phone #'s and had BBQ gatherings by the pool.  Years later I find myself among neighbors who did not want to talk to me and respond to my "good morning" greeting with a grunt.  I had to go buy another house in a "lesser" city's cul-de-sac where I'm on my neighbor's facebook, I walk their dog, attend their baby showers, we have each other's house keys for emergencies, and they pick up my mail while I'm on vacation.

Maybe, just maybe when fewer snobbish rich people move into this city, and more "ghetto" people (as Yaliu puts it) move in, I'd consider moving back to my house in Irvine and, when i say "good morning" to someone, that person will respond with a smile and "Buenos dias señor".  In the mean time, if the cemetery gets build and it's nice, you might find me there during lunch break with a croque monsieur or shooter's sandwich.

it seems alot of people prefer cemetery because they dont LIVE in Irvine.
alot of people wants to relocate cemetery because they are close by resident. 

i will be very happy to vote to relocate to momopi's city. 
this is a win win situation.  it is good for our veteran.  it is good for momopi because he wants quiet neighbors.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: qwerty on March 26, 2015, 11:06:13 PM
Yaliu - what if I told you I had the hookup at the department of defense to get you buried at this veterans cemetery. Would that change your mind? That way you can spend this life and the next in irvine. Let me know.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: . on March 26, 2015, 11:15:56 PM
Yaliu - what if I told you I had the hookup at the department of defense to get you buried at this veterans cemetery. Would that change your mind? That way you can spend this life and the next in irvine. Let me know.

it is way too early for me to decide.  but my answer is probably not.  i think i will probably bury in rose hill (S. CA) or China or (maybe other RED state).
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: . on March 26, 2015, 11:16:41 PM
I don't want to offend my fellow asian TI members but why the heck do you guys believe in feng shui? You guys know its all bullshit right? You guys are supposed to be the smart minority.  You guys disappoint me :-(

And the whole number four thing is that feng shui as well or some other stupid belief?

why does some building have 13th floor.  why is there a store called 7-11.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: . on March 26, 2015, 11:19:18 PM
my reasons to relocate the cemetery

so far, no one gave us a reason why cemetery can NOT relocate to less residential area or less asian area.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: Ready2Downsize on March 26, 2015, 11:48:45 PM
What does 7-11 have to do with the price of tea in china?

7-11 got it's name because it had extended hours, from 7 AM to 11 PM back in the day.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: bones on March 27, 2015, 03:51:02 AM
my reasons to relocate the cemetery
  • feng shui
  • ghost
  • house resale value
  • gun shot salute

so far, no one gave us a reason why cemetery can NOT relocate to less residential area or less asian area.

So you've said 1000 times. No ones given you a reason bc I don't think ppl really care.  The same reason you got a low turnout at whatever protest. And low # of signatures. Sure, the cemetary may alienate a few buyers but all you need is one buyer. You don't need the masses to love your home at resale.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: eyephone on March 27, 2015, 06:23:23 AM
my reasons to relocate the cemetery
  • feng shui
  • ghost
  • house resale value
  • gun shot salute

so far, no one gave us a reason why cemetery can NOT relocate to less residential area or less asian area.

So you've said 1000 times. No ones given you a reason bc I don't think ppl really care.  The same reason you got a low turnout at whatever protest. And low # of signatures. Sure, the cemetary may alienate a few buyers but all you need is one buyer. You don't need the masses to love your home at resale.

Everybody is like whatevers now, but wait until the cemetery is built. Who knows people's attitude might change when its built.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: eyephone on March 27, 2015, 06:40:58 AM
my reasons to relocate the cemetery
  • feng shui
  • ghost
  • house resale value
  • gun shot salute

so far, no one gave us a reason why cemetery can NOT relocate to less residential area or less asian area.

I like that reason: gun shot salute
#Funny
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: irvinehomeowner on March 27, 2015, 06:53:34 AM
so far, no one gave us a reason why cemetery can NOT relocate to less residential area or less asian area.
So when did Pavilion Park become an "asian area"?

And when did race become a criteria of where a cemetery should be built?

The proposed cemetery site is buffered by a park so that is "less residential".

If FCBs will buy on toxic land, next to a landfill, on a T,  next to a freeway, etc, they will still buy next to Casperville if the price is right.

Why isn't yaliu worried more about the jail? I would be more wary of the living than the dead.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: eyephone on March 27, 2015, 06:59:36 AM
so far, no one gave us a reason why cemetery can NOT relocate to less residential area or less asian area.
So when did Pavilion Park become an "asian area"?

And when did race become a criteria of where a cemetery should be built?

The proposed cemetery site is buffered by a park so that is "less residential".

If FCBs will buy on toxic land, next to a landfill, on a T,  next to a freeway, etc, they will still buy next to Casperville if the price is right.

Why isn't yaliu worried more about the jail? I would be more wary of the living than the dead.

Who knows Yaliu might march from PP to Irvine City Hall.  ;)
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: SoCal on March 27, 2015, 08:58:32 AM
Yaliu, as much as I give you a hard time about disrespecting the veterans and their families to put your needs first while enjoying the fruits of their labor, I'm going to try and cheer you up a little. I'm not one of those eternally optimistic people but that said, what will probably happen if you find that no Chinese person and not a single FCB is interested in buying your house in the future is that a financed buyer will come in, making you an even higher offer. Oh, nooo. More money. Cash buyers are notorious for expecting concessions and a discount because their offer is strong. They throw that crown on and let everybody know who's boss. However, the highest and most cooperative offers I've ever had selling a home were actually financed buyers. In Irvine, especially, I'm sure they would appreciate being given a chance. So, sell your home to one of them. I wouldn't lose any sleep over it. As Bones said, it only takes 1 buyer to close the deal.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: eyephone on March 27, 2015, 09:09:05 AM
Yaliu, as much as I give you a hard time about disrespecting the veterans and their families to put your needs first, I'm going to try and cheer you up a little. I'm not one of those eternally optimistic people but that said, what will probably happen if you find that no Chinese person and not a single FCB is interested in buying your house in the future is that a financed buyer will come in, making you an even higher offer. Oh, nooo. More money. Cash buyers are notorious for expecting concessions and a discount because their offer is strong. They throw that crown on and let everybody know who's boss. However, the highest and most cooperative offers I've ever had selling a home were actually financed buyers. In Irvine, especially, I'm sure they would appreciate being given a chance. So, sell your home to one of them. I wouldn't lose any sleep over it. As Bones said, it only takes 1 buyer to close the deal.

It only takes one offer, but multiples offers are better.  ;)
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: The California Court Company on March 27, 2015, 09:30:26 AM
I am correcting this Irvine hater 1000th time. Yaliu is not disrepecting the veterans, he is against the cemetery. any kind of cemetery in general.

Yaliu, as much as I give you a hard time about disrespecting the veterans and their families to put your needs first while enjoying the fruits of their labor, I'm going to try and cheer you up a little. I'm not one of those eternally optimistic people but that said, what will probably happen if you find that no Chinese person and not a single FCB is interested in buying your house in the future is that a financed buyer will come in, making you an even higher offer. Oh, nooo. More money. Cash buyers are notorious for expecting concessions and a discount because their offer is strong. They throw that crown on and let everybody know who's boss. However, the highest and most cooperative offers I've ever had selling a home were actually financed buyers. In Irvine, especially, I'm sure they would appreciate being given a chance. So, sell your home to one of them. I wouldn't lose any sleep over it. As Bones said, it only takes 1 buyer to close the deal.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: SoCal on March 27, 2015, 04:16:24 PM
I am correcting this Irvine hater 1000th time. Yaliu is not disrepecting the veterans, he is against the cemetery. any kind of cemetery in general.

Yaliu, as much as I give you a hard time about disrespecting the veterans and their families to put your needs first while enjoying the fruits of their labor, I'm going to try and cheer you up a little. I'm not one of those eternally optimistic people but that said, what will probably happen if you find that no Chinese person and not a single FCB is interested in buying your house in the future is that a financed buyer will come in, making you an even higher offer. Oh, nooo. More money. Cash buyers are notorious for expecting concessions and a discount because their offer is strong. They throw that crown on and let everybody know who's boss. However, the highest and most cooperative offers I've ever had selling a home were actually financed buyers. In Irvine, especially, I'm sure they would appreciate being given a chance. So, sell your home to one of them. I wouldn't lose any sleep over it. As Bones said, it only takes 1 buyer to close the deal.

Wow. You seem really tense again today. I had no idea being a receptionist at a patent attorney's office was so stressful.  :( Sorry, I hope you feel better soon.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: SoCal on March 27, 2015, 04:41:06 PM
I don't want to offend my fellow asian TI members but

 :o Lol. You know you've been on T.I. too long when...
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: Happiness on March 27, 2015, 04:44:25 PM
I don't want to offend my fellow asian TI members but

 :o Lol. You know you've been on T.I. too long when...

Many Mexicans have native American ancestors.  Native Americans came to America from Asia via the the Bering land bridge during periods in the past when the level of the Bering Sea was low enough that Asia and America were connected by dry land.  Therefore, Qwerty may, in fact, be Asian.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: qwerty on March 27, 2015, 05:33:16 PM
I don't want to offend my fellow asian TI members but

 :o Lol. You know you've been on T.I. too long when...

Many Mexicans have native American ancestors.  Native Americans came to America from Asia via the the Bering land bridge during periods in the past when the level of the Bering Sea was low enough that Asia and America were connected by dry land.  Therefore, Qwerty may, in fact, be Asian.

I see what you are doing here. Your just trying to include me as asian so I can bring the average size up :-)
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: lnc on March 28, 2015, 09:13:41 AM
I don't want to offend my fellow asian TI members but why the heck do you guys believe in feng shui? You guys know its all bullshit right? You guys are supposed to be the smart minority.  You guys disappoint me :-(

And the whole number four thing is that feng shui as well or some other stupid belief?

The number thing is more of superstition but the whole feng shui thing in a way is kind of too. 

Just like most of superstition stuff, even if you don't believe in them but once you knew about it, it kind of affect you in certain way. 

Just like walking under a ladder.  If no one told you it's a bad luck, you have no problem walking under a ladder.  But once someone told you about it, then it's like a curse, you'll try to avoid walk under a ladder as much as you can for rest of your life.

(https://s3.amazonaws.com/lowres.cartoonstock.com/myths-legends-superstition-superstitious-superstitiously-ladders-black_cats-kfon259_low.jpg)
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: The California Court Company on April 06, 2015, 03:34:32 PM
yaliu,
you can try to kill the cemetery by arguing that we are in a drought; no need to build new cemeteries and golf courses.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: jmoney74 on April 06, 2015, 03:44:43 PM
yaliu,
you can try to kill the cemetery by arguing that we are in a drought; no need to build new cemeteries and golf courses.

no golf course?  Now i'm in a pickle. 
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: The California Court Company on April 06, 2015, 03:52:23 PM
you cannot have it both ways. use drought against cemetery but still want golf course built

yaliu,
you can try to kill the cemetery by arguing that we are in a drought; no need to build new cemeteries and golf courses.

no golf course?  Now i'm in a pickle.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: eyephone on April 06, 2015, 03:56:22 PM
I have a solution: exclusive tennis courts (tennis club)
This will drive up the price of houses.

you cannot have it both ways. use drought against cemetery but still want golf course built

yaliu,
you can try to kill the cemetery by arguing that we are in a drought; no need to build new cemeteries and golf courses.

no golf course?  Now i'm in a pickle.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: . on April 06, 2015, 08:10:46 PM
yaliu,
you can try to kill the cemetery by arguing that we are in a drought; no need to build new cemeteries and golf courses.

most likely, they will use recycle water.  but, please keep posting more ideas.  :)
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: Homer_Simpson on April 07, 2015, 07:04:04 AM
So when's the cemetery coming?   :)
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: jmoney74 on April 07, 2015, 07:10:09 AM
So when's the cemetery coming?   :)

May 1st.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: Coleman on April 07, 2015, 07:17:15 AM
I don't want to offend my fellow asian TI members but why the heck do you guys believe in feng shui? You guys know its all bullshit right? You guys are supposed to be the smart minority.  You guys disappoint me :-(

And the whole number four thing is that feng shui as well or some other stupid belief?

The number thing is more of superstition but the whole feng shui thing in a way is kind of too. 

Just like most of superstition stuff, even if you don't believe in them but once you knew about it, it kind of affect you in certain way. 

Just like walking under a ladder.  If no one told you it's a bad luck, you have no problem walking under a ladder.  But once someone told you about it, then it's like a curse, you'll try to avoid walk under a ladder as much as you can for rest of your life.

(https://s3.amazonaws.com/lowres.cartoonstock.com/myths-legends-superstition-superstitious-superstitiously-ladders-black_cats-kfon259_low.jpg)

Can you guys think of something else in life that people regularly do in hopes to making one's life better based on some type of personal belief?

Feng shui, superstition, and ideal from above are all very similar. 
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: The California Court Company on April 07, 2015, 09:46:02 AM
yaliu, here is a preview for you. if there are ghosts, they are not that scary and often misunderstood.

http://www.groupon.com/deals/orange-county-ghosts-and-legends-tours-1
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: ps9 on May 24, 2015, 01:41:11 PM
Here are the Irvine Memorial day activities, the Northwood one is today at 4pm at "Castle" park.  Gonna try to go to one of the North San Diego County one tomorrow.  There's a link below for Socal Memorial Day events.

(http://i1233.photobucket.com/albums/ff390/Ps99472/Mday_zpsawuqxb3i.jpg)
(http://i1233.photobucket.com/albums/ff390/Ps99472/Mday2_zpsccy2istj.jpg)

https://www.calvet.ca.gov/Documents/2015%20Memorial%20Day%20Events%20Southern%20California.pdf
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: ps9 on May 30, 2015, 10:25:52 AM
So we're just in a waiting game now for Calvet?  Here are the slides from last year, note the 5point rebuttal on 7-11-14 (http://www.cityofirvine.org/council/comms/ad_hoc_state_veterans_cemetery_committee/agenda.asp).  It suggested alternative sites (Tustin Legacy?) and also utilizing the Cultural Terrace or the 100 acre county land that is currently being pursued for commercial use (http://www.talkirvine.com/index.php/topic,12999.0.html).  The lawyer letter summarizes a time frame:

(http://i1233.photobucket.com/albums/ff390/Ps99472/arda_zpslu4wlivo.jpg)

So the cemetery can only be developed after 12/27/17 and only if the golf course is 'finished'.  What I can interpret is that 5point is trying to flex some muscle and push the development of the cemetery to the Cultural Terrace?  Or maybe they can just never finish the golf course to prevent cemetery development?
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: eyephone on May 30, 2015, 10:44:20 AM
So we're just in a waiting game now for Calvet?  Here are the slides from last year, note the 5point rebuttal on 7-11-14 (http://www.cityofirvine.org/council/comms/ad_hoc_state_veterans_cemetery_committee/agenda.asp).  It suggested alternative sites (Tustin Legacy?) and also utilizing the Cultural Terrace or the 100 acre county land that is currently being pursued for commercial use (http://www.talkirvine.com/index.php/topic,12999.0.html).  The lawyer letter summarizes a time frame:

(http://i1233.photobucket.com/albums/ff390/Ps99472/arda_zpslu4wlivo.jpg)

So the cemetery can only be developed after 12/27/17 and only if the golf course is 'finished'.  What I can interpret is that 5point is trying to flex some muscle and push the development of the cemetery to the Cultural Terrace?  Or maybe they can just never finish the golf course to prevent cemetery development?

Did Yaliu have anything to do with this?
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: ps9 on May 30, 2015, 11:12:46 AM
I wish 5point can be more vocal with potential buyers about this, at least give some guidance on what roadblocks it can throw at the cemetery.  I was neutral about it but now I'm on yaliu's side because my BP plans just got vetoed by my CEO.  :(
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: jmoney74 on May 30, 2015, 11:52:52 AM
I wish 5point can be more vocal with potential buyers about this, at least give some guidance on what roadblocks it can throw at the cemetery.  I was neutral about it but now I'm on yaliu's side because my BP plans just got vetoed by my CEO.  :(

It might work against them
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: . on May 30, 2015, 01:14:10 PM
I wish 5point can be more vocal with potential buyers about this, at least give some guidance on what roadblocks it can throw at the cemetery.  I was neutral about it but now I'm on yaliu's side because my BP plans just got vetoed by my CEO.  :(

just drive around BP with the proposed cemetery location on BP grand opening date.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: . on May 31, 2015, 10:04:16 PM
there is a town hall meeting with Mayor Choi and Council Woman Lynn Schott on 06/08/2015 6-8pm at Cypress Community Park 255 Visions Irvine, CA 92620.  it is to discussion of relocating the veteran cemetery to another location.

see pdf attachment
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: zubs on May 31, 2015, 11:53:05 PM
How about by the garbage dump?
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: ps9 on June 01, 2015, 06:40:11 AM
there is a town hall meeting with Mayor Choi and Council Woman Lynn Schott on 06/08/2015 6-8pm at Cypress Community Park 255 Visions Irvine, CA 92620.  it is to discussion of relocating the veteran cemetery to another location.

https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/content_link/tIxWCAn1f2RAqhGQaf8WGxqOjlUwaRuyaaMjb97vUlaEKjmOC9jTRiZwRzNYirEh



What location?  Did you invite 5point as well?
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: jmoney74 on June 01, 2015, 07:58:51 AM
there is a town hall meeting with Mayor Choi and Council Woman Lynn Schott on 06/08/2015 6-8pm at Cypress Community Park 255 Visions Irvine, CA 92620.  it is to discussion of relocating the veteran cemetery to another location.

see pdf attachment

Yaliu is in the know!  Please continue our efforts my friend!
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: . on June 01, 2015, 09:58:01 AM
we worked hard to have this town hall meeting.  we appreciate if people can come and voice their thoughts.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: qwerty on June 01, 2015, 10:54:02 AM
Yaliu - ill be there for you man.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: Irvine Fanatic on June 01, 2015, 04:42:49 PM
whats the proposed / alternate location?
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: jmoney74 on June 01, 2015, 05:34:46 PM
whats the proposed / alternate location?

To the District
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: irvinehomeowner on June 01, 2015, 05:38:33 PM
whats the proposed / alternate location?

To the District
It's already like a graveyard.

They should put it somewhere in Tustin Legacy, that was a former military base too.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: qwerty on June 01, 2015, 05:40:48 PM
whats the proposed / alternate location?

To the District
It's already like a graveyard.

They should put it somewhere in Tustin Legacy, that was a former military base too.

you guys can keep your cemetary. we dont want it here, we got asians too.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: jmoney74 on June 01, 2015, 05:43:10 PM
whats the proposed / alternate location?

To the District
It's already like a graveyard.

They should put it somewhere in Tustin Legacy, that was a former military base too.

you guys can keep your cemetary. we dont want it here, we got asians too.

No worries.. it will go inside the hangar.  blocks the bad feng shui from coming out.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: The California Court Company on June 01, 2015, 05:51:04 PM
I am warming up to the idea of having a Veterans cemetery in the Great Park. what a great way to teach my children about being patriotic and the sacrifices of our military service men and women. I will bring all my Chinese friends with me to the town hall meeting to show support for our veterans.

we worked hard to have this town hall meeting.  we appreciate if people can come and voice their thoughts.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: eatthis on June 01, 2015, 10:54:57 PM
we worked hard to have this town hall meeting.  we appreciate if people can come and voice their thoughts.

I'll be there as well. The only way to show the city council that we're serious is if we put on a full court press and turn out lots of very vocal residents.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: eatthis on June 01, 2015, 11:55:30 PM
I am warming up to the idea of having a Veterans cemetery in the Great Park. what a great way to teach my children about being patriotic and the sacrifices of our military service men and women. I will bring all my Chinese friends with me to the town hall meeting to show support for our veterans.

There are plenty of ways to pay tribute to our veterans. Having them buried next to our home and where our kids go to school is not one of them.

1. Riverside veterans cemetery is currently the busiest in the country, handling 8000 burials each year. That's almost 22 every day 365 days a year. If the cemetery is established in Irvine, it's projected to be even busier. (LA Times) I can't imagine what this will do to the traffic on Irvine Blvd.

