"Paydirt". Do not buy in Great Park until you watch this.

socal78

socal78

Well-known member
You owe it to yourself to watch this 1-hour documentary which focuses on the criminal activity of Lennar and exposes the dangers associated with the El Toro base / Great Park.

For the lazy, I'll post the trailer first. Then the video. Then the Cliff Notes / highlights.

DO NOT BUY UNTIL YOU WATCH.

Trailer:

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3B7YuNVJrJM[/youtube]
 
1-17 - Lennar. Intro to their disgusting reputation across the country. Dirty sites plus shoddy construction.

7:55 - Brownfield Act of 2001 which allows a developer to purchase contaminated property and sell to a builder with no disclosures made to the homebuyer.

17:00 - The local focus. El Toro / New Homes at the Great Park. Daily life at the former El Toro Marine School included wipe-downs of pollution. Cancers and birth defects experienced by residents. Presence of Benzene which causes leukemia. Interview with former teacher. Memorial on site dedicated to a dead child - leukemia.

27:00 - Demolition & tearing up concrete at the base is stirring up contamination. Hanger 296 contaminated with Radium 226 used to paint luminescent dials.

29:00 - Donald Bren

29:47 - NBC building at El Toro. NBC = Nuclear Biological Chemical warfare. Workers wore protective great. Suits with full hoods and masks due to contamination. 3 kids dead - brain tumor & leukemia.

31:00 - Lennar went to AIG for a $100M oversight policy. They are already prepared to pay off you TI buyers for future damages. An entire family has been wiped out. Mom, dad, and 2 daughters all got cancer. Daughters died. One family of many. SLAM = Stop Lennar Action Movement.

36:00 - Toxic dust. Watch this before buying a phase near construction.

45:00 - Living near construction. Bloody noses, asthma. Only wire fences and low tarps for protection from asbestos. Lennar gets cheap fines. Slap on the wrist.

48:40 - Asbestos badge for workers at Hunter's Point Shipyard in San Fran to measure limits when they must leave job site. None for nearby residents. Lennar building on this toxic nuclear dump.

538 Lennar lawsuits (as of 3 years ago), most over $250G.

You've been warned. How hungry are you for a slice of Irvine Pie, hmm?
 
The majority of the plume is under Central Irvine such as The Branches in Woodbridge
 
test said:
The majority of the plume is under Central Irvine such as The Branches in Woodbridge
Click to expand...
So awesome when test throws rocks from his/her glass house.
http://www.tustinlegacy.com/article.cfm?id=81

During the operation of former MCAS Tustin, certain contaminants were released into the soil and groundwater primarily resulting from, but not limited to, solvents and jet fuel supporting the base operations, and from pesticides associated with the agricultural uses. Since the initiation of the ?Navy Assessment and Control of Installation Pollutants Program? in 1980 (which later became the current Installation Restoration Program (IRP)), the Navy has successfully completed numerous site investigations and remedial actions; however, contaminated groundwater plumes (VIEW MAP) remain.  The chemicals of concern (COC) remaining in the groundwater are generally a result of fuel and solvents previously used in the operation of former MCAS Tustin.
Click to expand...

Here is the map they are referring to:
http://www.tustinlegacy.com//images/Tustin/docs/OperableUnits AOCs and MTBE 17x11 2-17-10.pdf

2eyz2w7.jpg


Now... this should be taken with a grain of salt... and while many will still buy in "Pay Dirt" areas... others won't.
 
In the documentary, they go over the expansion of the plume. You astute observers will recognize Woodbridge in the trailer. It's there for a reason.

I recommend holding all questions until the documentary is viewed. The film will address many of them -- and create many more.
 
irvinehomeowner said:
test said:
The majority of the plume is under Central Irvine such as The Branches in Woodbridge
Click to expand...
So awesome when test throws rocks from his/her glass house.
http://www.tustinlegacy.com/article.cfm?id=81

During the operation of former MCAS Tustin, certain contaminants were released into the soil and groundwater primarily resulting from, but not limited to, solvents and jet fuel supporting the base operations, and from pesticides associated with the agricultural uses. Since the initiation of the ?Navy Assessment and Control of Installation Pollutants Program? in 1980 (which later became the current Installation Restoration Program (IRP)), the Navy has successfully completed numerous site investigations and remedial actions; however, contaminated groundwater plumes (VIEW MAP) remain.  The chemicals of concern (COC) remaining in the groundwater are generally a result of fuel and solvents previously used in the operation of former MCAS Tustin.
Click to expand...

Here is the map they are referring to:
http://www.tustinlegacy.com//images/Tustin/docs/OperableUnits AOCs and MTBE 17x11 2-17-10.pdf

2eyz2w7.jpg


Now... this should be taken with a grain of salt... and while many will still buy in "Pay Dirt" areas... others won't.
Click to expand...

if im looking at the map correctly, it appears the majority of the homes do not sit over plumes. im curious in what direction this stuff spreads.
 
On a personal note. Just something I found a little bit spooky weird and which reminded me to post about the doc.

I've been participating on IHB and TI for 5 years with all of you, including discussions about the plume among other things which I thought were interesting -- enough to want to carry things on over here to make a T.I.. At the same time, this doc by TV film maker Mr. Lundahl was being researched, produced, and filmed not far from where I was living. I had taken notice of it but stored it in the back of my mind until last night when I happened to receive an email from my grandmother. She mentioned getting a call from our cousin, Robert Lundahl, saying he has put out another documentary (a different one about the deserts of SoCal) and he has dedicated it to her. I was like, "What cousin??" It was the first I'd heard about that but not about him or the expos? on Irvine. (Fwiw, he is not the reporter in the film.)