2. There are lots of research and articles on how cemeteries are killing the living through the dead, caused by pollution from chemicals, like embalming fluid that seeps into the ground. I don't want to leave to chance this won't happen here.

3. Having to pass by the cemetery on the way to the high school every day is off-putting to say the least. But, the thought of having my teenager go to school where there's full view of a cemetery is even more disturbing. These are still young kids who are not fully mature in their thought process. Who knows what they'll think or do.

4. It will turnoff certain buyers and drive down property value. This includes if you intend to rent your property out. This affects properties in Irvine disproportionally due to the buyer mix.

Having a cemetery in the middle of a busy city surrounded a huge resident population is simply not a good idea. I haven't heard any good argument for having the cemetery located here other than sentimental reasons and it's unpatriotic to ever say no to the veterans.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: eyephone on June 02, 2015, 12:02:07 AM
I am warming up to the idea of having a Veterans cemetery in the Great Park. what a great way to teach my children about being patriotic and the sacrifices of our military service men and women. I will bring all my Chinese friends with me to the town hall meeting to show support for our veterans.

There are plenty of ways to pay tribute to our veterans. Having them buried next to our home and where our kids go to school is not one of them.

1. Riverside veterans cemetery is currently the busiest in the country, handling 8000 burials each year. That's almost 22 every day 365 days a year. If the cemetery is established in Irvine, it's projected to be even busier. (LA Times) I can't imagine what this will do to the traffic on Irvine Blvd.

2. There are lots of research and articles on how cemeteries are killing the living through the dead, caused by pollution from chemicals, like embalming fluid that seeps into the ground. I don't want to leave to chance this won't happen here.

3. Having to pass by the cemetery on the way to the high school every day is off-putting to say the least. But, the thought of having my teenager go to school where there's full view of a cemetery is even more disturbing. These are still young kids who are not fully mature in their thought process. Who knows what they'll think or do.

4. It will turnoff certain buyers and drive down property value. This includes if you intend to rent your property out. This affects properties in Irvine disproportionally due to the buyer mix.

Having a cemetery in the middle of a busy city surrounded a huge resident population is simply not a good idea. I haven't heard any good argument for having the cemetery located here other than sentimental reasons and it's unpatriotic to ever say no to the veterans.

http://www.realnatural.org/will-you-be-leaving-behind-a-polluted-legacy/
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: . on June 02, 2015, 07:09:33 AM
I am warming up to the idea of having a Veterans cemetery in the Great Park. what a great way to teach my children about being patriotic and the sacrifices of our military service men and women. I will bring all my Chinese friends with me to the town hall meeting to show support for our veterans.

we worked hard to have this town hall meeting.  we appreciate if people can come and voice their thoughts.

@TCCC, come out and voice your thoughts why cemetery should be in great park.  This gives us a chance to listen your thoughts and give you a chance to listen our thoughts.  any thoughts are welcome.

Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: Irvinecommuter on June 02, 2015, 08:17:09 AM
I am warming up to the idea of having a Veterans cemetery in the Great Park. what a great way to teach my children about being patriotic and the sacrifices of our military service men and women. I will bring all my Chinese friends with me to the town hall meeting to show support for our veterans.

There are plenty of ways to pay tribute to our veterans. Having them buried next to our home and where our kids go to school is not one of them.

1. Riverside veterans cemetery is currently the busiest in the country, handling 8000 burials each year. That's almost 22 every day 365 days a year. If the cemetery is established in Irvine, it's projected to be even busier. (LA Times) I can't imagine what this will do to the traffic on Irvine Blvd.

2. There are lots of research and articles on how cemeteries are killing the living through the dead, caused by pollution from chemicals, like embalming fluid that seeps into the ground. I don't want to leave to chance this won't happen here.

3. Having to pass by the cemetery on the way to the high school every day is off-putting to say the least. But, the thought of having my teenager go to school where there's full view of a cemetery is even more disturbing. These are still young kids who are not fully mature in their thought process. Who knows what they'll think or do.

4. It will turnoff certain buyers and drive down property value. This includes if you intend to rent your property out. This affects properties in Irvine disproportionally due to the buyer mix.

Having a cemetery in the middle of a busy city surrounded a huge resident population is simply not a good idea. I haven't heard any good argument for having the cemetery located here other than sentimental reasons and it's unpatriotic to ever say no to the veterans.

We have had all these discussion points before.  The arguments boils down to honoring former soldiers vs. potential market value impact/fear of the dead.  To me, it's a wash so I don't really support or are against it. 
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: eatthis on June 02, 2015, 08:27:35 AM
We have had all these discussion points before.  The arguments boils down to honoring former soldiers vs. potential market value impact/fear of the dead.  To me, it's a wash so I don't really support or are against it.

I couldn't disagree more. It's far more than just market value or the fear of the dead.

The fact that toxic chemical can seep into the ground and affect resident's health is not a wash against honoring soldiers. The fact that there will be 22 burials every single day through highly trafficked Irvine Blvd is not a wash against honoring soldiers.

One is sentimental, the other is real impact on the living.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: bones on June 02, 2015, 08:30:11 AM
We have had all these discussion points before.  The arguments boils down to honoring former soldiers vs. potential market value impact/fear of the dead.  To me, it's a wash so I don't really support or are against it.

I couldn't disagree more. It's far more than just market value or the fear of the dead.

The fact that toxic chemical can seep into the ground and affect resident's health is not a wash against honoring soldiers. The fact that there will be 22 burials every single day through highly trafficked Irvine Blvd is not a wash against honoring soldiers.

One is sentimental, the other is real impact on the living.

Where's the 22 number from?  Is it supposed to be as busy as riverside's cemetary?  Also, don't they reach capacity at a certain point and can no longer take on new "occupants"?  What is the capacity of the proposed cemetery?  is there one?
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: Irvinecommuter on June 02, 2015, 08:30:29 AM
We have had all these discussion points before.  The arguments boils down to honoring former soldiers vs. potential market value impact/fear of the dead.  To me, it's a wash so I don't really support or are against it.

I couldn't disagree more. It's far more than just market value or the fear of the dead.

The fact that toxic chemical can seep into the ground and affect resident's health is not a wash against honoring soldiers. The fact that there will be 22 burials every single day through highly trafficked Irvine Blvd is not a wash against honoring soldiers.

One is sentimental, the other is real impact on the living.

You understand that PP and BP are on a military base and former superfund site right?  Whatever toxicity is created by the cemetery is tiny compared to what is already out there. 

Also, you have construction and garbage truck running through Sand Canyon basically all parts the day to the dump (which also has soil toxicity issues).  I don't even know where you get 22 burials a day.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: ps9 on June 02, 2015, 08:39:50 AM
We have had all these discussion points before.  The arguments boils down to honoring former soldiers vs. potential market value impact/fear of the dead.  To me, it's a wash so I don't really support or are against it.

I couldn't disagree more. It's far more than just market value or the fear of the dead.

The fact that toxic chemical can seep into the ground and affect resident's health is not a wash against honoring soldiers. The fact that there will be 22 burials every single day through highly trafficked Irvine Blvd is not a wash against honoring soldiers.

One is sentimental, the other is real impact on the living.

Where's the 22 number from?  Is it supposed to be as busy as riverside's cemetary?  Also, don't they reach capacity at a certain point and can no longer take on new "occupants"?  What is the capacity of the proposed cemetery?  is there one?

50 years, 20 years minimum to get feds to fund, but ideal is 50 years

http://www.cityofirvine.org/civica/filebank/blobdload.asp?BlobID=25475
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: ps9 on June 02, 2015, 08:49:28 AM
Maybe BP is not that ideal after all:  look north for landfill, look west for freeway/low income housing, look east for cemetery, look further east for jail, and look down for ex-superfund site.  Might as well start a fracking operation next....
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: eatthis on June 02, 2015, 08:54:38 AM
Where's the 22 number from?  Is it supposed to be as busy as riverside's cemetary?  Also, don't they reach capacity at a certain point and can no longer take on new "occupants"?  What is the capacity of the proposed cemetery?  is there one?

No. It's projected to be busier. If you assume it's only the same as Riverside today it'd be 8000 burials / 365 days = 22 burials /day. As PS9 pointed to, it'd be active for no less than 20 years, most likely 50.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: bones on June 02, 2015, 08:57:41 AM
Where's the 22 number from?  Is it supposed to be as busy as riverside's cemetary?  Also, don't they reach capacity at a certain point and can no longer take on new "occupants"?  What is the capacity of the proposed cemetery?  is there one?

No. It's projected to be busier. If you assume it's only the same as Riverside today it'd be 8000 burials / 365 days = 22 burials /day. As PS9 pointed to, it'd be active for no less than 20 years, most likely 50.

Yea that's pretty busy. Although, I don't think all 22 (or whatever the number is) gets all the bells and whistles. Some are just lowkey flag folding affairs.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: Irvinecommuter on June 02, 2015, 08:58:29 AM
Where's the 22 number from?  Is it supposed to be as busy as riverside's cemetary?  Also, don't they reach capacity at a certain point and can no longer take on new "occupants"?  What is the capacity of the proposed cemetery?  is there one?

No. It's projected to be busier. If you assume it's only the same as Riverside today it'd be 8000 burials / 365 days = 22 burials /day. As PS9 pointed to, it'd be active for no less than 20 years, most likely 50.

First of all, most of events will be happening on weekends..70% of the projected "burial" will be cremation burials. 

Still haven't address the former military base/superfund site issue.  Also, you have a minimal security prison just down Irvine Blvd..yet no one seems to care about that.

Just be honest with the argument rather than come up with same tangential ones without little or no basis. 
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: bones on June 02, 2015, 09:00:17 AM
Where's the 22 number from?  Is it supposed to be as busy as riverside's cemetary?  Also, don't they reach capacity at a certain point and can no longer take on new "occupants"?  What is the capacity of the proposed cemetery?  is there one?

No. It's projected to be busier. If you assume it's only the same as Riverside today it'd be 8000 burials / 365 days = 22 burials /day. As PS9 pointed to, it'd be active for no less than 20 years, most likely 50.

First of all, most of events will be happening on weekends..70% of the projected "burial" will be cremation burials. 

Still haven't address the former military base/superfund site issue.

Just be honest with the argument rather than come up with same tangential ones without little or no basis. 

Is it weekend?  The riverside website seems to suggest otherwise.

Military Funeral Honors
In addition to the Department of Defense military funeral honors program, "Honoring Those Who Served," the Riverside National Cemetery Memorial Honor Detail (MHD) is generally available Monday through Friday to provide military funeral honors for veterans. MHD teams are strictly volunteers and vary in size and scope, from folding and presenting the flag only, to full honors with a rifle salute and bugler. All military funeral honors performed by the MHD are provided at NO COST to the family. Once a committal service has been scheduled, families and funeral directors can arrange military honors by calling (951) 300-3216.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: . on June 02, 2015, 09:00:59 AM
Maybe BP is not that ideal after all:  look north for landfill, look west for freeway/low income housing, look east for cemetery, look further east for jail, and look down for ex-superfund site.  Might as well start a fracking operation next....

and it cost at least 1 MILLION dollars for a SFR.  assume the minimum wage is 15 dollars per hours.

1000000 dollars / 15 dollars / 8 hours per day / 260 days = 32 years...

260 days = 365 / 7 days per week * 5 workdays per week
you only need 32 years to make 1 MILLION dollars.  :)
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: ps9 on June 02, 2015, 09:02:59 AM
and $10,000 per year in CFDs to live in this nice cut of Irvine luxury
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: eatthis on June 02, 2015, 09:05:08 AM
You understand that PP and BP are on a military base and former superfund site right?  Whatever toxicity is created by the cemetery is tiny compared to what is already out there. 

Also, you have construction and garbage truck running through Sand Canyon basically all parts the day to the dump (which also has soil toxicity issues).  I don't even know where you get 22 burials a day.

PP was farm land, not part of the military base. There's a superfund to help clean up the site prior to residential use. Whether you believe it or not is your call. But, is anyone setting aside a pile of cash to clean up the cemetery and pay for sick residents?

I'm not sure what the argument is here. The land is so toxic anyways that what's a few more chemicals?

22 burials is simple math. Riverside veteran's cemetery currently does 8000 burials a year, divide by 365 days a year is 22 burials a day. The current projection is that a GP cemetery would over take Riverside as the busiest in the country.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: Irvinecommuter on June 02, 2015, 09:09:44 AM
You understand that PP and BP are on a military base and former superfund site right?  Whatever toxicity is created by the cemetery is tiny compared to what is already out there. 

Also, you have construction and garbage truck running through Sand Canyon basically all parts the day to the dump (which also has soil toxicity issues).  I don't even know where you get 22 burials a day.

PP was farm land, not part of the military base. There's a superfund to help clean up the site prior to residential use. Whether you believe it or not is your call. But, is anyone setting aside a pile of cash to clean up the cemetery and pay for sick residents?

I'm not sure what the argument is here. The land is so toxic anyways that what's a few more chemicals?

22 burials is simple math. Riverside veteran's cemetery currently does 8000 burials a year, divide by 365 days a year is 22 burials a day. The current project is that a GP cemetery would over take Riverside as the busiest in the country.

The argument is that your "toxicity" argument is bad and mostly irrelevant.  PP is nowhere there the veteran park and the other parts of the GP is already "toxic."  There is already a TCE issue underneath the Great Park.   Farmland is not exactly kosher either...pesticides, insecticide, and fertilizers all contaminate the land.  Yet, you didn't care about any of those things when you bought the house...but veteran cemetery is like Cherynbol.

I find the estimation really inflated (probably for presentation purposes).  It is based upon a 25% rate (double that of other cemeteries) and a potential pool from both LA and OC counties.   

Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: eatthis on June 02, 2015, 09:10:58 AM
First of all, most of events will be happening on weekends..70% of the projected "burial" will be cremation burials.

What fact do you base this on?

Still haven't address the former military base/superfund site issue.
There's a superfund to pay for the cleanup. Whether you believe it's clean or not is another story. Where's the money to clean up after the cemetery pollutes the ground and make residents sick?

Also, you have a minimal security prison just down Irvine Blvd..yet no one seems to care about that.
Why is this mutually exclusive? This thread is about the cemetery.

Just be honest with the argument rather than come up with same tangential ones without little or no basis.
Can't argue with the facts.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: Irvinecommuter on June 02, 2015, 09:13:59 AM
First of all, most of events will be happening on weekends..70% of the projected "burial" will be cremation burials.

What fact do you base this on?

Still haven't address the former military base/superfund site issue.
There's a superfund to pay for the cleanup. Whether you believe it's clean or not is another story. Where's the money to clean up after the cemetery pollutes the ground and make residents sick?

Also, you have a minimal security prison just down Irvine Blvd..yet no one seems to care about that.
Why is this mutually exclusive? This thread is about the cemetery.

Just be honest with the argument rather than come up with same tangential ones without little or no basis.
Can't argue with the facts.

1)  There was cleanup but there is still plenty of toxic stuff down there.  It's not a coincidence that CG (who is based upon a former helicopter military base) has a disclosure warning you not to eat the fruit grown on the land.  TCE plume issue is well know.  If those things didn't concern you when you bought the house, why is the tiny threat posed by the cemetery a big one now?

2)  It's not mutual exclusive but the jail was there when you bought the house, but that not a concern.

3)  It's not "facts"...it's classic NIMBY.  Which is really weird because the Veteran's Park is not even in PP's backyard.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: irvinehomeowner on June 02, 2015, 09:16:19 AM
I agree with most of IC's points except that many funerals do happen during the weekdays... I attended a weekday military one at Lake Forest.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: eatthis on June 02, 2015, 09:19:16 AM
The argument is that your "toxicity" argument is bad and mostly irrelevant.  PP is nowhere there the veteran park and the other parts of the GP is already "toxic."  There is already a TCE issue underneath the Great Park.   Farmland is not exactly kosher either...pesticides, insecticide, and fertilizers all contaminate the land.

Yet, you didn't care about any of those things when you bought the house...but veteran cemetery is like Cherynbol.
Your argument make no sense. Just about all of orange county is farm land that's been cleaned up and people have been living here for years without problem. Cemetery on the other hand, no comparison. Proven to make people sick and contaminate water.

I find the estimation really inflated (probably for presentation purposes).  It is based upon a 25% rate (double that of other cemeteries) and a potential pool from both LA and OC counties.
It's not about how you feel. Go do your research. Riverside does 8000 burials a year. That's the fact.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: eatthis on June 02, 2015, 09:28:16 AM
If those things didn't concern you when you bought the house, why is the tiny threat posed by the cemetery a big one now?
On what basis do you have that this is a tiny threat? Go do some research.

2)  It's not mutual exclusive but the jail was there when you bought the house, but that not a concern.
Irrelevant to this conversation. What does toxic chemical from cemetery, cemetery's closeness to the high school and traffic impact from the burial on Irvine Blvd have to do with this?

3)  It's not "facts"...it's classic NIMBY.  Which is really weird because the Veteran's Park is not even in PP's backyard.
You keep restating your opinion without any additional fact to back up your argument.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: ps9 on June 02, 2015, 09:29:56 AM
@yaliu

don't know what strategy this town hall meeting you guys have brainstormed on... but you need to tread carefully.  Any guidance from 5point general counsel?  How you present yourself will be important, read 5 point memo in the link i posted above to see how to word your stance against the cemetery.  Consider hiring a PR consult?  Do you have a spokesperson?  Or is it gonna be a bunch of hecklers at the meeting with the mayor?
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: eyephone on June 02, 2015, 09:35:34 AM
This topic deserves a chat room feature on TI. ;)
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: Irvinecommuter on June 02, 2015, 09:46:05 AM
I'm done with the discussion...we had it a number of times before.  People who are against park is strictly doing it because they don't want it to affect their property value and/or fear of the dead.  It's their belief and not debatable.  I mean, you buy into an area that is next to a toll road, on top of a former military base, with a landfill and jail nearby...those things are fine but a cemetery is the deathknell?  You should probably worry more about Broadcom possibly closing its doors in Irvine.

I live in Stonegate, which also shares some of the same issues, but I'm whatever about the cemetery.  I bought into the area and I know its warts.  Personally, I rather they get rid of that balloon. 




Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: . on June 02, 2015, 09:58:44 AM
don't know what strategy this town hall meeting you guys have brainstormed on... but you need to tread carefully.
i dont think we have a strategy yet.  we are just going voice our opinion. 


Any guidance from 5point general counsel?  How you present yourself will be important, read 5 point memo in the link i posted above to see how to word your stance against the cemetery.
i dont think we communicate with 5point yet.  but i will suggest to our groups.
i can't find the link.  is it http://www.cityofirvine.org/civica/filebank/blobdload.asp?BlobID=25340

Consider hiring a PR consult? 
I dont think we hired a PR consult either.


Do you have a spokesperson?  Or is it gonna be a bunch of hecklers at the meeting with the mayor?
i dont think we dont have a spokesperson either.  i think we just going to voice our thoughts.

i use a lot of "i think" or "i dont think" because i am just a messenger.  :)

thanks for your suggestion.  i will communicate back our group about your suggestions.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: bones on June 02, 2015, 10:07:59 AM
I'm done with the discussion...we had it a number of times before.  People who are against park is strictly doing it because they don't want it to affect their property value and/or fear of the dead.  It's their belief and not debatable.  I mean, you buy into an area that is next to a toll road, on top of a former military base, with a landfill and jail nearby...those things are fine but a cemetery is the deathknell?  You should probably worry more about Broadcom possibly closing its doors in Irvine.

I live in Stonegate, which also shares some of the same issues, but I'm whatever about the cemetery.  I bought into the area and I know its warts.  Personally, I rather they get rid of that balloon. 


I feel the same way.  I also knew about all the various "issues" when I bought and had both eyes open when doing so.  I am pretty neutral on the cemetery so I could go either way on this.  That's why I support the folks in the neighborhood who are doing all the leg work in trying to get it moved.  Props to them for setting up the town hall meeting, for going door to door on a hot weekend day asking for signatures and raising awareness. 
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: qwerty on June 02, 2015, 10:08:15 AM
Irvinecommuter calling it like it is. Most areas have something wrong with them, as long as it's out of sight it's out of mind most people are willing to deal with it. You can't see the TCE, you can't see the landfill or jail etc. everyone has a price. I'm sure it has to suck backing to culver/jamboree/Jeffrey/sand canyon, yet every single house backing to those streets seems to sell. A lot of you have higher standards but there is always someone trying to stretch and move up.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: eatthis on June 02, 2015, 10:11:06 AM
People who are against park is strictly doing it because they don't want it to affect their property value and/or fear of the dead.  It's their belief and not debatable.
I'm sorry that your mind is closed to the possibility that there are other reasons why residents don't want a cemetery in their backyard. But, to each his own.

You should probably worry more about Broadcom possibly closing its doors in Irvine.
One worry at a time. And, what can one possibly do about that? At least with this it's not too late to get the local politicians to reverse course.

I bought into the area and I know its warts.  Personally, I rather they get rid of that balloon.
That's one thing we can agree on. That balloon is an eye sore. But, there are the warts you know about, and warts that come out of no where. There's enough warts where we live already!
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: eatthis on June 02, 2015, 10:18:35 AM
Irvinecommuter calling it like it is. Most areas have something wrong with them, as long as it's out of sight it's out of mind most people are willing to deal with it. You can't see the TCE, you can't see the landfill or jail etc. everyone has a price. I'm sure it has to suck backing to culver/jamboree/Jeffrey/sand canyon, yet every single house backing to those streets seems to sell. A lot of you have higher standards but there is always someone trying to stretch and move up.

I hope many of you will come and support the cause at the TH. It's only a couple of hours out of your life. This is only out of sight out of mind until the line at the cemetery for the endless burials jams traffic on Irvine Blvd or the first kid become sick from the chemicals. The only way for change to happen is if everyone take an active role making it happen.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: iacrenter on June 02, 2015, 10:37:18 AM
Irvinecommuter calling it like it is. Most areas have something wrong with them, as long as it's out of sight it's out of mind most people are willing to deal with it. You can't see the TCE, you can't see the landfill or jail etc. everyone has a price. I'm sure it has to suck backing to culver/jamboree/Jeffrey/sand canyon, yet every single house backing to those streets seems to sell. A lot of you have higher standards but there is always someone trying to stretch and move up.

I hope many of you will come and support the cause at the TH. It's only a couple of hours out of your life. This is only out of sight out of mind until the line at the cemetery for the endless burials jams traffic on Irvine Blvd or the first kid become sick from the chemicals. The only way for change to happen is if everyone take an active role making it happen.

Which chemical are you talking about? Embalming chemicals or the superfund site toxins spread around GP?
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: qwerty on June 02, 2015, 10:43:35 AM
It's only a couple of hours out of your life.

Choice 1 - Meeting for cemetery? Or sit on my ass and watch Rich Kids of Beverly hills.

Choice 2 - do some weights, eat dinner while enjoying Rich kids of beverly hills

Rich kids of beverly hills it is!!!!!!!!!!

(http://www.uslmag.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/07/roxy-sowlaty.png)
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: bones on June 02, 2015, 10:47:34 AM
It's only a couple of hours out of your life.

Choice 1 - Meeting for cemetery? Or sit on my ass and watch Rich Kids of Beverly hills.

Choice 2 - do some weights, eat dinner while enjoying Rich kids of beverly hills

Rich kids of beverly hills it is!!!!!!!!!!

(http://www.uslmag.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/07/roxy-sowlaty.png)

Wrong picture.  This is Talk Irvine.  You need to post Dorothy Wang, the FCB!
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: qwerty on June 02, 2015, 10:49:51 AM
done! that was for our persian readers.

(http://www.eonline.com/eol_images/Entire_Site/201403/rs_634x1024-140103134643-634.Rich-Kids-Dorothy-Wang.jl.010314.jpg)
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: Happiness on June 02, 2015, 10:51:26 AM
endless burials jams traffic on Irvine Blvd
Speaking of Irvine Blvd., I was in a car with a friend on Irvine Blvd. near Ridge Valley when we were passed by an OC Sheriff bus, you know, the big ones with the bars on the blacked out windows, that was presumably traveling from Musick to one of the courts, when my friend's kid asked her what the bus was.  My friend said "that's the sheriff's bus."  Her kid said, 'I want to ride in the sheriff's bus!"  My friend said "no you don't."
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: qwerty on June 02, 2015, 10:54:02 AM
my friend's kid asked her what the bus was.  My friend said "that's the sheriff's bus."  Her kid said, 'I want to ride in the sheriff's bus!"  My friend said "no you don't."

see, it is the adults who poison the innocent minds of our youth.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: Irvine Fanatic on June 02, 2015, 11:31:44 AM
You guys think the Cemetery is driving some folks to Greenwood? When I toured GW I noticed alot of asians. Just curious. And will it affect home prices in CV?
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: GH on June 02, 2015, 11:38:30 AM
so would GP residents rather have more apartments and houses on that strip of land instead of  cemetery ?
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: qwerty on June 02, 2015, 11:41:57 AM
You guys think the Cemetery is driving some folks to Greenwood? When I toured GW I noticed alot of asians. Just curious. And will it affect home prices in CV?

I would say no to both questions. From this board it sounds like there are plenty of people, Asians in particular who will not accept a substitute to irvine. I don't think it will affect property values in CV, it's too far away.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: ps9 on June 02, 2015, 12:06:27 PM
@yaliu

http://www.cityofirvine.org/civica/filebank/blobdload.asp?BlobID=25446

Pg 26 for the 5 point letter

I would recommend a dialog with 5 point if you guys haven't done so.  They would be your strongest ally for obvious reasons. 
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: zubs on June 02, 2015, 12:59:41 PM
I wonder if we can get one of the news agencies to cover this meeting.  We can have ABC news come out and interview home owners and veterans.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: Irvinecommuter on June 02, 2015, 01:02:16 PM
I wonder if we can get one of the news agencies to cover this meeting.  We can have ABC news come out and interview home owners and veterans.

Personally, I think you don't want any publicity on this matter if you are anti-park. It will casts as a NIMBY v. Veterans issues.  Regardless of merit, NIMBY is going to lose the public opinion on this.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: zubs on June 02, 2015, 01:04:48 PM
Shall I call ABC News and send them the flyer?  Maybe they're interested maybe they're not....
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: ps9 on June 02, 2015, 01:25:51 PM
I'm sure Calvet will be there, they're tracking this thread...
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: qwerty on June 02, 2015, 01:43:04 PM
I wonder if we can get one of the news agencies to cover this meeting.  We can have ABC news come out and interview home owners and veterans.

Personally, I think you don't want any publicity on this matter if you are anti-park. It will casts as a NIMBY v. Veterans issues.  Regardless of merit, NIMBY is going to lose the public opinion on this.


Then it will become a race issue. How the communist Chinese are against veterans
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: The California Court Company on June 02, 2015, 01:49:06 PM
yes not every Chinese is against the cemetery. Mainlanders already got a bad rep and please don't make it any worse.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: zubs on June 02, 2015, 03:02:13 PM
This seems more like a FOX news story than ABC.
Hopefully Yaliu will get some white people on his side during the meeting so it won't look like a bunch of Asians vs. US Veterans, otherwise it's gonna look bad.  At least he's got one Mexican.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: jmoney74 on June 02, 2015, 03:06:36 PM
I'm done with the discussion...we had it a number of times before.  People who are against park is strictly doing it because they don't want it to affect their property value and/or fear of the dead.  It's their belief and not debatable.  I mean, you buy into an area that is next to a toll road, on top of a former military base, with a landfill and jail nearby...those things are fine but a cemetery is the deathknell?  You should probably worry more about Broadcom possibly closing its doors in Irvine.

I live in Stonegate, which also shares some of the same issues, but I'm whatever about the cemetery.  I bought into the area and I know its warts.  Personally, I rather they get rid of that balloon.

If you are done with it then dont respond to it. Not hard.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: eyephone on June 02, 2015, 03:09:18 PM
I know he's got one Mexican.

Qwerty already said he's not going to go. Lol
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: Homer_Simpson on June 02, 2015, 03:20:50 PM
I'm Chinese and I would love for the cemetery to be built at the Great Park.   

#Cemetery@GP
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: qwerty on June 02, 2015, 03:21:53 PM
I know he's got one Mexican.

Qwerty already said he's not going to go. Lol

ill be there in spirit :-)
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: jmoney74 on June 02, 2015, 03:49:37 PM
Bad thing about cemetery: less home value due to chinese buyers

Good thing about cemetery: less urine around the neighborhood
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: irvinehomeshopper on June 02, 2015, 05:52:00 PM
I would prefer the serenity of the cemetery vs having Chinese nationals as my neighbors. Quality of life everyday vs miseries until I sell.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: . on June 02, 2015, 06:01:56 PM
I know he's got one Mexican.

Qwerty already said he's not going to go. Lol

Yaliu - ill be there for you man.

qwerty promised me that he will be there.  i will look for the MexiCAN with a big/huge bat.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: ps9 on June 02, 2015, 06:08:45 PM
That will be the most awkward town hall meeting ever
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: eatthis on June 02, 2015, 06:30:28 PM
Bad thing about cemetery: less home value due to chinese buyers

Good thing about cemetery: less urine around the neighborhood

Classy. Do you feel superior now?
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: eatthis on June 02, 2015, 06:35:51 PM
yes not every Chinese is against the cemetery. Mainlanders already got a bad rep and please don't make it any worse.

Why is this a Chinese issue? How does this make it worse? Some people want to turn this into a white versus asian issue because it fits the narrative they want to paint. It's about what makes for a great community to live in.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: jmoney74 on June 02, 2015, 07:48:46 PM
Bad thing about cemetery: less home value due to chinese buyers

Good thing about cemetery: less urine around the neighborhood

Classy. Do you feel superior now?

Hmmmmm

Yes
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: . on June 02, 2015, 07:57:44 PM
someone just stopped by house and passed me a Chinese Flyer on town hall meeting on June 8th.  J$, aquabliss, locked your door....   :)

Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: eyephone on June 02, 2015, 07:59:35 PM
someone just stopped by house and passed me a Chinese Flyer on town hall meeting on June 8th.  J$, aquabliss, locked your door....   :)
You don't lock your door?  :)
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: . on June 02, 2015, 08:01:44 PM
someone just stopped by house and passed me a Chinese Flyer on town hall meeting on June 8th.  J$, aquabliss, locked your door....   :)
You don't lock your door?  :)

this is IRVINE.  it is safest city.  why will i locked my door?  :)
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: jmoney74 on June 02, 2015, 08:15:00 PM
someone just stopped by house and passed me a Chinese Flyer on town hall meeting on June 8th.  J$, aquabliss, locked your door....   :)

I got it yesterday
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: ps9 on June 02, 2015, 08:26:16 PM
Can't read simplified...
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: . on June 02, 2015, 08:27:15 PM
lol..  you should ask for english flyer...
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: WTTCHMN on June 02, 2015, 08:31:28 PM
I'm surprised OC's new homeless shelter isn't going in the Great Park too.  Since there is already a landfill, toxic plume, jail, low income housing, farm pesticides, freeway noise/fumes, and cemetery with 22 funerals per day... why not add some homeless people too.

gee, Greenwood is not looking so bad after all, even with Chinese pee.


Orange County may be getting its first year-round homeless shelter 
 
The Orange County Board of Supervisors plans to buy a nearly 2-acre parcel of land that may eventually become the region's first year-round homeless shelter.

By    Eileen Frere 

The Orange County Board of Supervisors plans to buy a nearly 2-acre parcel of land that may eventually become the region's first year-round homeless shelter.

The proposed 200-bed shelter would be located in the 1000 block of North Kraemer Boulevard in Anaheim. Orange County's two largest homeless shelters are only open during winter.

The board agreed to start the process to acquire the $4.25-million property, starting the 90-day due diligence process to further examine the location.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: eatthis on June 02, 2015, 08:34:52 PM
Bad thing about cemetery: less home value due to chinese buyers

Good thing about cemetery: less urine around the neighborhood

Classy. Do you feel superior now?

Hmmmmm

Yes

Instead of writing derogatory comments about Chinese in an anonymous forum to make yourself feel superior I dare you to go out and spew your hate at work or out in public and see how people react.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: ps9 on June 02, 2015, 08:45:57 PM
lol..  you should ask for english flyer...

I'm catching up on the blog site, pretty impressive so far, I underestimated you guys, you're almost at 500 petitions.  I can kinda get simplified if I stare at it long enough.....
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: irvinehomeshopper on June 02, 2015, 08:50:34 PM
This may explain the background why Chinese defecate in public.

http://www.quora.com/Chinese-Etiquette-and-Behavior/Is-pooping-in-public-a-common-occurrence-in-China


Bad thing about cemetery: less home value due to chinese buyers

Good thing about cemetery: less urine around the neighborhood

Classy. Do you feel superior now?

Hmmmmm

Yes

Instead of writing derogatory comments about Chinese in an anonymous forum to make yourself feel superior I dare you to go out and spew your hate at work or out in public and see how people react.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: bones on June 02, 2015, 08:51:09 PM
Yal and Zubs made it on this Facebook page:

https://www.facebook.com/ocvmp
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: jmoney74 on June 02, 2015, 08:51:31 PM
Bad thing about cemetery: less home value due to chinese buyers

Good thing about cemetery: less urine around the neighborhood

Classy. Do you feel superior now?

Hmmmmm

Yes

Instead of writing derogatory comments about Chinese in an anonymous forum to make yourself feel superior I dare you to go out and spew your hate at work or out in public and see how people react.

 I do it all the time at work... Ask homer
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: jmoney74 on June 02, 2015, 08:53:33 PM
Yal and Zubs made it on this Facebook page:

https://www.facebook.com/ocvmp

Lol

Should ask them... So ok to build cemetery in your backyard?  No.?  How disrespectful.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: bones on June 02, 2015, 08:56:11 PM
And one more.  Apparently, not only are the IPac X plans "breathtaking".  This forum is too.  From Feb 5 on the OCVMP FB page:

This e-mail from one of our readers came very recently. Here is the gist of his comments posted with his permission:
Hi, With regard to your recent posts on the petitions against the Veteran Cemetery in Irvine, I would encourage your followers to visit the discussion board "Talk Irvine" thread "Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine". This discussion appears to be presided over by a leader of the petition. Some of the anti-Veteran commentary and motives for pushing the cemetery out of Irvine are truly breathtaking.
Thank you for all that you are doing; (I) will monitor this page to see if there are opportunities to assist in your efforts. I was a long term (former) resident of Irvine, and also a US Navy veteran. I can think of nothing better to honor our So Cal Veterans than this memorial, and no more appropriate place.
Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
www.talkirvine.com
Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: Homer_Simpson on June 02, 2015, 09:03:55 PM
Bad thing about cemetery: less home value due to chinese buyers

Good thing about cemetery: less urine around the neighborhood

Classy. Do you feel superior now?

Hmmmmm

Yes

Instead of writing derogatory comments about Chinese in an anonymous forum to make yourself feel superior I dare you to go out and spew your hate at work or out in public and see how people react.

 I do it all the time at work... Ask homer

Don't lie brah, we don't work! 1%errrzzz

However, I can vouch for JMoney when we are out in the public... I was with him at Tastey Gardens last week enjoying our Honey Lemon Tea and this Chinese fob sitting next to us was "ching chong ling long ding donging" on his phone so loudly.  JMoney gets up and goes ape shit on Mr. Lee Kum Kee.  The only time I've seen such action was when I saw a white dude cut in front of a black dude at a buffet line *true story*..
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: iacrenter on June 02, 2015, 09:05:44 PM
And one more.  Apparently, not only are the IPac X plans "breathtaking".  This forum is too.  From Feb 5 on the OCVMP FB page:

This e-mail from one of our readers came very recently. Here is the gist of his comments posted with his permission:
Hi, With regard to your recent posts on the petitions against the Veteran Cemetery in Irvine, I would encourage your followers to visit the discussion board "Talk Irvine" thread "Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine". This discussion appears to be presided over by a leader of the petition. Some of the anti-Veteran commentary and motives for pushing the cemetery out of Irvine are truly breathtaking.
Thank you for all that you are doing; (I) will monitor this page to see if there are opportunities to assist in your efforts. I was a long term (former) resident of Irvine, and also a US Navy veteran. I can think of nothing better to honor our So Cal Veterans than this memorial, and no more appropriate place.
Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
www.talkirvine.com
Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine

Yikes. I can see the death threats coming next for Yaliu. Better change your screen name.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: eyephone on June 02, 2015, 09:12:23 PM
Hold up it's not just Chinese that defecate in public. Go to a trailer park in America and you might see that. Come to think of it: hiking, camping, playing golf if there's no restroom find a bush or tree and release



Quote from: irvinehomeshopper link=topic=11986.msg262603#msg262603 d :)ate=1433303434
This may explain the background why Chinese defecate in public.

http://www.quora.com/Chinese-Etiquette-and-Behavior/Is-pooping-in-public-a-common-occurrence-in-China


Bad thing about cemetery: less home value due to chinese buyers

Good thing about cemetery: less urine around the neighborhood

Classy. Do you feel superior now?

Hmmmmm

Yes

Instead of writing derogatory comments about Chinese in an anonymous forum to make yourself feel superior I dare you to go out and spew your hate at work or out in public and see how people react.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: ps9 on June 02, 2015, 09:45:58 PM
This is one of the Todd Spitzer alternative sties:

(http://i1233.photobucket.com/albums/ff390/Ps99472/mod_zpsqbry7fev.jpg)
https://www.google.com/maps/@33.7032676,-117.6342477,312m/data=!3m1!1e3

In relation to the GP site:
(http://i1233.photobucket.com/albums/ff390/Ps99472/mod2_zpsehpp1fia.jpg)

Access will be an issue, one of the fed requirements is that the cemetery has easy access by freeway.  Don't know this area, what's county route S18 like?
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: eatthis on June 03, 2015, 01:19:21 AM
I was with him at Tastey Gardens last week enjoying our Honey Lemon Tea and this Chinese fob sitting next to us was "ching chong ling long ding donging" on his phone so loudly.  JMoney gets up and goes ape shit on Mr. Lee Kum Kee.  The only time I've seen such action was when I saw a white dude cut in front of a black dude at a buffet line *true story*..

Yeah. Such an embarrassment to hear Chinese speak Chinese in a Chinese restaurant. What a bunch of fob. Maybe you and J$ can stand in front of 99 Ranch and spit on those worthless mainlanders as come out the market. You guys are clearly superior.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: jmoney74 on June 03, 2015, 01:22:27 AM
I was with him at Tastey Gardens last week enjoying our Honey Lemon Tea and this Chinese fob sitting next to us was "ching chong ling long ding donging" on his phone so loudly.  JMoney gets up and goes ape shit on Mr. Lee Kum Kee.  The only time I've seen such action was when I saw a white dude cut in front of a black dude at a buffet line *true story*..

Yeah. Such an embarrassment to hear Chinese speak Chinese in a Chinese restaurant. What a bunch of fob. Maybe you and J$ can stand in front of 99 Ranch and spit on those worthless mainlanders as come out the market. You guys are clearly superior.

Thanks
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: Homer_Simpson on June 03, 2015, 06:49:24 AM
I was with him at Tastey Gardens last week enjoying our Honey Lemon Tea and this Chinese fob sitting next to us was "ching chong ling long ding donging" on his phone so loudly.  JMoney gets up and goes ape shit on Mr. Lee Kum Kee.  The only time I've seen such action was when I saw a white dude cut in front of a black dude at a buffet line *true story*..