Just thought that was a tiny bit weird. There must be something in the water. (TCE. mrmph.)
 
qwerty said:
if im looking at the map correctly, it appears the majority of the homes do not sit over plumes. im curious in what direction this stuff spreads.
Click to expand...
Currently, the 3 bigger TCE plumes are just south of Columbus Square. That area is where the OC Regional Park is planned and the high school.

The other homes being planned are more east where the Elem school is supposed to go, which fortunately, does not look like it has any plumes under.
http://www.tustinlegacy.com//images/Tustin/docs/Master Development Footprint Summary Map (MAR11).pdf

But just like second hand smoke (and freeway exhaust)... what is really a safe distance? And yes... I am wary of buying in  North Lake (and The Branches) because of these things.
 
If what's in the documentary is true (and I tend to believe this sort of thing and I don't trust government and corporates, especially when they're together), this must be disastrous, in US standard.  But yet it seems on the surface, things are pretty calm.  No mainstream media ever reported this.  Is there, or has there been, any kind of official independent investigations into this?

I worry because I've just signed the contract to purchase a home near Great Park (a.k.a., a SUPERFUND site).
 
Great Park homes are tailored made for Chinese buyers. They have been through worse in their home country, where almost everything is either polluted or poisonous.
 
songkou said:
But yet it seems on the surface, things are pretty calm.  No mainstream media ever reported this.  Is there, or has there been, any kind of official independent investigations into this?

I worry because I've just signed the contract to purchase a home near Great Park (a.k.a., a SUPERFUND site).
Click to expand...

I'm not sure I understand the question. The mainstream media has acknowledged the contamination at El Toro. Here are just a couple quick examples:

O.C. Register: "Skepticism lingers as decontamination of El Toro continues"Link
O.C. Weekly: "Fill 'Er Up. Even Jesus wouldn't try Irvine water district's plan to turn crap into tap" Link
L.A. Times: "Supervisors Seek Independent Study of El Toro Contamination. County hopes to limit any future liability for cleanup. Navy conducted only assessment so far." Link

And here is this LINK from the EPA listing all of the chemicals which "pose an unacceptable risk to human health or the environment" found in the groundwater and El Toro soil. 

Tip: Use the keywords "Irvine Desalter Project" to get more info.

Maybe you mean reporting on Lennar. There have been numerous mentions of "Lennar lemons", Lennar's use of defective Chinese drywall and that lawsuit when that happened back around 2009, etc. -- that was covered in the Wall Street Journal. (I can't link to it because I don't have an online subscription.)

Does this help?
 
OK.  I get it.  It's my ignorance to say that mainstream media didn't report it.  Now the questions are how much don't we know about the level of contamination and how much it will impact the neighborhood communities.

SoCal said:
songkou said:
But yet it seems on the surface, things are pretty calm.  No mainstream media ever reported this.  Is there, or has there been, any kind of official independent investigations into this?

I worry because I've just signed the contract to purchase a home near Great Park (a.k.a., a SUPERFUND site).
Click to expand...

I'm not sure I understand the question. The mainstream media has acknowledged the contamination at El Toro. Here are just a couple quick examples:

O.C. Register: "Skepticism lingers as decontamination of El Toro continues"Link
O.C. Weekly: "Fill 'Er Up. Even Jesus wouldn't try Irvine water district's plan to turn crap into tap" Link
L.A. Times: "Supervisors Seek Independent Study of El Toro Contamination. County hopes to limit any future liability for cleanup. Navy conducted only assessment so far." Link

And here is this LINK from the EPA listing all of the chemicals which "pose an unacceptable risk to human health or the environment" found in the groundwater and El Toro soil. 

Tip: Use the keywords "Irvine Desalter Project" to get more info.

Maybe you mean reporting on Lennar. There have been numerous mentions of "Lennar lemons", Lennar's use of defective Chinese drywall and that lawsuit when that happened back around 2009, etc. -- that was covered in the Wall Street Journal. (I can't link to it because I don't have an online subscription.)

Does this help?
Click to expand...
 
I'm a disbeliever until a couple of questions are answered:

1) TIC has been farming the land for years. Ever wonder what chemical cocktails they were brewing up the the 1930's-1960's? Pretty much all of that land has some sort of legacy issues. What kind of studies have been done on the entire Irvine Company land and compared let's say to Huntington Beach, Yorba Linda, or Brea. If you want to compare toxicity, try some of the oilfield data in that are and compare it to ag-land here.

2) Are these environmental studies aren't being passed over just at the Irvine City Council. It flow up through the County, State, and Federal levels. Once it gets passed those few dozen hurdles you've got legal challenges up the wazoo that will further press open and objective review of the data before homes are built.

3) Having a limited scientific background, are we talking parts per billion, trillion or quadrillion? If it's PPT, it's a worry only a NIMBY could take seriously. I'd sooner live in an area that has DDT or Benzine in parts per billion coming out of my tap water than 1 mile away from the I-5 which is spewing both engine exhaust and road noise 24/7.

Yes, Lennar builds some shoddy homes. They also build some good ones. I challenge anyone to find a major builder (Toll Bros, CalPacific, KB Homes, Lyon Communities, etc) that doesn't have a wide range of lawsuits against them. I live in a KB built home and would consider buying another one even with their less than stellar reputation. It's all a question of research. 

I'd rather have the land turned back in to orange groves myself, but thank God every day it's not an international airport.

My .02c

SGIP
 
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