Yeah. Such an embarrassment to hear Chinese speak Chinese in a Chinese restaurant. What a bunch of fob. Maybe you and J$ can stand in front of 99 Ranch and spit on those worthless mainlanders as come out the market. You guys are clearly superior.

ruh-oh... It probably was eatthis that was chingchonging.. I don't mind the Chinese speaking Chinese in a Chinese restaurant.. I just don't understand why the shouting conversation on the phone in a restaurant.  Chinese dude wasn't even mad, he was just explaining to the person on the phone how delighted he was of the honey walnut shrimp.  :P
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: . on June 03, 2015, 07:03:25 AM
And one more.  Apparently, not only are the IPac X plans "breathtaking".  This forum is too.  From Feb 5 on the OCVMP FB page:

This e-mail from one of our readers came very recently. Here is the gist of his comments posted with his permission:
Hi, With regard to your recent posts on the petitions against the Veteran Cemetery in Irvine, I would encourage your followers to visit the discussion board "Talk Irvine" thread "Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine". This discussion appears to be presided over by a leader of the petition. Some of the anti-Veteran commentary and motives for pushing the cemetery out of Irvine are truly breathtaking.
Thank you for all that you are doing; (I) will monitor this page to see if there are opportunities to assist in your efforts. I was a long term (former) resident of Irvine, and also a US Navy veteran. I can think of nothing better to honor our So Cal Veterans than this memorial, and no more appropriate place.
Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
www.talkirvine.com
Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine

Yikes. I can see the death threats coming next for Yaliu. Better change your screen name.

why always shoot the messenger??? :(
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: Irvinecommuter on June 03, 2015, 07:36:44 AM
I was with him at Tastey Gardens last week enjoying our Honey Lemon Tea and this Chinese fob sitting next to us was "ching chong ling long ding donging" on his phone so loudly.  JMoney gets up and goes ape shit on Mr. Lee Kum Kee.  The only time I've seen such action was when I saw a white dude cut in front of a black dude at a buffet line *true story*..

Yeah. Such an embarrassment to hear Chinese speak Chinese in a Chinese restaurant. What a bunch of fob. Maybe you and J$ can stand in front of 99 Ranch and spit on those worthless mainlanders as come out the market. You guys are clearly superior.

Many Chinese people are ashamed of what many other Chinese do.  In fact, the Chinese government have enacted a law punishing bad actions by Chinese tourists outside of China.

http://www.npr.org/sections/parallels/2015/05/08/405183120/beijing-clamps-down-on-chinese-tourists-behaving-badly
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: Irvinecommuter on June 03, 2015, 07:38:41 AM
I was with him at Tastey Gardens last week enjoying our Honey Lemon Tea and this Chinese fob sitting next to us was "ching chong ling long ding donging" on his phone so loudly.  JMoney gets up and goes ape shit on Mr. Lee Kum Kee.  The only time I've seen such action was when I saw a white dude cut in front of a black dude at a buffet line *true story*..

Yeah. Such an embarrassment to hear Chinese speak Chinese in a Chinese restaurant. What a bunch of fob. Maybe you and J$ can stand in front of 99 Ranch and spit on those worthless mainlanders as come out the market. You guys are clearly superior.

ruh-oh... It probably was eatthis that was chingchonging.. I don't mind the Chinese speaking Chinese in a Chinese restaurant.. I just don't understand why the shouting conversation on the phone in a restaurant.  Chinese dude wasn't even mad, he was just explaining to the person on the phone how delighted he was of the honey walnut shrimp.  :P

Some of this is just what the people are used to...non New York people always complain about how rude New York people are.  It's just what they are used to.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: eyephone on June 03, 2015, 08:43:05 AM
And one more.  Apparently, not only are the IPac X plans "breathtaking".  This forum is too.  From Feb 5 on the OCVMP FB page:

This e-mail from one of our readers came very recently. Here is the gist of his comments posted with his permission:
Hi, With regard to your recent posts on the petitions against the Veteran Cemetery in Irvine, I would encourage your followers to visit the discussion board "Talk Irvine" thread "Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine". This discussion appears to be presided over by a leader of the petition. Some of the anti-Veteran commentary and motives for pushing the cemetery out of Irvine are truly breathtaking.
Thank you for all that you are doing; (I) will monitor this page to see if there are opportunities to assist in your efforts. I was a long term (former) resident of Irvine, and also a US Navy veteran. I can think of nothing better to honor our So Cal Veterans than this memorial, and no more appropriate place.
Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
www.talkirvine.com
Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine

Yikes. I can see the death threats coming next for Yaliu. Better change your screen name.

why always shoot the messenger??? :(

Yaliu are you the leader?
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: . on June 03, 2015, 08:50:58 AM
And one more.  Apparently, not only are the IPac X plans "breathtaking".  This forum is too.  From Feb 5 on the OCVMP FB page:

This e-mail from one of our readers came very recently. Here is the gist of his comments posted with his permission:
Hi, With regard to your recent posts on the petitions against the Veteran Cemetery in Irvine, I would encourage your followers to visit the discussion board "Talk Irvine" thread "Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine". This discussion appears to be presided over by a leader of the petition. Some of the anti-Veteran commentary and motives for pushing the cemetery out of Irvine are truly breathtaking.
Thank you for all that you are doing; (I) will monitor this page to see if there are opportunities to assist in your efforts. I was a long term (former) resident of Irvine, and also a US Navy veteran. I can think of nothing better to honor our So Cal Veterans than this memorial, and no more appropriate place.
Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
www.talkirvine.com
Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine

Yikes. I can see the death threats coming next for Yaliu. Better change your screen name.

why always shoot the messenger??? :(

Yaliu are you the leader?

nope, just a messenger..
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: eyephone on June 03, 2015, 08:58:36 AM
And one more.  Apparently, not only are the IPac X plans "breathtaking".  This forum is too.  From Feb 5 on the OCVMP FB page:

This e-mail from one of our readers came very recently. Here is the gist of his comments posted with his permission:
Hi, With regard to your recent posts on the petitions against the Veteran Cemetery in Irvine, I would encourage your followers to visit the discussion board "Talk Irvine" thread "Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine". This discussion appears to be presided over by a leader of the petition. Some of the anti-Veteran commentary and motives for pushing the cemetery out of Irvine are truly breathtaking.
Thank you for all that you are doing; (I) will monitor this page to see if there are opportunities to assist in your efforts. I was a long term (former) resident of Irvine, and also a US Navy veteran. I can think of nothing better to honor our So Cal Veterans than this memorial, and no more appropriate place.
Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
www.talkirvine.com
Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine

Yikes. I can see the death threats coming next for Yaliu. Better change your screen name.

why always shoot the messenger??? :(

Yaliu are you the leader?

nope, just a messenger..

A messenger with distributing fliers, coordinating meetings, strategizing, making posts on opposition fb page, TI, and who knows what other forms of social platforms.

(Sounds like a leader to me)  :)
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: Happiness on June 03, 2015, 09:22:23 AM
Imagine if you will:

There is a certain town near Nanjing, China where about half the residents are Japanese nationals.  The town decides to build a memorial to Chinese vets who resisted the Japanese during the WWII Nanjing Massacre.  The Japanese residents of said town decide to protest in order to have the memorial moved somewhere else because of "traffic concerns."  How would the local Chinese react to this?
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: The California Court Company on June 03, 2015, 09:41:17 AM
this analogy is really bad.

US and China never went into a war between them; From China's point of view, there is a lot of blood on Japanese' hand, from WWII

Imagine if you will:

There is a certain town near Nanjing, China where about half the residents are Japanese nationals.  The town decides to build a memorial to Chinese vets who resisted the Japanese during the WWII Nanjing Massacre.  The Japanese residents of said town decide to protest in order to have the memorial moved somewhere else because of "traffic concerns."  How would the local Chinese react to this?
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: Happiness on June 03, 2015, 09:42:10 AM
This may explain the background why Chinese defecate in public.

http://www.quora.com/Chinese-Etiquette-and-Behavior/Is-pooping-in-public-a-common-occurrence-in-China


Great comment from IHO's link:

"Second, my parents once described the good manner of people around 1950s. But things changed after the 10 years Cultural revolution in China. People decried, defamed, abused and even fought with each other. No one trusted any people even their own family at that time. Morality was totally torn down. People became selfish and myopic. Some people won't care about the public environment because it's not their home. Their home could be very clean but they would spit on street, drop garbage and etc"

The key point of the link, written by a maninland Chinese, is that Chinese people are not naturally manners impaired, it was caused by Communism.  Mainland Chinese had good manners before the 1950s?  Of course, they did.  Those manlanders were educated under the Republic of China (which is still the government in Taiwan today).  Singaporeans and Hong Kongers have good manners, they were educated under the British.  After the Communists ran the ROC off to Taiwan, they demanded that all Chinese, especially city dwellers, to "learn from the peasants."  After several generations of learning from the peasants, you now have people pissing in other peoples bushes.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: Happiness on June 03, 2015, 09:44:12 AM
this analogy is really bad.

US and China never went into a war between them; From China's point of view, there is a lot of blood on Japanese' hand, from WWII

Imagine if you will:

There is a certain town near Nanjing, China where about half the residents are Japanese nationals.  The town decides to build a memorial to Chinese vets who resisted the Japanese during the WWII Nanjing Massacre.  The Japanese residents of said town decide to protest in order to have the memorial moved somewhere else because of "traffic concerns."  How would the local Chinese react to this?
Korean War was mainly fought between US and PRC.  In Vietnam War, PRC was main supplier to North Vietnam and Viet Cong.  Many people to be buried in proposed cemetery would be Korean and Vietnam War vets.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: jmoney74 on June 03, 2015, 09:47:12 AM
Imagine if you will:

There is a certain town near Nanjing, China where about half the residents are Japanese nationals.  The town decides to build a memorial to Chinese vets who resisted the Japanese during the WWII Nanjing Massacre.  The Japanese residents of said town decide to protest in order to have the memorial moved somewhere else because of "traffic concerns."  How would the local Chinese react to this?

bad analogy.. I'm all for building a memorial..
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: Irvinecommuter on June 03, 2015, 10:02:52 AM
This may explain the background why Chinese defecate in public.

http://www.quora.com/Chinese-Etiquette-and-Behavior/Is-pooping-in-public-a-common-occurrence-in-China


Great comment from IHO's link:

"Second, my parents once described the good manner of people around 1950s. But things changed after the 10 years Cultural revolution in China. People decried, defamed, abused and even fought with each other. No one trusted any people even their own family at that time. Morality was totally torn down. People became selfish and myopic. Some people won't care about the public environment because it's not their home. Their home could be very clean but they would spit on street, drop garbage and etc"

The key point of the link, written by a maninland Chinese, is that Chinese people are not naturally manners impaired, it was caused by Communism.  Mainland Chinese had good manners before the 1950s?  Of course, they did.  Those manlanders were educated under the Republic of China (which is still the government in Taiwan today).  Singaporeans and Hong Kongers have good manners, they were educated under the British.  After the Communists ran the ROC off to Taiwan, they demanded that all Chinese, especially city dwellers, to "learn from the peasants."  After several generations of learning from the peasants, you now have people pissing in other peoples bushes.

Yeah...this is not historically true at all.  The lack of etiquette has a lot to due with the sudden and abrupt increase in economic prosperity for the Chinese population.  They made a ton of money but never learned Western social edict.  It's analogous to the Beverly Hillbillies but on a much large scale. 

Historically, Chinese society was highly stratified...China was in a feudal system up until 1911, when imperial system was overturned.  That system had a few elites with a large working class.   After that, China was ruled by warlords and the feudal system nature of society maintained until 1949.   KMT was more worried about keeping power than helping the masses (therefore the populist support for the CCP after WW2).

The CCP actually made great strides in the 1950s educating the masses (simplifieid form), cleaning up the urban area, and implementing more modern social norms (like no spitting).  But like all CCP reforms...ideology and Mao's ego took over and reforms turned very badly.  Between 1950s and mid-1970s, CCP basically isolated China and focused primarily on rooting out political dissent and keeping Mao in power.  People in the countryside basically stayed who they were.

Beginning the 1980s, China began a mass economic boom in which very impoverished people became middle class/rich.  First of those began becoming exposed to Western Culture but only selectively.  There became an infatuation with luxury brands and bright colors...rich Chinese people were wearing super gawdy luxury brands from Europe in the 1990s/2000s because they were seen as status symbols.  That infatuation is simply filtering down to the masses while those at the top begin to master Western norms. 

Taiwan and SK went through the same phase but because of more direct American and Japanese influence, they grew out of that.  There are still "country bumpkins" in Taiwan that spit on the ground and chew betel nut (spit accordingly). 
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: Irvinecommuter on June 03, 2015, 10:05:39 AM
this analogy is really bad.

US and China never went into a war between them; From China's point of view, there is a lot of blood on Japanese' hand, from WWII

Imagine if you will:

There is a certain town near Nanjing, China where about half the residents are Japanese nationals.  The town decides to build a memorial to Chinese vets who resisted the Japanese during the WWII Nanjing Massacre.  The Japanese residents of said town decide to protest in order to have the memorial moved somewhere else because of "traffic concerns."  How would the local Chinese react to this?
Korean War was mainly fought between US and PRC.  In Vietnam War, PRC was main supplier to North Vietnam and Viet Cong.  Many people to be buried in proposed cemetery would be Korean and Vietnam War vets.

Actually no...Korean War was between the Koreas.  US decided to involve the PRC by crossing the Yalu River.  MacArthur wanted to reclaim China and that's why he was relieved of command by Truman.  If it wasn't for MacArthur, there would be no NK now.

Vietnam was a colonial war.  Soviets armed the Vietnamese, not China.  Soviets wanted Vietnam to check China in the south.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: aquabliss on June 03, 2015, 10:30:55 AM
someone just stopped by house and passed me a Chinese Flyer on town hall meeting on June 8th.  J$, aquabliss, locked your door....   :)



haha I got the English flyer.  Why do they think I don't speak Mandarin?! 

Can I reserve a session in the town hall meeting to discuss how the flyer distributors decided to put English or Chinese flyers at each homeowners doorstep.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: Happiness on June 03, 2015, 10:33:42 AM
US decided to involve the PRC by crossing the Yalu River. 
The US crossed the Yalu river?  Wow, I've never seen that in any American textbook from K to college.  Thanks for setting us Americans straight.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: Irvinecommuter on June 03, 2015, 10:42:57 AM
US decided to involve the PRC by crossing the Yalu River. 
The US crossed the Yalu river?  Wow, I've never seen that in any American textbook from K to college.  Thanks for setting us Americans straight.

My mistake...came extremely close to crossing the Yalu River. Chinese already warned the US that approaching the Yalu would result in Chinese coming into the war.  MacArthur had every intent of going into China.

Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: zubs on June 03, 2015, 11:44:21 AM
Yal and Zubs made it on this Facebook page:

https://www.facebook.com/ocvmp

If you read my posts you can tell I'm for the cemetery.  That post I put up to move the cemetery by the garbage dump was to troll people.  Manipulation works, how surprising.

However, I was surprised that no one took the bait here on TI.  I figured I'd get someone to comment on it....but Nope.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: iacrenter on June 03, 2015, 12:05:53 PM
US decided to involve the PRC by crossing the Yalu River. 
The US crossed the Yalu river?  Wow, I've never seen that in any American textbook from K to college. Thanks for setting us Americans straight.

We actually do need to set ourselves straight. On average Americans have very poor knowledge of our country's history. I bet most naturalized US citizens do better than US born citizens when it comes to civic history.

http://www.alternet.org/story/90161/ignorant_america%3A_just_how_stupid_are_we

http://www.prnewswire.com/news-releases/83-percent-of-us-adults-fail-test-on-nations-founding-78325412.html

http://news.heartland.org/newspaper-article/2013/05/13/study-finds-troubling-lack-us-history-knowledge
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: irvinehomeowner on June 03, 2015, 12:15:19 PM
The only time I've seen such action was when I saw a white dude cut in front of a black dude at a buffet line
He was going to get the last chicken fried steak and I didn't want to wait for them to bring out new ones.

Did you see us go outside to play 21 for it?
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: eyephone on June 03, 2015, 12:31:58 PM
Yal and Zubs made it on this Facebook page:

https://www.facebook.com/ocvmp

However, I was surprised that no one took the bait here on TI.  I figured I'd get someone to comment on it....but Nope.

I kind of figure, your not the person the website called out as the "leader on TI" lol ;)
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: Homer_Simpson on June 03, 2015, 12:34:19 PM
The only time I've seen such action was when I saw a white dude cut in front of a black dude at a buffet line
He was going to get the last chicken fried steak and I didn't want to wait for them to bring out new ones.

Did you see us go outside to play 21 for it?

I did... saw you bank the game winning 3... black guy said it was Sunday and the banks were closed and it didn't count.. You ate that chicken fried steak anyways...

#badass
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: irvinehomeowner on June 03, 2015, 12:36:47 PM
The only time I've seen such action was when I saw a white dude cut in front of a black dude at a buffet line
He was going to get the last chicken fried steak and I didn't want to wait for them to bring out new ones.

Did you see us go outside to play 21 for it?

I did... saw you bank the game winning 3... black guy said it was Sunday and the banks were closed and it didn't count.. You ate that chicken fried steak anyways...

#badass
Yep... and I told him I bank online... open 24/7!
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: Homer_Simpson on June 03, 2015, 12:38:51 PM
The only time I've seen such action was when I saw a white dude cut in front of a black dude at a buffet line
He was going to get the last chicken fried steak and I didn't want to wait for them to bring out new ones.

Did you see us go outside to play 21 for it?

I did... saw you bank the game winning 3... black guy said it was Sunday and the banks were closed and it didn't count.. You ate that chicken fried steak anyways...

#badass
Yep... and I told him I bank online... open 24/7!

He doesn't have online so he didn't get it...

#nicetry
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: jmoney74 on June 03, 2015, 12:48:34 PM
Yal and Zubs made it on this Facebook page:

https://www.facebook.com/ocvmp

If you read my posts you can tell I'm for the cemetery.  That post I put up to move the cemetery by the garbage dump was to troll people.  Manipulation works, how surprising.

However, I was surprised that no one took the bait here on TI.  I figured I'd get someone to comment on it....but Nope.

I am disappoint in you.. try harder.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: zubs on June 03, 2015, 12:57:09 PM
I trolled someone on FB...it must count for something....but seriously trolling FB users is like shooting fish in a barrel.

You TI guys are getting too hard to troll...at least there's always new members ...
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: jmoney74 on June 03, 2015, 01:01:40 PM
I trolled someone on FB...it must count for something....but seriously trolling FB users is like shooting fish in a barrel.

You TI guys are getting too hard to troll...at least there's always new members ...

eatthis

Homer
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: zubs on June 03, 2015, 01:02:57 PM
I love his passionate responses...keep them up pls.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: zubs on June 03, 2015, 02:39:11 PM
I emailed Fox News....here is their response.

Thanks for contacting FOX 11 and My13 Programming.  We receive a lot of e-mails and we do our best to respond to everyone. To reach our station by phone, please call (310) 584-2000.

It was an auto-reply....however I've done my part.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: eyephone on June 03, 2015, 02:44:01 PM
I emailed Fox News....here is their response.

Thanks for contacting FOX 11 and My13 Programming.  We receive a lot of e-mails and we do our best to respond to everyone. To reach our station by phone, please call (310) 584-2000.

It was an auto-reply....however I've done my part.

Are you going to the "showdown" I mean meeting?
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: jmoney74 on June 03, 2015, 04:00:49 PM
I emailed Fox News....here is their response.

Thanks for contacting FOX 11 and My13 Programming.  We receive a lot of e-mails and we do our best to respond to everyone. To reach our station by phone, please call (310) 584-2000.

It was an auto-reply....however I've done my part.

Are you going to the "showdown" I mean meeting?

Can someone put a song together?  Works out better when people sing their arguments
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: zubs on June 03, 2015, 04:10:07 PM
I'm not going no, but I hope to see it on the news.
If yaliu gives an interview to FOX I would be impressed.

Actually if any of the opponents of the cemetery gave an interview I would be impressed.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: qwerty on June 03, 2015, 04:14:44 PM
Yaliu - just made a couple of calls. to give your argument more credibility via diversity im sending these guys in my place. good luck

(http://2.bp.blogspot.com/-zUX87Zxwoog/UctsvGTsF4I/AAAAAAAABRE/y2morqr8va4/s1600/instant+6+pack.jpg)
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: Happiness on June 03, 2015, 04:15:34 PM
It's too bad Wally George isn't around anymore.  This town hall meeting would have been perfect on Hot Seat.  Do any of you old timers remember the debate on Hot Seat between Tom Metzger (grand dragon of the Ku Klux Klan) and Irv Rubin (president of the Jewish Defense League)?  That was epic.  They jumped on each other and tore down the entire set of the show.


(https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VW-6Xis-81o)
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: SoCal on June 03, 2015, 04:31:36 PM
It's too bad Wally George isn't around anymore.  This town hall meeting would have been perfect on Hot Seat.  Do any of you old timers remember the debate on Hot Seat between Tom Metzger (grand dragon of the Ku Klux Klan) and Irv Rubin (president of the Jewish Defense League)?  That was epic.  They jumped on each other and tore down the entire set of the show.


(https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VW-6Xis-81o)

Yes, or the famous chair-throwing incident on Geraldo Rivera. Black dude vs. Skinheads.

Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: zubs on June 03, 2015, 04:32:19 PM
Do reporters discourage the 500 people who signed the petition from going to the town hall meeting?  I hope not....however, it did discourage one Mexican....at least he's sending in the B-team.

If you have the conviction that the veterans cemetery should be moved out of former Marine Corp Air Station El Toro, then reporters shouldn't stop you from going on Monday.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: eyephone on June 03, 2015, 04:36:04 PM
It's too bad Wally George isn't around anymore.  This town hall meeting would have been perfect on Hot Seat.  Do any of you old timers remember the debate on Hot Seat between Tom Metzger (grand dragon of the Ku Klux Klan) and Irv Rubin (president of the Jewish Defense League)?  That was epic.  They jumped on each other and tore down the entire set of the show.


(https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VW-6Xis-81o)

Yes, or the famous chair-throwing incident on Geraldo Rivera. Black dude vs. Skinheads.


U think?
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: . on June 03, 2015, 06:17:42 PM
Imagine if you will:

There is a certain town near Nanjing, China where about half the residents are Japanese nationals.  The town decides to build a memorial to Chinese vets who resisted the Japanese during the WWII Nanjing Massacre.  The Japanese residents of said town decide to protest in order to have the memorial moved somewhere else because of "traffic concerns."  How would the local Chinese react to this?

bad analogy.. I'm all for building a memorial..
i respect all veterans.  i also support to build a veteran memorial.  i also support the veteran house in irvine couple month ago. 
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: Irvinecommuter on June 03, 2015, 10:15:29 PM
Imagine if you will:

There is a certain town near Nanjing, China where about half the residents are Japanese nationals.  The town decides to build a memorial to Chinese vets who resisted the Japanese during the WWII Nanjing Massacre.  The Japanese residents of said town decide to protest in order to have the memorial moved somewhere else because of "traffic concerns."  How would the local Chinese react to this?

bad analogy.. I'm all for building a memorial..
i respect all veterans.  i also support to build a veteran memorial.  i also support the veteran house in irvine couple month ago.

Just none that are located in or near your backyard right ;)
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: eyephone on June 03, 2015, 10:26:18 PM
Imagine if you will:

There is a certain town near Nanjing, China where about half the residents are Japanese nationals.  The town decides to build a memorial to Chinese vets who resisted the Japanese during the WWII Nanjing Massacre.  The Japanese residents of said town decide to protest in order to have the memorial moved somewhere else because of "traffic concerns."  How would the local Chinese react to this?

bad analogy.. I'm all for building a memorial..
i respect all veterans.  i also support to build a veteran memorial.  i also support the veteran house in irvine couple month ago.

Yaliu - It's too late to apologize.

(There you go J$, lyrics from a song like you requested)
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: SoCal on June 03, 2015, 10:42:44 PM
El Toro is the perfect place for the memorial. Vets have served at the Marine Corps Air Station since the 1940s, long before it was "Irvine". What more suitable place for them to be laid to rest than at that very base. What do we always read on T.I., that the average length of stay in one home is 7 years. Any concerns to homeowners today are purely fleeting. Your stay is but a vapor. However, just as the site was used long before the newbies arrived, the veterans and their families will continue to use this site long after you've moved on. It all boils down to #BucksOverVets.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: jmoney74 on June 03, 2015, 10:53:41 PM
El Toro is the perfect place for the memorial. Vets have served at the Marine Corps Air Station since the 1940s, long before it was "Irvine". What more suitable place for them to be laid to rest than at that very base. What do we always read on T.I., that the average length of stay in one home is 7 years. Any concerns to homeowners today are purely fleeting. Your stay is but a vapor. However, just as the site was used long before the newbies arrived, the veterans and their families will continue to use this site long after you've moved on. It all boils down to #BucksOverVets.

Nah
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: . on June 03, 2015, 11:29:18 PM
Imagine if you will:

There is a certain town near Nanjing, China where about half the residents are Japanese nationals.  The town decides to build a memorial to Chinese vets who resisted the Japanese during the WWII Nanjing Massacre.  The Japanese residents of said town decide to protest in order to have the memorial moved somewhere else because of "traffic concerns."  How would the local Chinese react to this?

bad analogy.. I'm all for building a memorial..
i respect all veterans.  i also support to build a veteran memorial.  i also support the veteran house in irvine couple month ago.

Just none that are located in or near your backyard right ;)

i am okay w/ memorial and veteran house in great park.  :)
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: iacrenter on June 04, 2015, 12:05:16 AM
Vets have served at the Marine Corps Air Station since the 1940s, long before it was "Irvine".

Well if we use this logic, then QWERTY and amigos deserve their own cemetery. They were here long before we were part of the United States.

(http://amazingmexicans.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/09/mexico2.jpg)
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: Homer_Simpson on June 04, 2015, 06:54:43 AM
Vets have served at the Marine Corps Air Station since the 1940s, long before it was "Irvine".

Well if we use this logic, then QWERTY and amigos deserve their own cemetery. They were here long before we were part of the United States.

(http://amazingmexicans.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/09/mexico2.jpg)

Well if we use this logic, then JMoney and his tribes deserve their own cemetery.  They were here long before we were part of the United States.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: irvinehomeowner on June 04, 2015, 11:34:17 AM
It doesn't matter who was here first, just like pick-up basketball, as long as you keep winning, you own the court.

:)
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: Irvinecommuter on June 04, 2015, 11:48:45 AM
It doesn't matter who was here first, just like pick-up basketball, as long as you keep winning, you own the court.

:)

Yup

(http://i.kinja-img.com/gawker-media/image/upload/s--ZKLDrYZK--/nywtm7gtsevhtp34kg0x.jpg)
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: SoCal on June 04, 2015, 11:59:13 AM
Not sure where this is going... builders already do acknowledge and consult with tribal leaders when any remains are unearthed. Burial grounds have had their impact on home building and construction of the toll road. Going with that logic, then, why should the people who are living today - the ones we owe our freedom to - deserve any less?
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: SoCal on June 04, 2015, 12:06:11 PM
The meeting has now been cancelled, according to a post made by Melissa Fox last night on the Orange County Veteran's Memorial Park FB page.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: bones on June 04, 2015, 12:29:51 PM
http://www.theliberaloc.com/2015/06/04/choi-wont-attend-town-hall-meeting-either/

It's not cancelled but the mayor and company won't be attending. Apparently the group still plans on holding the meeting.....
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: zubs on June 04, 2015, 01:05:28 PM
I would like to think my posts here had something to do with the Mayor cancelling his appearance.  Probably not...but I'll just pretend it happened that way.

like Socal patting herself on the back for exposing the birth tourists @ Hoag.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: qwerty on June 04, 2015, 01:06:54 PM
http://www.theliberaloc.com/2015/06/04/choi-wont-attend-town-hall-meeting-either/

It's not cancelled but the mayor and company won't be attending. Apparently the group still plans on holding the meeting.....

Yaliu - what the hell man? what kind of clown operation are you guys running over there that you had the mayor back out? :-)
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: SoCal on June 04, 2015, 01:19:42 PM
I would like to think my posts here had something to do with the Mayor cancelling his appearance.  Probably not...but I'll just pretend it happened that way.

like Socal patting herself on the back for exposing the birth tourists @ Hoag.

We really need longer arms... to pat ourselves on the back with. But this time, I got you. Well played, Zubs. Well played.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: Irvine Fanatic on June 04, 2015, 01:26:50 PM
http://www.theliberaloc.com/2015/06/04/choi-wont-attend-town-hall-meeting-either/

It's not cancelled but the mayor and company won't be attending. Apparently the group still plans on holding the meeting.....

Yaliu - what the hell man? what kind of clown operation are you guys running over there that you had the mayor back out? :-)

Maybe you guys could pack up and move to Orchard Hills or Tustin Legacy. No Cemetery there  ;D
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: The California Court Company on June 04, 2015, 01:38:43 PM
probably the mayor and council member cancelled because they are fearing of the backlash if they show up.

however the meeting is scheduled for people to vent.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: zubs on June 04, 2015, 02:55:42 PM
Being mayor sucks...stressful and people pulling you in all different directions.  Ah well..he signed up for it...he should not have cancelled.  Here he is in 2014 talking about the cemetery.

Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: jmoney74 on June 04, 2015, 03:01:59 PM
Yaliu scared the Mayor away.. he was fearful of the backlash Y was carrying with him. 
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: eyephone on June 04, 2015, 11:17:20 PM
Yaliu scared the Mayor away.. he was fearful of the backlash Y was carrying with him.

I think the comments on TI scared him away.
1. Pictures of Latinos posing by a fence that Qwerty will send. But that message can mean, Qwerty sending two hundred. (Qwerty got the connections)  ;)
2. Video of what can go wrong during the debate - old Gerado footage
3. Message from the other side - driving more fuel to the fire.
4. Yaliu - taking roll call on who's going to the event.
5. Also, the security that is needed just for this event might be huge.



Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: aquabliss on June 05, 2015, 02:10:44 AM
I expect an updated flyer at my door tomorrow informing me that Mr. Choi will not attend.  Simplified Chinese this time please.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: Happiness on June 05, 2015, 09:24:33 AM
One could argue that those with the most to lose regarding the cemetery is 5P and other developers but their silence in this dispute has been deafening.  The developers should declare unequivocally do they want this cemetery or not rather than hide behind sincere homeowners and the City of Irvine.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: Irvinecommuter on June 05, 2015, 09:32:49 AM
One could argue that those with the most to lose regarding the cemetery is 5P and other developers but their silence in this dispute has been deafening.  The developers should declare unequivocally do they want this cemetery or not rather than hide behind sincere homeowners and the City of Irvine.

No way a develop like 5P comes out strongly against the memorial/cemetery.  There is a link of a letter that 5P wrote asking Irvine to reconsider the location.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: iacrenter on June 05, 2015, 09:33:31 AM
One could argue that those with the most to lose regarding the cemetery is 5P and other developers but their silence in this dispute has been deafening.  The developers should declare unequivocally do they want this cemetery or not rather than hide behind sincere homeowners and the City of Irvine.

5p doesn't want bad press. I'm sure their leadership team has an opinion but will let others fight their battle. They might be working behind the scenes with Irvine city leaders.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: ps9 on June 05, 2015, 09:44:43 AM
Emile didn't respond to my email :(

And their website is down?  Had to hack into the state bar site to get their general counsel's contact info
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: zubs on June 05, 2015, 10:10:15 AM
I didn't think about the security side of things if this town hall meeting got out of hand.  That is one thing to consider.  IPD charging overtime @ cypress village community center.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: jmoney74 on June 05, 2015, 10:11:51 AM
I didn't think about the security side of things if this town hall meeting got out of hand.  That is one thing to consider.  IPD charging overtime @ cypress village community center.

Yaliu already hired Qwerchete.. we're good. 
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: zubs on June 05, 2015, 10:27:40 AM
If any of you go to this meeting, please take pix and upload it here.  It would be interesting to see how many people show up.
I predict more pro-cemetery folx cause retired people ain't got shit to do.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: jmoney74 on June 05, 2015, 10:28:43 AM
If any of you go to this meeting, please take pix and upload it here.  It would be interesting to see how many people show up.
I predict more pro-cemetery folx cause retired people ain't got shit to do.

would be nice to see the vet supporters on one side and then GP home residents on the other. 

Ching Chong Chang!

AMERICA!!! AMERICA!!!
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: SoCal on June 05, 2015, 10:34:39 AM
It's too bad Wally George isn't around anymore.  This town hall meeting would have been perfect on Hot Seat.  Do any of you old timers remember the debate on Hot Seat between Tom Metzger (grand dragon of the Ku Klux Klan) and Irv Rubin (president of the Jewish Defense League)?  That was epic.  They jumped on each other and tore down the entire set of the show.


(https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VW-6Xis-81o)

Yes, or the famous chair-throwing incident on Geraldo Rivera. Black dude vs. Skinheads.


U think?


The Chinese may be passive aggressive by nature (per IHS). But Americans... not as much. This, however, isn't so passive. Add a little flagrant disregard for our Vets - or a lot - and you are inviting trouble. You're almost begging for it. Honestly, this was not well thought-out by those who planned it.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: eyephone on June 05, 2015, 10:34:59 AM
If any of you go to this meeting, please take pix and upload it here.  It would be interesting to see how many people show up.
I predict more pro-cemetery folx cause retired people ain't got shit to do.

would be nice to see the vet supporters on one side and then GP home residents on the other. 

Ching Chong Chang!

AMERICA!!! AMERICA!!!

I predict there will a lot of shouting, finger pointing, name calling
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: SoCal on June 05, 2015, 10:51:25 AM
If any of you go to this meeting, please take pix and upload it here.  It would be interesting to see how many people show up.
I predict more pro-cemetery folx cause retired people ain't got shit to do.

would be nice to see the vet supporters on one side and then GP home residents on the other. 

Ching Chong Chang!

AMERICA!!! AMERICA!!!

I predict there will a lot of shouting, finger pointing, name calling


They've already managed to piss off other Asians. So, one might expect to see the American side look a bit more like the other than first imagined. I noticed these comments written by two Asian Americans on the OCVMP page: Petite Cherie is a Public Relations Executive and Andy Nguyen is a Veteran.

Petite Cherie says: "As an Asian American, I am insulted that the petitioners are using our community to place the blame on. This is misrepresentation of our culture and people. I am embarrassed that there are SOME Asians that feel this way and use our culture as a weapon. I am in support of establishing a Veterans Cemetery and it is a huge part of the Asian culture to show gratitude to those who sacrificed for us. I thank all the veterans, especially Vietnam Veterans for saving my family. Please don't think that this petition reflects the thoughts of all Asians!"

Andy Nguyen says: "I'm Asian. I'm American. And most of all, I'm an Air Force Veteran, and I will shove point number 2 into the mouth of the politician(s) that it came out of. Out!" (He is referring to point #2 on the petition.)
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: Happiness on June 05, 2015, 10:51:42 AM
5P should be taking the laboring oar in providing an alternative site for the cemetery, if that's what 5P wants, since they were the ones who sold PP without telling buyers a cemetery was a possibility.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: irvinehomeowner on June 05, 2015, 10:55:04 AM
If it's like this... I'm going:

Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: Happiness on June 05, 2015, 10:59:19 AM
US Vets have done a great job of defending other people's freedom also.  If not for US vets, all of Korea, not just the North half, would be living under the maniac Kim Jong Un.  If not for US vets, free and democratic Taiwan ROC would have been "liberated" by Red China decades ago.  So, yes, SoCal, many people in Asia appreciate US Vets.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: Irvinecommuter on June 05, 2015, 11:20:10 AM
US Vets have done a great job of defending other people's freedom also.  If not for US vets, all of Korea, not just the North half, would be living under the maniac Kim Jong Un.  If not for US vets, free and democratic Taiwan ROC would have been "liberated" by Red China decades ago.  So, yes, SoCal, many people in Asia appreciate US Vets.

Well..that's a little simplistic...US had a lot of self-interested in mind in "protecting" Taiwan.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: eyephone on June 05, 2015, 11:24:12 AM
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: zubs on June 05, 2015, 11:24:24 AM
Can the cemetery be built along the southern edges of the base?
Why not move it south?

It looks like there is a train station down there...would be nice.

(http://2.bp.blogspot.com/-_strejDN-fI/VM6VX-bBtdI/AAAAAAAAABA/h_dgLcRYeSs/s1600/Location%2B-%2BProposed%2BState%2BVeterans%2BCemetery.jpg)
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: Soylent Green Is People on June 05, 2015, 12:33:06 PM
So if it's moved to an area near a train, the ectoplasm leeching out is then not going to be strong enought to make the 1/2 mile journey to everyone's home in the GP? It's not OK in my back yard, but it is ok a 1/2 mile away, just as long as it's not visible? Not understanding quite when / how this ends. 
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: bones on June 05, 2015, 12:38:19 PM
So if it's moved to an area near a train, the ectoplasm leeching out is then not going to be strong enought to make the 1/2 mile journey to everyone's home in the GP? It's not OK in my back yard, but it is ok a 1/2 mile away, just as long as it's not visible? Not understanding quite when / how this ends. 

NIMBY is annoying but it's also the residents' right to voice their opinion.  So far, nothing the "move the cemetery please" group has done has been wrong or illegal. People may not agree with them and that's ok too.  What is more annoying than NIMBY-ism is when people who don't live in GP start saying things like... "i wouldn't object to a cemetery being built in my neighborhood".  Well, that's great.  Those people can support THAT cemetery if and when it comes into their backyard. 
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: Irvinecommuter on June 05, 2015, 12:41:30 PM
So if it's moved to an area near a train, the ectoplasm leeching out is then not going to be strong enought to make the 1/2 mile journey to everyone's home in the GP? It's not OK in my back yard, but it is ok a 1/2 mile away, just as long as it's not visible? Not understanding quite when / how this ends. 

NIMBY is annoying but it's also the residents' right to voice their opinion.  So far, nothing the "move the cemetery please" group has done has been wrong or illegal. People may not agree with them and that's ok too.  What is more annoying than NIMBY-ism is when people who don't live in GP start saying things like... "i wouldn't object to a cemetery being built in my neighborhood".  Well, that's great.  Those people can support THAT cemetery if and when it comes into their backyard.

I don't have a problem with NIMBY as long as people are honest about it.  None of these "toxic leakage" or "traffic" concern...people don't want a cemetery in their neighborhood.  Understandable and reasonable...but not very politically sound.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: bones on June 05, 2015, 12:44:34 PM
So if it's moved to an area near a train, the ectoplasm leeching out is then not going to be strong enought to make the 1/2 mile journey to everyone's home in the GP? It's not OK in my back yard, but it is ok a 1/2 mile away, just as long as it's not visible? Not understanding quite when / how this ends. 

NIMBY is annoying but it's also the residents' right to voice their opinion.  So far, nothing the "move the cemetery please" group has done has been wrong or illegal. People may not agree with them and that's ok too.  What is more annoying than NIMBY-ism is when people who don't live in GP start saying things like... "i wouldn't object to a cemetery being built in my neighborhood".  Well, that's great.  Those people can support THAT cemetery if and when it comes into their backyard.

I don't have a problem with NIMBY as long as people are honest about it.  None of these "toxic leakage" or "traffic" concern...people don't want a cemetery in their neighborhood.  Understandable and reasonable...but not very politically sound.

I think most people on this board who are against putting the cemetery in the proposed location are honest about it.  Some fear the dead.  Some fear how it affects resale values.  Some fear added traffic.  All these arguments lead back to the overall NIMBY umbrella.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: lnc on June 05, 2015, 12:58:28 PM
I didn't think about the security side of things if this town hall meeting got out of hand.  That is one thing to consider.  IPD charging overtime @ cypress village community center.

Yaliu already hired Qwerchete.. we're good. 

But Qwerchete can't stand the sight of blood!!


I don't know if this is true but this is according to IHO. :)
http://www.talkirvine.com/index.php/topic,11487.msg225239.html
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: Irvine Fanatic on June 05, 2015, 01:00:37 PM
Just wanted some clarification, which neighborhoods will the cemetery have the biggest impact (home value)? Based on the map I'm guessing Beacon Park and Pavillion park only?
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: bones on June 05, 2015, 01:04:20 PM
Just wanted some clarification, which neighborhoods will the cemetery have the biggest impact (home value)? Based on the map I'm guessing Beacon Park and Pavillion park only?

No.  If i'm reading the map correctly, the future neighborhoods will be the closest - neighborhood 4 (or maybe it's 5) is adjacent to it on the same side of the street and neighborhood 5 (or maybe it's 4) is across Irvine Blvd.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: eyephone on June 05, 2015, 01:08:38 PM
Just wanted some clarification, which neighborhoods will the cemetery have the biggest impact (home value)? Based on the map I'm guessing Beacon Park and Pavillion park only?

Go to the meeting and find out ;)
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: zubs on June 05, 2015, 01:16:05 PM
The veterans get their cemetery in the Great Park, and the residents get it moved 0.5 mile further south.  Not the optimal solution, but a better one than the current location.  Or is that area Broadcom's new offices?

Let's say every 0.1 miles the grave yard is away from a property, that property goes up 1%....That's a shitload of money...
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: iacrenter on June 05, 2015, 01:23:05 PM
The veterans get their cemetery in the Great Park, and the residents get it moved 0.5 mile further south.  Not the optimal solution, but a better one than the current location.  Or is that area Broadcom's new offices?

Isn't that souhern portion designated for county development already?

http://m.ocregister.com/articles/county-659502-irvine-great.html
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: SoCal on June 05, 2015, 01:27:58 PM
What is more annoying than NIMBY-ism is when people who don't live in GP start saying things like... "i wouldn't object to a cemetery being built in my neighborhood".  Well, that's great.  Those people can support THAT cemetery if and when it comes into their backyard. 

I am in the process of re-reading this entire thread and just want to point out that the anti-cemetery group has posed the question several times, in various ways, with the gist of: "How would you like it if a cemetery was being built next to your house?" If an answer is given, it could be because it was prompted by some, one, or all of those questions.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: Irvinecommuter on June 05, 2015, 01:43:04 PM
What is more annoying than NIMBY-ism is when people who don't live in GP start saying things like... "i wouldn't object to a cemetery being built in my neighborhood".  Well, that's great.  Those people can support THAT cemetery if and when it comes into their backyard. 

I am in the process of re-reading this entire thread and just want to point out that the anti-cemetery group has posed the question several times, in various ways, with the gist of: "How would you like it if a cemetery was being built next to your house?" If an answer is given, it could be because it was prompted by some, one, or all of those questions.

I think I posted before that the argument has been hashed and rehashed...the NIMBY argument is just not a winner.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: bones on June 05, 2015, 01:44:07 PM
What is more annoying than NIMBY-ism is when people who don't live in GP start saying things like... "i wouldn't object to a cemetery being built in my neighborhood".  Well, that's great.  Those people can support THAT cemetery if and when it comes into their backyard. 

I am in the process of re-reading this entire thread and just want to point out that the anti-cemetery group has posed the question several times, in various ways, with the gist of: "How would you like it if a cemetery was being built next to your house?" If an answer is given, it could be because it was prompted by some, one, or all of those questions.

1.  It's not an anti cemetary group
2.  Then if that's the case, the people who are asking that question are stupid. It doesn't matter how someone who doesn't live in the GP feels about a cemetary in their backyard bc it's not happening to them.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: Irvinecommuter on June 05, 2015, 01:45:47 PM
What is more annoying than NIMBY-ism is when people who don't live in GP start saying things like... "i wouldn't object to a cemetery being built in my neighborhood".  Well, that's great.  Those people can support THAT cemetery if and when it comes into their backyard. 

I am in the process of re-reading this entire thread and just want to point out that the anti-cemetery group has posed the question several times, in various ways, with the gist of: "How would you like it if a cemetery was being built next to your house?" If an answer is given, it could be because it was prompted by some, one, or all of those questions.

1.  It's not an anti cemetary group
2.  Then if that's the case, the people who are asking that question are stupid. It doesn't matter how someone who doesn't live in the GP feels about a cemetary in their backyard bc it's not happening to them.

But they are trying to sway public opinion on the matter..which requires empathy to their plight.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: bones on June 05, 2015, 01:53:20 PM
What is more annoying than NIMBY-ism is when people who don't live in GP start saying things like... "i wouldn't object to a cemetery being built in my neighborhood".  Well, that's great.  Those people can support THAT cemetery if and when it comes into their backyard. 

I am in the process of re-reading this entire thread and just want to point out that the anti-cemetery group has posed the question several times, in various ways, with the gist of: "How would you like it if a cemetery was being built next to your house?" If an answer is given, it could be because it was prompted by some, one, or all of those questions.

1.  It's not an anti cemetary group
2.  Then if that's the case, the people who are asking that question are stupid. It doesn't matter how someone who doesn't live in the GP feels about a cemetary in their backyard bc it's not happening to them.

But they are trying to sway public opinion on the matter..which requires empathy to their plight.

Well honestly, I'm not sure what the group is trying to do in terms of getting to their goal.  Not sure how involving people who don't live in the GP is useful.  It just creates backlash because like many have pointed out - no one without any real skin in the game is going to be anti-anything on this matter.  B/c why should they?  No skin off their back.  And for the record, there are people who live in the GP that are FOR the cemetery and welcome it with open arms.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: Irvinecommuter on June 05, 2015, 02:14:59 PM
What is more annoying than NIMBY-ism is when people who don't live in GP start saying things like... "i wouldn't object to a cemetery being built in my neighborhood".  Well, that's great.  Those people can support THAT cemetery if and when it comes into their backyard. 

I am in the process of re-reading this entire thread and just want to point out that the anti-cemetery group has posed the question several times, in various ways, with the gist of: "How would you like it if a cemetery was being built next to your house?" If an answer is given, it could be because it was prompted by some, one, or all of those questions.

1.  It's not an anti cemetary group
2.  Then if that's the case, the people who are asking that question are stupid. It doesn't matter how someone who doesn't live in the GP feels about a cemetary in their backyard bc it's not happening to them.

But they are trying to sway public opinion on the matter..which requires empathy to their plight.

Well honestly, I'm not sure what the group is trying to do in terms of getting to their goal.  Not sure how involving people who don't live in the GP is useful.  It just creates backlash because like many have pointed out - no one without any real skin in the game is going to be anti-anything on this matter.  B/c why should they?  No skin off their back.  And for the record, there are people who live in the GP that are FOR the cemetery and welcome it with open arms.

They are trying to convince the Irvine board and mayor to move the site to somewhere else...not so close to their backyard.  That requires more voices than those from GP. 

It's basically futile IMO but the Light Bridge charged anyways.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: bones on June 05, 2015, 02:26:36 PM
What is more annoying than NIMBY-ism is when people who don't live in GP start saying things like... "i wouldn't object to a cemetery being built in my neighborhood".  Well, that's great.  Those people can support THAT cemetery if and when it comes into their backyard. 

I am in the process of re-reading this entire thread and just want to point out that the anti-cemetery group has posed the question several times, in various ways, with the gist of: "How would you like it if a cemetery was being built next to your house?" If an answer is given, it could be because it was prompted by some, one, or all of those questions.

1.  It's not an anti cemetary group
2.  Then if that's the case, the people who are asking that question are stupid. It doesn't matter how someone who doesn't live in the GP feels about a cemetary in their backyard bc it's not happening to them.

But they are trying to sway public opinion on the matter..which requires empathy to their plight.

Well honestly, I'm not sure what the group is trying to do in terms of getting to their goal.  Not sure how involving people who don't live in the GP is useful.  It just creates backlash because like many have pointed out - no one without any real skin in the game is going to be anti-anything on this matter.  B/c why should they?  No skin off their back.  And for the record, there are people who live in the GP that are FOR the cemetery and welcome it with open arms.

They are trying to convince the Irvine board and mayor to move the site to somewhere else...not so close to their backyard.  That requires more voices than those from GP. 

It's basically futile IMO but the Light Bridge charged anyways.

Thanks Sherlock.  I meant, how?  By throwing a bunch of signatures on a page?  By throwing a town hall decision makers aren't going to?  If they want to really move the location, it needs to be a lot more strategic than Yal being the messenger on TI.  No offense Yal :)
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: jmoney74 on June 05, 2015, 02:31:25 PM
What is more annoying than NIMBY-ism is when people who don't live in GP start saying things like... "i wouldn't object to a cemetery being built in my neighborhood".  Well, that's great.  Those people can support THAT cemetery if and when it comes into their backyard. 

I am in the process of re-reading this entire thread and just want to point out that the anti-cemetery group has posed the question several times, in various ways, with the gist of: "How would you like it if a cemetery was being built next to your house?" If an answer is given, it could be because it was prompted by some, one, or all of those questions.

1.  It's not an anti cemetary group
2.  Then if that's the case, the people who are asking that question are stupid. It doesn't matter how someone who doesn't live in the GP feels about a cemetary in their backyard bc it's not happening to them.

But they are trying to sway public opinion on the matter..which requires empathy to their plight.

Well honestly, I'm not sure what the group is trying to do in terms of getting to their goal.  Not sure how involving people who don't live in the GP is useful.  It just creates backlash because like many have pointed out - no one without any real skin in the game is going to be anti-anything on this matter.  B/c why should they?  No skin off their back.  And for the record, there are people who live in the GP that are FOR the cemetery and welcome it with open arms.

They are trying to convince the Irvine board and mayor to move the site to somewhere else...not so close to their backyard.  That requires more voices than those from GP. 

It's basically futile IMO but the Light Bridge charged anyways.

Thanks Sherlock.  I meant, how?  By throwing a bunch of signatures on a page?  By throwing a town hall decision makers aren't going to?  If they want to really move the location, it needs to be a lot more strategic than Yal being the messenger on TI.  No offense Yal :)

Don't underestimate the power of the Yaliu!  Seen that man put a dead body in OH and nobody knows what happened.  (Too soon?)
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: bones on June 05, 2015, 02:32:22 PM

Don't underestimate the power of the Yaliu!  Seen that man put a dead body in OH and nobody knows what happened.  (Too soon?)

Ha!  You're right... maybe Yal and co are busy making things happen behind the scenes that we just don't know about ;)
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: Swordfish on June 05, 2015, 02:37:07 PM
You would have to figure that 5P could take the land now allocated for the Veterans Cemetery and generate a huge amount of cash if it was allowed to use the land instead for residential development. The proceeds from that could then be used to purchase a pretty nice cemetery somewhere else where land is going for a whole lot less... 5P gets rid of a major negative for its development, City of Irvine avoids a major headache, and Veterans get an even bigger cemetery. Seems like a win-win-win... Of course if that was on their minds 5P would start marketing that site as a future neighborhood... hmm... Aren't they doing that already?
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: ps9 on June 05, 2015, 03:16:51 PM
Sure....future 'neighborhood' for who?
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: eyephone on June 05, 2015, 05:01:11 PM

Qwerty's  support/connections  ;D

Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: Happiness on June 05, 2015, 05:50:28 PM
The guy in the Geraldo brawl was John Metzger, the son of the Tom Metzger, the guy in the Wally George brawl.

Tom Metzger was the California Grand Dragon of the KKK.  The Grand Dragon is a state leader of the KKK.  The national leader of the KKK is the Grand Wizard who was David Duke.  After Tom Metzger retired from his Grand Dragon position, he founded the White Aryan Resistance (WAR) which his son John was a leader in.  WAR is a formidable presence in California prisons.  After David Duke left the KKK, he founded the civil rights organization National Association for the Advancement of White People (NAAWP).

Wally George was an Orange County institution in the old days.  He was from Garden Grove and had a long running show on KDOC channel 56 called Hot Seat.  He was such an OC icon I remember seeing someone in Anaheim walking around on Halloween dressed as Wally George.  SoCal, your parents let you stay up late enough to watch Hot Seat?



It's too bad Wally George isn't around anymore.  This town hall meeting would have been perfect on Hot Seat.  Do any of you old timers remember the debate on Hot Seat between Tom Metzger (grand dragon of the Ku Klux Klan) and Irv Rubin (president of the Jewish Defense League)?  That was epic.  They jumped on each other and tore down the entire set of the show.


(https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VW-6Xis-81o)

Yes, or the famous chair-throwing incident on Geraldo Rivera. Black dude vs. Skinheads.

Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: . on June 05, 2015, 11:55:19 PM
Cemetery culture clash in Irvine: Asian neighbors say graves would create bad feng shui, hurt property values

http://www.ocregister.com/articles/cemetery-664876-park-veterans.html
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: eyephone on June 06, 2015, 10:24:25 AM
Cemetery culture clash in Irvine: Asian neighbors say graves would create bad feng shui, hurt property values

http://www.ocregister.com/articles/cemetery-664876-park-veterans.html

Is that you in the group photo, in the article that you posted?  ;D
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: SoCal on June 08, 2015, 08:21:35 PM
@TCCC, come out and voice your thoughts why cemetery should be in great park.  This gives us a chance to listen your thoughts and give you a chance to listen our thoughts.  any thoughts are welcome.



So, any thoughts are welcome... but only if they are Chinese.

Here is what happened tonight at the meeting according to the vets:

We only wanted to dialog, but were turned away at the door. "Private party rental' we were told. Chinese only.
Source (https://www.facebook.com/ocvmp?fref=ts)
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: . on June 08, 2015, 08:37:55 PM
i didn't see qwerty there.  calling out qwerty.

are you mexiCAN or mexiCANT?
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: SoCal on June 08, 2015, 08:41:20 PM
we worked hard to have this town hall meeting.  we appreciate if people can come and voice their thoughts.

5 days ago, a letter was posted here (http://icity168.blogspot.com/), slamming the councilwoman for pulling the rug out from under your meeting. "No written explanation or apology was given by Ms. Schott to OCRA for OCRA's work and time spent on this TH efforts." She was criticized as being "unprofessional" and a disappointment for her lack of communication. Tonight, you did the same thing to the group of veterans who showed up to the advertised meeting, where supposedly, all thoughts would be welcomed. They were turned away at the door. How do you respond to those who see incongruities here?


Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: . on June 08, 2015, 08:43:20 PM
@TCCC, come out and voice your thoughts why cemetery should be in great park.  This gives us a chance to listen your thoughts and give you a chance to listen our thoughts.  any thoughts are welcome.



So, any thoughts are welcome... but only if they are Chinese.

Here is what happened tonight at the meeting according to the vets:

We only wanted to dialog, but were turned away at the door. "Private party rental' we were told. Chinese only.
Source (https://www.facebook.com/ocvmp?fref=ts)

according to the organizer, there WILL be communication with veterans.

i also think the organizer said that there were already some communication with veterans and veterans are nice and reasonable people.  but unfortunately, i sat in the back and didn't hear that sentence clearly. 

there were another races there too including american.  unfortunately, there were no mexiCANT.  again, calling out qwerty....
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: qwerty on June 08, 2015, 08:57:17 PM
i didn't see qwerty there.  calling out qwerty.

are you mexiCAN or mexiCANT?

Yaliu - my apologies. I had an appointment with roxy, Dorothy and Morgan.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: aquabliss on June 08, 2015, 08:57:56 PM
I don't know what the fuss is all about.  I heard all veterans were offered complimentary towels at the door.

(http://i58.tinypic.com/kcjjfl.jpg)
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: jmoney74 on June 08, 2015, 09:48:24 PM
Recap of meeting please
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: i1 on June 08, 2015, 10:16:45 PM
OC vets memorial fb page feels like it has an anti-Chinese vibe to it.
So yaliu's group respects vets, but doesn't want a cemetery
The vets group is drumming up anti-Chinese sentiment over this? And lying about the presence of non-Chinese at the mtg?
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: . on June 08, 2015, 10:26:46 PM
OC vets memorial fb page feels like it has an anti-Chinese vibe to it.
So yaliu's group respects vets, but doesn't want a cemetery
The vets group is drumming up anti-Chinese sentiment over this? And lying about the presence of non-Chinese at the mtg?

there are 95% asians and 5% non-asians.  i categorize indians asians too.  i dont think they are lying about the "non-chinese at the mtg".  it is just easy to miss the 5% non-asians. 

we did took pictures during the meeting and we have proof.  quote from IHO favorite sentence.

btw, i know there is one american in PP openly support relocate the cemetery.  if Jmony comes to HOA board meeting, he WOULD be the witness.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: SoCal on June 08, 2015, 10:29:22 PM
according to the organizer, there WILL be communication with veterans.

Why were these veterans (https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=1625090811110468&set=pcb.1625091831110366&type=1&theater) turned away at the door?
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: . on June 08, 2015, 10:35:27 PM
according to the organizer, there WILL be communication with veterans.

Why were these veterans (https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=1625090811110468&set=pcb.1625091831110366&type=1&theater) turned away at the door?

i dont know so cal.  but according to the organizer, he/the group WILL COMMUNICATE with veteran to find a win-win situation. 
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: jmoney74 on June 08, 2015, 10:36:51 PM
Looks like there are more roadblocks ahead.  Shea responded to the website that was trying to throw jabs at her.

christina Shea
June 4, 2015 at 9:06 am
Dear Dan,
You love to create controversy and spin facts, which isn’t responsible, in my opinion.
Yes the Governor came to Irvine and he stated, on camera, to my surprise, the Dept of Finance wouldn’t agree to approve the funding for the cemetery, but he stated, he moved forward with the Quirk Silva plan, as she was so tenacious. Best to review that media statement.
We approved the site at the Great Park as a set aside. We haven’t changed the General Plan, because there are so many hurdles ahead of us. The State and the Federal government must decide if they will fund this project
We have many competing interests, and as electeds, we must represent everyone.
We have hundreds of residents that spent up to a million dollars and more for their homes, and they have a right to their opinion, as do our Veterans,
Diminishing their interests, is unfair and not what I was elected to do.
The decision is in the lap of the State and Federal government, not further with our City.
Best you take up your battle there.
Our Council and our Supervisors shouldn’t be pressured to make public policy decisions based on your intimidation. I have never made decisions to support an issue because someone or even many try to intimidate me into their way of thinking.
I was elected to represent all our residents and I will continue to do so.
There was no smoking gun letter, it was a letter I sent to respond to our residents, just like I do as a matter of course in my daily duties.
My Father, Stepfather and Grandfather were Veterans. I am working on an affordable housing plan for our Veterans. Don’t try to characterize me in opposition to our Vets, as that impression is just wrong.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: momopi on June 08, 2015, 10:36:56 PM
@TCCC, come out and voice your thoughts why cemetery should be in great park.  This gives us a chance to listen your thoughts and give you a chance to listen our thoughts.  any thoughts are welcome.



So, any thoughts are welcome... but only if they are Chinese.

Here is what happened tonight at the meeting according to the vets:

We only wanted to dialog, but were turned away at the door. "Private party rental' we were told. Chinese only.
Source (https://www.facebook.com/ocvmp?fref=ts)



Tell the Veterans to kindly remind the doorman that Irvine is not a 19th century foreign concession, and they're not trying to enter Huangpu Park here.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: i1 on June 08, 2015, 10:42:13 PM
Z
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: . on June 08, 2015, 10:43:32 PM
Looks like there are more roadblocks ahead.  Shea responded to the website that was trying to throw jabs at her.

christina Shea
June 4, 2015 at 9:06 am
Dear Dan,
You love to create controversy and spin facts, which isn’t responsible, in my opinion.
Yes the Governor came to Irvine and he stated, on camera, to my surprise, the Dept of Finance wouldn’t agree to approve the funding for the cemetery, but he stated, he moved forward with the Quirk Silva plan, as she was so tenacious. Best to review that media statement.
We approved the site at the Great Park as a set aside. We haven’t changed the General Plan, because there are so many hurdles ahead of us. The State and the Federal government must decide if they will fund this project
We have many competing interests, and as electeds, we must represent everyone.
We have hundreds of residents that spent up to a million dollars and more for their homes, and they have a right to their opinion, as do our Veterans,
Diminishing their interests, is unfair and not what I was elected to do.
The decision is in the lap of the State and Federal government, not further with our City.
Best you take up your battle there.
Our Council and our Supervisors shouldn’t be pressured to make public policy decisions based on your intimidation. I have never made decisions to support an issue because someone or even many try to intimidate me into their way of thinking.
I was elected to represent all our residents and I will continue to do so.
There was no smoking gun letter, it was a letter I sent to respond to our residents, just like I do as a matter of course in my daily duties.
My Father, Stepfather and Grandfather were Veterans. I am working on an affordable housing plan for our Veterans. Don’t try to characterize me in opposition to our Vets, as that impression is just wrong.
picture or link please.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: . on June 08, 2015, 10:46:40 PM
My Father, Stepfather and Grandfather were Veterans. I am working on an affordable housing plan for our Veterans. Don’t try to characterize me in opposition to our Vets, as that impression is just wrong.
i stated before and i will state again that I would support veteran house plan in Irvine.
i DO understand their sacrifice and i DO appreciate their effort to keep us safe.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: eyephone on June 08, 2015, 10:58:59 PM
@TCCC, come out and voice your thoughts why cemetery should be in great park.  This gives us a chance to listen your thoughts and give you a chance to listen our thoughts.  any thoughts are welcome.



So, any thoughts are welcome... but only if they are Chinese.

Here is what happened tonight at the meeting according to the vets:

We only wanted to dialog, but were turned away at the door. "Private party rental' we were told. Chinese only.
Source (https://www.facebook.com/ocvmp?fref=ts)



Tell the Veterans to kindly remind the doorman that Irvine is not a 19th century foreign concession, and they're not trying to enter Huangpu Park here.

Did this really happen?
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: momopi on June 08, 2015, 11:02:46 PM

SoCal provided a link to the report, but I don't think we have any recorded evidence?
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: eyephone on June 08, 2015, 11:03:30 PM

SoCal provided a link to the report, but I don't think we have any recorded evidence?

Did you attend the meeting?
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: momopi on June 08, 2015, 11:11:23 PM
SoCal provided a link to the report, but I don't think we have any recorded evidence?
Did you attend the meeting?

No, was not aware of it until tonight.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: WillJoy on June 09, 2015, 02:01:21 AM
There is a saying in Chinese similar to 'when in Rome, do as Romans do'. These anti-cemetery vocals, so bent on clinging to their custom, seem to have forgotten that deeply ingrained philosophy. The stupid fengshui is everything and the only thing they care about now. It is plainly rude imho.


Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: jmoney74 on June 09, 2015, 06:54:50 AM
There is a saying in Chinese similar to 'when in Rome, do as Romans do'. These anti-cemetery vocals, so bent on clinging to their custom, seem to have forgotten that deeply ingrained philosophy. The stupid fengshui is everything and the only thing they care about now. It is plainly rude imho.

Follow with a rude comment about feng shui.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: irvinehomeowner on June 09, 2015, 07:19:22 AM
How did those Veterans know it was Chinese people?

Don't all Asians look alike?

:)
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: Soylent Green Is People on June 09, 2015, 08:05:30 AM
If that quote from Shea is true, she can only be a bigger moron that once feared. To say

"We have hundreds of residents that spent up to a million dollars and more for their homes, and they have a right to their opinion, as do our Veterans"

while true, the $$$ of property cannot be put on the same scale as someone who spent their life as a sacrifice in the defense of this country.

Interesting perspective - again if true - on this persons priorities.

My .02c
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: jmoney74 on June 09, 2015, 08:06:17 AM
The Chinese only comment was bs. They would have raised more stank.

Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: jmoney74 on June 09, 2015, 08:08:35 AM
If that quote from Shea is true, she can only be a bigger moron that once feared. To say

"We have hundreds of residents that spent up to a million dollars and more for their homes, and they have a right to their opinion, as do our Veterans"

while true, cannot be put on the same scale as someone who spent their life in the defense of this country.

Interesting perspective - again if true - on this persons priorities.

My .02c

She didnt say that your comments are not true either.  Everyone has a right to opinion and she clearly states just that. She didn't mention anything else about vets who have served their "entire" lives.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: Irvine Dream on June 09, 2015, 08:37:34 AM


She didnt say that your comments are not true either.  Everyone has a right to opinion and she clearly states just that. She didn't mention anything else about vets who have served their "entire" lives.

It is BS to think that everyone has a right to their opinion.  If that is the case slavery might still be legal, women wouldn't still be able to vote etc.   
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: eyephone on June 09, 2015, 08:53:15 AM
@TCCC, come out and voice your thoughts why cemetery should be in great park.  This gives us a chance to listen your thoughts and give you a chance to listen our thoughts.  any thoughts are welcome.



So, any thoughts are welcome... but only if they are Chinese.

Here is what happened tonight at the meeting according to the vets:

We only wanted to dialog, but were turned away at the door. "Private party rental' we were told. Chinese only.
Source (https://www.facebook.com/ocvmp?fref=ts)

there were another races there too including american.  unfortunately, there were no mexiCANT.  again, calling out qwerty....

He didn't show up, because you didn't pay the appearance fee.  :D
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: Irvine Fanatic on June 09, 2015, 09:09:53 AM
Curious, if this effort becomes futile, what are the options?
1) Sell and run for the hills...Orchard Hills? Or some other Irvine development.
2) Stay and just deal with it? (property values may hold steady...isn't there a Veteran's Cemetery in Westwood?)
3) Rent out your place and move to some other development?
4) Other option...(fill in the blank)?
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: The California Court Company on June 09, 2015, 09:10:14 AM
there is an old Chinese saying which English translation is "There is neither lowliness nor nobleness in careers"

how much more recognition or entitlements we still need to give to the veterans? they have VA hospital, VA discount, VA loans, VA holidays, VA memorials...

the residents are only against the cemetery of any kind, but they are willing to compromise and settle for a memorial or monument instead in order to honor the Veterans and the heritage of the Great park/El Toro base.

Even though I am warming up to the idea of veterans cemetery, it is pretty clear the residents are against the cemetery, not against Veterans, yet the Veterans are turning this into an anti-Chinese agenda because they don't get whatever they want?

should we just bend over and give whatever demands veterans want?
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: Irvinecommuter on June 09, 2015, 09:26:07 AM
there is an old Chinese saying which English translation is "There is neither lowliness nor nobleness in careers"

how much more recognition or entitlements we still need to give to the veterans? they have VA hospital, VA discount, VA loans, VA holidays, VA memorials...

the residents are only against the cemetery of any kind, but they are willing to compromise and settle for a memorial or monument instead in order to honor the Veterans and the heritage of the Great park/El Toro base.

Even though I am warming up to the idea of veterans cemetery, it is pretty clear the residents are against the cemetery, not against Veterans, yet the Veterans are turning this into an anti-Chinese agenda because they don't get whatever they want?

should we just bend over and give whatever demands veterans want?

I think veteran deserves everything they have received and more.  But I do agree that there is no reason to make it personal.  It is reasonable for people to want to venerate veterans who fought for this county.  Similarly, it is reasonable for people to hold beliefs and hold true to those beliefs.  The issue here is that the belief system at issue is not the majority opinion and thus get swept under the rug as nonsense.

Just make this about the ideas, not the people.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: Irvinecommuter on June 09, 2015, 09:26:58 AM


She didnt say that your comments are not true either.  Everyone has a right to opinion and she clearly states just that. She didn't mention anything else about vets who have served their "entire" lives.

It is BS to think that everyone has a right to their opinion.  If that is the case slavery might still be legal, women wouldn't still be able to vote etc.

Everyone has a right to an opinion...you just don't have to agree to it. 
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: iacrenter on June 09, 2015, 09:29:29 AM
Veterans aren't stupid. They understand their political power and will push their agenda.

The money is on the anti cemetery side but the politics favor the veterans.

It is easy to PR spin for the veterans group:
"Selfish Rich NIMBY Foreign Irvinites fight patriotic American Veterans over their final resting place"  :)
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: Irvinecommuter on June 09, 2015, 09:32:30 AM
Veterans aren't stupid. They understand their political power and will push their agenda.

The money is on the anti cemetery side but the politics favor the veterans.

It is easy to PR spin for the veterans group:
"Selfish Rich NIMBY Foreign Irvinites fight patriotic American Veterans over their final resting place"  :)

Yup.  NIMBY is already a tough argument...NIMBY vs veterans is like a snowball vs. a volcano.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: . on June 09, 2015, 09:33:57 AM
there is an old Chinese saying which English translation is "There is neither lowliness nor nobleness in careers"

how much more recognition or entitlements we still need to give to the veterans? they have VA hospital, VA discount, VA loans, VA holidays, VA memorials...

the residents are only against the cemetery of any kind, but they are willing to compromise and settle for a memorial or monument instead in order to honor the Veterans and the heritage of the Great park/El Toro base.

Even though I am warming up to the idea of veterans cemetery, it is pretty clear the residents are against the cemetery, not against Veterans, yet the Veterans are turning this into an anti-Chinese agenda because they don't get whatever they want?

should we just bend over and give whatever demands veterans want?

I think veteran deserves everything they have received and more.  But I do agree that there is no reason to make it personal.  It is reasonable for people to want to venerate veterans who fought for this county.  Similarly, it is reasonable for people to hold beliefs and hold true to those beliefs.  The issue here is that the belief system at issue is not the majority opinion and thus get swept under the rug as nonsense.

Just make this about the ideas, not the people.

http://www.latimes.com/nation/nationnow/la-na-nn-veteran-dies-in-hospital-20140703-story.html

i dont see anybody come out and say "i am willing to pay more tax, so we can build more VA hospital or hire more VA doctor"...
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: eyephone on June 09, 2015, 09:36:25 AM
there is an old Chinese saying which English translation is "There is neither lowliness nor nobleness in careers"

how much more recognition or entitlements we still need to give to the veterans? they have VA hospital, VA discount, VA loans, VA holidays, VA memorials...

the residents are only against the cemetery of any kind, but they are willing to compromise and settle for a memorial or monument instead in order to honor the Veterans and the heritage of the Great park/El Toro base.

Even though I am warming up to the idea of veterans cemetery, it is pretty clear the residents are against the cemetery, not against Veterans, yet the Veterans are turning this into an anti-Chinese agenda because they don't get whatever they want?

should we just bend over and give whatever demands veterans want?

I think veteran deserves everything they have received and more.  But I do agree that there is no reason to make it personal.  It is reasonable for people to want to venerate veterans who fought for this county.  Similarly, it is reasonable for people to hold beliefs and hold true to those beliefs.  The issue here is that the belief system at issue is not the majority opinion and thus get swept under the rug as nonsense.

Just make this about the ideas, not the people.

http://www.latimes.com/nation/nationnow/la-na-nn-veteran-dies-in-hospital-20140703-story.html

i dont see anybody come out and say "i am willing to pay more tax, so we can build more VA hospital"...

You just indirectly did.  ;D
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: Irvinecommuter on June 09, 2015, 09:36:57 AM
there is an old Chinese saying which English translation is "There is neither lowliness nor nobleness in careers"

how much more recognition or entitlements we still need to give to the veterans? they have VA hospital, VA discount, VA loans, VA holidays, VA memorials...

the residents are only against the cemetery of any kind, but they are willing to compromise and settle for a memorial or monument instead in order to honor the Veterans and the heritage of the Great park/El Toro base.

Even though I am warming up to the idea of veterans cemetery, it is pretty clear the residents are against the cemetery, not against Veterans, yet the Veterans are turning this into an anti-Chinese agenda because they don't get whatever they want?

should we just bend over and give whatever demands veterans want?

I think veteran deserves everything they have received and more.  But I do agree that there is no reason to make it personal.  It is reasonable for people to want to venerate veterans who fought for this county.  Similarly, it is reasonable for people to hold beliefs and hold true to those beliefs.  The issue here is that the belief system at issue is not the majority opinion and thus get swept under the rug as nonsense.

Just make this about the ideas, not the people.

http://www.latimes.com/nation/nationnow/la-na-nn-veteran-dies-in-hospital-20140703-story.html

i dont see anybody come out and say "i am willing to pay more tax, so we can build more VA hospital"...

We already do pay taxes for VA hospitals and I would pay more.  It could be better managed but having good aftercare for veterans not only helps veterans but with a number of ancillary issues such as homelessness and domestic violence.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: eyephone on June 09, 2015, 09:39:22 AM
Curious, if this effort becomes futile, what are the options?
1) Sell and run for the hills...Orchard Hills? Or some other Irvine development.
2) Stay and just deal with it? (property values may hold steady...isn't there a Veteran's Cemetery in Westwood?)
3) Rent out your place and move to some other development?
4) Other option...(fill in the blank)?

5) Let them eat cake. (Both parties - pro and anti)
I'm sick of this. This is like talking about the OJ trial - it never EnDs!!!!!
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: irvinehomeowner on June 09, 2015, 09:47:39 AM
I still don't really see how a cemetery that far away will be an issue. You can't even see it from PP.

Someone asked if I minded if they were going to build a cemetery in my backyard... if it's as far away from my 'hood as it is from PP (where yaliu is) or BP (where ps9 is going to be)... I would be totally okay with it (and if Irvine Dream thinks I live in PP, then that even strengthens my opinion).

Quite honestly, I would be more worried about the jail.

bones doesn't seemed worried about it... what other PP residents other than yaliu think this cemetery is too close for comfort?
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: iacrenter on June 09, 2015, 09:51:06 AM
Yaliu,

Since the NIMBY argument is very hard to overcome try a different approach. Consider:

1) Flip vetrans prestige on its head
You can argue that war is immoral and it is repugnant to glorify people who kill others. There are many leftist anti war group who would gladly protest along Irivne boulevard.

2) Environmental Impact
I imagine most cemeteries are of full of water sucking plants/grass. Given we are in a severe drought, it makes no sense to allocate precious water resources to a cemetery.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: jmoney74 on June 09, 2015, 09:52:41 AM
I still don't really see how a cemetery that far away will be an issue. You can't even see it from PP.

Someone asked if I minded if they were going to build a cemetery in my backyard... if it's as far away from my 'hood as it is from PP (where yaliu is) or BP (where ps9 is going to be)... I would be totally okay with it (and if Irvine Dream thinks I live in PP, then that even strengthens my opinion).

Quite honestly, I would be more worried about the jail.

bones doesn't seemed worried about it... what other PP residents other than yaliu think this cemetery is too close for comfort?

I just think there are way better land to build cemeteries. Motorcades going to make people cringe. 
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: jmoney74 on June 09, 2015, 09:54:17 AM
Yaliu,

Since the NIMBY argument is very hard to overcome try a different approach. Consider:

1) Flip vetrans prestige on its head
You can argue that war is immoral and it is repugnant to glorify people who kill others. There are many leftist anti war group who would gladly protest along Irivne boulevard.

2) Environmental Impact
I imagine most cemeteries are of full of water sucking plants/grass. Given we are in a severe drought, it makes no sense to allocate precious water resources to a cemetery.

Drought tolerant cemetery?  Lol
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: irvinehomeowner on June 09, 2015, 09:59:16 AM
I just think there are way better land to build cemeteries.
But where in OC?

I think one of the issues is there is no veteran cemetery in OC so that it makes visitation easier for relatives.

Tustin Legacy would be a good choice... then qwercalves might actually show up.
Quote
Motorcades going to make people cringe. 
Really? I never feel sad when I see one, I think that the person must have been blessed to have touched so many lives.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: jmoney74 on June 09, 2015, 10:02:26 AM
I just think there are way better land to build cemeteries.
But where in OC?

I think one of the issues is there is no veteran cemetery in OC so that it makes visitation easier for relatives.

Tustin Legacy would be a good choice... then qwercalves might actually show up.
Quote
Motorcades going to make people cringe. 
Really? I never feel sad when I see one, I think that the person must have been blessed to have touched so many lives.

Maybe after 100 times you see it on sand canyon... Can get old.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: Irvinecommuter on June 09, 2015, 10:08:30 AM
I just think there are way better land to build cemeteries.
But where in OC?

I think one of the issues is there is no veteran cemetery in OC so that it makes visitation easier for relatives.

Tustin Legacy would be a good choice... then qwercalves might actually show up.
Quote
Motorcades going to make people cringe. 
Really? I never feel sad when I see one, I think that the person must have been blessed to have touched so many lives.

I think the OC register article talked about a location in Anaheim Hills.  Slight aside, I like how the supporter of the cemetery cited in the presentation that all the other cities in OC supports a memorial in Irvine.  Just about every other city in OC north of Irvine hates Irvine...those cities and the beach cities were the ones pushing for an airport in GP.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: Irvine Fanatic on June 09, 2015, 10:10:52 AM
I just think there are way better land to build cemeteries.
But where in OC?

I think one of the issues is there is no veteran cemetery in OC so that it makes visitation easier for relatives.

Tustin Legacy would be a good choice... then qwercalves might actually show up.
Quote
Motorcades going to make people cringe. 
Really? I never feel sad when I see one, I think that the person must have been blessed to have touched so many lives.

I think the OC register article talked about a location in Anaheim Hills.  Slight aside, I like how the supporter of the cemetery cited in the presentation that all the other cities in OC supports a memorial in Irvine.  Just about every other city in OC north of Irvine hates Irvine...those cities and the beach cities were the ones pushing for an airport in GP.

Whats with the Irvine hatred? I've encountered that as well. Even South OC. They should leave our utopia alone  ;D
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: Irvinecommuter on June 09, 2015, 10:12:18 AM
I just think there are way better land to build cemeteries.
But where in OC?

I think one of the issues is there is no veteran cemetery in OC so that it makes visitation easier for relatives.

Tustin Legacy would be a good choice... then qwercalves might actually show up.
Quote
Motorcades going to make people cringe. 
Really? I never feel sad when I see one, I think that the person must have been blessed to have touched so many lives.

I think the OC register article talked about a location in Anaheim Hills.  Slight aside, I like how the supporter of the cemetery cited in the presentation that all the other cities in OC supports a memorial in Irvine.  Just about every other city in OC north of Irvine hates Irvine...those cities and the beach cities were the ones pushing for an airport in GP.

Whats with the Irvine hatred? I've encountered that as well. Even South OC. They should leave our utopia alone  ;D

For one, Irvine blocked the Center Line and thus the lack of a viable public transit system in OC.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: bones on June 09, 2015, 10:17:22 AM

bones doesn't seemed worried about it... what other PP residents other than yaliu think this cemetery is too close for comfort?

I don't worry about things like this that are beyond my control. Besides part of me believes 5p makes this go away.  One day. Quietly. I know people think they can't and/or they won't but having worked in RE development in the past, don't be surprised at the backroom horsetrades that go on.  So many hurdles to actually get this thing built. Trotting out Asians and 70yo vets in a faceoff is a waste of time.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: zubs on June 09, 2015, 10:22:01 AM
5P is the big loser if this thing gets built.  How is Bacon Park being marketed?  Will they have to disclose to buyers that there could be a vet cemetery next to their million dollar homes?  How many buyers will look somewhere else? 

Perhaps if you really want to live in Bacon Park, you should support the cemetery so that prices will drop and you can pick one up at a 5%-10% discount.

The 5-10% number was meticulously calculated by taking the China money and dividing it out of my ass.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: Ready2Downsize on June 09, 2015, 10:25:54 AM
5P is the big loser if this thing gets built.  How is Bacon Park being marketed?  Will they have to disclose to buyers that there could be a vet cemetery next to their million dollar homes?  How many buyers will look somewhere else? 

Perhaps if you really want to live in Bacon Park, you should support the cemetery so that prices will drop and you can pick one up at a 5%-10% discount.

WHERE are they going to go?

NOT Irvine? Doubt it so remove Tustin Legacy, Baker Ranch and any other OC location, not Irvine.

Hidden Canyon? WAY more $$ and I doubt it competes with Beacon Park

Orchard Hills? Maybe.

Maybe they'll all just not buy and/or sell their properties they bought in Irvine over the cemetery but I doubt it.

Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: SoCal on June 09, 2015, 10:42:38 AM
Do any feng shui experts want to weigh in on possible remediations for when the cemetery gets built? Whenever a feng shui consultant is shown on T.V., they always have some sort of "fix" for bad juju. I believe Irvinehomeshopper mentioned previously that in one of the newer developments, a token of some kind -- I can't remember right now what it was -- anyway, it was buried in the ground to improve the flow. If you can hang a crystal from the ceiling in the northwest corner of your bedroom to restore your marriage (stealing from RHOC) then couldn't the homeowners just do something similar?
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: WillJoy on June 09, 2015, 10:48:58 AM
there is an old Chinese saying which English translation is "There is neither lowliness nor nobleness in careers"

how much more recognition or entitlements we still need to give to the veterans?

Ouchy. It is not what they are demanding. It is how much we value the life we are leading now as the result of their sacrifice. There is another old Chinese saying which English translation is "When you drink the H2O, think of the men who dug the well." On the other hand, the Chinese sayings obviously don't apply to Chinese in America.

A resting place on or near a toxic piece of land is really not that much. I think the toxicity does more damage to property value than a veteran cemetery. The Chinese buyers don't know that yet because builders don't give them the Chinese version of the disclosure report.




Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: Irvine Fanatic on June 09, 2015, 10:57:56 AM
5P is the big loser if this thing gets built.  How is Bacon Park being marketed?  Will they have to disclose to buyers that there could be a vet cemetery next to their million dollar homes?  How many buyers will look somewhere else? 

Perhaps if you really want to live in Bacon Park, you should support the cemetery so that prices will drop and you can pick one up at a 5%-10% discount.

WHERE are they going to go?

NOT Irvine? Doubt it so remove Tustin Legacy, Baker Ranch and any other OC location, not Irvine.

Hidden Canyon? WAY more $$ and I doubt it competes with Beacon Park

Orchard Hills? Maybe.

Maybe they'll all just not buy and/or sell their properties they bought in Irvine over the cemetery but I doubt it.

I'm gonna guess OH. My chinese realtor & friend told me that his clients, who were waiting for BP, have decided to look at OH more seriously.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: Soylent Green Is People on June 09, 2015, 11:06:04 AM
Demolish one of the blimp hangars and relocate the cemetary to that site? Interesting.

Another suggestion: The Naval Weapons Base in Seal Beach however methinks too many save the whale types would have a canary over any kind of "wetlands conversion" idea.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: iacrenter on June 09, 2015, 11:06:14 AM
5P is the big loser if this thing gets built.  How is Bacon Park being marketed?  Will they have to disclose to buyers that there could be a vet cemetery next to their million dollar homes?  How many buyers will look somewhere else? 

Perhaps if you really want to live in Bacon Park, you should support the cemetery so that prices will drop and you can pick one up at a 5%-10% discount.

WHERE are they going to go?

NOT Irvine? Doubt it so remove Tustin Legacy, Baker Ranch and any other OC location, not Irvine.

Hidden Canyon? WAY more $$ and I doubt it competes with Beacon Park

Orchard Hills? Maybe.

Maybe they'll all just not buy and/or sell their properties they bought in Irvine over the cemetery but I doubt it.

I'm gonna guess OH. My chinese realtor & friend told me that his clients, who were waiting for BP, have decided to look at OH more seriously.

TIC executives are smiling now.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: irvinehomeowner on June 09, 2015, 11:09:49 AM
Maybe after 100 times you see it on sand canyon... Can get old.
C'mon... you don't live on Sand Canyon.

And if you did, the sound of the garbage trucks would be more bothersome. :)
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: eyephone on June 09, 2015, 11:10:45 AM
I'm wondering, why did Yaliu & co. turn the veterans away? If the situation was turned around, I believe the veterans would have made room for you guys.

I don't want to hear room capacity as an excuse.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: Irvinecommuter on June 09, 2015, 11:13:48 AM
Maybe after 100 times you see it on sand canyon... Can get old.
C'mon... you don't live on Sand Canyon.

And if you did, the sound of the garbage trucks would be more bothersome. :)

Definitely a lot of trucks on Sand Canyon...I live not too far from it but no sounds from within the house...a little when one is outside but not much either.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: irvinehomeowner on June 09, 2015, 11:15:49 AM
I don't want to hear room capacity as an excuse.
It was anti-cemetery capacity. There was no room for pro-cemetery participants. :)

I say they fight for it... five 5-minute rounds, UFC rules.

I'm with bones, I'm not sure the cemetery will happen. If an airport can be blocked, it doesn't look good for poltergeists (veteran or not).
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: eyephone on June 09, 2015, 11:20:08 AM
I don't want to hear room capacity as an excuse.
It was anti-cemetery capacity. There was no room for pro-cemetery participants. :)

Some of the anti supporters could of stepped out.
It just looks bad, that a group got turned away. Top it off, with that they are veterans. The goal is to get public support on your side.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: irvinehomeowner on June 09, 2015, 11:21:52 AM
I don't want to hear room capacity as an excuse.
It was anti-cemetery capacity. There was no room for pro-cemetery participants. :)

Some of the anti supporters could of stepped out.
It just looks bad, that a group got turned away. Top it off, with that they are veterans. The goal is to get public support on your side.
I agree... but Chinese anti-cemetery supporters don't like confrontation.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: SoCal on June 09, 2015, 11:34:55 AM
Some of the anti supporters could of stepped out.
It just looks bad, that a group got turned away. Top it off, with that they are veterans. The goal is to get public support on your side.

Going off the pics posted online, I count 8 vets in the group that were shoo'd away from the "private party". Agreed, making room for 8 should not have been an *insurmountable obstacle* for these intelligent folks. Asking 8 tag-alongs to wait outside comes to mind. As the saying goes: "Where there is a will, there is a way."
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: zubs on June 09, 2015, 11:36:34 AM
5P is the big loser if this thing gets built.  How is Bacon Park being marketed?  Will they have to disclose to buyers that there could be a vet cemetery next to their million dollar homes?  How many buyers will look somewhere else? 

Perhaps if you really want to live in Bacon Park, you should support the cemetery so that prices will drop and you can pick one up at a 5%-10% discount.

WHERE are they going to go?

NOT Irvine? Doubt it so remove Tustin Legacy, Baker Ranch and any other OC location, not Irvine.

Hidden Canyon? WAY more $$ and I doubt it competes with Beacon Park

Orchard Hills? Maybe.

Maybe they'll all just not buy and/or sell their properties they bought in Irvine over the cemetery but I doubt it.

I'm gonna guess OH. My chinese realtor & friend told me that his clients, who were waiting for BP, have decided to look at OH more seriously.

TIC executives are smiling now.

I get what you're saying...5-10% drop in Bacon Park realestate becomes a 5-10% increase at OH and other Irvine areas....This means:

Every Irvine property owner that is 2-3 miles away from the proposed vet cemetery should be cheerleading it to get built! as their property values will go up.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: iacrenter on June 09, 2015, 11:57:50 AM
I just think there are way better land to build cemeteries.
But where in OC?

I think one of the issues is there is no veteran cemetery in OC so that it makes visitation easier for relatives.

Tustin Legacy would be a good choice... then qwercalves might actually show up.
Quote
Motorcades going to make people cringe. 
Really? I never feel sad when I see one, I think that the person must have been blessed to have touched so many lives.

I think the OC register article talked about a location in Anaheim Hills.  Slight aside, I like how the supporter of the cemetery cited in the presentation that all the other cities in OC supports a memorial in Irvine.  Just about every other city in OC north of Irvine hates Irvine...those cities and the beach cities were the ones pushing for an airport in GP.

"The land is open space near the intersection of the 91 express lanes and the 241 toll road, part of 2,500 acres donated to the county last year by the Irvine Co."

http://www.ocregister.com/articles/cemetery-664876-park-veterans.html

It sounds like the same area as the shelved Mountain Park community. That area would have easy access to the 91 and 241. Also there are no close by neighbors who would protest. Future residential development is probably years away.

http://www.ocregister.com/articles/irvine-524933-park-convention.html

http://www.ocregister.com/articles/irvine-524933-park-convention.html

(http://images.onset.freedom.com/ocregister/msveau-msveaqmountainparkanaheim.gif)
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: WTTCHMN on June 09, 2015, 12:07:18 PM
Some of the anti supporters could of stepped out.
It just looks bad, that a group got turned away. Top it off, with that they are veterans. The goal is to get public support on your side.

Going off the pics posted online, I count 8 vets in the group that were shoo'd away from the "private party". Agreed, making room for 8 should not have been an *insurmountable obstacle* for these intelligent folks. Asking 8 tag-alongs to wait outside comes to mind. As the saying goes: "Where there is a will, there is a way."

Without having been there, I wouldn't draw any conclusions from anything you read on the internet...  just like that show you like so much, Catfish.  After all, look what zubs accomplished with just one sarcastic post - he got the vets to believe he wanted them buried at a landfill.  Of course, they didn't know he was just catfishing them too.  But it riled them up so much, it became a rallying cry (even if it was false).

To draw the conclusion that "I see 8 people in a photo and they were all turned away because it was Chinese only" is a dangerous assumption to make.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: SoCal on June 09, 2015, 12:58:46 PM
Some of the anti supporters could of stepped out.
It just looks bad, that a group got turned away. Top it off, with that they are veterans. The goal is to get public support on your side.

Going off the pics posted online, I count 8 vets in the group that were shoo'd away from the "private party". Agreed, making room for 8 should not have been an *insurmountable obstacle* for these intelligent folks. Asking 8 tag-alongs to wait outside comes to mind. As the saying goes: "Where there is a will, there is a way."

Without having been there, I wouldn't draw any conclusions from anything you read on the internet...  just like that show you like so much, Catfish.  After all, look what zubs accomplished with just one sarcastic post - he got the vets to believe he wanted them buried at a landfill.  Of course, they didn't know he was just catfishing them too.  But it riled them up so much, it became a rallying cry (even if it was false).

To draw the conclusion that "I see 8 people in a photo and they were all turned away because it was Chinese only" is a dangerous assumption to make.

Woah, Nelly. Let's recap. Yesterday, I posted here (http://www.talkirvine.com/index.php/topic,11986.msg263244.html#msg263244) that, according to the source I cited, the vets were turned away. The caption of the 2 photos showing 8 vets outside the meeting read, 'We only wanted to dialog, but were turned away at the door. "Private party rental' we were told. Chinese only.' Red flag #1. I then asked the group spokesman, Yaliu, why they were turned away. He said he didn't know. (http://www.talkirvine.com/index.php/topic,11986.msg263262.html#msg263262) But he did not deny that it happened. Red flag #2. I1 then jumped in. He seems to have some first-hand knowledge of what took place. Correct me if I'm wrong but he was there. He said others were turned away "as well". (http://www.talkirvine.com/index.php/topic,11986.msg263265.html#msg263265) Red flag #3. "As well" means "in addition to." In addition to means in addition to the veterans being turned away. The vets were turned away. That's not jumping to conclusions. That's basic English literacy skills. In fact, he stated the reason was due to the facility being over capacity. So, the turning away of the vets does not seem to be in dispute from either side.

Now, I'm not generally a fan of this site (http://www.theliberaloc.com/2015/06/08/cancelled-town-hall-meeting-attracts-dozens-of-great-park-chinese-homeowners-veterans-greet-them-over-cemetery/), The Liberal O.C., as I am so conservative that I make Mother Teresa look like a hippie. However, if you click that link, you can see an updated post today about the meeting. According to the blogger who did attempt to gain access, the vets and the press were, indeed, turned away. It details the difficulty he had getting. So, there is an additional account from someone else who did show up and was also rebuffed along with a representative from each branch of the service.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: WTTCHMN on June 09, 2015, 02:04:27 PM
The problem is everything you are quoting is all hearsay without any firsthand knowledge of the situation.  You weren't there, nor was I.

You interpret a Facebook post as gospel.  You claim Yaliu is the group spokesperson, when he has clearly stated he is not.  You say he didn't deny anything.  But that's not an acknowledgement either.  You claim i1 states others were denied as well.  But "others" could refer to anyone - Asians, vets, kids, dogs.  That doesn't mean vets were denied exclusively.  Finally, your turn to condescension and say it's basic English literacy skills.  How insulting!
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: The California Court Company on June 09, 2015, 02:08:11 PM
yup - for people who are new to this site, just a reminder of SoCal's hidden agenda - she advocates anything that could potentially hurt Irvine's real estate value. Instead of laying blame on her secretive husband that does not make enough money to support their lifestyle and an Irvine address, she is bitter against Asians who have priced her family out of Irvine

The problem is everything you are quoting is all hearsay without any firsthand knowledge of the situation.  You weren't there, nor was I.

You interpret a Facebook post as gospel.  You claim Yaliu is the group spokesperson, when he has clearly stated he is not.  You say he didn't deny anything.  But that's not an acknowledgement either.  You claim i1 states others were denied as well.  But "others" could refer to anyone - Asians, vets, kids, dogs.  That doesn't mean vets were denied exclusively.  Finally, your turn to condescension and say it's basic English literacy skills.  How insulting!
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: jmoney74 on June 09, 2015, 02:56:57 PM
Some of the anti supporters could of stepped out.
It just looks bad, that a group got turned away. Top it off, with that they are veterans. The goal is to get public support on your side.

Going off the pics posted online, I count 8 vets in the group that were shoo'd away from the "private party". Agreed, making room for 8 should not have been an *insurmountable obstacle* for these intelligent folks. Asking 8 tag-alongs to wait outside comes to mind. As the saying goes: "Where there is a will, there is a way."

Without having been there, I wouldn't draw any conclusions from anything you read on the internet...  just like that show you like so much, Catfish.  After all, look what zubs accomplished with just one sarcastic post - he got the vets to believe he wanted them buried at a landfill.  Of course, they didn't know he was just catfishing them too.  But it riled them up so much, it became a rallying cry (even if it was false).

To draw the conclusion that "I see 8 people in a photo and they were all turned away because it was Chinese only" is a dangerous assumption to make.

Woah, Nelly. Let's recap. Yesterday, I posted here (http://www.talkirvine.com/index.php/topic,11986.msg263244.html#msg263244) that, according to the source I cited, the vets were turned away. The caption of the 2 photos showing 8 vets outside the meeting read, 'We only wanted to dialog, but were turned away at the door. "Private party rental' we were told. Chinese only.' Red flag #1. I then asked the group spokesman, Yaliu, why they were turned away. He said he didn't know. (http://www.talkirvine.com/index.php/topic,11986.msg263262.html#msg263262) But he did not deny that it happened. Red flag #2. I1 then jumped in. He seems to have some first-hand knowledge of what took place. Correct me if I'm wrong but he was there. He said others were turned away "as well". (http://www.talkirvine.com/index.php/topic,11986.msg263265.html#msg263265) Red flag #3. "As well" means "in addition to." In addition to means in addition to the veterans being turned away. The vets were turned away. That's not jumping to conclusions. That's basic English literacy skills. In fact, he stated the reason was due to the facility being over capacity. So, the turning away of the vets does not seem to be in dispute from either side.

Now, I'm not generally a fan of this site (http://www.theliberaloc.com/2015/06/08/cancelled-town-hall-meeting-attracts-dozens-of-great-park-chinese-homeowners-veterans-greet-them-over-cemetery/), The Liberal O.C., as I am so conservative that I make Mother Teresa look like a hippie. However, if you click that link, you can see an updated post today about the meeting. According to the blogger who did attempt to gain access, the vets and the press were, indeed, turned away. It details the difficulty he had getting. So, there is an additional account from someone else who did show up and was also rebuffed along with a representative from each branch of the service.

Ugh

That is some jumping to conclusions at its finest. Lol
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: jmoney74 on June 09, 2015, 02:58:40 PM
yup - for people who are new to this site, just a reminder of SoCal's hidden agenda - she advocates anything that could potentially hurt Irvine's real estate value. Instead of laying blame on her secretive husband that does not make enough money to support their lifestyle and an Irvine address, she is bitter against Asians who have priced her family out of Irvine

The problem is everything you are quoting is all hearsay without any firsthand knowledge of the situation.  You weren't there, nor was I.

You interpret a Facebook post as gospel.  You claim Yaliu is the group spokesperson, when he has clearly stated he is not.  You say he didn't deny anything.  But that's not an acknowledgement either.  You claim i1 states others were denied as well.  But "others" could refer to anyone - Asians, vets, kids, dogs.  That doesn't mean vets were denied exclusively.  Finally, your turn to condescension and say it's basic English literacy skills.  How insulting!

Damnnnnnnnnnnn

Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: SoCal on June 09, 2015, 03:03:41 PM
The problem is everything you are quoting is all hearsay without any firsthand knowledge of the situation.  You weren't there, nor was I.

You interpret a Facebook post as gospel.  You claim Yaliu is the group spokesperson, when he has clearly stated he is not.  You say he didn't deny anything.  But that's not an acknowledgement either.  You claim i1 states others were denied as well.  But "others" could refer to anyone - Asians, vets, kids, dogs.  That doesn't mean vets were denied exclusively.  Finally, your turn to condescension and say it's basic English literacy skills.  How insulting!

Wow. Who is the one "jumping to conclusions"? How about not going around demanding someone do something that you are apparently not willing to do yourself. Here, I'll highlight it in blue to make it clearer: According. To. The. Source. I've said this from the very beginning, I've said it about four times since then, and I'll say it once more... According to the source. I never said it is the gospel truth. That is why I have said "according to the source". I have presented information I have found and asked questions to gain more information. Some of the questions were for Yaliu because he said he was at the meeting. Rather than bickering about it here, why not do the same and contact various sources yourself if you really are open to hearing from all sides. Here are some contacts who were all there Monday night:

Will Jardine, Vet: https://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=100008286939694

Mr. Loughrey, "bouncer" at the meeting: http://www.theliberaloc.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/06/013.jpg

Dan Chmielewski, blogger: dchm@cox.net / 949.231.2965

I don't care who the "others" are that were bounced because it is rather beside the point. The emphasis was on the veterans. However, it is worth noting that Dan reports approximately 100 chairs were set up, and only about 3 dozen were seated. That would leave more than enough seats available to accommodate the veterans. If you want to know more details, contact him.

"Finally, your turn to condescension and say it's basic English literacy skills.  How insulting!" --- I'm surprised you are offended that I said I can comprehend I1's post just fine. It has me questioning if this post was made with the intent to troll. What does it feel like to be offended by that? Is it a sharp, physical pain in the pit of your stomach? Or is it more of an emotional, dull, aching pain? Well, since you are hurt by my ability to read, then I only have one thing to say about that:

(https://scontent-sjc2-1.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-xap1/v/t1.0-9/11188182_957290997637344_7207696945197559371_n.jpg?oh=c26faddcb28d49ca4fa333662974326f&oe=55E64EE9)
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: WTTCHMN on June 09, 2015, 03:43:51 PM
The problem is everything you are quoting is all hearsay without any firsthand knowledge of the situation.  You weren't there, nor was I.

You interpret a Facebook post as gospel.  You claim Yaliu is the group spokesperson, when he has clearly stated he is not.  You say he didn't deny anything.  But that's not an acknowledgement either.  You claim i1 states others were denied as well.  But "others" could refer to anyone - Asians, vets, kids, dogs.  That doesn't mean vets were denied exclusively.  Finally, your turn to condescension and say it's basic English literacy skills.  How insulting!

Wow. Who is the one "jumping to conclusions"? How about not going around demanding someone do something that you are apparently not willing to do yourself. Here, I'll highlight it in blue to make it clearer: According. To. The. Source. I've said this from the very beginning, I've said it about four times since then, and I'll say it once more... According to the source. I never said it is the gospel truth. That is why I have said "according to the source". I have presented information I have found and asked questions to gain more information. Some of the questions were for Yaliu because he said he was at the meeting. Rather than bickering about it here, why not do the same and contact various sources yourself if you really are open to hearing from all sides. Here are some contacts who were all there Monday night:

Will Jardine, Vet: https://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=100008286939694

Mr. Loughrey, "bouncer" at the meeting: http://www.theliberaloc.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/06/013.jpg

Dan Chmielewski, blogger: dchm@cox.net / 949.231.2965

I don't care who the "others" are that were bounced because it is rather beside the point. The emphasis was on the veterans. However, it is worth noting that Dan reports approximately 100 chairs were set up, and only about 3 dozen were seated. That would leave more than enough seats available to accommodate the veterans. If you want to know more details, contact him.

"Finally, your turn to condescension and say it's basic English literacy skills.  How insulting!" --- I'm surprised you are offended that I said I can comprehend I1's post just fine. It has me questioning if this post was made with the intent to troll. What does it feel like to be offended by that? Is it a sharp, physical pain in the pit of your stomach? Or is it more of an emotional, dull, aching pain? Well, since you are hurt by my ability to read, then I only have one thing to say about that:

(https://scontent-sjc2-1.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-xap1/v/t1.0-9/11188182_957290997637344_7207696945197559371_n.jpg?oh=c26faddcb28d49ca4fa333662974326f&oe=55E64EE9)

There's crazy, and then there's bat-shit crazy.

Your honor, I rest my case.
Title: Re: Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine
Post by: SoCal on June 09, 2015, 05:21:46 PM
Demolish one of the blimp hangars and relocate the cemetary to that site? Interesting.

Another suggestion: The Naval Weapons Base in Seal Beach however methinks too many save the whale types would have a canary over any kind of "wetlands conversion" idea.